Games Journalism! Wainwright/Florence/Tomb Raider/Eurogamer/Libel Threats/Doritos

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http://gamergateharrassment.tumblr.com/ just like at the bile by all of these people....here's the latest bullshit one that that these people protecting the press are doing yep totally reasonable I sorta wonder if some people are going to be fired at all for this.

Ben Spurr is not what I would consider an individual capable of commenting on matters in which he thinks behaviour gets "out of hand" and "incendiary", which is why it makes my skin crawl to see his post second on that tumblr so far.
 
I really wish people would drop the usage of 'SJW'. I have seen legitimate concerns and criticism instantly disregarded because of folks using SJW to refer to people opposing to the gamergate hashtag.

You are undermining your entire argument when you use language like this, it's like calling someone a poopyhead and expecting to be taken seriously.

http://gamergateharrassment.tumblr.com/ for example.

There's some legitimate stuff in there that needs to be addressed. But the header of "If you have any evidence of SJW's attacking you for your opinion, then let me know." just makes me eye-roll and be more likely to write the entire thing off.
 
Tempted to agree considering her more in-depth, revealing features on Gamasutra, but while we're on the topic of things being arbitrarily more important, as everyone decrying Kotaku last week was wont to do, I have greater qualms about Alexander's integrity. Most notably when she revealed, and drew attention to the fact that she revealed, the email address of someone responding to one of her articles last month.

That and this. these people need to stop being in positions to influence many games and while still having the power to review them also. It creates an industry of games that only these "journalists" want.
 
I really wish people would drop the usage of 'SJW'. I have seen legitimate concerns and criticism instantly disregarded because of folks using SJW to refer to people opposing to the gamergate hashtag.

You are undermining your entire argument when you use language like this, it's like calling someone a poopyhead and expecting to be taken seriously.

http://gamergateharrassment.tumblr.com/ for example.

There's some legitimate stuff in there that needs to be addressed. But the header of "If you have any evidence of SJW's attacking you for your opinion, then let me know." just makes me eye-roll and be more likely to write the entire thing off.

Ohh I know but you yourself are seeing all of this correct? I mean you're a writer for http://gamesnosh.com/gamergate-silly-sounding-sincere-call-fair-representation-gamers-within-media/ this is just getting to ridiculous levels.
 
"Journalists" are being called out on their shit for constantly having a conflict of interest and complete and utter bias for the people the write about. The wishy washy crap of being a blogger but then a journalist but then a only an enthusiast. They're responding in complete vitriol to people that dare question ethics in journalism no matter sincere those questions are because they feel offended that they have to actually do work for their job. Even better they're trying to canabalize each other because of ideologies and not ethics to the point where they ragged on people like Jason and Kotaku because they dare changed their code to match more closely to this.

Not to mention, that they try to spin the entire thing, based on the threat that Anita got on her twitter, as if "gamers" are all like the person who threatened her - misogynistic, neckbearded, shut-ins (in their words).
Thus, framing the "debate" as "sexist assholes vs the righteous media", instead of what it actually is - people who want transparency (especially when every day there are more questionable things popping up), and to be treated right by the game journalism
 
Ohh I know but you yourself are seeing all of this correct? I mean you're a writer for http://gamesnosh.com/gamergate-silly-sounding-sincere-call-fair-representation-gamers-within-media/ this is just getting to ridiculous levels.

I was the one to put up the original Quinn story, so I'm very aware of what is going on.

Being close to this I can clearly see the element of the community that is in this for reasons other than trying to address the conflict of interest.

There's a minority of very loud people that are using this to push their anti-feminist agenda that are completely missing the point. This is about the people who are supposed to serve the gamer community actively despising it.

When the folks who are responsible for covering games media hate the consumers, you have to wonder if the claims of corruption have a base.

Going off on feminists and "SJW's" distracts from that and gives an excuse for the media to just ignore to entire thing and say "see, it really is just a bunch of sad angry men"

That is a damn shame and a disservice to the hobby.
 
just wondering but did they ever apologize to him?

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As amusing as the whole Doritopope thing was, I think the beatings that Geoff Keighly got was a bit unfair. He never claimed to be either a journalist or objective. And as far as gaming media personalities go, he's pretty decent.

Have to agree tbh. I always felt he was a terrible example to point the finger at because he's a presenter rather than a day in day out games journalist, and when he has written things such as the final hours pieces they've generally been investigative. Getting mad at Keightley is like getting mad at Letterman or Stewart when a guest comes on to promote their book/film it's a case of saying here it is, not buy this. It's product awareness not product advocacy.


Glad to see at least some voices in the gaming press are talking about establishing standard of practice going forward, though I'm hoping fact checking is also part of that move as well.
 
Many game "journalists" are always utterly professional and ethical journalists, up until the regular wagon-circle-fest comes around, at which point many of them denounce their status as a journalist(and a 'gamer', because that's nerdy!) and suddenly turn into mere bloggers.

They then spout an endless pile of drivel about how whatever blatant case of bullshit going on in their profession isn't important, and "now isn't the time to have that discussion". This is usually followed up by a convenient stream of articles passive-aggressively lashing out at their audience, constructing a convenient strawman to rally their twitter followers into shitting on.

Anyone notice how all those articles about how "gamers are over" and "gamers are nerds, losers, etc." happened to get published on damn near the same day?
 
Many game "journalists" are always utterly professional and ethical journalists, up until the regular wagon-circle-fest comes around, at which point many of them denounce their status as a journalist(and a 'gamer', because that's nerdy!) and suddenly turn into mere bloggers.

They then spout an endless pile of drivel about how whatever blatant case of bullshit going on in their profession isn't important, and "now isn't the time to have that discussion". This is usually followed up by a convenient stream of articles passive-aggressively lashing out at their audience, constructing a convenient strawman to rally their twitter followers into shitting on.

Anyone notice how all those articles about how "gamers are over" and "gamers are nerds, losers, etc." happened to get published on damn near the same day?

most hypocritical thing is http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=885881 ....read the article thoroughly, guess what they reference in it that they themselves proclaimed dead just the other day?
 
Anyone notice how all those articles about how "gamers are over" and "gamers are nerds, losers, etc." happened to get published on damn near the same day?

This struck me as weird. Sorta Fox News like where a talking point will be decided and then on every sort of medium that point will be hammered.

The further this goes on, the worse many gaming "journalists" are looking.
 
This struck me as weird. Sorta Fox News like where a talking point will be decided and then on every sort of medium that point will be hammered.

The further this goes on, the worse many gaming "journalists" are looking.

I want them to continue and just keep throwing these completely disgusting remarks to everybody even truly innocent people like Boogie and such just because he even talked a single word of this whole thing. Just so at the end of the day we can go "See this? this is a thing called humanity it's in everybody of different color/sex/sexual orientation and such" and that you can never go the lazy route of blanket statements because over the course of many years it's proven to never ever work. Hopefully this shows people that their moral superiority high ground is false.
 
(incoming some rambling. If this feels too off topic, signal it to me and i'll delete and keep it for some other occasion. This is also somewhat of a big opinion piece)

What I find extremely curious in all this is that "gamer culture" and "gamer" that journalists like to blame today didn't really stem out of the will of old video game players. But mostly by publishers, console manufacturers and lo' and behold, video game related media.

When I was a kid, there wasn't much of a concern about game culture, nor was there a real want for one. It usually limited itself at "hey, did you play that ?" or "Oh man what did you think of that bit" or whatever bad game/good game came about, a bit of console warring of course, and lot's and lot's of pokemon and bomberman for me.

If anything, the gaming group was very similar to what the tabletop/RPG/larping group was and still kinda is today: Sure we had our magazines and gatherings, but mostly it stayed as some geeky, nerdy sub "thing", occasionally target of the media like tabletop was, but it didn't go much further than that for a while.

The key difference for me is that, while tabletop and roleplay stayed relatively the same in scope (it grew larger but still keeps being this "niche" thing compared to other medias and hobbies), games grew large because of the money involved. Around the early to mid noughties, with the boom of big consoles like the PS2, and then later on, the Wii, games were "in". Publishers and console manufacturers started to spin this image of the cool new "gamer", and media followed suit, because it also allowed them to be "legitimate". They would be no longer journalists for a geeky nerdy hobby but respected for "covering a new art form".

So suddenly we're told that there's this culture, and gamers and gaming is great. It's no longer for children, it's the art movement of the new generation. That's when we started seeing more rebuttals against the likes of Jack Thompson who constantly attacked video games, asking for games to be taken seriously. And for a very short while, it was kinda just like that. And "gamers", or rather the people who used to play games before kinda rolled with it, while they didn't necessarily ask for it. Because hey, games are getting a bit more popular and accepted, but as long as we can keep playing them, no so sweat. Even though it meant that a bunch of journalists started speaking for us. But at the time, no one really cared

But thing is, the general change in internet media, and games journalism started to change. It wasn't just enough to cover games, they wanted to be respected. Moreso, they wanted to be respected by people outside the medium. Social issues started to be all the rage. Key personalities started to rise, in both the media and the indie scene. But to really get that respect they wanted, they had to get rid of the old image. More important, they had to get rid of "old gamers", or "the old guard" as they started calling it recently. Because who wants to be associated to nerds anyway if you're trying to appear legitimate. And for a few years now, there's a confrontation that started brewing, as people who initially didn't really care about gamer culture in the first place are started to be painted in quite a negative light, reminiscing for most for their school years. We're back to being "gross" and "awkward" and "weird" and nerdy, all in a bad way. We don't fit in the progressive narrative, and we're ruining the "culture" that they claim we created.

Funnily enough, if you go on /v/ for example, they really don't like the idea of "gamer culture". In fact, most of them HATE this stuff. They don't want to be associated with any kind of culture of association, they just care about good video games (or ranting at bad video games, or your taste in video games are shit and you're only having fake fun, jesus christ why aren't you playing 10/10 GOTYAY you...oops, got distracted). Of course, not gonna deny that there are anti feminists, racists, and whatever bigots you might think of. I have yet to find a single group of hobbyist that doesn't. My father who has been a journalist for most french-swiss newspapers for decades still has to face the same kind of dumb people that we see today in games media.
But most of them don't care, don't want to care, and don't want to be told what to care about, especially for something that they didn't really want in the first place.

So now we have a weird simultaneous movement of almost a dozen game media who, in the space of 2 days, are all trying to say that gamer culture is dead or dying, and gamers are dead, and try to paint "us" in the most pathetic human beings that could possibly exist in a 1st world country.
If they want to kill gamer culture, sure, fine, go ahead. I think it's mostly their mess in first place. But I find it a bit distasteful to avoid responsibility of it in the first place.

I hope this was not too long or dumb. English ain't my first language, plus talking from a personal view point and I PROBABLY said some incredibly dumb stuff. If so, do point it out (politely please) and i'll "eat crow" as I think it's the saying here

EDIT: I'm also realizing that I'm unjustly throwing every game journalist under the bus here. And I have to point out that not everything is bad from what came of games journalism. For example one of my fav articles, and it was from kotaku of all place, was about the state of Japan Studio at the end of the 7th gen. It was really really well made and I usually recommend it to people curious about SCEJ. And there are some voices I actually like to hear like Jim Sterling and Yahtzee from the escapist it did help in getting the indie movement popular and for that I am grateful
 
http://gamergateharrassment.tumblr.com/ just like at the bile by all of these people....here's the latest bullshit one that that these people protecting the press are doing yep totally reasonable I sorta wonder if some people are going to be fired at all for this.

Wow. But yeah, I wouldn't expect anyone to get fired, they are going back to the old posts by Patricia Hernandez where she pimped the games of friends/lovers to update them retro-actively with "full disclosure" now that it has been proven she is guilty of ethics violations (the same thing Nathan Grayson was originally accused of). If she still has a job after that, these people are untouchable.
 
most hypocritical thing is http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=885881 ....read the article thoroughly, guess what they reference in it that they themselves proclaimed dead just the other day?

There is no they. One article was written by Rob Fahey for GamesIndustry, the other was from Leigh Alexander for Gamasutra. They are two different persons with very different positions within the "writing scene" and with different outlooks on the gaming world. Don't expect the press as a whole or any publication in particular (or even a single author) to have a coherent position.
 
There is no they. One article was written by Rob Fahey for GamesIndustry, the other was from Leigh Alexander for Gamasutra. They are two different persons with very different positions within the "writing scene" and with different outlooks on the gaming world. Don't expect the press as a whole or any publication in particular (or even a single author) to have a coherent position.

Except that we saw over the course of less than 48 hours a barrage of articles from various publications that all featured the same exact talking point (similar to how major news outlets like Fox decide that they're going to focus on a specific issue across all of their shows). In this case, it was the death of the term "gamer" and how being a "gamer" makes you a bad person.

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That's a pretty coherent position across a number of writers and publications, all pointing the finger in one direction while ignoring the abusive vitriol that non-gamers and feminists have been spouting towards anyone who has raised questions in the last two weeks.
 
Wow. But yeah, I wouldn't expect anyone to get fired, they are going back to the old posts by Patricia Hernandez where she pimped the games of friends/lovers to update them retro-actively with "full disclosure" now that it has been proven she is guilty of ethics violations (the same thing Nathan Grayson was originally accused of). If she still has a job after that, these people are untouchable.

I wonder what kind of backlash Kotaku and Steven would get if they fired her.
I could see a lot of angry people.
 
Except that we saw over the course of less than 48 hours a barrage of articles from various publications that all featured the same exact talking point (similar to how major news outlets like Fox decide that they're going to focus on a specific issue across all of their shows). In this case, it was the death of the term "gamer" and how being a "gamer" makes you a bad person.

That's a pretty coherent position across a number of writers and publications, all pointing the finger in one direction while ignoring the abusive vitriol that non-gamers and feminists have been spouting towards anyone who has raised questions in the last two weeks.

"Everyone is writing about this, it must be a conspiracy!". Could it not just be that multiple people are writing about this because it's something worth discussing?
 
I wonder what kind of backlash Kotaku and Steven would get if they fired her.
I could see a lot of angry people.

I can see a lot of angry people when they find out she pimped games by friends/lovers, including showering praise on them and linking directly to sales pages without disclosing that at the time of publication.

"Everyone is writing about this, it must be a conspiracy!". Could it not just be that multiple people are writing about this because it's something worth discussing?

I'm not saying it's a conspiracy, I was replying to the person who said you can't expect a coherent perspective from a diverse range of writers and publications. But I do think it's incredibly naive to assume that these writers aren't following each other and tweeting each other and direct-messaging or emailing each other about these topics.

If there was a barrage of articles just discussing the misogyny in gaming culture in general, that would be a topical thing to write about and the subject is wide enough to include lots of different articles and perspectives. It's the fact that all of those articles are focused on demonizing the term "gamer" that makes it look like a PR agency / consulting firm sent out an email to their contacts in the press to focus on that talking point.
 
I'm not saying it's a conspiracy, I was replying to the person who said you can't expect a coherent perspective from a diverse range of writers and publications.

It's the fact that all of those articles are focused on demonizing the term "gamer" that makes it look like a PR agency / consulting firm sent out an email to their contacts in the press to focus on that talking point.

Umm, that 2nd part reads like major conspiracy talk. I'm genuinely curious, What reason would a PR agency have for getting people to focus on this talking point? Or for talking about the erosion of the term "gamer" anyway?
 
Most of that looks like jump on the bandwagon click bait.

It could easily be that, but it's disappointing that no one is writing an article about how the extremists on both sides of hi-jacked the conversation in the same way that the crazies in politics have. And many of them are avowed non-gamers who are only getting involved in the discussion because it gives them a platform to push their own agenda.

Umm, that 2nd part reads like major conspiracy talk. I'm genuinely curious, What reason would a PR agency have for getting people to focus on this talking point? Or for talking about the erosion of the term "gamer" anyway?

I said it "looks like" the same thing Fox news and other news orgs do when they send out the talking points for all their news readers. Conan O'Brien does a bit about that, where he shows how all these different news readers across the country are all reading the same script. I'm not saying that is actually the case in this instance, just that it looks very similar. And given the current "us vs them" climate I wouldn't be surprised if this was the result of an internal email conversation across several writers.
 
"Everyone is writing about this, it must be a conspiracy!". Could it not just be that multiple people are writing about this because it's something worth discussing?

it's not a conspiracy that a group of people have concocted for a purpose. but i think it's very telling how many outlets used the identical framing of "gamers are dead" for quite an open ended issue.

it's worth discussing the harassment, it's worth discussing the deep anger and suspicion in parts of the gaming world, it's worth discussing gaming culture and how much these incidents are indicative of wider malaise or not. there's a lot to unpack. i don't think you do service to that when everything goes after the same single angle, borrowed from the single lens of examining it that's established by an influential voice.

i think it's basically just lazy journalism. instead of finding a distinct, insightful angle to approach the story, you look at what people in your circles on twitter are saying then you decide you need to be a part of the story and create a cover version quickly. there's sadly probably a few economic factors at play. the kind of reflective, thoughtful piece that adds to the discourse takes way too much time and expertise to compete online and only a few people want to read it or care by the time it's written. money means outlets just go for the easy options.
 

It was a shitty week and it's understandable that websites write about it. I'm not going to read all these articles but some of them seem to be mere reactions to the death threat towards Anita Sarkeesian and/or the the Leigh Alexander piece and/or the Zoe Quinn drama.

Here are some snippets from three articles I skimmed:

Luke Plunkett / Kotaku
Note they're not talking about everyone who plays games, or who self-identifies as a "gamer", as being the worst. It's being used in these cases as short-hand, a catch-all term for the type of reactionary holdouts that feel so threatened by gaming's widening horizons. If you call yourself a "gamer" and are a cool person, keep on being a cool person.
Casey Johnston / ars technica
For gaming to be taken seriously as an art form, it needs to be able to stand up to cultural critiques, and gamers need to be able to separate a developer's personal life from her work. But it especially holds the medium back when these situations not only fail to play out in a civilized way, but become opportunistic embroiling of women in the "problems" of gaming culture, creation, and coverage.
Arthur Chu / The Daily Beast
Okay, gamers, let’s have a talk.
First of all, my cred—rest assured I am one of your tribe.
[…]
I don’t know. What I do know is that the subset of entitled, belligerent gamers convinced that being “objectively” right entitles them to defend their rightness by any means necessary are overwhelmingly male. And that obnoxious guys convinced of their objective correctness find it way easier to dismiss your opinions as “subjective” if you’re female.
They all touch on the same issues but the arguments, the tone and the conclusions are rather dissimilar (the Gamasutra pieces kinda stand out). Imho, it’s rather disingenuous to lump them together and imply the press orchestrates a witch hunt against gamers.
 
I said it "looks like" the same thing Fox news and other news orgs do when they send out the talking points for all their news readers. Conan O'Brien does a bit about that, where he shows how all these different news readers across the country are all reading the same script. I'm not saying that is actually the case.

Right I get that but the first thing you suggested was still that it *looks like* it could be the work of a PR company (and thus some sort of targeted campaign?), as opposed to pure coincidence or the more likely idea that it's a current topic that is interesting to discuss.

it's not a conspiracy that a group of people have concocted for a purpose. but i think it's very telling how many outlets used the identical framing of "gamers are dead" for quite an open ended issue.

it's worth discussing the harassment, it's worth discussing the deep anger and suspicion in parts of the gaming world, it's worth discussing gaming culture and how much these incidents are indicative of wider malaise or not. there's a lot to unpack. i don't think you do service to that when everything goes after the same single angle, borrowed from the single lens of examining it that's established by an influential voice.

i think it's basically just lazy journalism. instead of finding a distinct, insightful angle to approach the story, you look at what people in your circles on twitter are saying then you decide you need to be a part of the story and create a cover version quickly. there's sadly probably a few economic factors at play. the kind of reflective, thoughtful piece that adds to the discourse takes way too much time and expertise to compete online and only a few people want to read it or care by the time it's written. money means outlets just go for the easy options.

"Gamers are dead" could very well just be used because it's a punchy memorable line though right? This is nothing new, "X is dead" as long been used either seriously or with some sarcasm or humor when discussing change in cultures or technology or whatever (a bit like how people paraphrase famous GAF quotes, amir0x etc). Also seeing as how these discussions have all erupted out of specific events in the last few weeks it's kinda understandable that it multiple outlets might group it around the same term.

I agree that getting multiple angles is useful but these look like thinkpieces to me and maybe it's as much that multiple journalists are all kinda feeling the same way about their relationship with their readers/communities, or the same way about where gaming culture is headed.

I'm having trouble seeing the sort of conspiracy/not-conspiracy angle here. Wanting more from journalists or being disappointed that more viewpoints haven't been explored is perfectly understandable but that doesn't mean that it's all down to clickbaits or conspiracies.
 
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-10-24-lost-humanity-18-a-table-of-doritos

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Yup, it's real.








Youtube>GAF>Internet>GAF


Recap from shagg_187


(Thanks to Ledsen)
Current articles/videos/podcasts
Wings over Sealand (Stuart Campbell) articles (second article has early summary) 1 2 3
John Walker's (Rock Paper Shotgun) blog (start with Games Journalists, And The Perception Of Corruption, includes guest post by Rab Florence)
TotalBiscuit
Jim Sterling
Penny-Arcade 1 2
Gamasutra
Forbes
Worthplaying
GiantBomb
Jason Lauritzen editorial and GAF post
RPGCodex writes an excellent summary
Destructoid
BoingBoing
TheSixthAxis
EDGE article that was written a few weeks ago
PlayerOne Podcast
Eurogamer's Tom Bramwell (editor who edited Rab's column) about the last few days
Rock Paper Shotgun official stance
The Guardian and a funny thing related to the article
Giant Bombcast
VG247 on their new ethics statement
Video Games Interactive
Kotaku 1 2
Pocketgamer
Videogamer.com
Gamesindustry.biz 1 2

Old (but still relevant) articles/videos/podcasts
Rab Florence (the guy who started all this) criticizing games writing since 2008
An old episode of CGW Radio discussing Gerstmann-gate
Old Gamasutra article on the influence of PR
Old GFW radio bits
1up YoursShawn Elliot and Shane Bettenhausen

Comments from the industry
Shawn Elliot - 1 (aegies is Arthur Gies of polygon.com) 2 3 4 5 6 on the psychology of PR etc
and some more Arthur Gies - 1 2 3 4 5 and some replies 1 2 3
Jeff Green on the way it actually works, and another post, an another
ShockingAlberto on his view as a former games writer
Jason Schreier (Kotaku) - 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 and many more
N'Gai Croal initial reaction on Twitter
Chris Schilling (freelance) likes both people involved and so doesn't want to write about it
Danny O'Dwyer (Gamespot UK) on why his site won't cover this (audience is not interested) - 1 2 3
pastapadre on being shunned by the industry
Stephen Totilo (Kotaku) doesn't think this is an important story (has changed his mind about that part, read post 9). Wants to focus on good games journalism, this prompted a pretty funny picture and a comment about it, then Stephen Totilo enters the thread 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 (ignore the comment on 18, couldn't find a direct link to Totilo's comment) 19 20 (in reply to this
Weekend Confirmed 1 2 (these two are from the podcast) 3 4 (comments from Garnett) 5 (podcast #2)
Syriel on his experiences of PR
Jeff Gerstmann short comment on swag
Christian Donlan and Simon Parkin of Eurogamer want to change how they do things
Nert on his experience as PR in the tech industry 1 2
John Walker (RPS) on why the site won't cover it (they did anyway) like his blog did
Rab Florence tweets
Jeff Gerstmann 1 (1 is from Tumblr) 2 (2 via EternalGamer, highlights some other stuff) 3 4 5 (3-5 are comments by Jeff in this thread)
Christian Spicer
MaxwellGT2000 talks about his experiences as a writer for a small site that got bigger
Dave Long 1 2
Brad Shoemaker 1 (in reply to this) 2
Brad Lawrence (2K games UK PR)

Comments from others
GillianSeed79 and firehawk12 on how journalist do criticize their peers
voodoopanda highlights that the issue is not in any way black or white
Snowden's Secret comments on gaming press reactions
Zissou weighs in

Other relevant/interesting links and examples of PR
Examples of various press kits
The 3DS comes to GiantBomb
Letter sent to reviewers from UbiSoft along with their press copy of Assassin's Creed 3
How Rockstar handled the reviews for GTA4
Battlefield 3 review questionnarie[/QUOTE]
 
I don't use, "gamer" in my articles because I just find the origins of the word to be a little distasteful. Gamer does not represent who plays games now. The word defines people for what they like and stigmatizes them.

There are a load of other words and phrases that do a better job of describing people that like games than gamer.
 
"Gamers are dead" could very well just be used because it's a punchy memorable line though right? This is nothing new, "X is dead" as long been used either seriously or with some sarcasm or humor when discussing change in cultures or technology or whatever (a bit like how people paraphrase famous GAF quotes, amir0x etc). Also seeing as how these discussions have all erupted out of specific events in the last few weeks it's kinda understandable that it multiple outlets might group it around the same term.

I agree that getting multiple angles is useful but these look like thinkpieces to me and maybe it's as much that multiple journalists are all kinda feeling the same way about their relationship with their readers/communities, or the same way about where gaming culture is headed.

I'm having trouble seeing the sort of conspiracy/not-conspiracy angle here. Wanting more from journalists or being disappointed that more viewpoints haven't been explored is perfectly understandable but that doesn't mean that it's all down to clickbaits or conspiracies.

fair points.
 
I don't use, "gamer" in my articles because I just find the origins of the word to be a little distasteful. Gamer does not represent who plays games now. The word defines people for what they like and stigmatizes them.

There are a load of other words and phrases that do a better job of describing people that like games than gamer.

The term "gamer" would not have any negative connotations besides the usual idea of them being "nerdy" if it wasn't for the feminist narrative currently drowning out the realities, which is that roughly half the gaming population is female, and that the worst representatives of the group are a very small minority of the total population, and are the same assholes you'll find anywhere. This same minority could be used to spin gamers as incredibly racist too, if all you go by are the things you hear spouted over an Xbox Live COD game, but nobody would blanket every gamer as being a racist.

What is it about the term "gamer" applying to "people who enjoy playing videogames" that you find so abhorrent compared to say: "film buff", "bookworm", "metalhead", "foodlover", "petrolhead", "gym rat", etc, etc..? Sure, many of these terms are used derisively by people outside the group, but they are also often adopted and used positively by the members of the group, too. Also note that these terms apply to members of both sex.
 
The term "gamer" would not have any negative connotations besides the usual idea of them being "nerdy" if it wasn't for the feminist narrative currently drowning out the realities, which is that roughly half the gaming population is female
It's not "feminists" who are trying to drown out that point.
 
It's not "feminists" who are trying to drown out that point.

Then the people demonizing the term "gamer" are labeling female gamers as misogynists too, since they make up 50% of the gaming population. That's kind of a strange stance to take, don't you think? Or do you think that the term "gamer" is only applicable to males who enjoy playing videogames?
 
The term "gamer" would not have any negative connotations besides the usual idea of them being "nerdy" if it wasn't for the feminist narrative currently drowning out the realities, which is that roughly half the gaming population is female.

What is it about the term "gamer" applying to "people who enjoy playing videogames" that you find so abhorrent compared to than say: "film buff", "bookworm", "metalhead", "foodlover", "petrolhead", "gym rat", etc, etc..? Sure, many of these terms are used derisively by people outside the group, but they are also often adopted and used positively by the members of the group, too. Also note that these terms apply to members of both sex.

It has nothing to do with social justice or feminism.

Jeff Gerstmann talked about this last night at the GB PAX panel. Essentially what he said was that the word was used to define a specific cross section of people who were passionate about games. Gamer was used by ignorant marketing people as another form of nerd or geek. "Those people who play a lot of games, how can we define them?"

Gaming is one of the few industries that uses a word like gamer. You rarely hear the word film buff or bookworm in other industries because people do more than just their hobby. To define people based on one particular interest is ignorant.

I hate to bring in race, but I think words like gamer or bookworm have a similar connection to racial slurs. When you boil them down to their simplest form, both gamer and racial slurs are used to define a person based on one particular trait or hobby. People are more than their hobby or features.
 
Then the people demonizing the term "gamer" are labeling female gamers as misogynists too, since they make up 50% of the gaming population. That's kind of a strange stance to take, don't you think?

I think in reality a lot of the people you think are demonizing "gamers" as a group are actually saying that the stereotype of "people who play games" is not very accurate, as gaming as a hobby is pretty mundane and mainstream now, representing a wide group of people from diverse backgrounds and (other) interests. At the same time, they're saying that there is a large portion of folks within this broader group who are trying to desperately hang-on to an outdated notion of what "gaming" and "gamers" really means, and instead of accepting or encouraging this broadening of appeal are instead pulling themselves inward and lashing out inappropriately.


Mully: I'd also say that "film buff" describes a passion, while for many people "gamer" describes a lifestyle or identity. I think we're seeing a conflict between people who really think that's a real thing, vs people who are just like, yeah I have that hobby too.
 
It has nothing to do with social justice or feminism.

Jeff Gerstmann talked about this last night at the GB PAX panel. Essentially what he said was that the word was used to define a specific cross section of people who were passionate about games. Gamer was used by ignorant marketing people as another form of nerd or geek. "Those people who play a lot of games, how can we define them?"

Gaming is one of the few industries that uses a word like gamer. You rarely hear the word film buff or bookworm in other industries because people do more than just their hobby. To define people based on one particular interest is ignorant.

I hate to bring in race, but I think words like gamer or bookworm have a similar connection to racial slurs. When you boil them down to their simplest form, both gamer and racial slurs are used to define a person based on one particular trait or hobby. People are more than their hobby or features.

I don't see how that reading is in any way representative of reality. Saying I'm a "gamer" shouldn't carry any negative connotations than calling myself a film buff or bookworm, except that movies and books are generally more acceptable forms of entertainment for the general population.

they're saying that there is a large portion of folks within this broader group who are trying to desperately hang-on to an outdated notion of what "gaming" and "gamers" really means, and instead of accepting or encouraging this broadening of appeal are instead pulling themselves inward and lashing out inappropriately.

On the contrary, I'd say it's a vocal minority who are causing problems, and the broader group is sick of being lumped in with them. If you look at the vitriol being spewed against the entire "gamer" population by feminists right now on twitter you'll see they are not advocating for the wider population but are pigeon-holing all of us based on a few assholes. And, while you say gaming as a hobby is "mundane and mainstream" many of the most vocal critics are themselves avowed non-gamers who say they have no interest or outright hate videogames.
 
On the contrary, I'd say it's a vocal minority who are causing problems
Those are not two mutually-exclusive propositions. A minority of a huge group can still be a large amount of people.

and the broader group is sick of being lumped in with them.
Exactly exactly exactly. If you're in the camp that doesn't want to be grouped-in with assholes, you're in the same camp as the "feminists" you're complaining about.


If you look at the vitriol being spewed against the entire "gamer" population
So this is where your logic drops off, or at least your ability to actually accept the actual argument that has been placed before you. Once again, the idea is that there is right now a conflict rising from a polarized group of (mostly dudes) who are clinging on to an idea of "gamer" and "gaming" that does not actually reflect reality and that--people who hold on to this idea and believe that playing games is part of their identity or lifestyle that's being attacked, vs a hobby that a lot of people share and is growing--is what people are reacting against.


And, while you say gaming as a hobby is "mundane and mainstream" many of the most vocal critics are themselves avowed non-gamers who say they have no interest or outright hate videogames.

So your point is that people who don't share this hobby see the awful reception women get from self-proclaimed gamers, and then have a negative view of people who game.


And as an aside, I have to say, every time you say "feminist" it makes your position weaker and makes you look bad.
 
so how do we identify this vocal minority of game journalism who are making swathe generalizations under the guise of "feminism"?

is there a word or identifiable category we can point out without being accused of being misogynist or racist or sexist?
 
(incoming some rambling. If this feels too off topic, signal it to me and i'll delete and keep it for some other occasion. This is also somewhat of a big opinion piece)

What I find extremely curious in all this is that "gamer culture" and "gamer" that journalists like to blame today didn't really stem out of the will of old video game players. But mostly by publishers, console manufacturers and lo' and behold, video game related media.

When I was a kid, there wasn't much of a concern about game culture, nor was there a real want for one. It usually limited itself at "hey, did you play that ?" or "Oh man what did you think of that bit" or whatever bad game/good game came about, a bit of console warring of course, and lot's and lot's of pokemon and bomberman for me.

If anything, the gaming group was very similar to what the tabletop/RPG/larping group was and still kinda is today: Sure we had our magazines and gatherings, but mostly it stayed as some geeky, nerdy sub "thing", occasionally target of the media like tabletop was, but it didn't go much further than that for a while.

The key difference for me is that, while tabletop and roleplay stayed relatively the same in scope (it grew larger but still keeps being this "niche" thing compared to other medias and hobbies), games grew large because of the money involved. Around the early to mid noughties, with the boom of big consoles like the PS2, and then later on, the Wii, games were "in". Publishers and console manufacturers started to spin this image of the cool new "gamer", and media followed suit, because it also allowed them to be "legitimate". They would be no longer journalists for a geeky nerdy hobby but respected for "covering a new art form".

So suddenly we're told that there's this culture, and gamers and gaming is great. It's no longer for children, it's the art movement of the new generation. That's when we started seeing more rebuttals against the likes of Jack Thompson who constantly attacked video games, asking for games to be taken seriously. And for a very short while, it was kinda just like that. And "gamers", or rather the people who used to play games before kinda rolled with it, while they didn't necessarily ask for it. Because hey, games are getting a bit more popular and accepted, but as long as we can keep playing them, no so sweat. Even though it meant that a bunch of journalists started speaking for us. But at the time, no one really cared

But thing is, the general change in internet media, and games journalism started to change. It wasn't just enough to cover games, they wanted to be respected. Moreso, they wanted to be respected by people outside the medium. Social issues started to be all the rage. Key personalities started to rise, in both the media and the indie scene. But to really get that respect they wanted, they had to get rid of the old image. More important, they had to get rid of "old gamers", or "the old guard" as they started calling it recently. Because who wants to be associated to nerds anyway if you're trying to appear legitimate. And for a few years now, there's a confrontation that started brewing, as people who initially didn't really care about gamer culture in the first place are started to be painted in quite a negative light, reminiscing for most for their school years. We're back to being "gross" and "awkward" and "weird" and nerdy, all in a bad way. We don't fit in the progressive narrative, and we're ruining the "culture" that they claim we created.

Funnily enough, if you go on /v/ for example, they really don't like the idea of "gamer culture". In fact, most of them HATE this stuff. They don't want to be associated with any kind of culture of association, they just care about good video games (or ranting at bad video games, or your taste in video games are shit and you're only having fake fun, jesus christ why aren't you playing 10/10 GOTYAY you...oops, got distracted). Of course, not gonna deny that there are anti feminists, racists, and whatever bigots you might think of. I have yet to find a single group of hobbyist that doesn't. My father who has been a journalist for most french-swiss newspapers for decades still has to face the same kind of dumb people that we see today in games media.
But most of them don't care, don't want to care, and don't want to be told what to care about, especially for something that they didn't really want in the first place.

So now we have a weird simultaneous movement of almost a dozen game media who, in the space of 2 days, are all trying to say that gamer culture is dead or dying, and gamers are dead, and try to paint "us" in the most pathetic human beings that could possibly exist in a 1st world country.
If they want to kill gamer culture, sure, fine, go ahead. I think it's mostly their mess in first place. But I find it a bit distasteful to avoid responsibility of it in the first place.

I hope this was not too long or dumb. English ain't my first language, plus talking from a personal view point and I PROBABLY said some incredibly dumb stuff. If so, do point it out (politely please) and i'll "eat crow" as I think it's the saying here

EDIT: I'm also realizing that I'm unjustly throwing every game journalist under the bus here. And I have to point out that not everything is bad from what came of games journalism. For example one of my fav articles, and it was from kotaku of all place, was about the state of Japan Studio at the end of the 7th gen. It was really really well made and I usually recommend it to people curious about SCEJ. And there are some voices I actually like to hear like Jim Sterling and Yahtzee from the escapist it did help in getting the indie movement popular and for that I am grateful
I just want to quote your post because you rather eloquently explained a less discussed aspect of this whole debacle, namely the way the word 'gamer' came to be defined not by us, the players, but rather by the big corporations who wanted us to buy their products and the media who wanted us to read their words about those very same products.

The manipulative marketing practices which enforce those male-centric stereotypes about people who play videogames are of key import in defining the original narrative of 'gaming culture' as a whole. Over the past two generations the image of a gamer has slowly been transformed from a hobbyist geek to a more aggressive macho male. The experience of play is made to be less and less about the joy of exploration and discovery or the mastering of difficult challenges. Instead, it is the defined more and more by the singular act of killing, defeating your enemy and the rush that follows from it.

Of course, exploration-heavy RPGs are still being made today and FPS's existed 20 years ago as well, but there has been an undeniable shift occurring in the way we are being portrayed by marketing and the outside world in general.

It is, of course, unfortunate that this way of framing things will probably not get much traction, as the blame would be placed on ambiguous culprits, not as easy to define and put down like those so-called SJW or the mobs of "angry nerds" railing against them. That, and a journalist usually doesn't like to bite the hand that feeds.
 
It has nothing to do with social justice or feminism.

Jeff Gerstmann talked about this last night at the GB PAX panel. Essentially what he said was that the word was used to define a specific cross section of people who were passionate about games. Gamer was used by ignorant marketing people as another form of nerd or geek. "Those people who play a lot of games, how can we define them?"

Gaming is one of the few industries that uses a word like gamer. You rarely hear the word film buff or bookworm in other industries because people do more than just their hobby. To define people based on one particular interest is ignorant.

I hate to bring in race, but I think words like gamer or bookworm have a similar connection to racial slurs. When you boil them down to their simplest form, both gamer and racial slurs are used to define a person based on one particular trait or hobby. People are more than their hobby or features.

This just seems very arbitrary and contrived, the whole process and need for it, especially the brutalizing going around behind it. It's like it was made up after the fact for convenient punching bag and a buffer from that punching bag in face of the current situation. I think up until now few felt they were being defined by the word gamer, they were being categorized, as shorthand for "those who play games" (perhaps regularly/passionately). It's really easy to compare it to "fan", as in "sport fan" or "those who watch sports", which people are no less defined/categorized by it, no less enthusiastic about it, and no less manipulated by marketing. Like "fan", gamer is used so casually and inconsistently that up until it hardly even meant anything (hence "core" gamer, "professional" gamer, "casual" gamer, "hardcore" gamer, "PC" gamer, "console" gamer, etc.) The idea of gamer as a slur, to aggressively define others with it, seems like a new development. It is also impossible to know what people habits are in relation to games at a glance. The harassers, the doxers, anonymous posters on /v/ (nevermind 4chan, which has over twenty non-gaming boards), the people who say horrible things on Xbox Live, the people getting insulted on twitter for replying, etc., no one knows if they actually fit the "defined by gaming" stereotype. Also something I think you overlook about racial slurs is that you are never not commenting on that race when you use it; I wonder if a similar relationship can be drawn between gamer and person who plays games or at least game enthusiast.
 
If you want to see who are really toxic, have a gander through the #GamerGate tag. Gamers are broad brushed into labels and corners and called the most horrible things simply for liking and identifying oneself as a gamer. There also tamer, but no less ridiculous, insults being thrown at us like "nerd" and "geek" - are those last two supposed be insulting in this day and age pretty much everyone proudly proclaims to have nerdy/geeky interests and tendencies?

Another thing I've noticed is that the majority are not only fans of games, they are also not even remotely interested in games if you click on their profiles but are rather "supporting" Anita Sarkeesian and Zoe Quinn through mindless abuse.

What? #GamerGate is not about Anita Sarkeesian or Zoe Quinn, and it's not certainly not misogyny drive hate-speech by "petulant manchildren" that don't want to "share" their toys. It's about transparent, honest and, above all, ethical journalism.

There are always those that lose focus or do hold such archaic beliefs, but that doesn't justify such utter contempt from so-called journalists in the industry.

And if you think this is still somehow an unfound conspiracy, then please read the knowyourmeme entry on the Quinnspiracy-Zoe Gate.

Conflicts of Interest and Journalistic Integrity
As Quinn’s intimate ties to journalists were being revealed, it was discovered that several games journalists were actively contributing money to her via Patreon.[27] Journalist Patricia Hernandez soon came under fire as well, as gamers began investigating other questionable journalist-developer relationships. Similarly, Robin Arnott, one of the “five guys” that were allegedly involved with Quinn, was also part of a game competition judging panel in which Quinn’s Depression Quest won, despite having competition from other widely successful and critically acclaimed games.

The End Of ‘Gamers’
On August 28th, a slew of similar articles arguing for the death of the term “gamer” as a cultural identity were published on various blogs all within 24 hours of each-other. Notably these articles were not limited to just game-related blogs. The Financial Post, Ars Technica, The Daily Beast, The Stranger, and Beta Beat, were among the non-gaming sites to report this message. On the gaming side, Gamasutra, Polygon, and Kotaku, all published similar articles on the matter. Overall, there were a total of over 15 different articles with a similar message published that day.

And if you doubt there's collusion in the video game journalism industry?
Code:
[IMG]http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/820/941/a84.jpg[/IMG]

Every day more shit is being exposed. This isn't about an imaginary boogeyman that gamers have made up. This isn't even about the original scandal that started this. It's about exposing systemic, corrupt and unethical journalism that deeply permeates within the industry.

It's easy to conclude your belief is right if you've already decided the other side is the enemy and not just concerned critics. Like, Schreier said, lobbing insults at caricatures is also easy, but it's also counterproductive. And of course this takes place on both sides. I've stopped using SJW pejoratively because doing so would imply I don't support social justice or don't support the people fighting for social justice. The thing is, I do support social justice, and I do support the people that fight for, what I believe, a noble goal.

If people on both sides could just stop fancying themselves as noble crusaders and try to understand each other, then perhaps this would have blown over already, perhaps changes would have been made for the better without the vitriol.
 
And if you think this is still somehow an unfound conspiracy, then please read the knowyourmeme entry on the Quinnspiracy-Zoe Gate.

And if you doubt there's collusion in the video game journalism industry?
Code:
[IMG]http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/820/941/a84.jpg[/IMG]

Every day more shit is being exposed. This isn't about an imaginary boogeyman that gamers have made up. This isn't even about the original scandal that started this. It's about exposing systemic, corrupt and unethical journalism that deeply permeates within the industry.

It's easy to conclude your belief is right if you've already decided the other side is the enemy and not just concerned critics. Like, Schreier said, lobbing insults at caricatures is also easy, but it's also counterproductive. And of course this takes place on both sides. I've stopped using SJW pejoratively because doing so would imply I don't support social justice or don't support the people fighting for social justice. The thing is, I do support social justice, and I do support the people that fight for, what I believe, a noble goal.

If people on both sides could just stop fancying themselves as noble crusaders and try to understand each other, then perhaps this would have blown over already, perhaps changes would have been made for the better without the vitriol.
You cannot make these two arguments together without looking disingenuous. If you really think that people need to stop being vitriolic while seeing themselves as noble crusaders, you should realize how it comes across to read people responding with negative opinions to recent events as "collusion." It's just a bunch of shitty opinion pieces like posts on discussion boards; unlike actual colluding consumer-hurting journalism, they aren't trying to mislead is about the products we consume, they're just treating their readers as shitheads because of some bad eggs.
 
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