Wiktor
Member
Indeed. Blackface alone isn't racist, it's the cultural context that makes it so. That context exist pretty much solely in USA, so only there can the black face be considered racist
Cosplayer being labeled Racist for her blackface Michonne From The Walking Dead'
- Thread starter clem84
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Indeed. Blackface alone isn't racist, it's the cultural context that makes it so. That context exist pretty much solely in USA, so only there can the black face be considered racist
I made and at least two others made a very simple and easy to read point regarding your hypothetical and you did an amazing job of digesting it only to blow it out your ass.
You can continue to act like you didn't understand it and roll on with your ridiculous attempt at a circular argument but the fact that remains is very clear - historical context is important everywhere and your ignorance can easily offend. Whenever you want to address THAT let someone know.
What is going on in here and how can people think this is okay or justifiable because it's "performance art" of some kind?
While the cultural paradigm is different in Germany than in North America and the woman may have had "good intentions", perpetrating someone else's colour/race/culture just isn't cool. It's one of the first things I learned about society way back in the stone age we call the 1980s.
While the cultural paradigm is different in Germany than in North America and the woman may have had "good intentions", perpetrating someone else's colour/race/culture just isn't cool. It's one of the first things I learned about society way back in the stone age we call the 1980s.
I think people expect to see exaggerated features and negative stereotypical characteristics in modern blackface. The girl you posted earlier is exactly what I'd expect if I heard the phrase 'contemporary blackface'. The girl in the OP is not.
I see that as a separate issue from whether the girl in the OP was right to do as she did.
Do you want to try and be intellectually honest for a minute?
I've been saying this whole time she isn't stereotyping a race, she handled the make up to give a respectable appearance, and she's not impeding black actors or cosplayers. Funny how all of that is absent in your quotes of me.
Hardly? You truly don't know what you talking about.
SparkPeople
Banned
Lived in Africa, Europe, the Middle East, and now North America. Originally from Africa.
He is and doesn't care
Or simply hasn't even given the topic that much thought before.
Where is this rebuttal? All I saw was, "yup, it's offensive".
Why I like the term "Progressive Blackface"
maniac-kun
Member
So here is a little German culture for you:
Maybe you know Cologne from Gamescom we have a tradition here: its called Kölner Karneval:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cologne_Carnival
And in tribute to Attila the Hun (who raided cologne and demanded 11000 virgins from cologne) there are people dressing up as Huns in carnival clubs and have little meetings:
http://fototeam-besgen.de/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=909
The 11 flames in the Stadt Wappen of Cologne represent this 11000 virgins that
Attila demanded.
but obviously it's far from what people keep posting as "real blackface" and certainly closer to what's posted in the op
I think others here haven't given it enough thought and are simply saying "white people can't ever ever ever ever ever make themselves look like a black person for any reason ever".
Historical context isn't important? Break out the holocaust jokes then. They're only words after all.
Yes she is. Look at that nose, and how it looks nothing like the actresses nose. She used a stereotype to create a round stereotypical bantu nose which in no way resembles the actress she was copying.
SHOULD be.
I wish people were more sensible about this sort of thing. She made a mistake. Educate her and get over it. Calling her a racist and going into "outrage" mode over someone being ignorant makes no sense to me. It's always 0-60 with shit like this.
People need to be better than this.
pants
Member
As am I, Middle East and North America apart. We arent what people refer to when they say "black culture" on GAF. It's an American thing, let it go, roll with it and stick around so I can have other people to talk with
well, when she did get 'educated' she basically said
"haters gonna hate" and "i do what i want"
well they're your quotes, not mine
ãInaba Residentã
Banned
Why stop at the nose? Why not exaggerate everything? She said it was a "make up test" and its possible she wasn't done. That or she's not a very good make up artist.
Historical context isn't important? The fact that she is not stereotyping black people or impeding black actors/cosplayers (this is indeed a part of the historical context) isn't important? Why do you get to say "hey people made their faces really dark back in old movies and some assholes still do it today" and then ignore everything about why it was actually offensive?
Wiktor
Member
All your links can be boiled to "it's racist in america, so it has to be everywhere else". Blackfaces aren't raising any eyebrows in those other countries because they weren't used in mass media to degrade black people.
Same. It's just so flagrantly terrible for someone who takes cosplaying that serious.
You conveniently chose quotes that only had one of my arguments then mocked an argument I didn't make. If you're going to start mocking people, you should actually know what it is you are mocking.
This thread has made me lose faith in some gaffers. Honestly, if you think this is racist you'll need to grow up. If this character is her favorite character, then there's nothing wrong with her painting her skin to achieve this. It's not like she's running around saying "**** black people." She is literally just wearing a costume of a character from a TV show. I doubt she's even saying anything or acting racist in the slightest.
Ninja Scooter
Member
Did the point of Tropic Thunder really go over some peoples heads? Tropic FUCKING Thunder!?!?
Calling her a racist and accusing her of using "black face" is educating her?
Someone else already said it in this thread but I think calling this "black face" is extremely ignorant and waters it down. It's like the word "racist". Everything is "racist" now and the word has lost all meaning.
This is not racism.
Blackface is super goddamn racist in the Low Countries, too. Black Pete says hi.
Tell us more about how us poor black people need to get over it.
What explains the stereotypical round nose, which does not even look like the character's nose?
It was still a work in progress, it seems. And yes, the actresses' is very wide, so I don't see the problem with attempting to mirror that. When I cosplayed as Michael Jackson, I made my nose narrower, for example. That stuff is hard to pull off, too.
Wearing someone's else's ethnicity as a costume for entertainment is itself degrading and offensive. It has nothing to do with it being an american thing. It's a reason why images like zwarte piet are offensive.
I wish it were just a costume. That would have been cool honestly.
I dunno, man. I guess it's just one of those things where I thought I understood what was offensive about blackface (historical or modern), and now I'm back at square one.
See, I disagree with that. The girl you posted was clearly taking the piss out of black people and the negative stereotypes associated with 'em, the girl in the OP isn't.
I can accept that this is one of those things that I don't understand, and given that I have no intention of darkening my face, it doesn't really matter that I don't get the lack of differentiation by execution or intent.
It looks exactly like the nose (Best most people could do) and I'm fully qualified to say this as a matter of fact. I'm black myself
Zen_Arcade
Banned
It's been pointed out, in fact I think multiple times to you, that the costume wasn't finished and it was test makeup.
Stop harping on the same shit people already answered for you. All it does is clutter up the thread.
Corronchilejano
Member
This is the first time in my life I've heard of an ethnicity (not a nationality or religion) identified by its nose.
ãInaba Residentã
Banned
Again, "make up "test. The skin isn't 100% accurate but it isn't exaggeratedly dark either. Why only exaggerate the nose? Why not go the whole way? Why can't she just be a bad make up artist?
Oldschoolgamer
The physical form of blasphemy
2bh. It didn't even dawn on me that Michonne isn't even the color that she used. I probably gave her more credit than she deserved. lol. Like, she recognized that it might be problematic to go all the way, and decided to half ass it, and then put that wackass nose on top of it all.
6 years and people still missed the obvious ass point of his character. lol
The actresses nose is wide, not round. The cosplayed looked like she was trying to take piss out of black people with that silly puddy thing.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
Yeah are we now going to act like the actress does not have a very wide nose? There's nothing wrong with her nose and nothing wrong with trying to replicate that nose.
Wiktor
Member
Bullshit. Complete and utter bullshit. Some people can enjoy and aprecieate other cultures and ethnicities and be happy when others experience theirs, instead of having militant attitude towards anyone from outside trying to dip their toes in. You're just projecting your own prejudices into the whole world.
she got the nose from mass effect's character creator
MWS Natural
Member
Fixed.
Yes show me your 5 examples of black people in "whiteface" vs the hundreds of examples of white people doing this nonsense.
It looked like she was trying to make it look wide to me. Incomplete work is incomplete work though.
Would you feel the same way about Japanese people dressing up as Nazis for fun? What about non-Muslim Americans wearing hijab as an "edgy" fashion statement? Would you feel that because in their own specific culture it's a meaningless gesture, as a society we should tell them to go ahead and do it?
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