Super Smash Bros. for 3DS & Wii U Thread 7: How Can My Smash Brother Be This Cut

Perhaps the random challenger vs champ game won't be a standard affair.

Maybe they'll use the situation to show of something like a competitive adventure mode or something. Maybe coin battle part deux.
 
That's all true, but the Pro Player would go in knowing that this game isn't going to be Melee and adjust accordingly.

How are they going to "adjust" during the damn tourney?

Adjusting would require them to quickly learn the physics of the game and find out which characters benefit most from them overall.
 
Which has to be altered to each game, if you fool around trying to do stuff you did in Melee that you did in Smash 64 you will get fucked up. If you do stuff that you tried to do in Melee in Brawl, you will get fucked up. My friend was a beast with Luigi in Melee and had to drop him in Brawl. Hell Sakurai screwed with edge guarding in this game, so there goes a big chunk of competitive strategy right there, if they fool around thinking they can do that they could end up losing a stock if they don't do their research with all the physics.

Yes, this is why Mango isn't winning a Brawl tournament or Nairo isn't winning a Melee tournament.
How this is going to matter in a game that doesn't even have an established metagame yet, especially when one player will have a lot more skill AND more experience with the game, you have yet to explain.
 
Which has to be altered to each game, if you fool around trying to do stuff you did in Melee that you did in Smash 64 you will get fucked up. If you do stuff that you tried to do in Melee in Brawl, you will get fucked up. My friend was a beast with Luigi in Melee and had to drop him in Brawl. Hell Sakurai screwed with edge guarding in this game, so there goes a big chunk of competitive strategy right there, if they fool around thinking they can do that they could end up losing a stock if they don't do their research with all the physics.

I'm not talking about shit that's Melee specific, I'm talking about things that are universal to not just every version of Smash Bros., but almost every fighting game (if not every competitive video game) ever. The pro player just has a much better understanding of that shit compared to the average scrub.
 
How are they going to "adjust" during the damn tourney?

Adjusting would require them to quickly learn the physics of the game and find out which characters benefit most from them overall.
I'm just saying they're not going to jump into the game, immediately start trying to wave dash and when it doesn't work go "What the fuck! It's not working!" They're going to understand it's a game with different physics. They've gotten where they are by being able to break down a game to it's fundamentals and, while this isn't Melee (or whatever game they play professionally), they're definitely doing to pick up on things a lot quicker than someone who plays the game with friends who are "pretty good" (meaning, players like me). They're not going to be firing on all cylinders, but they're going to be damn good.
 
How are they going to "adjust" during the damn tourney?

Adjusting would require them to quickly learn the physics of the game and find out which characters benefit most from them overall.
I mean yeah, it's a factor. It takes time to unlearn old habits and exploit new things about the game. But someone with an already higher basic understanding of Smash Bros. has a much better shot at that than a random person who's only ever been able to get decent at any of the 3-4 previous games. I think the idea you're talking about though holds some merit, and it's why we won't necessarily see the current best Melee or Brawl players beat everyone. Among experienced veterans, it's kinda up in the air for this first event. But adjusting is what fighting game players do. It's a common characteristic of higher level play.

You're also making the assumption that they'll be playing for the first time ever during the tournament. That seems pretty likely, but it also seems reasonably possible that they'd let the players try out the game and the characters, in order to put on a better show for everyone.
 
How are they going to "adjust" during the damn tourney?

Adjusting would require them to quickly learn the physics of the game and find out which characters benefit most from them overall.

You would be surprised. There is this real story about the ValleCC in SFA2, a advanced tech that only Alex Valle knew about. His opponent John Choi managed to figure out the tech in the middle of the set and use it against him.
 
You would be surprised. There is this real story about the ValleCC in SFA2, a advanced tech that only Alex Valle knew about. His opponent John Choi managed to figure out the tech in the middle of the set and use it against him.
Is there footage of that? That sounds awesome.
 
Alright, so I've decided tomorrow will be a new stage shown off. A Starfox stage for the WiiU.

Also, hello SmashGAF. I'm new, please don't hurt me.

Quick recap of myself for you to form opinions on.

I would love to see Wonder Red playable. I expect 48-49 characters. I primarily played as Kirby, Luigi, and Dedede in each smash game.

This was a hopeful (and totally improbable) roster of mine I made a few weeks back.

WGn4bDJ.png


Yes, I actually believe that Sega and Nintendo are buddies enough to let another Sonic character in.

Welcome to SmashGaf, leave your sanity at the door please.
 
How much money do "pro" smash players make? Always been curious about that.
It's hard to say exactly. I know our locals usually give about 100-300 bucks for singles, and usually about 2/3 for teams. Sometimes those happen every other weekend, other times we can go about a month without having any. A top player can (and around here, does) always win those.

Mango got ~2500? for Evo, and PP got 5200 for Apex. Big tournaments have pretty varying pot sizes/bonuses. Of course, even for the elite they can find themselves placing down to 7th or 9th sometimes. There are usually a few big tournaments a year. You also have to take out travel costs, since there's a plane ticket involved in many cases. It's hard to gauge with any sort of certainty. If I had to guess I'd say the top 5 probably make enough to call it a living, but not enough that it would be a salary to get excited about.

That doesn't even consider sponsorship. I have no idea how that all works.

Regardless of how much they make, it must be nice to get payed to travel and compete. There are plenty of scrubs like me that go out to these things and only ever lose money. :)
 
Asuming they do nothing from 9 to 5, I guess so.

But seriously, these guys have other jobs and lives beside smash, few of them have the luxury to work at smash related thing from 9-5.

What other jobs do they have? I know m2k says his family is poor and doesn't have insurance. Sounds like all he does is play smash and doesn't work.
 
What other jobs do they have? I know m2k says his family is poor and doesn't have insurance. Sounds like all he does is play smash and doesn't work.

M2K is the exception in that all his money does actually come from Smash, I think.
this being said, he travels fucking everyone and takes everyone's money in Melee, Brawl, and Project M, so there's that
 
M2K is the exception in that all his money does actually come from Smash, I think.
this being said, he travels fucking everyone and takes everyone's money in Melee, Brawl, and Project M, so there's that

Doesn't he accept money matches by anyone? I think I heard that some time back. Should make a nice few quids at tournaments. Still, being a SSBM Pro brings in a laughable amount of money when compared to big eSports games.
 
It's hard to say exactly. I know our locals usually give about 100-300 bucks for singles, and usually about 2/3 for teams. Sometimes those happen every other weekend, other times we can go about a month without having any. A top player can (and around here, does) always win those.

Mango got ~2500? for Evo, and PP got 5200 for Apex. Big tournaments have pretty varying pot sizes/bonuses. Of course, even for the elite they can find themselves placing down to 7th or 9th sometimes. There are usually a few big tournaments a year. You also have to take out travel costs, since there's a plane ticket involved in many cases. It's hard to gauge with any sort of certainty. If I had to guess I'd say the top 5 probably make enough to call it a living, but not enough that it would be a salary to get excited about.

That doesn't even consider sponsorship. I have no idea how that all works.

Regardless of how much they make, it must be nice to get payed to travel and compete. There are plenty of scrubs like me that go out to these things and only ever lose money. :)

Forgot about sponsers. Curious how much they get from them.
 
Doesn't he accept money matches by anyone? I think I heard that some time back. Should make a nice few quids at tournaments. Still, being a SSBM Pro brings in a laughable amount of money when compared to big eSports games.

Yes he does, in fact most of the top players do this. Money matching a good player is a good way to learn some stuff about your own play and at the same time easy money for them.
 
Yes he does, in fact most of the top players do this. Money matching a good player is a good way to learn some stuff about your own play and at the same time easy money for them.

It's not so good for top Marvel players that MM Nemo though ;)

Doesn't he accept money matches by anyone? I think I heard that some time back. Should make a nice few quids at tournaments. Still, being a SSBM Pro brings in a laughable amount of money when compared to big eSports games.

well yeah, the FGC as a whole is poverty after all :P
 
It's hard to say exactly. I know our locals usually give about 100-300 bucks for singles, and usually about 2/3 for teams. Sometimes those happen every other weekend, other times we can go about a month without having any. A top player can (and around here, does) always win those.

Mango got ~2500? for Evo, and PP got 5200 for Apex. Big tournaments have pretty varying pot sizes/bonuses. Of course, even for the elite they can find themselves placing down to 7th or 9th sometimes. There are usually a few big tournaments a year. You also have to take out travel costs, since there's a plane ticket involved in many cases. It's hard to gauge with any sort of certainty. If I had to guess I'd say the top 5 probably make enough to call it a living, but not enough that it would be a salary to get excited about.

That doesn't even consider sponsorship. I have no idea how that all works.

Regardless of how much they make, it must be nice to get payed to travel and compete. There are plenty of scrubs like me that go out to these things and only ever lose money. :)

Bold: Top player have most of, if not all, their travel expenses covered.

Only speaking to Melee here, as that's the game I have experience with.

It's hard to say for sure, because it's varied over time. Back in the MLG days (2005-2007) some pots were as high as 10,000. I remember Ken saying he'd made nearly 100,000$ on smash over the span of his career. Certainly nothing that he can rest on for long, but it's pretty damn good considering. Of course, Ken was the best for ages, no one else has sustained that level of dominance. Melee is gaining lots of momentum now, so we're starting to see pots in that wheel house again. I would hazard a guess that the best smashers now pull 20K a year.
 
Is there footage of that? That sounds awesome.

Yeah, but it's hard to undestand what is happening for most people

http://youtu.be/ykP6lFCvdHM?t=1h18m29s

What it's happening is that there is a thing called Custom Combo, when you do that your character glows and you can link many moves in a row (something you cant do normaly)

So Alex Valle starts a custom combo close to Choi, the flash stuns Choi's character for a little while, enough for Alex to use a low attack to go through Choi's block (it happens at 1:21:30) Basically,if Choi is not already blocking low when the flash happens, he is getting hit and eating a full combo and then some.

Later in the match you see Choi trying this and getting a free combo on Valle too, he loses that round though. He does it again a few more times in the match.
 
Bold: Top player have most of, if not all, their travel expenses covered.

Only speaking to Melee here, as that's the game I have experience with.

It's hard to say for sure, because it's varied over time. Back in the MLG days (2005-2007) some pots were as high as 10,000. I remember Ken saying he'd made nearly 100,000$ on smash over the span of his career. Certainly nothing that he can rest on for long, but it's pretty damn good considering. Of course, Ken was the best for ages, no one else has sustained that level of dominance. Melee is gaining lots of momentum now, so we're starting to see pots in that wheel house again. I would hazard a guess that the best smashers now pull 20K a year.

maybe across one game, but M2K probably earns a fair bit more across Melee/Brawl/Project M these days

also M2K wants Ridley in, so he sucks anyway and why do we even care about him /s
 
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And that was during the Golden Age of MLG in 2006.

We in the Platinum Age now. Melee will have million dollar tourneys soon like DOTA 2 just watch.
 
Yeah, but it's hard to undestand what is happening for most people

http://youtu.be/ykP6lFCvdHM?t=1h18m29s

What it's happening is that there is a thing called Custom Combo, when you do that your character glows and you can link many moves in a row (something you cant do normaly)

So Alex Valle starts a custom combo close to Choi, the flash stuns Choi's character for a little while, enough for Alex to use a low attack to go through Choi's block (it happens at 1:21:30) Basically,if Choi is not already blocking low when the flash happens, he is getting hit and eating a full combo and then some.

Later in the match you see Choi trying this and getting a free combo on Valle too, he loses that round though. He does it again a few more times in the match.
I have a little knowledge of pro Street Fighter gameplay, so I've heard of that (I use Juri in SSF4, and she sort of has an offshoot of that). That's crazy cool! Thanks for the share.
 
I think a low level player can win a tournament pre-release. It happened in Marvel 3, and Brawl to Smash 4 is similar in concept to Marvel 2 to Marvel 3.
 
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