Yakuza Ishin: No Plans For A Western Release. (1 Year To Develop)

That's more or less what I was trying to convey, yeah. I'm always bad at being concise. :)

But yeah, even assuming it was the case that Atlus USA had that much free time and resources on its hands, the numbers have probably already spoken over the years about how well a Yakuza title typically does versus Atlus' most popular fare and I wouldn't be at all surprised if at least post-Persona 4 there's a solid precedence for believing their stuff is a safer bet when it comes to a return on investment. I really enjoy Yakuza myself like a lot of other people here and have recently been playing through 5, but that sort of game is really daunting from a time and money perspective to do a good localization job for. If you commit to bringing that over, you better be expecting to pay your translators to be working on it nonstop for at least a few months and we get expensive fast!



Miku games absolutely pale in comparison to a Yakuza game in terms of what needs to be done to make it functional in English by virtue of content differences. Every localization takes time and effort, especially from a technical perspective, but we're talking about the difference in scope between a rhythm game and a 40-plus-hour RPG with a lot of optional side content that can potentially double or triple that amount. I'm pretty certain there are more foreign Miku fans than there are foreign Yakuza fans at this point, but even if that's the case, I imagine the sheer cost proposition of localizing a Miku game when there's a known demand for it and making a profit on it is much more assured thing by comparison.

That and all the licensing involved with the yak titles.
 
I don't understand how they can just disregard NA so nonchalantly. Sega of Japan is such a joke of a company.

(Almost) Nobody in the US buying Yakuza games tends to make it easier for SoJ to not bother.

I'm sure the publisher is hearing the feedback, but it's from the same tiny group of people who have been buying the games all along. It's simply not enough to justify the cash and resources needed to localize these games-- and it's quite the effort to do so, as earlier posts have pointed out.

The indifference of the many outweighs the interest of a few.
 
Not surprised but man am I sad. I wish the would just sub them and have just digital downloads of the games.

Thats the whole problem which you seem to miss. The sheer amount of work that would go into localizing the title and budget required is the very reason why they dont want to touch it.

Just because it aint on physical media does not suddenly make it a cakewalk to produce.

Disappointing.
The game is really fun.

Btw impressions on your time with natural doctrine in the thread please, seeing that you are back now lol.
 
Were the Yakuza sales really that bad in the West? I can't imagine localisation to be that costly, especially compared to the relatively high initial development costs.
 
The fifth game in the yakuza franchise that is not localized, so this is not really a surprise.

Still ....

:'(
 
Thats the whole problem which you seem to miss. The sheer amount of work that would go into localizing the title and budget required is the very reason why they dont want to touch it.

Just because it aint on physical media does not suddenly make it a cakewalk to produce.

I know it would be time consuming however I thought if they didn't have to pay for disks, cases, manuals, and shipping that maybe it wouldn't be that bad to pay for translations. I have no idea what that would cost (and know that Yakuza games tend to have a ton of dialog) so I may be way off on this.
 
I know it would be time consuming however I thought if they didn't have to pay for disks, cases, manuals, and shipping that maybe it wouldn't be that bad to pay for translations. I have no idea what that would cost (and know that Yakuza games tend to have a ton of dialog) so I may be way off on this.

its not just translation as stated its full on production once again which isnt cheap.
 
Is it simply not worth it to translate the game and release it in the west? Or is this just an example bad business management by Sega?

They spent a lot of marketing money on the first Yakuza, gave it a top notch voice cast, and it was a total bomb. For Yakuza 2, they scaled back the marketing, subtitled it instead of dubbing it, and it was a bomb. So the series died in the US the for the first time

People scream at Sega for ages to bring Yakuza 3 over. So they finally relent, and it is a sales bomb. Not deterred by this, they not only commit to bringing Yakuza 4 over, they greenlight a game targeted more at western audiences (Dead Souls), and bring both games over. Neither game sells at all, and the series once again dies

Sega should absolutely not be bringing these games over. They never make money, and it's not like they haven't tried. The market has spoken, and has no desire for these games.
 
They spent a lot of marketing money on the first Yakuza, gave it a top notch voice cast, and it was a total bomb. For Yakuza 2, they scaled back the marketing, subtitled it instead of dubbing it, and it was a bomb. So the series died in the US the for the first time

People scream at Sega for ages to bring Yakuza 3 over. So they finally relent, and it is a sales bomb. Not deterred by this, they not only commit to bringing Yakuza 4 over, they greenlight a game targeted more at western audiences (Dead Souls), and bring both games over. Neither game sells at all, and the series once again dies

Sega should absolutely not be bringing these games over. They never make money, and it's not like they haven't tried. The market has spoken, and has no desire for these games.

You sure have a funny idea of what "top notch" is with the voice work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pcd1FERb70E#t=283

okay.
They will be a little harsh.
My time with it got progressively worse, as I don't think a game has tested my patience like ND in a very long time.

Its appreciated nonetheless as you are another of the rare few of us who have actually played the game.

dont really blame you either considering how the mechanics work. its either stick with it or wind up throwing the vita into the fucking wall lol.
 
it was such a giant fucking mistake to waste resources on dead souls...
I like Dead Souls but even i agree resources should have remained on the mainline titles.

Keep the tradition of not giving us the spin offs but always give us the main series. :(

RIP Yakuza in the west. It was nice not having to import you each time
 
Yakuza Ishin much like Yakuza 5, will not be coming to the west. A recent Sega interview with Gamingbolt reveled that there are no plans to bring the series outside of Japan.

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Doesn't change the fact that they spent the money. They had high hopes for the game.

Which wasn't needed. They burnt money in an area where they could get much better quality for a cheaper cast. Look at the games that are generally considered as having the best voice acting. Games developed by studios like Naughty Dog and Rockstar. How many of them are filled with well known celebrities?
 
Fuck this company for not losing money.

Hopefully Sony approaches them to lose the money themselves.

Indeed. It's understandable to be disappointed about the lack of localization, but it's full-on ridiculous to be angry that a company won't throw away (more) money for a relative handful of fans.

Maybe Sony will foot the bill. Maybe there should be one of those Kickstarter campaigns that are so popular these days. But it would be fiscally irresponsible of SEGA to keep spending cash on the localization of a series that just hasn't sold well in this territory.
 
still say they should have released Ishin for the PS4 here as there was, and still is no competition. Surely it would have easily made back the translation costs.
 
Which wasn't needed. They burnt money in an area where they could get much better quality for a cheaper cast. Look at the games that are generally considered as having the best voice acting. Games developed by studios like Naughty Dog and Rockstar. How many of them are filled with well known celebrities?

Rockstar? The company that hired Ray Liotta, Burt Reynolds, Dennis Hopper, Danny Trejo and Gary Busey for Vice City? And this was years before Naughty Dog was making Narrative based games- they were still doing the Jak and Daxter series back then.
 
Just one of the many reasons I'm learning Japanese

Perhaps by the time you learn Japanese there will be no more Yakuza games. :p

But seriously i think the shrinking Japanese market alone cannot sustain the constantly rising production costs for games like Yakuza IMO.
If Sega will continue being incapable to promote and market the games properly outside Japan then this series will soon cease to exist.
 
What's the worst quandary out of these two.

1. Knowing there isn't another Shenmue
2. Knowing there is several Yakuza games that you cant play
 
So Sega is only interested in selling shit Sonic titles to kids and parents who don't know any better? Great, just when I thought Sega had something decent to offer in Yakuza, they cut off western audiences. Don't feel like importing.
 
So Sega is only interested in selling shit Sonic titles to kids and parents who don't know any better? Great, just when I thought Sega had something decent to offer in Yakuza, they cut off western audiences. Don't feel like importing.

No, they are interested in selling PC games like Total War, Company of Heroes, and Football Manager. They are also interested in updating their classic games for new platforms (Sega 3D classics on 3DS, the iOS versions of Sonic done by Christian Whitehead with new content), bringing untested IPs overseas (Hatsune Miku), and making some licensed games based on big name properties (Aliens).

I'd argue Sega is actually one of the better publishers out there today. Just because YOUR FAVORITE GAME isn't coming out in America doesn't make them a bad company.
 
Rockstar? The company that hired Ray Liotta, Burt Reynolds, Dennis Hopper, Danny Trejo and Gary Busey for Vice City? And this was years before Naughty Dog was making Narrative based games- they were still doing the Jak and Daxter series back then.

And they stopped doing that as well and it's generally agreed upon that the voice acting from their games this past gen is better than it was during the PS2 era. Jak was also fairly story oriented and was praised for its voice acting, but they still didn't hire well known actors for the roles.

My point isn't that you can't hire well known actors and get quality results, it's that those actors aren't needed to achieve it. Sega and that series would've been better off if they would've hired standard gaming, anime and cartoon voice actors while putting the rest of that money into marketing the game.
 
My point isn't that you can't hire well known actors and get quality results, it's that those actors aren't needed to achieve it. Sega and that series would've been better off if they would've hired standard gaming, anime and cartoon voice actors while putting the rest of that money into marketing the game.

the idea behind that was that they hire well known actors just like they cast well known actors in hollywood. to put faces on posters and sell the name of the actors. They were going Tarantino -style with the advertisements and wanted an ensemble cast that would appeal to movie going audiences.

Not to get a good performance out of them normal voice actors couldn't do.
 
And they stopped doing that as well and it's generally agreed upon that the voice acting from their games this past gen is better than it was during the PS2 era. Jak was also fairly story oriented and was praised for its voice acting, but they still didn't hire well known actors for the roles.

My point isn't that you can't hire well known actors and get quality results, it's that those actors aren't needed to achieve it. Sega and that series would've been better off if they would've hired standard gaming, anime and cartoon voice actors while putting the rest of that money into marketing the game.

You do realize Yakuza was a PS2 game? And they did spend money on marketing that first game. (http://www.1up.com/features/story-yakuza-franchise). And that game came out at a time when even 2nd rate open world crime games like Saint's Row and Scarface were selling well.
 
I know it would be time consuming however I thought if they didn't have to pay for disks, cases, manuals, and shipping that maybe it wouldn't be that bad to pay for translations. I have no idea what that would cost (and know that Yakuza games tend to have a ton of dialog) so I may be way off on this.

I'll try to give you a very vague idea of what I would probably charge as a freelancer if I was contracted to do a game like Yakuza. Let's take a look at this now increasingly cliche image that puts into perspective the word and character counts for the first three Trails in the Sky games. I'm fairly certain a Yakuza game isn't quite that wordy, but they're definitely up there, so we'll just use the Trails in the Sky figures as a rough estimate since it's difficult to directly ascertain character counts for a Yakuza game as someone not actually working on one.


I can't speak for salaried employees like (I assume) people who work at Atlus, as I've never worked for them, but for a typical text-based freelancing job, I normally charge somewhere in the neighborhood of $0.05 USD to $0.10 USD per Japanese character depending on the volume of the work and the nature of it. These are pretty standard rates for people that actually want to be able to feed themselves. Often times it goes on the lower end of the scale because the sheer volume of work I might get from a given client is enough to just outright offer them that sort of discounted rate to ensure I have work coming in, especially since I'm pretty good about getting stuff done in a timely manner, but sometimes it hits the higher end, especially if it's a smaller one-off job where I really do need to maximize my revenue in the short term to make it worth my time to work on that versus other work.

If a game like Yakuza were to clock in at the first Trails in the Sky's 1.5 million characters and I was (somewhat implausibly) asked to do it by myself, that job could cost Sega $75,000 if I charge them at that minimum $0.05 USD per word. That might look pretty high, especially considering that, again, a Yakuza game probably isn't that wordy. So let's maintain that $0.05 USD rate, but cut the word count by half, down to 750,000 characters. I would probably be at least a little surprised if the figure came in that low, but let's go with it for the sake of simpler math. That's still going to cost Sega $37,500 and, again, that's if we use my lowest normal rate. They can reduce the wait time by throwing more translators at it and giving each individual person less work to do, but it's not like anybody is going to take a serious pay cut in that scenario. It'll ultimately be a matter of several months of, at minimum, eight-hour work days until a sufficient final English script is ready to be submitted. I think I read somewhere that once localization work began on Yakuza 3, the proper translation process took something like 9 months. If we use that $37,500 figure, this amounts to about $4100 a month and if you've got at least two translators working on it, which is likely, that means you're paying them about $2050. That's hardly ideal, but I guess not entirely out of the question depending on who's being hired. I've definitely been undercut before by especially cheap translators that emphasize sheer speed over a quality bar that at least precludes coherence.

Now you might be thinking to yourself that Sega can make back those translation costs by just selling a few thousand copies. But as I and Parakeetman have been saying, translators aren't the only people you need to pay in order to bring a localization to market. Somebody also has to be paid to transplant that English script back into the game, which can still be a bit of an ordeal as some companies still don't plan ahead for localizations while developing the base game. After all, game localizations don't just entail changing the text to a Latin script, but they also routinely include graphic edits (e.g.: menu options, etc.) and technical modifications to account for the logistics of how that Latin script is processed and rendered differently in a computer compared to an Asian one like Japanese (e.g.: changing the byte type for character encoding, font kerning, etc.). Then somebody (or more like multiple people) has to be paid to test the English version of the game to make sure the localization didn't break something and if something does break, which is to be expected, then either the translator and other the other production members involved have to be brought in to fix things, whether the solution requires a script modification, glitch fix, or something else entirely. That process continues and everyone involves obviously keeps getting paid to work on it as necessary. Then after all of that, you get to pay for the certification process with Sony or whichever console maker you're working with and then if you still have money after all that, you get to pay for publishing and distribution to actually get it into the hands of the public. Bear in mind that even if you go completely digital, the console makers are likely still going to take a cut for every purchase made on their digital store and if they have technical requirements like drafting up an electronic manual, somebody has to be paid to go and make those things too before the game can come out. Also note that I haven't even included the costs of hiring voice actors or licensing the original Japanese assets to reuse them overseas as the Yakuza games normally do, neither of which is going to be particularly cheap on top of everything else that actually has to be done to make a game localization functional and playable.

None of those people involved in all of that work are going to be willing to do their respective jobs for free out of the kindness of their hearts, even if they want to help bring those games over as badly as the foreign fans want to play them. Again, everyone has to get paid enough to be able to feed themselves and keep a roof over their heads. As I've hopefully shown with a translator, it's not that hard to be pushing survivability issues once your rate is at a low enough figure and they're only one part of a much bigger equation. A lot of those other people in addition to the translators are probably getting paid full-time salaried wages, so it's pretty easy to see the overall budget for a localization ballooning to be at least several times just what the translators alone cost.

Again, it's hard to know the specific costs for a game like Yakuza without actually being involved and there's definitely some back and forth in terms of overall payment and completion timelines as a freelance translator because both sides are interested in getting the work done. But they each have their own needs that have to be addressed in order to undertake the work comfortably and satisfying those needs gets pricey fast.

Hopefully my insight helps a little!
 
I don't know about you but I would have thought a gangster/mob/yakuza open world, violet game would sell more units then a kawaii niche music game. But hey this is sega. Still waiting on a Phantasy Star Online 2

You really thought a brawler would sell more than a animu/waifu game? Really? Reeeeeally?
 
You would think even Sega's inept marketing team could sell a game about samurai doing samurai shit. Put a gun and half-naked chick on the cover, call it "Call of Daimyo" and it'll sell just fine. Polygon will run a story about how awful it is because of the girl on the cover, but nobody gives a shit what they have to say about it anyway.
 
These people are releasing a Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA 2 in the West.

I don't know about you but I would have thought a gangster/mob/yakuza open world, violet game would sell more units then a kawaii niche music game. But hey this is sega. Still waiting on a Phantasy Star Online 2

Well, it obviously must not have.

You would think even Sega's inept marketing team could sell a game about samurai doing samurai shit. Put a gun and half-naked chick on the cover, call it "Call of Daimyo" and it'll sell just fine. Polygon will run a story about how awful it is because of the girl on the cover, but nobody gives a shit what they have to say about it anyway.

So, were you giving yourself a handjob during or after the writing of this post?
 
I like Dead Souls but even i agree resources should have remained on the mainline titles.

Keep the tradition of not giving us the spin offs but always give us the main series. :(

RIP Yakuza in the west. It was nice not having to import you each time

i liked it too but i know a huge mistake when i see one. even more so considering the games shooting mechanics were quite terrible for the most part and thats the first thing everyone is going to rip it over. therefore losing the "casuals" and even then its not like the hardcore fans are so numerous that it would have made the title profitable, with those who even did then decide to pick it up.

Truthfully im pretty certain that the game was more of a "test bed" to allow the team to try different things as a third person shooter, which said experience was to be used in Binary Domain.
 
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