Is anyone else concerned about Far Cry 4's villain? (LGBT issue + mild spoilers)
- Thread starter Garrett Hawke
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TheChillyAcademic
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Just watched the reveal trailer and...I'm at a loss here.
I'm gay myself, quite gay, and I fail to see what besides the possible mention of shoes might lead one into believing that he's....gay?
What in the actual fuck.
He's insane, he's narcissistic, and he has fantastic fashion sense. So what if he's straight or gay? If anything, he reminded me of Heath Ledger's Joker.
I just dont see it.
I'm gay myself, quite gay, and I fail to see what besides the possible mention of shoes might lead one into believing that he's....gay?
What in the actual fuck.
He's insane, he's narcissistic, and he has fantastic fashion sense. So what if he's straight or gay? If anything, he reminded me of Heath Ledger's Joker.
I just dont see it.
Resident_UA
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Auto-Reply
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The cover looked more excentric to me than gay, some people just like to dress fancy and stand out .. like Elton John.
InsaneTiger
Member
If one is a member of the LGBT community can one be a member of the straight community?
It's ok to advocate for more LGBT representation in heroic roles in games. I'm fully behind that. But condemning upcoming game villains based on no information other than attempting to frame the villain into preconceived stereotypes to label that villain as a gay man is pretty fucked.
And telling developers that LGBT villains are off limits until a pre-determined number of them are represented across all gaming in heroic roles is equally fucked.
Garrett Hawke
Member
Elton John is gay.
So now game developers are only allowed to use LGBT characters if they are the heroes? Ridiculous. Imagine if a racial minority requested the same thing.
Death Penalty
Member
For my part, I see less trivialization and more warnings at caution in this particular thread. There is so little information to go on, we don't know this character's entire role in the story or even his orientation. It's just too early to be concerned, and indicates oversensitivity to my eyes. Even if he does turn out to be gay and a villain, is that really such a problem if he's a well-written and meaningful addition to the story? Far Cry 3 had great villains, and I expect Far Cry 4 will as well.
I would also like to mention that it is a little bit ironic that the OP assumes this character is gay because of stereotyping. I suppose it's only natural to be on your guard about such things when you see them and they're often harmful, but flamboyance in villains who are never indicated to be homosexual isn't new at all, and this guy isn't even playing it particularly flamboyant yet beyond his appearance.
Haloid1177
Banned
So LGBT characters can't be villains (and all this based on one we know nothing about). Got it, good talk.
Deified Data
Banned
I'd have to see this hypothetical movie. You're basically banking on the fact that it's outside the realm of possibility for a black man to genuinely antagonize a group of white people. If every movie being made in the country worked around this dynamic I'd agree with you that it was a problem, but one among thousands? How many gays stand as antagonists in video games (as opposed to straights) that you view it as a potentially institutionalized problem?
curlyfries
Neo Member
OP reminds me of a gay professor I had. He was one of my favorite professors. But any time a character showed any tiny (stereotypical) sign of being gay, he would share his belief to the class that the character was indeed gay. And this would happen with just about every piece of literature. The class would generally sigh and just let him do his thing.
I don't find the antagonist of Far Cry 4 gay, but who knows. And really.. who cares? I think that a gay villain would be awesome! Any representation of a gay character is great. Not to mention they should not be limited to protagonists just because they're under-represented.
I don't find the antagonist of Far Cry 4 gay, but who knows. And really.. who cares? I think that a gay villain would be awesome! Any representation of a gay character is great. Not to mention they should not be limited to protagonists just because they're under-represented.
Gamers are smart enough to differentiate the difference between hating the villain in FC4 and hating gay people.
You're create a fake narrative for FC4 to further your personal agenda when it is not warranted at all.
What's mighty whitey about the protagonist outside of his skin tone? He's not a western culture protagonist. Is it no longer about the western white male being protagonists and now it's moved to anyone from any culture that happens to be of light skin tone shouldn't be a protagonist?
Jackie Chan is looking pretty light skinned these days. I guess he's out of the possible protagonist pool then?
This. Besides, regardless of sexual preference, what stylishly insane bad guy wouldnt get mad at messing up his shoes?
Remember Kefka? He got pissed at someone getting sand on his boots IN THE DESERT.
According how people from the US define race he's not white at all.
UnwrittenZero
Member
Um he's from that country he is returning to spread his mothers ashes.
How DARE you call this woman a dude just because she looks masculine?! You gender-racist!
Orthogonal
Member
It is fiction, who cares. There are plenty of straight guy, meat-head dudebro tropes and no one gets offended. It's a game, and no one will think less of gays if there is a stereotypical gay guy who happens to be a villain. Maybe he's an eccentric straight. Doesn't matter. It is just something to give the game story some flair.
Farcry is becoming it's own cliche and carving it's own brand of edgy and extreme narrative presentation.
Farcry is becoming it's own cliche and carving it's own brand of edgy and extreme narrative presentation.
I dunno, maybe I just have greater faith in the average gamer, but I hope most won't automatically think antagonist = homosexual hence homosexuals = bad. He looks to be an awesome villain, so maybe that would elevate the impression that some people have of homosexuals if anything, I mean Vaas for example was considerably liked based on what I've read. Having said all that, I'm still not so sure that the character is actually homosexual, he certainly doesn't "sound" like it at all, unlike with some of South Park's depictions of homosexuals for example.
T.M. MacReady
NO ONE DENIES MEMBER
I would also wager given the history of this franchise's villains (Jackal, Vaas, and to a lesser extent Col. Sloan), he'll be remembered first and foremost as a memorable character than for his sexuality.
Good, well written villains often become beloved figures. Why does everyone assume people will hate FC4's if he is gay?
Thread full of irony.
Good, well written villains often become beloved figures. Why does everyone assume people will hate FC4's if he is gay?
Thread full of irony.
BloodMoney
Banned
Oh man... nice twist. Will there be next-gen scissoring?
ab.aeterno
Member
What are both sides, exactly? Especially if we're taking about more than this thread and whether people agree or disagree with the OP's specific argument?
If you can't contribute anything except misusing a quote, then maybe, yeah.
You're not the only one doing it, but that doesn't mean you're not doing something both unproductive and, iirc, skirting the rules on thread whining.This whole thread is based on whining. In addition, I actually provided an answer rather than doing a driveby. However, Iove how you singled out my post though
And this thread isn't whining, it's putting forth concerns and arguments. Agree with it or not, it's not whining to say "hey this might be problematic."
Give me a break, you're not seriously arguing this, are you?
War Raichu
Member
so since the guy was confirmed to not be white (something that was painfully obvious to people that didn't just look at his skin), people are trying to make a stink about his *possible* sexuality now?
I want to shoot all races, genders and sexual orientations in the head equally. It seems a bit hypocritical to complain about the lack of gay characters in video games but then complain when there is a villain who happens to be gay. If gays can be protagonists then they can also be villains. Trying to say that minority groups should only be represented by positive characters is ridiculous. I haven't noticed a trend of gay villains in games, so it's hardly the time to start raising red flags and complaining about it when it isn't even an issue yet.
michaelius
Banned
Resident Evil 5 says hello
Seems like protagonists should be diverse but enemies can only be straight white caucassian males to not offend anybody. Oh and north koreans because they don't buy games anyway.
I didn't really get a sense that he was gay, I thought he was just a very flashy, charismatic and well, quite frankly an insane villain. That was one of the things that made Far Cry 3 so good, so Ubi is sticking with it.
At least that's what I thought when I saw the trailer, but then again, I wasn't really looking for things to get offended by.
At least that's what I thought when I saw the trailer, but then again, I wasn't really looking for things to get offended by.
Basically this. If the majority of the target audience is homophobic and sees the game as an anti-gay crusade, then it sucks but it's not against the law. Freedom of speech and freedom of expression protect even the most vitriolic and hateful of words. All we can do is express our concerns in a constructive manner. People are way too heated to discuss this actively in a constructive manner because we flat out don't have the facts yet. This topic will not accomplish anything but stir up the same controversy we complain about in terms of "crusading." This could very easily become a witch hunt over potentially nothing.
I agree that we should play it first. I'm definitely holding off on any judgements till I see more of the story.
BUT you are dead wrong about what we can or cannot complain about in regards to representation. We don't have to just deal with whatever we get. Having our voices heard is one of the only ways that representation will improve, so if a character is created in a bad way, you're damn right I'm gonna complain about it.
Brian_FETO
Banned
The reason it's so hard to introduce LGBT characters in games is because they are "damned if they do, damned if they don't". People want characters they can relate to, which is perfectly understandable and there should be more diverse characters in games.
But, whenever a character is created that is gay (or whatever underrepresented group), he or she is made out to be the final representation of this group in video games. "Is this ok? Is this how we/these people want to be represented?"
Now obviously if a sensitive topic is handled poorly then it deserves to be discussed, but to say that people should be worried that an evil character MIGHT be gay (he likes fashion, you're stereotyping him, you ENTITLED RACIST) is a bit over the top. If LGBT people are people
then they can play whatever positive or negative role they wish in the world.
If the game tried to make this character a "scary, abnormal Gay dictator" that forces the "evil LGBT agenda" on the "good, American people who are straight" then yes, be afraid, be very afraid. However, that doesn't appear to be the case
But, whenever a character is created that is gay (or whatever underrepresented group), he or she is made out to be the final representation of this group in video games. "Is this ok? Is this how we/these people want to be represented?"
Now obviously if a sensitive topic is handled poorly then it deserves to be discussed, but to say that people should be worried that an evil character MIGHT be gay (he likes fashion, you're stereotyping him, you ENTITLED RACIST) is a bit over the top. If LGBT people are people
they are
If the game tried to make this character a "scary, abnormal Gay dictator" that forces the "evil LGBT agenda" on the "good, American people who are straight" then yes, be afraid, be very afraid. However, that doesn't appear to be the case
I think that the problem is that you make him being gay his most important attribute. I look at him as a villain that happens to be gay (and who cares if he's straight or gay), while you see a gay villain. You would never look at the "usual" villains as being a straight villain, but rather just a villain, whose actions make him the villain.
If everybody would just accept that being gay isn't what solely defines a person, but is just one part of so many others that make up said person's personality, everything would be much easier.
If everybody would just accept that being gay isn't what solely defines a person, but is just one part of so many others that make up said person's personality, everything would be much easier.
CyberPunked
Member
No. Stop being so Liberal
captainpat
Member
Not sure whether the guy is gay but he's definitely queer coded.
LordOfChaos
Member
As a man of Indian descent I'm just hyped that there is a serious Indian protagonist, rather than the usual comedic sideshow.
But no, I'm not concerned about the OP. In fact I'd take it as a sign of progress. The way I see it this means the LGBT community is being treated more equally. Most villains I can think of are straight, if lgbt "good" characters are progress, I think so are cunning evil ones. Mind, there's a difference between someone being evil BECAUSE they are gay (which this game is not implying, of course), and an evil dude who just so happens to be gay (which is fine).
But no, I'm not concerned about the OP. In fact I'd take it as a sign of progress. The way I see it this means the LGBT community is being treated more equally. Most villains I can think of are straight, if lgbt "good" characters are progress, I think so are cunning evil ones. Mind, there's a difference between someone being evil BECAUSE they are gay (which this game is not implying, of course), and an evil dude who just so happens to be gay (which is fine).
Are you serious? What the fuck? People are sick.
As for your question, I just hope people are gonna be smarter than that and make the distinction between the bad intentions of the villain and his sexual orientation. But referring to what you just wrote about Watch Dogs... I wouldn't hold my breath.
Yeah, I think this as well. It seems like a lot of users here don't care or don't see it, which is good, but I hope their wider audience doesn't think badly of it :/
I wouldn't take anything the OP says seriously.
everything she has said, is based on assumptions, ignorance and stereotypes. I wouldn't put it past this poster to make stuff up to fit her argument.
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