• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

2014 Israel-Gaza Conflict [UN: 1,525+ Palestinian dead, mostly civilian; 66 Israeli]

Status
Not open for further replies.
So what's up with the West Bank settlements then?

To try and legitimize a military conquered land. Its basically a semi dirty move. You start populating a conquered land that is not fully determined as owned formally and legally yet since palestine does not have official borders. The unfinalized bordering of israel/palestine by the british during the formation of israel is beginning of the whole land dispute problem. anyhow, once an area is setteled later on israel can say "well yeah now its has people on it so":
A) we want to keep it, you can take other land instead of it of the same size somewhere else (as israel offered for some areas in peace negotiations a few years back)
B) We will evacuate the people from it but consider it as a high sacrifice on our part. Though during the sharon ministration, he just evacuated all settlement "for free".
 
When will the Palestinians get help?

When there's so few that we have to stop the extinction of their people?
Would anyone even stop that?
 
This place really is amazing.

Constantly trying to justify Hamas without actually saying it out loud, while at the same time minimizing anything Hamas does "These rockets are just firework!"

Then calling out people with different a opinion as if they are getting paid by some group to say what they say, like it's impossible to a have a different view no this subject

I guess you guys like democracy only when it suits you

I think the argument is that both sides are acting ridiculous. However, the media loves to glorify Israel, so it's nice to see people realizing that they're actions are no better than Hamas.
 
Despicable. Indefensible.

AGpItdL.jpg


Fuck my country.
 
Disgusting. I hate that Israel continues to do shit like this, and that the US continues to give them billions of dollars in aid to help them in their illegal invasion of Palestine and attempted genocide.
 
I guess you guys like democracy only when it suits you

Israel should annex the West Bank and Gaza, make the Palestinians there full citizens and grant the right of return for Palestinian refugees in neighbouring countries.

Democracy! Human rights!
 
I could counter argue the Palestinians are suffering from an illusion since the early formation of israel where they keep thinking they can rid of it, wage wars and conflicts, lose and get territories lost, and keep the same flame going. Unlike Egypt, Jordan and Lebanon who made peace and got their territories back, they just keep failing and not living with it. Not to say israel has been easy towards them, in many cases the opposite, but they had their chances with 3 different israeli ministries lead by - Rabin, Ulmert and Sharon.
Right now there is a war going on between 2 forces where 1 is immensely stronger then the other, but a war is a war, its not like in your videogames.
People in this thread need to do their homework, because reading the last headline on BBC aint gonna cut it.
This. So much.
 
This place really is amazing.

Constantly trying to justify Hamas without actually saying it out loud, while at the same time minimizing anything Hamas does "These rockets are just firework!"

Then calling out people with different a opinion as if they are getting paid by some group to say what they say, like it's impossible to a have a different view no this subject

I guess you guys like democracy only when it suits you




This place. Are you having a go at GAF now?
 
I saw this on my facebook feed and I had to share it. It's in swedish from a swedish guy who is down in Gaza to observe with the organisation International Solidarity Movement. He has been down there since before this latest flare up and has been stationed in the Al-Wafa hospital until they had to evacuate it. This is his latest update from Gaza! The google translated text is here.

"I, Joe Catron, Charlie Andreasson, Rina Andolini and our interpreter is now back from Sheijaija after we tried to retrieve damaged during the ceasefire. We were guided by a young Palestinian, around 20, who wanted to bring his family. There is nothing left of the area, it is hardly possible to see where the road goes. We climbed over what was left of the houses when the Israeli occupation army started shooting at us from the road on the left. I, Joe and Charlie pulled back and Rina, our interpreter and the young Palestinian guide took shelter in the future. We stood on each side and took cover. The young Palestinian, who guided us went to the front end, we shouted at him to stop and the IDF shot him. He fell and lay on the ground, still alive. We tried to think of how we could reach him without all get shot, we realized that there was nothing we could do. 30 seconds after the first shot, they executed him in front of our eyes. Even though the IDF saw that we were civilians, and even though they said that there was a ceasefire. He wanted to pick up his family and was murdered. We could not do anything but watch. We do not even know his name and now he's dead."

Wow...this country. Truly carrying out one of the worst massacres in recent times and right infront of the whole world because they know no one will being them to justice.
 
Israel has given back a lot more land they acquired during various attacks over the course of it's existence. Arguably because they couldn't possibly defend it all, but gave it back none the less.

I'm not interested in defending Israeli expansion or even these attacks, what surprises me though is the people pretending HAMAS and the 'fringe" elements are just poor victims. Of the two sides they are by far the worst.

I get that the very existence of Israel is a big shit sandwich for some people, but as far as the ongoing war, that is one sided. Israel would be quite happy to be left alone.

Yes, it certainly seems that way... Not. Please go read these UN ground reports for as many weeks and months as you can possibly be bothered to. What you'll notice is that Israel has continued the demolition of Palestinian structures and displacement of its people, week in week out, for years and years. Mostly to make way for it's illegal settlement expansion plans, irrespective of whether rockets have been fired at them or not.

Links to weekly UN reports
http://www.ochaopt.org/reports.aspx?id=104


Please bare in mind, pre 47 the land referred to as Palestine was officially known as Mandated Palestine or the British Mandate for Palestine and was under British rule, given up as a result of pressure from both Jews and Arabs, but mostly as a result of violence on British personnel by Israel terrorist groups such as Irgun and Lehi.

palestinian-loss-of-land-1946-2010.jpg
 
I think the argument is that both sides are acting ridiculous. However, the media loves to glorify Israel, so it's nice to see people realizing that they're actions are no better than Hamas.

Both sides aren't acting in equivalent manners, though. One side is conducting and invasion and slaughtering civilians. The other side is trying to fight off an imperialist power which is invading their land and slaughtering their civilians.

You can't judge the actions of Hamas or anyone else in Palestine by the same standards, because they're an oppressed people, and they have the moral right to fight off their oppressors.
 
I could counter argue the Palestinians are suffering from an illusion since the early formation of israel where they keep thinking they can rid of it, wage wars and conflicts, lose and get territories lost, and keep the same flame going. Unlike Egypt, Jordan and Lebanon who made peace and got their territories back, they just keep failing and not living with it. Not to say israel has been easy towards them, in many cases the opposite, but they had their chances with 3 different israeli ministries lead by - Rabin, Ulmert and Sharon.
Right now there is a war going on between 2 forces where 1 is immensely stronger then the other, but a war is a war, its not like in your videogames.
People in this thread need to do their homework, because reading the last headline on BBC aint gonna cut it.

You forgot about how the PLO made peace a got their territories back.

Oh wait, it was Gaza that got territories back for firing rockets, meanwhile peace in the West Bank has only made it easier for their homes to be destroyed.
 
You forgot about how the PLO made peace a got their territories back.

Oh wait, it was Gaza that got territories back for firing rockets, meanwhile peace in the West Bank has only made it easier for their homes to be destroyed.

What peace? there are security arrangements, if IDF and PLO were not holding that area" together" it would probably be another hamas region. PLO is or rather was talking about territory arrangements according to 67ish lines a few months back but it failed.
Gaza did not even have rockets when the settlements were evacuated and they gained that territory, it was a one sided move by israel to be able to say "here we aint there or near there".
 
This. So much.

What do u mean this so much.... Egypt with war get it land with leaving Palestine alone..

Lebanon cuz of Hezbollah they left the south after there attack on them

Jordan they are with the Israel there is alot of info in how he sold the Arab in 1948...
 
What peace? there are security arrangements, if IDF and PLO were not holding that area" together" it would probably be another hamas region. PLO is or rather was talking about territory arrangements according to 67ish lines a few months back but it failed.
Gaza did not even have rockets when the settlements were evacuated and they gained that territory, it was a one sided move by israel to be able to say "here we aint there or near there".

Fortunately, the PLO is willing to cooperate, and has cooperated with Israel. Why isn't that rewarded? Why can't that lead to peace?

And Gaza was firing rockets as early as 2002. Israeli disengagement started in 2005.
 
After about 10 years of this, I'm thinking Hamas doesn't have the best interest of the Palestinian people in mind. The IDF is brutal and heavy handed because they know it works, and Hamas continually feeds into the cycle of violence by attempting to go "eye for an eye" with someone twice their weight.
 
Give me a fucking a break. And don't equate "GAF" with anything. You speak for fucking no one.

When I said 'This place' I was quoting the poster I was responding to. They said 'this place' so I inquired as to whether they were having a go at GAF now.

I can't comprehend why you appear to be so upset at that.
 
After about 10 years of this, I'm thinking Hamas doesn't have the best interest of the Palestinian people in mind. The IDF is brutal and heavy handed because they know it works, and Hamas continually feeds into the cycle of violence by attempting to go "eye for an eye" with someone twice their weight.
Can't really blame people for wanting to fight people doing this to them.
 
After about 10 years of this, I'm thinking Hamas doesn't have the best interest of the Palestinian people in mind. The IDF is brutal and heavy handed because they know it works, and Hamas continually feeds into the cycle of violence by attempting to go "eye for an eye" with someone twice their weight.

Hamas is the symptom, not the rot. Whether they capitulate like the West Bank or resist like in Gaza they are still met with the IDF boot on the neck.
 
Both sides aren't acting in equivalent manners, though. One side is conducting and invasion and slaughtering civilians. The other side is trying to fight off an imperialist power which is invading their land and slaughtering their civilians.

You can't judge the actions of Hamas or anyone else in Palestine by the same standards, because they're an oppressed people, and they have the moral right to fight off their oppressors.

What I don't get is that neither Hamas nor Palestine can beat Israel in their current state, so surely choosing to fight is foolish and suicidal on their part, right?

I mean you can claim they have a moral right all you like, but that doesn't stop the decision to fire rockets at Israel or commit terrorist acts as fairly stupid ideas when the enemy you're antagonizing has the power to destroy you.
 
What I don't get is that neither Hamas nor Palestine can beat Israel in their current state, so surely choosing to fight is foolish and suicidal on their part, right?

I mean you can claim they have a moral right all you like, but that doesn't stop the decision to fire rockets at Israel or commit terrorist acts as fairly stupid ideas when the enemy you're antagonizing has the power to destroy you.

They're out for blood. Pure and simple.
 
After about 10 years of this, I'm thinking Hamas doesn't have the best interest of the Palestinian people in mind. The IDF is brutal and heavy handed because they know it works, and Hamas continually feeds into the cycle of violence by attempting to go "eye for an eye" with someone twice their weight.
I dont think the IDF wants peace. This is how they deal with 'peace.'
http://stream.aljazeera.com/story/201405212125-0023753
 
Can't really blame people for wanting to fight people doing this to them.

The rocket attacks and kidnappings can't even be considered fighting at this point. Just a child flailing in tantrum before being spanked.

It's gross that the fighting is this lopsided. It's just baffling that they still condone these provocations knowing what the retaliation will be.

Hamas is the symptom, not the rot. Whether they capitulate like the West Bank or resist like in Gaza they are still met with the IDF boot on the neck.

Sometimes submission is the answer. This is not a war they can win.
 
Fortunately, the PLO is willing to cooperate, and has cooperated with Israel. Why isn't that rewarded? Why can't that lead to peace?

And Gaza was firing rockets as early as 2002. Israeli disengagement started in 2005.

PLO cooperating is important but, it was broken down and banished under gunfire by hamas from gaza, well, Fatach was, which is PLO basically. Point being, according to israels standpoint until PLO either rules gaza instead of hamas, or hamas gives up terrorism as its mean for obtaining leverage there wont be any chance for peace.

as to the rockets, my point was it was not the rockets that were the reason gaza settlements were evacuated, there were minuscule at that time, not like onward when they became the policy of hamas.
 
What I don't get is that neither Hamas nor Palestine can beat Israel in their current state, so surely choosing to fight is foolish and suicidal on their part, right?

I mean you can claim they have a moral right all you like, but that doesn't stop the decision to fire rockets at Israel or commit terrorist acts as fairly stupid ideas when the enemy you're antagonizing has the power to destroy you.

The enemy they're antagonizing is using its power to destroy them regardless of whether or not rockets get fired.
 
The rocket attacks and kidnappings can't even be considered fighting at this point. Just a child flailing in tantrum before being spanked.

It's gross that the fighting is this lopsided. It's just baffling that they still condone these provocations knowing what the retaliation will be.

I don't at all agree with Hamas actions but what do you think the Palestinian people should do?
 
This place really is amazing.

Constantly trying to justify Hamas without actually saying it out loud, while at the same time minimizing anything Hamas does "These rockets are just firework!"

Then calling out people with different a opinion as if they are getting paid by some group to say what they say, like it's impossible to a have a different view no this subject

I guess you guys like democracy only when it suits you

I'm not sure I understand. Are you saying the JIDF don't exist and are you claiming the image posted isn't official propaganda?

Are we not allowed to even mention the JIDF's existence or perhaps question if someone uses official propaganda and generally holds a view/opinion that Israel do no wrong no matter what the situation is perhaps associated with that organisation?

I'm also not sure how either of these is suggesting I'm trying to justify Hamas or questioning the basic tenets of democracy.
 
The enemy they're antagonizing is using its power to destroy them regardless of whether or not rockets get fired.

But didn't this all come about because of years of simmering violence inflicted by Hamas and it's supporters that eventually culminated in the the kidnapping and murder of three Israeli teens?

If none of that happened would Israel really have started these bombardments and ground offensives?
 
But didn't this all come about because of years of simmering violence inflicted by Hamas and it's supporters that eventually culminated in the the kidnapping and murder of three Israeli teens?

If none of that happened would Israel really have started these bombardments and ground offensives?

There is ZERO credible evidence that Hamas was behind the kidnapping. What set this off is the IDF re-arresting 300+ people who were released in a prisoner swap. After the teens went missing. Hamas responded by ending the previous cease fire.
 
PLO cooperating is important but, it was broken down and banished under gunfire by hamas from gaza, well, Fatach was, which is PLO basically. Point being, according to israels standpoint until PLO either rules gaza instead of hamas, or hamas gives up terrorism as its mean for obtaining leverage there wont be any chance for peace.

as to the rockets, my point was it was not the rockets that were the reason gaza settlements were evacuated, there were minuscule at that time, not like onward when they became the policy of hamas.

I don't see why they can't be taken separately. Perhaps if the West Bank saw some sort of relief it would give Hamas or the people of Gaza some incentive. As it stands now both methods seem to end in the same hopeless situation for the people stuck in Palestine.

But didn't this all come about because of years of simmering violence inflicted by Hamas and it's supporters that eventually culminated in the the kidnapping and murder of three Israeli teens?

If none of that happened would Israel really have started these bombardments and ground offensives?

Well you can either die by bombardments and ground offensives in Gaza or crippling poverty and having your home taken from you in the West Bank. Take your pick. That's the difference between peace and war in Palestine.
 
But didn't this all come about because of years of simmering violence inflicted by Hamas and it's supporters that eventually culminated in the the kidnapping and murder of three Israeli teens?

If none of that happened would Israel really have started these bombardments and ground offensives?

Yes, Israel hasn't been bulldozing houses and farms for year. They are really the victims that have never oppressed a people into fighting back.

WTF would you do if you house, farm and livelihood is constantly threatened and destroyed by an occupying force?
 
I don't know if anyone actually believes this. We still have videos of Hamas leaders repeating their "wipe out Israel" mantra, and they haven't updated their charter to reflect their change of heart due to "internal reasons".

They may have had a 'change in heart', but i'm not sure anyone (governments) is convinced and this conflict hasn't done anything to cement that 'change of heart'.

Oh, give me a fucking break, with using this tired, intellectually dishonest excuse to justify the slaughter that's going on now, and purposely leaving out all context. You think senior Israeli officials and lawmakers don't say the same thing? And if they did, would that justify a slaughter of Israelis in your mind? You know what the difference is? Israel actually has the capability to act on these statements, while Hamas does not. Here are a couple recent quotes from those in the Israeli gvt:

On the eve of Abu Khudair’s lynching, Member of Knesset (Israel’s parliament) and government faction whip Ayelet Shaked issued a call over Facebook to ethnically cleanse the land, declaring “the entire Palestinian people is the enemy.” She advocated their complete destruction, “including its elderly and its women,” adding that these must be slaughtered, otherwise they might give birth to more “little snakes.”

If that isn't incitement to genocide, what is?

Just yesterday: Moshe Feiglin, The deputy speaker of Israel’s parliament, the Knesset, and a member of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s ruling Likud Party:

“After the IDF completes the ‘softening’ of the targets with its firepower, the IDF will conquer the entire Gaza, using all the means necessary to minimize any harm to our soldiers, with no other considerations,” Feiglin writes in one of several calls for outright war crimes.

Following the reconquest, Israel’s army “will thoroughly eliminate all armed enemies from Gaza. The enemy population that is innocent of wrongdoing and separated itself from the armed terrorists will be treated in accordance with international law and will be allowed to leave,” Feiglin writes.

“Gaza is part of our Land and we will remain there forever,” Feiglin concludes. “Subsequent to the elimination of terror from Gaza, it will become part of sovereign Israel and will be populated by Jews. This will also serve to ease the housing crisis in Israel.”

Not sure how much more clear a call for ethnic cleansing can be.

Regarding some Israelis:

Since the beginning of July, raging crowds of Jewish Israelis just like these have marched through Tel Aviv, Jerusalem, Nazareth and Beer Sheva, chanting “Death to Arabs” and “Death to Leftists,” swarming and attacking vulnerable victims. While a tiny contingent of radical Israelis have formed a loose “anti-fascist” network that tries to patrol city streets and prevent additional lynchings, they are extremely few in numbers and cannot be everywhere at all times.

There has been MANY such examples in the past, of Israel leaders calling for genocide of Palestinians and the desire to either wipe them out or kick them all out of the area. Don't you see the hypocrisy of condemning all Palestinians to death and belittling their lives because of what Hamas has said in the past, while there's no shortage of that from the Israeli side? What a weak, cowardly argument in order to justify the killing.

As for Hamas, Israel has never recognized them as legitimate government, and from day 1 they punished all Gazans by imposing a blockage in order to suffocate the population and restrict the flow of basic supplies that is needed for a functioning, economically viable society.

Anyone who thinks this merciless assault against Gaza has anything to do with defence needs to inform themselves, and anyone who isn't strongly condemning Israel for its actions needs to check both their objectivity and basic humanity.

In what despicably twisted is the slaughter of 450+ (and rising by the minute) mostly civilians, tens of thousands of injured, the displacement of 50,000+ people who are now refugees, the decimation of entire neighbourhoods, the shelling of multiple hospitals, the dropping of bombs on extremely dense populated areas justified? Hamas "rocket attacks" managed to kill a SINGLE Israeli 11 days after the bombings started. Entire families in gaza have been wiped out. Bodies of women and children are piling up in the hundreds. But thats fair game, to those people that believe Palestinian blood is worth absolutely nothing compared to Israeli blood- and that a life of a single Israeli is worth more than every Gazan combined.

But let's assume for a second you think that way- that Palestinians are worth nothing, but as much blood as needed should be spilled for Israel's "security" (and if many of you are honest with yourselves, you should admit thats exactly what you believe). Ok, fine. In what world could these kind of attacks POSSIBLY be a net positive for Israel's security? Taking out a few rockets outweighs the extreme hatred, desire for vengeance towards Israel that all Gazans now feel, while more and more of their friends and families are being slaughtered and their homes destroyed? That will suddenly entice them to want to be friends with Israel and be reasonable? No, it will radicalize everyone, and Israel absolutely knows this. Anyone who can rub 2 braincells together knows it, and its all part of the plan. Any damage Israel is doing to Hamas is negligible to the damage they're doing to their own future security with the bodies piling up, and the families they are destroying- many whom have nothing left to live for beyond the desire for vengeance- a feeling that's utterly normal and natural.

This is genocide, no ifs or buts. The "human shield" excuse is utter and absolutely horse-shit, as if Israel doesn't' know that they will kill scores of civilians by dropping massive bombs (sorry, "targeted strikes") on dense areas. These deaths are already factored in, they're not surprising for Israel, nor accidental. They just don't care, regardless of the PR they keep repeating, and which many (including those in this thread) simply parrot. The facts do not support that PR. It's a cowardly thing, to never hold themselves accountable for the carnage dropped from thier own bombs, and instead try to put the blame entire on Hamas. Not surprisingly, people eat that up.

The most depressing thing from the mainstream media is how they're reporting this in a vacuum, ignoring the fact that even before this latest ongoing massacre, Gazans have been living in an open-air prison, under a brutal occupation. Israel has never stopped bulldozing homes and expanding their settlements, stealing land, water and resources from Palestinians and denying them the most basic building blocks to building a future. It's not a shock that in conditions such as these, there WILL be the environment for groups that resort to violence. However, the biggest magic trick that Israel has pulled is convincing the world it is threatened by the Palestinians or Hamas. Israel has never been in danger from Palestinians, and never will be. It has used this false pretense to continue expanding its settlements, and keeping the Palestinians in a state of utter hopelessness and torment.

Who knows what the body count will be at the end of this latest massacre, (a term like "lopsided" does not begin to describe a 400-to-1 ratio) but whatever it is, there will be many claiming that it was "worth it". These people should take a deep, hard look into that statement and what lies they're repeating to themselves to condone such carnage. This is not a "war"- it never has been. The term is utterly laughable in its ridiculousness. Israel does not want peace, and has never wanted peace, undermining the possibility at every opportunity- anyone who has actually followed the events of the last few years closely, instead of mindlessly swallowing the PR narratives of Israel and the media would see this blatant, obvious fact. Its why they were so, so enraged by the formation of the united government, while pretty much every other country in the world saw it as a good thing. The narrative of always "being under attack" and in an "existential crisis" is the only thing keeping the country from falling apart from internal strife. Again, anyone who knows a damn thing about whats going on inside Israel in terms of both politics and economy can see this.
 
Please bare in mind, pre 47 the land referred to as Palestine was officially known as Mandated Palestine or the British Mandate for Palestine and was under British rule, given up as a result of pressure from both Jews and Arabs, but mostly as a result of violence on British personnel by Israel terrorist groups such as Irgun and Lehi.

palestinian-loss-of-land-1946-2010.jpg

Your chart leaves out some minor details, like Israel being attacked by Egypt, Iraq, Syria, Jordan (then Transjordan) Lebanon, Saudi Arabia and Yemen. Or the 6 day war, or any of the intifadas etc. But sure. Nice maps.
 
In 2010, Khaled Mashal said the Charter "is a piece of history and no longer relevant, but cannot be changed for internal reasons." Source

However, Mahmoud al-Zahar, the founder of Hamas said "The Hamas charter is a matter for interpretation. It expresses a political and social position based indirectly on the Koran. There is no doubt about the Koran itself, but the charter is a political vision. No one is thinking now about changing the charter, but in principle it is not impossible." Source

Additionally, Zahar said "If I were to tell you that the charter could be changed, it would immediately be seen as a concession and the collapse of Hamas’ principles. No one is thinking now about changing the charter, but in principle it is not impossible.” Source

For details on the Hamas Charter, which calls for the destruction of Israel, and the death of Jews, look here.

Thank you, this is very interesting.

However it does not prove that Hamas recognizes Israel's right to exists (or even jews), it just says that some of Hamas's leaders say some parts of it's charter "is up for interpretation".

In fact, the last link you supplied even claims that (article 7) -

"The Day of Judgement will not come about until Moslems fight the Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, (evidently a certain kind of tree) would not do that because it is one of the trees of the Jews."

Sadly the mentality of these people who support Hamas seems very like-minded and violent. They brainwash their children for hatred through kid shows -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3OYjKZ2Cu8

Patah on the other hand already publicly announced that it is willing to recognize Israel's right to exist and to negotiate a peace treaty.

I hope both side eventually come to the recognition that this is the only solution but days like this leave me very skeptic .
 
Sometimes submission is the answer. This is not a war they can win.



In April, a unity government was formed between the PA and Hamas. Netanyahu was enraged by the unity government - and he called the US and EU to break relations with the unity government. Surprisingly, the US said no - that they would give the unity government time and see if it works or not. The EU said the same. Angered, Netanyahu was determined to break up the unity government. The 3 kids that were abducted was used as pretext, though there was no evidence of Hamas involvement. The pretext was to go into the West Bank, attack Hamas, arrest 700 members of Hamas, blow up 2 homes, carry on their ransackings, and to try to evoke a reaction from Hamas. An Israeli political scientist, Avner Yaniv calls these offensives, "Palestinian Peace Offenses" - whenever the Palestinians seemed like they tried to reach a settlement of the conflict (which the unity gov't was) at that point, Israel does everything it can to provoke a violent reaction from Hamas, who use force as a way to get international attention, and Israel has its pretext. And when the reaction comes, Israel can claim that they can't deal with these people, because they're terrorists. Hamas does some pretty despicable things, but I can see the frustration and hopelessness.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom