What do you are talking about? Reach is more tech than Halo 4 for a different points of view. Bungie has pushed 360 hardware a lot at the time.
Digital Foundry: Destiny Beta XB1 analysis and PS4 comparison
- Thread starter nynt9
- Start date
This is what I want to know. It's beyond well known the Destiny Beta is 900p on X1, how could Gamespot mess that up listing it at 720p?
Habit? Or was it intentional?
Edit: Lol, if you go to youtube to watch the video, they put a youtube caption over the 720p with a 900p. So professional.
ElRenoRaven
Member
wow! much parity! so secrets!
anyway, blue rectangle should be much bigger.
reading the internet I have come to the conclusion that xbone is nothing but a pimple on ps4's back
I just havent figured out yet in which parallel universe my consoles are living and do not adhere.
Yes I agree with the AA part. I said the same thing in the beginning of this thread.
That is still going on the assumption though that there is enough overhead there it wouldn't hinder performance.
It's basic math. It depends on which perspective the poster is talking about. This what you get when people want differences to be reduced to a single number.
Please tell me you were actually aware of this given that you post in a Digital Foundry thread.
He said around 50% where is not false at all. But nice bait troll post.
dragonelite
Member
Or they already had some overhead over at 900p and the 10% bump allowed 1080p probably with some sacrifices i think. Would be interesting to see DF comparison at launch.
Mr Moose
Member
It's always been about 45-50% more powerful, hasn't it? This has been known since last year?
Waylon Drums
Member
People are so bitchy for no reason. I find it fairly hilarious.
Or the game was running 25 FPS at 1080p on Xbox One so they put it to 900p. Kinect resource removal and MS Engineers gave them their needed ability to hit a stable 30 FPS1080p without sacrifices.
The PS4 most likely runs this game at 60 FPS with dips to 40, like Tomb Raider. Bungie locked it to 30 FPS for a more stable frame rate. Which is preferable in my opinion anyway.
No, it's not lazy. It's called having a finite amount of resources and time, and a target. One platform has hit the target, the other hasn't. You're going to devote your remaining resources to getting the platform which hasn't hit the target up to that level. Not on making the platform which is already at that target better; That would be very poor resource management.
FairXchange
Member
The game looks really good, but the static environments and overall world layout appear to support 'cross-gen' requirements. So, it makes sense that the game able to scale relatively easily between 8 year old consoles, and the new generation hardware.
& what exactly prevents to improve more the ps4 after optimized so much in the weaker console? Fxaa or other raw effects could be fixed, if you care to optimze at the best on both platform
urk (Bungie employee) has said they are trying to get the most out of every platform.
We will have to see. This is not a final comparison.
Shouldn't Bungie have known that the PS4 and XB1 are not the same machine and therefore not necessarily be able to achieve the same targets? I mean it wasnt until MS backpedaled on one of their biggest pillars (Kinect) that 1080p was a possibility.
psn
Member
Math - how does it work?
Xbone: 1.23 TF GPU (12 CUs) for games
Xbone: 768 Shaders
Xbone: 48 Texture units
Xbone: 16 ROPS
Xbone: 2 ACE/ 16 queues
PS4: 1.84TF GPU ( 18 CUs) for games + 50% Compute Units, +50% TFlops
PS4: 1152 Shaders +50%
PS4: 72 Texture units +50%
PS4: 32 ROPS + 100%
PS4: 8 ACE/64 queues +300%
Xbox one is around 30% slower, but the ps4 is around 50% faster.
Portugeezer
Member
Sizes are exaggerated for visualisation.
The numbers however speak for themselves, thus, this is the only conclusion we have when a game has parity between both consoles.
crappybannedjunior999999
Banned
Ten games that look exactly the same on both? Ok. Go!
BibiMaghoo
Member
I've only seen a single comparison shot, showing clearly in it that the PS3 version is uglier than the 360 version. That is my opinion on it.
I have no expectation that a game must push everything a console has, or the dev is lazy. That is absurd.
Just imagine the landscape for a moment, if you would, if such a mentality was applied to PC games...
This is console wars extremes, where by a developer is lambasted for not pushing a console to it's limits with extra effects over a weaker console, when every person on this board has played many titles throughout their lives that do exactly that without complaint.
family_guy
Member
Maybe in terms of level scale but I didn't find any of the games they did that good to look at. Halo Anniversary and Halo 4 by 343 were better looking.
Kssio_Aug
Member
But they know that the Xone is capable to run this game with great visuals at 1080p, so why not work on that now, since they reach their target on PS4 already? Are you people really thinking that they should let the PS4 version looking better just for the sake of looking better because has the best hardware? It seems a very egoistic way of thinking.
Destiny already looks great on PS4. Im sure that if the Xone version werent targeting 1080p and had some frame rate problems some people here would already feel satisfied simply because the platform that they chose is showing better results!
What makes you think Bungie didn't "max out" the 360? Is it because they don't make heavily scripted games with narrow/linear levels while smearing the screen with lens flare and motion blur effects? For whatever reason it's difficult for people to see Bungie's technical accomplishments, but they did plenty of impressive things on the 360.
Yup and it's sad how willing people are to use that stupid "lazy dev" line.
People don't buy a lot of things for a lot of reasons.
But if people are upset about parity (alleged parity, final game will reveal if both versions are identical), we can discuss why parity is bullshit.
The swing in opinion is insane when we just spent 8 years being relieved to hear that developers were putting extra time into getting the PS3 version "up to par". I honestly don't think I heard a single person complain that the 360 version wasn't getting the same number of hours to be even better.
Cizeta-Moroder
Banned
For consolation, maybe they could release a patch to spam invisible triangles to use all the power. Gotta get rid of that frametime headroom.
JonathanPower
Member
Surely a better anti-aliasing method than the shitty FXAA, considering that PS4 has twice as many ROPs.
It not ONLY 50% faster, it has way superior Ram setup. also the gap is there in almost all games released so far.
AgentP
Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
Wow... So put effort into the XB1 to reach its potential, but let the PS4 sit below its potential and why? PS4 ownners pay the same $60, they want the same effort.
The two consoles are not equal, there is no reason the final product should be equal If they are it means they put less work into one than the other. Great for XB1 owners who want to think their machine is just as powerful, but PS4 owners want more. 1080P 30fps at these visuals is a cake walk for the PS4. It should be hitting 60fps, the only reason they are not is they capped the frame rate and left the PS4 version in a less than optimal state.
travisbickle
Member
There's a lot of people in this thread very relieved Bungie are putting in extra time to get the XB1 version up to par. It's the same argument, but you might be on the other side now.
crappybannedjunior999999
Banned
The consumer pays the same price for either version. Why am I paying the same price if I buy it on the PS4 if it was the one that had less time and resources allocated to it?Shouldn't I expect a better visual experience from a more powerful machine?
As somebody who has all three new-gen machines parity really pisses me off. There is no consumer driven reason in this generation for it to exist other than to mollify those with the less powerful system.
I'm just talking parity in general here. For the record, Bungie is a company that I would never suspect of being "lazy shit devs". This is the one big reason that the apparent parity in this instance is surprising and bothersome to me (concern trolling, smh).
With that being said, Urk came here and addressed it with a response. I respect that and it is enough for me until we see the final product. He stated that the advantages of EVERY platform will be utilized. My hope is he's not talking about just touch pads and rumble trigger type stuff here.
I hate to feel like I am "subsidizing" a weaker system when I buy a product. This is what parity makes me feel like. I already bought a One and WiiU in addition to a PS4 I did my part.
The swing in opinion is insane when we just spent 8 years being relieved to hear that developers were putting extra time into getting the PS3 version "up to par". I honestly don't think I heard a single person complain that the 360 version wasn't getting the same number of hours to be even better.
Yea right, considering a lot of them can't even be assed to switch R2 over to R1. I mean how much effort is that?
The swing in opinion is insane when we just spent 8 years being relieved to hear that developers were putting extra time into getting the PS3 version "up to par". I honestly don't think I heard a single person complain that the 360 version wasn't getting the same number of hours to be even better.
PS3/X360 are about the same power (different architectures but similar output). PS4/X1 are not (same architectures but one has better everything).
You are right. In some aspect it's 300% more powerful. ; )
This is a pointless argument because developers releasing games on multiple platforms are not going to be the ones pushing the hardware. It's always the first parties or third parties that are releasing games exclusively for one of the platforms. Developers releasing on multiple platforms have it in their best interest to make sure they spend their resources on improving the version that's struggling and not making the version that's already running at 1080p 30fps even better. You don't piss off a potential revenue source.
Kssio_Aug
Member
And they said that they have put less effort on PS4 for that? Also, Xbox owners are also paying 60 dollars for this same game, and WITHOUT exclusive temporary shit.
Sony seems to have paid a good ammount of money for Bungie, and I believe that they focused on the PS4 version 1st, to reach their target... they reached it. So now what they should do, is obviously, focus on the Xone version to reach the target aswell, afterall their consumers are on both platforms!
I'm not seeing any Xbox owner trying to think that the Xone hardware is just as powerfull as the PS4 here, I think that its clear to everyone already that the PS4 is the strongest one. What its looks like to me, is that some PS4 owners are trying to justify even more their purchase trying to believe that evey single multiplatform game HAS to look better in some way on PS4. However you're missing something very clear here, I have an PS4 and by everything I played on the system Destiny is not looking bad at all! The game runs smoothly, its has pretty visuals (besides not the most impressive type) and its running on 1080p... why it necessarily has to look better then the Xone version if they already managed to make it as great as they wanted on the system? I dont think they have to do that, and I think that if they can make the Xone version runs as smooth and also on 1080p they have to work on that! I congratulate Bungie for that! Its good to know that they are putting efforts on both platforms so their game can run smoothly and looks good at both systems!
A) The point was that there was no "other side of the argument" before. Nobody was bitching about the PS3 needing more time/attention. It wasn't this pervasive thing that took over every thread about every modern game.
B) I have both a PS4 and XBO, I'm on the "think with your brain" side.
What does that have to do with the time put in? Over and over in this very thread, it's "if the PS4 got the same attention, it would be even better". If that's your take, fine, but I think it's fair to defend that concept over more than just the last 6 months of game development.
LittleJohnny
Banned
It's common knowledge to anyone following Xbone, but that's not really common around here lol.
Xbox One drivers currently "Horrible" says anonymous developer:
Tweet here.
When you're focused on the negatives, these positives tend to go unnoticed.
Oppo
Member
Bad example
it probably IS supersampled, on both new consoles. X1 has a very slightly less consistent frame rate.http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=817258
miDnIghtEr20C
Banned
I read in the news that the Oceans are now all freshwater since the release of Destiny on the X1. As if the salt were just magically sucked out of it and spread somewhere else.
LittleJohnny
Banned
Not just Kinecturd, but horrible drivers initially. Judging the difference by initial games was a mistake, now with mature drivers that probably closer match the polish of PS4 drivers and no more Kinect reserve, we're starting to see what the true difference looks like, which for some reason is pissing off PS4 fans who want the old ways to continue. They don't closely follow Xbone developments and now blindly blame developers for the smaller differences.
Game development involves a target, for PS4 it was 1080p 30fps with the set of visuals that the artists and graphics engineers believe can be achieved; for Xbox One it was 900p 30fps with that same or similar goal. Proof right there that they were pushing beyond what Xbone could do, with only PS4 able to hit 1080p, it was only after the SDK improvements that they're now able to hit 1080p on Xbone, has nothing to do with lazy developers or under-targeted PS4 development.
psn
Member
Okay, what else do you want to compare? The GPU has the biggest impact. Just look up some benchmarks. The CPU is identical, we don't know the speed of the ps4 cpu, but I remember a benchmark where the ps4 cpu was still faster than the xb1 cpu, maybe because the system is reserving a core less.
And still, the memory is superior in the ps4.
So even if the ddr3 + esram setup would be as fast as the gddr5 ram in the ps4 (and we know it isn't) and the cpu is really close, what else do you want to calculate in? It is around 50% more powerful. 900p vs 1080p is around 50% more pixels.. I don't know what your definition about a wide >>>>>>> gap is, but 900p vs 1080p is the gap we should expect imo (just if you look at the resolution with same effects etc). It is not enough to be 30 vs 60fps, since that would require a 100% difference in a perfect world..
So yeah, there should be overhead in the ps4 version. There is no need to deny it. They may have reasons but denial? Come on.
BouncyFrag
Member
Good point, but this thread is chock full of silly making reasonable points like this irrelevant. Narratives have to be advanced. Logic be damned.