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[kitschbeam]

I need more gameplay footage!

 

[CosmicGroinPull]

I still see some clipping. Clearly the PS4 is not the advance system I thought it was, I'm selling it on eBay as I'm typing this.

Too slow. I'm drilling holes in my PS4 as I type this. What a piece of crap.

 

[VanWinkle]

This guy

Haha

 

[flamingotripod]

Has it been explained why the game has black bars?

 

[KalBalboa]

Looking really impressive.

 

[RELIGHT]

It's almost like AOT where they're standing on the buildings.

 

[VanWinkle]

Has it been explained why the game has black bars?

It fits into their cinematic look, which permeates pretty much every facet of the visuals.

 

[KalBalboa]

Man, I've been reading some excessively reductive things in this thread. Claiming this looks just like The Last of Us...?

 

[nycgamer4ever]

because it was said in the faq "it's a cover shooter" lol.

I have had no clue what the gameplay is of the game till now. From "mildly anticipated" to probably "won't buy".

Why can't they just release some gameplay trailer. wtf. The 3 minute thing didn't offer much in terms of actual gameplay and the variance of it.

Bro just stop with you stealth trolling. and what with all the contradictions?!

"The 3 minute thing didn't offer much in terms of actual gameplay and the variance of it"

Yet that is more than enough for you to form your "mildly anticipated" to "won't buy" opinion and "generic cover shooter".

So much hate and salt over a game that is maybe 7 or 8 months from release.

 

[nycgamer4ever]

I wouldn't be shocked if this isn't gameplay being showcased but just a cutscene.

But then again gifs always hide a lot of detail.

They've been saying over and over that there will be no difference between gameplay and cutscene graphics so unless they are lying we can expect this level of graphics during gameplay.

 

[nycgamer4ever]

Uh-huh.Hmmm.

As I've said already, I can only judge what I've seen, and it certainly doesn't help that the actual dev comments about the mechanic sound pretty darn vague:
I'm not seeing anything here that disputes the notion that these sequences are extravagant but ultimately scripted trivial set-pieces.

You're right to point out that good action titles like Bayonetta include QTEs as well. I guess the great design underlying the combos and actual gameplay make up for the mundanity of mashing X a bunch of times. The jury's, of course, still out on whether or not the same can be said of The Order(and, certainly, whether its melee segments need to be made up for in terms of fun game mechanics).


But then I'II simply have to ask; what's the point of putting the scene in? I mean, sure, you can make a QTE scene where your main character leaps into the air, does a somersault while shooting ten guys around him with dual uzis before landing on a skateboard , then ollies onto a monster's face and and blows his face off with a shotgun. But if my input to make that happen clashes so much with the core game controls it completely rips me out of the game since it's basically an acknowledgement that the devs thought of some set-piece that didn't translate properly into their gameplay, so they just went ahead and cooked up some half-baked scheme to bring their animated creation to life.

I'm against the concept of QTEs in principal, and what has been shown of The Order's implementation doesn't excite me at all. Sure, they haven't shown everything, but that doesn't mean you can simply assume that all that depth will be present and accounted for, especially when the devs themselves seem so non-committal to giving us a proper explanation on that.



You really should stop using the word desperate. You sound a bit too attached. By all means, help yourself to my post history and find some evidence of fanboy dumbassery if you can, but I'm well within my rights to express my lack of excitement for what looks like the latest line in a string of uninteresting approaches to game design.

Maybe you and all the other haters and negative nancies should just GTFO here if you aren't at all interested in the game and let other people be excited. With all the amount of negative shit you guys spew I can't see how you would ever enjoy this game. Even if it turned out to be the best game ever you wouldn't enjoy so what is the point? Maybe you should play a more simpler game, like connect four or something.

Better yet if you are so good at game design maybe you should just make your own game and play that and just leave us alone to be excited for a game.

 

[TetraGenesis]

Has it been explained why the game has black bars?

So many times, yes.

 

[dragonbane]

You ever watch a QTE and wish you could do that through direct gameplay? Yeah, that's pretty much me most of the time, wondering "why couldn't I have done that?" Which is why it feels like a hack, a small failure where control is wrested from the player, only QTEs provide the most bare-bones of interactivity so that there's some modicum of player involvement.

But like I said, it depends. I love many of God of War's over the top QTEs, so I guess it comes down to balance. How much of the cool stuff is happening in direct gameplay versus canned cinematic moments? How often is control being taken from me? Are the QTEs and cinematics a nice break from the action or exploration? Or are they the bulk of the game's interesting parts?

In general I dislike QTEs but any given game might change my mind, so I hold out some hope.

Well, you managed to beat and enjoy HR, a game that uses QTEs as its primary gameplay interface. So you should be fine unless they do yet another bad implementation of them.

 

[NullPointer]

Well, you managed to beat and enjoy HR, a game that uses QTEs as its primary gameplay interface. So you should be fine unless they do yet another bad implementation of them.

I didn't really consider Heavy Rain or Beyond) to be QTE fests. They had QTEs for sure, but the majority of the time it was just contextual input prompts. Contextual inputs with heavy choice and consequence to the characters and story in Heavy Rain, and contextual inputs that mostly just push the story forward in Beyond: Two Souls.

When I think of QTEs I think of quick contextual (sometimes arbitrary or randomized) prompts that you either match, Simon Says style, or you fail and have to try again. The evolution of QTEs has been to add multiple states so maybe you can fail the first which leads to a second win/lose condition, but that's pretty much been the long and short of it.

More to your point I'm OK (actually a fan) with Heavy Rain's contextual commands, as it doesn't really have a direct gameplay focus or genre. Its not a finite set of commands to learn which you then apply to overcome challenges. In Cage's games the only commands you can use (outside of movement) are the ones presented on screen, and only in specific context, and those are the sum total of your inputs and choices.

But give me a third person shooter, or a racing game, or a hack and slash action RPG and I'm going to want to directly control those characters and make cinematic things happen through that finite, learn-able and master-able set of controls - and not just when the camera and control gets pulled away from me. I'm thinking emergent, systemic games, whether a GTA or a Halo - but they're built upon a finite set of controls and systems that interact, and provide a consistent set of rules for the player to exploit, and that lead to amazing fucking videos that get shared online.

So yeah, I definitely prefer that to cinematics and QTEs. But all the same, I'm open to having my mind changed. I mentioned digging God of War, and I loved Max Payne, but while those had plenty of cinematics, most of the time it was the gameplay setups that provided the biggest and more memorable payoffs.

 

[dragonbane]

I didn't really consider Heavy Rain or Beyond) to be QTE fests. They had QTEs for sure, but the majority of the time it was just contextual input prompts. Contextual inputs with heavy choice and consequence to the characters and story in Heavy Rain, and contextual inputs that mostly just push the story forward in Beyond: Two Souls.

When I think of QTEs I think of quick contextual (sometimes arbitrary or randomized) prompts that you either match, Simon Says style, or you fail and have to try again. The evolution of QTEs has been to add multiple states so maybe you can fail the first which leads to a second win/lose condition, but that's pretty much been the long and short of it.

More to your point I'm OK (actually a fan) with Heavy Rain's contextual commands, as it doesn't really have a direct gameplay focus or genre. Its not a finite set of commands to learn which you then apply to overcome challenges. In Cage's games the only commands you can use (outside of movement) are the ones presented on screen, and only in specific context, and those are the sum total of your inputs and choices.

But give me a third person shooter, or a racing game, or a hack and slash action RPG and I'm going to want to directly control those characters and make cinematic things happen through that finite, learn-able and master-able set of controls - and not just when the camera and control gets pulled away from me. I'm thinking emergent, systemic games, whether a GTA or a Halo - but they're built upon a finite set of controls and systems that interact, and provide a consistent set of rules for the player to exploit, and that lead to amazing fucking videos that get shared online.

So yeah, I definitely prefer that to cinematics and QTEs. But all the same, I'm open to having my mind changed. I mentioned digging God of War, and I loved Max Payne, but while those had plenty of cinematics, most of the time it was the gameplay setups that provided the biggest and more memorable payoffs.

Interesting post. I completely agree with you. Unfortunately most people lump all of those together under QTEs. Glad to see you are not one of those. I definitely love well implemented context sensitive prompts in adventure games as well and agree that QTEs are mostly a distraction in more traditional genres. Here is hoping The Order has some real branching in those fights that don't all end with your death and they use those scenarios with restraint.

 

[Dark_castle]

Hey guys! What's wrong?

Same eyes.

 

[Booty Patrol]

 

[rdrr gnr]

But give me a third person shooter, or a racing game, or a hack and slash action RPG and I'm going to want to directly control those characters and make cinematic things happen through that finite, learn-able and master-able set of controls - and not just when the camera and control gets pulled away from me. I'm thinking emergent, systemic games, whether a GTA or a Halo - but they're built upon a finite set of controls and systems that interact, and provide a consistent set of rules for the player to exploit, and that lead to amazing fucking videos that get shared online.

So yeah, I definitely prefer that to cinematics and QTEs. But all the same, I'm open to having my mind changed. I mentioned digging God of War, and I loved Max Payne, but while those had plenty of cinematics, most of the time it was the gameplay setups that provided the biggest and more memorable payoffs.

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but there is also a bit of novelty to QTEs. Not every potential scenario fully utilizes that finite and systemic set of controls that otherwise dictate the game's action. So the question then becomes whether one wants to be the passive viewer of a cinematic sequence or wishes for some minor input via QTE. It's not so much an undermining of game systems as it is the acknowledgment of its limitations. Nine times out of ten I'd rather not participate and just watch some action play out, but those that are hellbent against any sort of QTE seem to think any scenario in which a game's system is not capable of exploring should be removed all together.

 

[LightofRohan]

Yea, it is a bit odd (fixed):

(probably didn't complete the facial animation in that scene)

 

[FeiRR]

If they can't think of an interesting and non-shallow mechanic for combat then they shouldn't bother. So far this melee stuff looks like a rapid choose-your-own-adventure minigame with scripted paths. If that's what it is(and we don't know for sure what it is yet, since they're so bloody vague and roundabout whenever they talk) then it doesn't sound like it'll be very interesting at all.

How would I imagine something better in terms of game mechanics? Well, basically, if I went through a bunch of potential concepts for an expanded melee system and my final concept was a QTE tree with animations then I'd scrap the entire thing completey and focus on creating good gameplay systems elsewhere, since at that point it would be evident I was creating the melee system for the visuals and animations, and not the other way around.

Which is how games should be made. Unfortunately, too many devs just seem more interested in replicating whatever blockbuster action choreography they recently saw in the cinema without sparing a though for how to make it engaging for the player beyond 'wow those graphics'. Judging by RAD's incessant comments about replicating films I fear they are taking this approach.

You wrote a lot of words which can be summarized in one sentence "I don't know". Why? Because there's no other way to introduce interactivity to cutscenes. Let me give you an example:

In typical gameplay (let's say you're playing a side-scroll platformer), you see visualization of the game world. Instead of e.g. X button shown explicitly there is a shelf hovering in the middle of the screen, then a gap and then another shelf. In order to succeed, you have to press X for jump to get from one shelf to another. It may give you some freedom as where to start the jump but the basic idea is similar to QTE: a certain response (button press) will let you carry on. Lack of or wrong response will make you die (fall).

Your question then could be: why not leave that response to the player? If you can do it in gameplay (good games are those with challenge, they don't give you button prompts outside of tutorials). And there lies the limitation of cutscenes: camera is not fixed and the rules of game environment (shelf = ok, gap = fall) aren't there. You would not know what to do in that situation. I bet people would complain a lot that a game is too confusing, the idea would fail as early as in focus tests. I actually know games which tried not to give you prompts in ever-changing environments: Dragon's Lair didn't have them. You had to figure it out yourself what to press. Many people found this game frustrating and too difficult. And it was in the times when you had ONE button and FOUR directions. Now imagine a modern joypad with over a dozen of them.

The solution is to keep cutscenes non-interactive or stick only to the gameplay or modify gameplay to look a bit more cinematic (Max Payne 3's way). But people like cinematic games so why not make them? I like challenging games but when I'm playing something like Heavy Rain or Beyond, I'm not looking for a challenge or question myself "will I be able to finish the game?" I know I will. Those games are experiences, not challenges. Because people like different media for their different taste.

I'm afraid we won't see any other way to interact with games outside of that "visual prompt-kinetic response" loop until technology allows other input than button presses and gestures (because, per principle, motion gaming is the same as controller input, just more awkward and less acurate). There is some hope in emotion reading, biometric feedback and such but, as you can see, companies aren't ready to implement that, even with devices like Kinect. We're simply not ready. Our technology is in the stage where we can immitate cinema and add interactivity to it. It hasn't been available for so long, not until BDs/big downloads became standard and 3D stopped looking like a mess. I think this generation will be all about adding more realizm to the presentation, introducing physics in a proper form, etc. And I'm fine with that. We have to be patient and not silly to want something which cannot happen yet.

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

Man I was looking through Vanquish to see examples of QTE in games I enjoyed, and I totally forgot how awesome the game was. If only more TPS took queues from it than generic TPS number 5.

Try to branch out a little do something visibly and radically different that seems fun.

I love Asura's Wrath and that game is full of QTEs, but is also full of AWESOME.

If I felt the need to nit-pick a game based on 5 minutes of ... whatever ... and couldn't find anything good to say about it, then I would probably move on from that game. I say probably, but I mean 'would':

Diablo 3 looks shit to me, I hate whatever type of game (lame!) that it's supposed to be. There I said it. That's the first time I said it, anywhere.

But I just don't want to play Diablo 3. I don't want to waste my time nit-picking Diablo 3, or (apart from that one time just there) and I don't want to tell people who like Diablo 3 that the game they like is actually shit (lol lolo ll ol o)

I'm a human who knows what a human should look like, obviously the eyes will pop out at me in that scene. Uncanny valley and all that. The more realistic the look they go for, the littlest of changes from normality will stick out like a sore thumb.

Mate, they aren't people, they're characters in a videogame who fight monsters with daft guns. Anyway, none of these moustached characters are as uncanny as that guy in your avatar. I know who I'd rather go for a drink with (that claw-scarred girl with the tache)

 

[benny_a]

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

oh god! those eyes are sticking out like sore thumbs! Sort yourselves out, RAD!

 

[Sorc3r3r]

I want to welcome RaD in the awesome world of the AAA games with this thread as gift for their debut.
I am trying to figure if they are laughing to some of these replies or they are begining to understand the pressure that an AAA game brings.
Expectations are sky high guys, for this seems to be the 1st full nextgen game we have seen.
Keep calm and work hard.

 

[Principate]

I love Asura's Wrath and that game is full of QTEs, but is also full of AWESOME.

If I felt the need to nit-pick a game based on 5 minutes of ... whatever ... and couldn't find anything good to say about it, then I would probably move on from that game. I say probably, but I mean 'would':

Diablo 3 looks shit to me, I hate whatever type of game (lame!) that it's supposed to be. There I said it. That's the first time I said it, anywhere.

But I just don't want to play Diablo 3. I don't want to waste my time nit-picking Diablo 3, or (apart from that one time just there) and I don't want to tell people who like Diablo 3 that the game they like is actually shit (lol lolo ll ol o)

The difference you dislike the core genre behind that, that's not the same as s
someone that actually likes the genre but dislike the trend it it's going, that the majority seem to follow. I don't care for Baseball sports games or certain types of mmo's, but I also wouldn't bother commenting because it's a genre not remotely aimed and really shouldn't be aimed at me, because I don't enjoy the base concept of the game.

TPS are a genre I enjoy very much and certainly I'm not alone with the dislike of cinematic TPS that don't offer any tangible or visible gameplay improvements that look fun. So we'll complain hoping some developers will change their mind.

 

[Jacobi]

I want to welcome RaD in the awesome world of the AAA games with this thread as gift for their debut.
I am trying to figure if they are laughing to some of these replies or they are begining to understand the pressure that an AAA game brings.
Expectations are sky high guys, for this seems to be the 1st full nextgen game we have seen.
Keep calm and work hard.

I don't think that these posts matter. You don't sell millions by abiding to stupid GAF posts from people that probably don't even have a PS4 or don't buy games at launch.

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

The difference you dislike the core genre behind that, that's not the same as s
someone that actually likes the genre but dislike the trend it it's going, that the majority seem to follow. I don't care for Baseball sports games or certain types of mmo's, but I also wouldn't bother commenting because it's a genre not remotely aimed and really shouldn't be aimed at me, because I don't enjoy the base concept of the game.

TPS are a genre I enjoy very much and certainly I'm not alone with the dislike of cinematic TPS that don't offer any tangible or visible gameplay improvements that look fun. So we'll complain hoping some developers will change their mind.

Sorry! Only the first sentence was an actual reply to you, I went off on one after that!

 

[ItAintEasyBeinCheesy]

oh god! those eyes are sticking out like sore thumbs! Sort yourselves out, RAD!

Breaking the third wall. Looking into my soul.

 

[AltogetherAndrews]

I love Asura's Wrath and that game is full of QTEs, but is also full of AWESOME.

If I felt the need to nit-pick a game based on 5 minutes of ... whatever ... and couldn't find anything good to say about it, then I would probably move on from that game. I say probably, but I mean 'would':

Diablo 3 looks shit to me, I hate whatever type of game (lame!) that it's supposed to be. There I said it. That's the first time I said it, anywhere.

But I just don't want to play Diablo 3. I don't want to waste my time nit-picking Diablo 3, or (apart from that one time just there) and I don't want to tell people who like Diablo 3 that the game they like is actually shit (lol lolo ll ol o)

 

[Dark_castle]

This gif is fake. If you look closely, someone replaced Galahad's eyes.

 

[Messofanego]

Mate, they aren't people, they're characters in a videogame who fight monsters with daft guns. Anyway, none of these moustached characters are as uncanny as that guy in your avatar. I know who I'd rather go for a drink with (that claw-scarred girl with the tache)

But she's not a person. She's just a character in a videogame who fights monsters with daft guns. So why are you thinking of going for a drink with her? Is she your waifu now?

That's me in the avatar btw

 

[benny_a]

This gif is fake. If you look closely, someone replaced Galahad's eyes.

I swear I only edited the black bars out of it. Maybe the eyes are pronounced due to that?

 

[nelsonroyale]

This gif is fake. If you look closely, someone replaced Galahad's eyes.

I think this actually an updated version.

 

[thehunter01]

They've been saying over and over that there will be no difference between gameplay and cutscene graphics so unless they are lying we can expect this level of graphics during gameplay.

They can mean anything with graphics. Doesn't say much.

 

[G_Berry]

Amazing

 

[Arkham]

This gif is fake. If you look closely, someone replaced Galahad's eyes.

Which one is Galahad?

 

[Denzar]

Which one is Galahad?

The dude with the 'stache and 'burns.

This is like male hipsters, the game, right?

 

[luca_29_bg]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vGBDyWdBFE#t=82 new interview ^^

 

[ced]

So enough eyeball talk, do we know why the triangle icon is different over the guys head during that QTE than how it is when he chooses the knife?

 

[LilWayneSuckz]

In all seriousness, some people are being so nitpicky about this game that Sony probably isn't going to show as much until it's literally almost finished.

 

[AltogetherAndrews]

The dude with the 'stache and 'burns.

This is like male hipsters, the game, right?

The facial hair is much too controlled. Gives the impression that the characters care about style... which is absolutely anti-hipster.

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

Looks like benny_a has early access to the PS4's sharpening filter, with those eyes a' poppin' like that.

 

[Honey Bunny]

The dude with the 'stache and 'burns.

This is like male hipsters, the game, right?

Yes, hipsters ran rampant in Victorian London.

 

[kyser73]

Several years after The Order were disbanded, Galahad popped up in Toon Town...

 

[TheRealTalker]

I don't get why people are angry that they barely showed anything when similar games that where announced at E3 didn't get anything else beyond their teaser trailer *ahem Sunset Overdrive/Halo/Uncharted *ahem


Heck Quantum Break only got some small snippets too


Why is everyone on their neck... like hell this represents the whole game

 

[Phades]

Yes, hipsters ran rampant in Victorian London.

Back then, didn't they do a lot of things before they were cool though?

 

[benny_a]

I don't get why people are angry that they barely showed anything when similar games that where announced at E3 didn't get anything else beyond their teaser trailer *ahem Sunset Overdrive/Halo/Uncharted *ahem


Heck Quantum Break only got some small snippets too


Why is everyone on their neck... like hell this represents the whole game

I think it's important how you announce your game and gameplay, and I think The Order 1886 failed that.

The better option, in my mind, would have been to shut up about the game before you have a good segment of gameplay to show off.

 

[Ludicrous Speed]

Sometimes you'll press Square, but other times you'll press...TRIANGLE.

That is what it looks like. Triangle to grab knife, square to grab brick.

Gross.

 

[nycgamer4ever]

Hey guys! What's wrong?

Reminds me of Splinter Cell CT:

You guys do know that these knights are not normal human beings right, and that they live much longer. Maye they just have different shades in their eyes that make them look different than ours. Who knows. Either way I just want this game already.

 

[Denzar]

Yes, hipsters ran rampant in Victorian London.

Yes, of course. I was being very serious.