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[DoktorEvil]

Again. Don't understand this. Lebron gets payback for a bad public moment 4 years ago- but it's cool that tony parker cheated on his wife?

The way we evaluate lebron publicly is on a completely different scale than anyone else

If Tony Parker made some brash declaration that the Spurs were going to be 7 time world champs when all said and done at the end of his career, I'd hate him just as much.

You're confusing a situation that's between TP, Eva, and his cheater than something LBJ openly did to make himself the self-proclaimed "heel" of the NBA.

His infidelities, along with Kobe's and Jordan's and any other athlete's infidelities are their business. It's only when something from the personal life crosses over with their ability to play that it becomes a problem (EX: Big Ben motorcycle accident).

 

[otapnam]

What does Parker's cheating have to do with basketball?

And a big ol' LOL to whoever said they'd take Bosh over Rodman. I mean, come on.

His infidelities, along with Kobe's and Jordan's and any other athlete's infidelities are their business. It's onl;y when something from the personal life crosses over with their ability to play that it becomes a problem (EX: Big Ben motorcycle accident).

well parker did cheat with brent barry's wife. you know. HIS TEAMMATE. There was a lot of turmoil in SA after that, these guys are supposed to play for each other. That's a big part of their system

 

[Squalor]

I don't get why anyone has to worry about LeBron's "greatest of" status at this point in his career.

He still has plenty of time left. Maybe he achieves it. Maybe he doesn't. There's no point to talk about "greatest of" status now. It's pathetic.

What matters is that he's the best player in the world at this time, but has a team that's sorely lacking in just about every other area.

 

[AdventureRacing]

We weren't winning that game.

Why risk injury.

Haha we're talking about a GF final here. I don't get what sport you follow this is just bullshit. There is no way that is a legit reason to take off your best player at that point in the final game of the season.

 

[Siegcram]

If Tony Parker made some brash declaration that the Spurs were going to be 7 time world champs when all said and done at the end of his career, I'd hate him just as much.

You're confusing a situation that's between TP, Eva, and his cheater than something LBJ openly did to make himself the self-proclaimed "heel" of the NBA.

His infidelities, along with Kobe's and Jordan's and any other athlete's infidelities are their business. It's onl;y when something from the personal life crosses over with their ability to play that it becomes a problem (EX: Big Ben motorcycle accident).

People seriously expecting the Heat to win 8 championships after that festivity are looking stupider than Lebron on "The Decision".

It was an event for the fans, not a serious NBA prediction podcast. Christ.

 

[DoktorEvil]

I don't get why anyone has to worry about LeBron's "greatest of" status at this point in his career.

He still has plenty of time left. Maybe he achieves it. Maybe he doesn't. There's no point to talk about "greatest of" status now. It's pathetic.

What matters is that he's the best player in the world at this time, but has a team that's sorely lacking in just about every other area.

This is a very valid statement of Lebron James.

People seriously expecting the Heat to win 8 championships after that festivity are looking stupider than Lebron on "The Decision".

It was an event for the fans, not a serious NBA prediction podcast. Christ.

I'm not expecting anything out of Lebron. He can do as much talking he wants (deservedly so) BUT he has to still deliver and stand behind his words.

But you can't tell me making a 1 hour special on his free agent decision to leave Cleveland was in good taste.

 

[Epsilon-delta]

I don't get why anyone has to worry about LeBron's "greatest of" status at this point in his career.

He still has plenty of time left. Maybe he achieves it. Maybe he doesn't. There's no point to talk about "greatest of" status now. It's pathetic.

What matters is that he's the best player in the world at this time, but has a team that's sorely lacking in just about every other area.

Exactly. LeBron is a great player and the best in the league right now. He's a guaranteed a HOFer no matter what.

Like another poster said about MJ's legacy, it's hard for anyone beating his story. Game-tying/championship winning jumpers and going 6 for 6 is hard to surpass.

Going back to my teenager days, I definitely remember some of my friends hating on Jordan because he always kept winning rings.

My friends repped the Magic, but when it came to the Bulls vs anyone in the Finals, they always picked the other team lol.

 

[Gorillaz]

People seriously expecting the Heat to win 8 championships after that festivity are looking stupider than Lebron on "The Decision".

It was an event for the fans, not a serious NBA prediction podcast. Christ.

I dont get why people are still talking up that whole decision and rally thing 4 years later. After the first season everything that could be said and joke about it was said.

Its 4 years later and it's still a talking point? Alot of people must be letting media shape their view on all of this.

 

[badscooter]

I don't get why anyone has to worry about LeBron's "greatest of" status at this point in his career.

He still has plenty of time left. Maybe he achieves it. Maybe he doesn't. There's no point to talk about "greatest of" status now. It's pathetic.

What matters is that he's the best player in the world at this time, but has a team that's sorely lacking in just about every other area.

Agreed. Watching LeBron try to figure out the NBA and then the NBA trying to figure him out has been a real treat for this NBA fan, even though I'm not a LBJ or Heat fan in particular.

I'm eagerly anticipating his upcoming third act, and the NBA is going to be more exciting than ever.

 

[HiResDes]

Heart and clutch? HRD I love u but ur basketball analysis kills me

Not a fan of intangible analysis

Kukoc, Kerr, Paxton, all were able to hit important shots, but in the big scheme of things they didn't hit too many overall. And they couldn't really create their own shots.

 

[Siegcram]

I'm not expecting anything out of Lebron. He can do as much talking he wants (deservedly so) BUT he has to still deliver and stand behind his words.

But you can't tell me making a 1 hour special on his free agent decision to leave Cleveland was in good taste.

He's carried them to the finals each year, winning 2 of those. I'd say that's a pretty good track record. More than most franchises in the league can say.

And on the Decision and the public "unveiling" of the Big Three. It's been nearly 4 years. Time to let it go.

 

[Malleymal]

I just wish that I could see That Lebron that takes over the game like he did against the pistons that one year on his way to the finals and when he did it to the celtics that one year. He goes completely numb and just demolishes everything in his way.

That lebron is what Michael Jordan was every night and that is what makes them different. Jordan held grudges with people and even made up fake grudges to have a advantage. Lebron just isnt built that way. With that being said, he is still the best player in the league and should be at least respected as such.

 

[DoktorEvil]

I just wish that I could see That Lebron that takes over the game like he did against the pistons that one year on his way to the finals and when he did it to the celtics that one year. He goes completely numb and just demolishes everything in his way.

That lebron is what Michael Jordan was every night and that is what makes them different. Jordan held grudges with people and even made up fake grudges to have a advantage. Lebron just isnt built that way. With that being said, he is still the best player in the league and should be at least respected as such.

That'll be what keeps Jordan head and shoulders above any other athletes who get to that level of their respective sport.

He didn't mind being hated, but he wanted to be absolutely respected and possibly feared.

I don't know how many people had a chance here to see Jordan play in person, but I definitely remember going to games at MSG with my dad and watching a hard nosed player like John Starks have to battle Jordan whenever the Bulls were in town. Watching Jordan play, he's indescribable. He reads defenses so goddamn well and know exactly what offensive move to use in any situation. You could tell he was THAT obsessive about his craft. I don't get that same passion from Lebron, no matter how many commercials he makes of him working out.

Putting my bias of Lebron aside, he's not in the same caliber of player as Jordan. Kobe is the closest thing I've seen to a player to emulate Jordan.

He's carried them to the finals each year, winning 2 of those. I'd say that's a pretty good track record. More than most franchises in the league can say.

And on the Decision and the public "unveiling" of the Big Three. It's been nearly 4 years. Time to let it go.

2/3 is pretty goddamn good.

 

[Spineker]

Jordan's Bulls didn't have to compete against an all time great coach and three hall of famers. Jordan nostalgia is the worst.

The tall poppy syndrome surrounding Jordan is just laughable to behold.

 

[Epsilon-delta]

I just wish that I could see That Lebron that takes over the game like he did against the pistons that one year on his way to the finals and when he did it to the celtics that one year. He goes completely numb and just demolishes everything in his way.

That lebron is what Michael Jordan was every night and that is what makes them different. Jordan held grudges with people and even made up fake grudges to have a advantage. Lebron just isnt built that way. With that being said, he is still the best player in the league and should be at least respected as such.

Jordan also invited Barkley to dine at his restaurant during their Finals. MJ played games on and off the court.

The man is a competitive SOB.

 

[HiResDes]

I just wish that I could see That Lebron that takes over the game like he did against the pistons that one year on his way to the finals and when he did it to the celtics that one year. He goes completely numb and just demolishes everything in his way.

That lebron is what Michael Jordan was every night and that is what makes them different. Jordan held grudges with people and even made up fake grudges to have a advantage. Lebron just isnt built that way. With that being said, he is still the best player in the league and should be at least respected as such.

He also did it in a losing effort versus the Spurs when he was a Cav.

 

[Epsilon-delta]

That'll be what keeps Jordan head and shoulders above any other athletes who get to that level of their respective sport.

He didn't mind being hated, but he wanted to be absolutely respected and possibly feared.

The most successful people I know tend to be the biggest assholes as well. It seems like that attitude takes you far, whether in sports or in the corporate world.

 

[DoktorEvil]

The most successful people I know tend to be the biggest assholes as well. It seems like that attitude takes you far, whether in sports or in the corporate world.

He's one of the few black owners of the NBA, so indeed it'll take you far.

 

[Liquidsnake]

Let's face it, without David Stern, as NBA commissioner, to rig the games in LeBron's favor, he is finished.

He'll never win a championship again.

Finally someone who understands.

 

[boiled goose]

Athletically and raw natural talent wise, he is the best ever.

He is not the best player of all time though because he is not the best at winning. That requires mental toughness, being clutch, and bringing the best out of your teammates, areas lebron has always lacked in compared to the other greats.

 

[BobTheFork]

My problem isn't really with Lebron, just everyone else who talks about him for a living.
1) I think there is a real nasty selfishness going on with talking heads and commentators who have been trying to call Lebron the greatest ever since before he even came to Miami. Honestly I think it has something to do with wanting 'the great player' to be someone they spent their careers reporting on and it becomes more about how that reflects on them as commentators than his career.
2)I was alive and watching bball when Jordan played but I never watched sports shows or radio or heard talk about it back then. So, I don't have a great handle on how people talked about Jordan on a daily basis. That said, I am so fucking sick of people that feel they have to bat down criticism of Lebron after every fucking game. He can do that himself and if he doesn't defend himself than he doesn't care. I refues to believe that guys like Jordan and Magic had people trying to defend them when they didn't win, they didn't need that. They were some of the best and that always spoke for itself. This isn't LeBron fault but it's the worst part of watching him play. Dan Patrick is one of my favorites but he was been almost un-listenable in the past two weeks. This ties in heavily with stupid phrases like 'the twitterverse' and trying to generalize several million opinions into a 3 seconds sentence and making yourself look smart but shooting it down.

 

[Tom Penny]

Athletically and raw natural talent wise, he is the best ever.

He is not the best player of all time though because he is not the best at winning. That requires mental toughness, being clutch, and bringing the best out of your teammates, areas lebron has always lacked in compared to the other greats.

Lebron is a freak but Wilt was more physically gifted and with today's science would have been more absurd and averaged more than 48 minutes PER game one season..

 

[v0yce]

I think Spo put him there. Pretty sure LBJ didn't do it himself.

I don't know.

Lebron bricked a 3 and then just stood there and watched SA rebound and then slowly walked as the rest of the players on the floor ran to the other end. Then he took a seat.

He checked out.

 

[Shining Sunshine]

I wonder if any Lebron fans watched Basketball in the Jordan days to make a comparison.

 

[Epsilon-delta]

I wonder if any Lebron fans watched Basketball in the Jordan days to make a comparison.

I don't think some were old enough to be honest.

 

[Cloudy]

What happened to "making teammates better"? I really don't believe in that bullshit (guys either make shots or they don't) but it's pretty funny to see how the media agenda works. When a guy they don't like gets no support it's because he didn't make anyone better. When it's a guy they like, he didn't have any help.

It's interesting how LeBron suddenly stopped making his teammates better when they ran up against a superior team lol

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

I wonder if any Lebron fans watched Basketball in the Jordan days to make a comparison.

I did. Grew up a Bulls fan.

And it's too early too tell who will be the greatest.

 

[ShinobiFist]

Lebron is an all time great player. I don't know how anyone is doubting that.

Is he Michael Jordan? No.

For one they are two different type of players. Jordan was the epitome of a shooting guard. An attacker that distributed when it was opportune but not his first instinct. James is a Magic Johnson type player, a point forward. A guy who works best when he has teammates that can he can get going and feed off of. A guy much more comfortable going 30-10-10 then going 45-5-5.

But let's not discount the fact that Jordan also was one of the luckiest SOB's to be drafted by such a quality organization in a desirable city. To work with possibly the greatest coach of all time and some of the best supporting casts for a superstar in his era.

There wasn't much Lebron could of done last night. He could of scored 60 on 60% shooting and it likely wouldn't have made a lick of difference because the rest of the team couldn't do anything and couldn't stop the spurs. Give this spurs team some credit, they are one of the most proficient teams the league has seen in some time.

Jordan face way tougher comp than Lebron. The Pacers, Knicks, Celtics, Cavs and Detroit were no joke during the mid 80's to early 90's. And those teams had solid coaches. Jordan faced against teams that were coached by Larry Wilkins, Chuck Daily and Pat Riley. Arguably 3 of the top ten coaches of all time. Also, those teams were fucking stacked with talent. Jordan was that fucking good.

 

[HiResDes]

What happened to "making teammates better"? I really don't believe in that bullshit (guys either make shots or they don't) but it's pretty funny to see how the media agenda works. When a guy they don't like gets no support it's because he didn't make anyone better. When it's a guy they like, he didn't have any help.

It's interesting how LeBron suddenly stopped making his teammates better when they ran up against a superior team lol

Lebron is so unselfish, but I never thought his chemistry was all that. He needs someone that consistently make open shifts and move without the ball well.

 

[-tetsuo-]

The Heat have the best 3pt shooter of all time in Allen.

Wade, Bosh, Allen > Kerr, Rodman, Kukoc

It's clear as day to me.

Dennis Rodman is so much better than Chris Bosh. It is kind of funny to even compare him to Rodman. Kerr was doing the same thing Ray was doing. Hitting open jumpers. Knee-Wade vs Toni? Toss up.

 

[DoktorEvil]

I wonder if any Lebron fans watched Basketball in the Jordan days to make a comparison.

I did. The intensity Jordan brought every game, especially in MSG, is amazing.

He was intimating at 6'6" but what was even more intimidating was his stare.

He stared through players and if you were in his sights he'd go out of his way to embarrass you.

He also did stuff like this on players:

Knicks fans absolutely despised Jordan, but they respect him. The fans also respect Kobe. I've heard mixed opinions against Lebron at Knick games.

 

[HiResDes]

Dennis Rodman is so much better than Chris Bosh. It is kind of funny to even compare him to Rodman. Kerr was doing the same thing Ray was doing. Hitting open jumpers. Knee-Wade vs Toni? Toss up.

Bosh is so much better than Rodman offensively. 19 points a game versus 8 points a game. Also averages more assists and blocks. Dennis can shut down an opponent better, and grabs boards, but that's it. Kerr is nothing even compared to a senile Allen. Kukoc's best year isn't even as good as Wade's worst.

 

[entremet]

I did. The intensity Jordan brought every game, especially in MSG, is amazing.

He was intimating at 6'6" but what was even more intimidating was his stare.

He stared through players and if you were in his sights he'd go out of his way to embarrass you.

He also did stuff like this on players:

Knicks fans absolutely despised Jordan, but they respect him. The fans also respect Kobe. I've heard mixed opinions against Lebron at Knick games.

Lebron sprurned the Knicks during Free Agency, I don't blame him given Dolan, but that's where a lot of hate comes from. Also Heat rivalry over the years.

 

[friskykillface]

Salt from the past but if we are bringing up the past then I'll say this, the Celtics played the entire game 6 back in 2012 like the spurs played the first quarter last night.

They beat themselves as much as lebron beat them

1-14 from 3 smh



I still don't care about the decision, I had more respect for LeBron when he left the shitty cavs and if he goes back I'll lose respect

 

[Cloudy]

Speaking of "making people better", is it just me or does every star LeBron play with regress? Only catch and shoot players actually play better with him. Established players tend to get relegated to role player status

 

[PBY]

Speaking of "making people better", is it just me or does every star LeBron play with regress? Only catch and shoot players actually play better with him. Established players tend to get relegated to role player status

I think that's just a basic function of volume.

 

[Audible Phonetics]

Jordan's Bulls didn't have to compete against an all time great coach and three hall of famers. Jordan nostalgia is the worst.

WTF basketball ignorance is basketball ignorance.

1991 - First Championship against Magic and the Lakers
1992 - Over the Trailblazers you know who had Drexler
1993 - When he beat Charles Barkley

1996 - Against Supersonics and Gary Payton
1997 - Against the Jazz Stockton and Malone
1998 - Beat the Jazz again.

So please tell me where your logic is again?

 

[HiResDes]

I think that's just a basic function of volume.

Also age catching up to players.

 

[jordan0386]

Jordan face way tougher comp than Lebron. The Pacers, Knicks, Celtics, Cavs and Detroit were no joke during the mid 80's to early 90's. And those teams had solid coaches. Jordan faced against teams that were coached by Larry Wilkins, Chuck Daily and Pat Riley. Arguably 3 of the top ten coaches of all time. Also, those teams were fucking stacked with talent. Jordan was that fucking good.

Meh. Don't over sell it. Most teams in the 80s went 41-41.

Jordan didn't face that much tougher comp after 91.

 

[-tetsuo-]

Bosh is so much better than Rodman offensively. 19 points a game versus 8 points a game. Also averages more assists and blocks. Dennis can shut down an opponent better, and grabs boards, but that's it. Kerr is nothing even compared to a senile Allen.

Yea you are right that isn't important at all when you have a team full of other players that can score better than you. We can just forget that Dennis played harder than anyone on the court pretty much every game. Who cares about that stuff.


Kerr's career 3FG% is 45 compared to Allen's 40 soooooo... yea. Sure.

 

[Epsilon-delta]

Dennis Rodman is so much better than Chris Bosh. It is kind of funny to even compare him to Rodman. Kerr was doing the same thing Ray was doing. Hitting open jumpers. Knee-Wade vs Toni? Toss up.

Ray is definitely better than Kerr, lets get that out of the way. Knee-Wade vs Toni? Kukoc 13 PPG isn't all that great. I still stay Wade but wouldn't disagree with anyone saying it's a toss up.

 

[jordan0386]

WTF basketball ignorance is basketball ignorance.

1991 - First Championship against Magic and the Lakers
1992 - Over the Trailblazers you know who had Drexler
1993 - When he beat Charles Barkley

1996 - Against Supersonics and Gary Payton
1997 - Against the Jazz Stockton and Malone
1998 - Beat the Jazz again.

So please tell me where your logic is again?

For the most part, CHI faced no trouble in the previous rounds.

Comp is the same.

 

[HiResDes]

Yea you are right that isn't important at all when you have a team full of other players that can score better than you. We can just forget that Dennis played harder than anyone on the court pretty much every game. Who cares about that stuff.


Kerr's career 3FG% is 45 compared to Allen's 40 soooooo... yea. Sure.

Allen can create his own shot if he wants to, and is less of a liability defensively. He also has a better midrange game and can drive to the whole. A marginally better 3-point percentage is the stupidest stat to ever pull out.

 

[Audible Phonetics]

For the most part, CHI faced no trouble in the previous rounds.

Comp is the same.

This is also ignorance. The east WAS the powerhouse in the 90s.

Indiana, Knicks, Miami, pistons were all contenders during the bulls Dynasty ERA.

 

[Epsilon-delta]

Yea you are right that isn't important at all when you have a team full of other players that can score better than you. We can just forget that Dennis played harder than anyone on the court pretty much every game. Who cares about that stuff.


Kerr's career 3FG% is 45 compared to Allen's 40 soooooo... yea. Sure.

Allen is the best 3pt shooter of all time. You're twisting stats to make Kerr better than he actually was.

 

[ratcliffja]

For the most part, CHI faced no trouble in the previous rounds.

Comp is the same.

Do you ever stay up late at night and wonder "Why didn't my parents name me James?"

 

[Halcyon]

For the most part, CHI faced no trouble in the previous rounds.

Comp is the same.

Are you ignoring the Knicks and the Pacers?

 

[jordan0386]

This is also ignorance. The east WAS the powerhouse in the 90s.

Indiana, Knicks, Miami were all contenders during the bulls Dynasty ERA.

They all were contenders. But Mike beat them all, every year.

3-1 most of those series. Fatigue loss. Then closed them in 6.

Tim hardaway, of those three teams, had the only guard who avg 20 vs the bulls. And he was only 6'1.

Bulls spanked everyone. I don't wanna hear about this all time competition stuff.

 

[Moondrop]

No, 2-3 in the Finals is right in line with my perception of him. He's the best player in the game but he needs better teammates than that.

 

[Squalor]

Allen is the best 3pt shooter of all time. You're twisting stats to make better Kerr than he actually was.

You're confusing highest percentage with most shots made.

Kerr's percentage is higher. Allen made more.