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[moolamb]

Okay back to the map.

Here's where I think Link is after the 'time of day warp':

I still disagree with my fellow investigator RagnarokX's hypothesis that they are beyond the first region. The scale matches up - watch the parallax of the cliffs on the right as Link rides through and out of the forest. It's actually geographically quite near Link, so that's why I think Link is at the arrow I marked above.

EDIT: It's the same feature as the mountain I've circled on the right below but we're now a little bit closer. Note that visibility seems to have dropped after the time of day warp, or the bloom has increased, so I think it's an illusion that the mountains are further away. The only surefire way to judge distances is with parallax.

 

[georly]

I agree that Midna was a far better character, but I think something a lot of people missed is that Fi's calculations are meant to be amusing with how she tends to estimate things at less than 100% for things that you know are 100%,

Fi actually made me laugh a few times with the absurdity of the things she said. I think one of them involved asking if a kikwi was Zelda and if you catch a fairy in the bug net she estimates the possibility that it's a new kind of insect.

My analysis indicates a 90% chance
that this is a Fairy. I calculate a 10%
chance that this is a rare or previously
undiscovered insect.

Yup. Don't get me wrong, I like Fi, but I can totally see where people's complaints are coming from.

That said, a Zelda with no helper at all is a better zelda. The map can tell me where to go. Sheika stones can help people who are stuck. The glasses from ALBW can point to puzzle solutions. There are ways to help people who need help... without hindering those who don't need it. You had no helper following you around in ALBW, yet link handled talking to NPCs just fine. Hilda telepathically gave you introductions to each area in lorule, which helped flesh out the backstory for each location, but she only did it once, and it was the first time you entered it. I really hope Zelda U takes some clues from ALBW.

That's not to say there can't be secondary characters who are pivotal to the story... just don't have them follow me around. Have them coincidentally meet up with me at key parts in the story.

 

[RagnarokX]

Okay back to the map.

Here's where I think Link is after the 'time of day warp':

I still disagree with my fellow investigator RagnarokX's hypothesis that they are beyond the first region. The scale matches up - watch the parallax of the cliffs on the right as Link rides through and out of the forest. It's actually geographically quite near Link, so that's why I think Link is at the arrow I marked above.

Dude, we see the mountains you circled from the cliff they start from and from the cliffside where they find Epona. We also see the ground where you say Link is with your blue arrow. That is definitely not the same area. It's waaay too small and the mountains are too close.

 

[MouldyK]

Midna did repeat what NPCs said, though.

And remember the Temple of Time? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dNfDPMir2g
Oh hey, Midna pops up right at the start of the dungeon and gives you a hint you didn't ask for!

Yeah, I first played TP a couple weeks back and there are times she mentions things which ruin the puzzle for you without you talking to her.

 

[BeatResetsTheWorld]

Are you guys seriously trying to match amorphous blobs of rocks (the distant mountains) with the zoomed out topography map screen?

 

[Inquisitive_Ghost]

I'd love it if late in the game you can get a winged mount (Dragon/loftwing?) and you can fly with it high up and then jump off and dive to a location with your sail cloth.
Maybe a late game side quest where you climb to a mountain to fight the dragon and he becomes your friend once you beat him.

A flying mount (I'd prefer a bird again, or a gryphon/hippogriff-type creature, but I'll take anything alive) is one of my most-wanted features in this game. I would do big swoops around Skyloft and jacknife between the two primary sections on the underside and be sad there was no larger landmass to do this with.

I seem to recall an old Skyward Sword interview that claimed this was in the plans for that game, but either something changed or I made that up.

 

[GrandHusk]

Okay back to the map.

Here's where I think Link is after the 'time of day warp':

I still disagree with my fellow investigator RagnarokX's hypothesis that they are beyond the first region. The scale matches up - watch the parallax of the cliffs on the right as Link rides through and out of the forest. It's actually geographically quite near Link, so that's why I think Link is at the arrow I marked above.

EDIT: It's the same feature as the mountain I've circled on the right below but we're now a little bit closer. Note that visibility seems to have dropped after the time of day warp, or the bloom has increased, so I think it's an illusion that the mountains are further away. The only surefire way to judge distances is with parallax.

I don't know if Link went to the north after getting in epona wouldn't the mountains on the distance be kind of like more close?
I think he went to the west.

 

[Smellycat]

I really really hope that the overworld isn't barren. I want to finish a dungeon and then come out to be greeted by a huge meadow with lots of flowers and animals. I have faith though

 

[zeldablue]

I watched Princess Mononoke again...

Now I'm very excited about this game. I can't say I'll be thoroughly hyped until I see a story trailer though.

 

[georly]

I watched Princess Mononoke again...

Now I'm very excited about this game. I can't say I'll be thoroughly hyped until I see a story trailer though.

My plan is to play through every zelda in reverse chronological order (per platform, I play 3DS in bed, so I'm doing spirit tracks/SS at the same time right now - just finished ALBW) and end with Zelda 1 the week before launch. The day before launch I will watch mononoke.

 

[Gsnap]

That's nonsense. ALBW had NPCs that gave tutorial, but talking to them was 100% optional. This new Zelda can do the exact same thing. In fact, with the open nature of this one, it can't really go any other way. Putting mandatory tutorials would be completely against the design philosophy of Zelda Wii U right from the start.

As far as tutorials go, I hope this Zelda doesn't open up right away. Within the first hour, sure, but I hope there is still some world/character building in the beginning, though not necessarily with the overbearing tutorials of TP.

I feel like the perfect way to start a zelda game (especially this zelda game) is to start smack in the middle of a dungeon. Link already has his sword and shield, some bombs, and maybe something else like the grappling hook. You explore the dungeon, learn how to use the items, learn how to fight, learn how to use the map, and everything else in a way that people would consider fun. Then in the dungeon you get the bow and arrow (since the bow seems really important in this game), and then eventually you fight a boss, and then you exit the dungeon, and the world opens up after that.

Maybe in the first dungeon they could have a companion with you, like link's best friend or something. He/she could give you simple advice if you ask for it, and once the dungeon is over they could direct you to the first town where the plot advances, even though you wouldn't have to go there right away.

Mainly I feel that starting in a dungeon is the best way to tutorialize a zelda game. That's what you're gonna do most of the time, so start strong with the fun and then tone it down for the story beats afterwards. People would probably appreciate the pacing more than they do just being thrown into simple town life right away.

 

[zeldablue]

It should start with Link in his village or whatever and then him getting immediately abducted/kidnapped and having him wake up and then escape in the middle of the overworld.

And then the first goal for the player would be to use the map to find home and then the rest of the story could unravel from there.

 

[Dimmle]

It should start with Link in his village or whatever and then him getting immediately abducted/kidnapped and having him wake up and then escape in the middle of the overworld.

And then the first goal for the player would be to use the map to find home and then the rest of the story could unravel from there.

If the game is seriously inspired by Mononoke, perhaps he's banished from his village? The presence of his hood seems to imply that he's an outlaw or outsider of sorts.

 

[Gsnap]

It should start with Link in his village or whatever and then him getting immediately abducted/kidnapped and having him wake up and then escape in the middle of the overworld.

And then the first goal for the player would be to use the map to find home and then the rest of the story could unravel from there.

That could work too. I just chose to start in a dungeon because the game needs a way to work its tutorials into a quick fun gameplay segment (and because this link looks like he's already a well trained explorer/fighter). Escaping from an enemy stronghold could work just as well.

I think what's most important is:

-Start with a "high": Dungeon, enemies, swordplay, items, puzzles, etc.

-Transition into a "low": Story, town life, npcs, etc.

-Transition into the main game

 

[Enduin]

If the game is seriously inspired by Mononoke, perhaps he's banished from his village? The presence of his hood seems to imply that he's an outlaw or outsider of sorts.

Could be accused of something and hiding his identity from authorities. Maybe an outlaw of some kind like Robin Hood type.

 

[Inquisitive_Ghost]

If the game is seriously inspired by Mononoke, perhaps he's banished from his village? The presence of his hood seems to imply that he's an outlaw or outsider of sorts.

Could be accused of something and hiding his identity from authorities.

Would be down for this.

I'd also like if he's a scout or patrol.

I hope Link actually is somewhat experienced at the start, with a position in society (whether lawful or outcast) that requires he already know some swordplay/horseback riding/scouting/whatever. We don't need to do the "total novice" story every single time.

 

[Dimmle]

Could be accused of something and hiding his identity from authorities. Maybe an outlaw of some kind like Robin Hood type.

What with the arrows, that might be the archetype.

 

[zeldablue]

That could work too. I just chose to start in a dungeon because the game needs a way to work its tutorials into a quick fun gameplay segment (and because this link looks like he's already a well trained explorer/fighter). Escaping from an enemy stronghold could work just as well.

I think what's most important is:

-Start with a "high": Dungeon, enemies, swordplay, items, puzzles, etc.

-Transition into a "low": Story, town life, npcs, etc.

-Transition into the main game

That's probably good...except I quit TWW because it basically started at the Forsaken Fortress and I hated that place.

Though...I personally really loathe stealth in Zelda games.

 

[BY2K]

I feel the open nature of the game is gonna make for a less story-focused Zelda actually.

 

[Gsnap]

That's probably good...except I quit TWW because it basically started at the Forsaken Fortress and I hated that place.

Though...I personally really loathe stealth in Zelda games.

Doesn't have to be stealth. Shouldn't be stealth, unless for some reason they're going to make stealth a really important aspect of the new one. Doubt they will though.

Also the FF is crazy easy. Go finish it and enjoy the best zelda game. : p

 

[Dimmle]

I feel the open nature of the game is gonna make for a less story-focused Zelda actually.

What better way to lighten the load on story than by centering on a roguish type who's separated from his past? No early game background dump required.

 

[Inquisitive_Ghost]

Maybe the hood is keeping Link's face hidden because the big bad is getting off their ass for once and trying to hunt down the Triforce of Courage instead of just the Triforce of Wisdom and its relatively fixed location.

 

[zeldablue]

Doesn't have to be stealth. Shouldn't be stealth, unless for some reason they're going to make stealth a really important aspect of the new one. Doubt they will though.

Also the FF is crazy easy. Go finish it and enjoy the best zelda game. : p

I was 9 when it came out initially. And I gave up there.

I've beaten TWW a billion times now.

 

[RagnarokX]

I hope this post clears up confusion about where they are on the map when they are riding through the massive plain:

One of the most standout landmarks in the footage is a half-dome mountain. It appears to be the mountain on the map that is bisected in half by a river. According to the coloring of the topography, the south half appears to be taller. Here we see they are facing the half dome and viewing it from opposite sides.

Now, if that wasn't good enough:

From the plain riding north they should be able to view Death Mountain, and... although it was very faded, after bumping up the contrast it seems to be the case. When they turn to look to their right from the red line, they look across the shallow pond they rode next earlier in the footage, and just beyond the trees along the blue line you can make out the half dome in the distance... along with the shorter north half of the mountain that we had yet to see.

 

[Gsnap]

I was 9 when it came out initially. And I gave up there.

I've beaten TWW a billion times now.

Good. Or else we'd be enemies.

Anyway. I don't think this Zelda is gonna be that light on story. Even though it'll be more open, I expect much more story than ABLW, since it's not a handheld game and they'll probably expect us to be playing for many hours.

 

[jmizzal]

I think this game might have options for motion controls if Link is right handed.

Which means that I only have a year to decide what control scheme to go for. Decions, decisions...

Nintendo as been great with control options, I wouldnt be shocked if it has both, and Pikmin 3 style where you can use the wiimote plus game pad as map or pro controller plus gamepad as map

 

[ibyea]

How is she any different from midna or navi+Kaepora? Mechanically speaking?



Majority opinion is a bit overblown. I think people remember her being worse than she actually is. Probably because some people found the actual lines of dialog a bit soulless they remember them being a bit more irritating. Playing through it now and it's not that bad, honestly. It's probably that she butts in to normal conversations which makes her FEEL like she is giving you more forced tutorials than she actually is.

My opinion too. Having recently played Ocarina of Time 3D, I personally found Navi the most annoying companion. Fi never tells you how to open a door to begin with. Furthermore, the "Hey!" I found to be harder to ignore.

 

[moolamb]

Dude, we see the mountains you circled from the cliff they start from and from the cliffside where they find Epona. We also see the ground where you say Link is with your blue arrow. That is definitely not the same area. It's waaay too small and the mountains are too close.

I don't know if Link went to the north after getting in epona wouldn't the mountains on the distance be kind of like more close?
I think he went to the west.

You guys are right, I'm going to scrap that guess.

I hope this post clears up confusion about where they are on the map when they are riding through the massive plain:

This is a possibility - the angles line up but I still feel like your map scale is too small. Here's another one. Can you see this working?

 

[TDLink]

As far as tutorials go, I hope this Zelda doesn't open up right away. Within the first hour, sure, but I hope there is still some world/character building in the beginning, though not necessarily with the overbearing tutorials of TP.

I feel like the perfect way to start a zelda game (especially this zelda game) is to start smack in the middle of a dungeon. Link already has his sword and shield, some bombs, and maybe something else like the grappling hook. You explore the dungeon, learn how to use the items, learn how to fight, learn how to use the map, and everything else in a way that people would consider fun. Then in the dungeon you get the bow and arrow (since the bow seems really important in this game), and then eventually you fight a boss, and then you exit the dungeon, and the world opens up after that.

Maybe in the first dungeon they could have a companion with you, like link's best friend or something. He/she could give you simple advice if you ask for it, and once the dungeon is over they could direct you to the first town where the plot advances, even though you wouldn't have to go there right away.

Mainly I feel that starting in a dungeon is the best way to tutorialize a zelda game. That's what you're gonna do most of the time, so start strong with the fun and then tone it down for the story beats afterwards. People would probably appreciate the pacing more than they do just being thrown into simple town life right away.

That could work too. I just chose to start in a dungeon because the game needs a way to work its tutorials into a quick fun gameplay segment (and because this link looks like he's already a well trained explorer/fighter). Escaping from an enemy stronghold could work just as well.

I think what's most important is:

-Start with a "high": Dungeon, enemies, swordplay, items, puzzles, etc.

-Transition into a "low": Story, town life, npcs, etc.

-Transition into the main game

I agree the game should start in a dungeon with you already having some basic items. Waking up in your town, doing various tutorials, and slowly acquiring the sword/shield/tunic before heading to the first dungeon is an archaic part of the formula that I really am not a fan of. Just drop the player in a dungeon with the sword and shield (and maybe something else) already and let that act as a natural tutorial. Then you can introduce the town and other characters if you want. Hopefully they do it this time.

 

[hatchx]

If the game is seriously inspired by Mononoke, perhaps he's banished from his village? The presence of his hood seems to imply that he's an outlaw or outsider of sorts.

Link's small village is attacked by a beast which link fends off but is poisoned/bound by. Perhaps a town elder forsees great evil and sends Link off into the world.

 

[jmizzal]

I wanna see the gamexplain video before bed lol

I wonder if they talk about the one thing I think I was the first person to discover on gaf at least lol

 

[TDLink]

Link's small village is attacked by a beast which link fends off but is poisoned/bound by. Perhaps a town elder forsees great evil and sends Link off into the world.

Eh, I think the game can be Mononoke/Miyazaki inspired (via its art style and perhaps some themes) without the story literally riffing on or drawing parallels from it.

 

[Darryl]

I really really hope that the overworld isn't barren. I want to finish a dungeon and then come out to be greeted by a huge meadow with lots of flowers and animals. I have faith though

It would be very conflicting to have this game be barren when compared to the rest of Nintendo's main line-up. They've been putting a lot of work into small details and game responsiveness. I think we haven't seen it in practice with this game because they want to surprise us and keep expectations managed.

 

[Sami+]

If the game is seriously inspired by Mononoke, perhaps he's banished from his village? The presence of his hood seems to imply that he's an outlaw or outsider of sorts.

I really, really hope this is the case. I'm kind of hesitant to expect something new and exciting from a Zelda story these days but the fact that Link is wearing blue in all the promotional stuff for this one is piquing my interest.

 

[Red]

I feel the open nature of the game is gonna make for a less story-focused Zelda actually.

We can only hope.

 

[Crayolan]

How is she any different from midna or navi+Kaepora? Mechanically speaking?



Majority opinion is a bit overblown. I think people remember her being worse than she actually is. Probably because some people found the actual lines of dialog a bit soulless they remember them being a bit more irritating. Playing through it now and it's not that bad, honestly. It's probably that she butts in to normal conversations which makes her FEEL like she is giving you more forced tutorials than she actually is.

I'm one of the people who actually like Skyward Sword, and I still fucking despise Fi. I never even thought Navi was bad, but Fi is so so so goddamn annoying. I don't need to be bothered after every other dialogue box and after entering every new map or approaching every new puzzle just to be told useless bullshit that there is a 90% chance I already knew.

If the game is seriously inspired by Mononoke, perhaps he's banished from his village? The presence of his hood seems to imply that he's an outlaw or outsider of sorts.

Speaking of Link's outfit, I think it'd be cool if we get to go at least half the game without donning the traditional green tunic. Even better if after that point we're not required to wear it all the time.

 

[zeldablue]

I feel the open nature of the game is gonna make for a less story-focused Zelda actually.

I want story. Good story through gameplay.

 

[Inquisitive_Ghost]

Speaking of Link's outfit, I think it'd be cool if we get to go at least half the game without donning the traditional green tunic. Even better if after that point we're not required to wear it all the time.

I want the option to change clothing, too. In OoT I would always wear the Goron Tunic in the endgame because it matches the Mirror Shield and the rubies on the Silver and Gold Gauntlets. In ST I generally played in Link's engineer uniform. In TP I wore the standard outfit though, because wearing the aquatic tunic around would have just looked bizarre, and the Magic Armour obviously ate all your Rupees.

I just want options that you can also plausibly wear in any situation.

 

[GrandHusk]

I agree the game should start in a dungeon with you already having some basic items. Waking up in your town, doing various tutorials, and slowly acquiring the sword/shield/tunic before heading to the first dungeon is an archaic part of the formula that I really am not a fan of. Just drop the player in a dungeon with the sword and shield (and maybe something else) already and let that act as a natural tutorial. Then you can introduce the town and other characters if you want. Hopefully they do it this time.

I still think the game can start in your village, just don't make Link have to do hundreds of chores to progress the narrative, make them optional or just minigames.

What about if you have to go with a caravan to hyrule castle, the starting village have all the people that tells you mechanics like z targeting or how to use your items in a way that you just can skip. During the travel the caravan gets attacked by one of those monsters from the E3 trailer.

Link is the only one that escapes but he enters in a cavern (this would be your tutorial dungeon) wer he discovers this mysterious arrow head that can defeat the monster, after defeating the boss you discover that everyone from the caravan got kidnapped or something and is your job rescuing them and try to figuring out what happened to the kingdom at tbe same time.

There you have your exposition without being three hours long, without innessesary tutorials

Spoiler

unless you need them

and an open world design from there.

 

[Ihaa]

You guys are right, I'm going to scrap that guess.



This is a possibility - the angles line up but I still feel like your map scale is too small. Here's another one. Can you see this working?

One of the things for your argument in my opinion is the size of death mountain from where we see it in the demo in comparison to its size in the first reveal trailer. In the first reveal trailer, it looks to be around 1/6 or less the size of what it is in the gameplay demo, so we have to be a lot closer to the mountain than we were in the e3 trailer. People also said we were around the lake hylia area in the e3 trailer so the sizes wouldn't match up (in terms on onscreen pixels used up fr the mountain). So that means were a lot closer this time to the mountain. From e3, we also know death mountain is surrounded by a mountain range and it itself is in the far back. So even if we are what looks to be close to it on the map, there's actually so much area taken up by the mountains around it that it would still be a huge distance away.

We also know the map is huge based on the trees measurement which could explain the fields. Keep in mind the field wasn't all that big, it had pretty big structures around it. I think the biggest problem is not knowing just how large the elevation of the death mountain based on the map. It seems were over estimating it and under estimating the size of the actual world, which could lead us to say were under the mountains foot when in reality, were super far away.

I'm convinced that we travelled part way to the beacon. Ill do a proper pic drawing after exams if gamexplain doesn't agree with this hypothesis. There was a analysis video someone put up here that sort of said what I agree with where they had to travel down south to get to the beacon since the other path was blocked off.

 

[moolamb]

One of the things for your argument in my opinion is the size of death mountain from where we see it in the demo in comparison to its size in the first reveal trailer. In the first reveal trailer, it looks to be around 1/6 or less the size of what it is in the gameplay demo, so we have to be a lot closer to the mountain than we were in the e3 trailer. People also said we were around the lake hylia area in the e3 trailer so the sizes wouldn't match up (in terms on onscreen pixels used up fr the mountain). So that means were a lot closer this time to the mountain. From e3, we also know death mountain is surrounded by a mountain range and it itself is in the far back. So even if we are what looks to be close to it on the map, there's actually so much area taken up by the mountains around it that it would still be a huge distance away.

We also know the map is huge based on the trees measurement which could explain the fields. Keep in mind the field wasn't all that big, it had pretty big structures around it. I think the biggest problem is not knowing just how large the elevation of the death mountain based on the map. It seems were over estimating it and under estimating the size of the actual world, which could lead us to say were under the mountains foot when in reality, were super far away.

I'm convinced that we travelled part way to the beacon. Ill do a proper pic drawing after exams if gamexplain doesn't agree with this hypothesis. There was a analysis video someone put up here that sort of said what I agree with where they had to travel down south to get to the beacon since the other path was blocked off.

But I didn't mark death mountain - we don't even see it here. I just marked another mountain. Death Mountain is waaaay to the north.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

I feel the open nature of the game is gonna make for a less story-focused Zelda actually.

Would really go against what aonuma said about matching and or beating hyrule warriors in the cutscene department. Im all for keeping expectations low but just because 1 thing happens doesnt mean the other wont. They will do both.

 

[Elfforkusu]

I presume he's not wearing the green tunic on the basis that he'd be completely impossible to see amidst all the greenery.

 

[Dimmle]

I presume he's not wearing the green tunic on the basis that he'd be completely impossible to see amidst all the greenery.

this has to be it

it's the most Nintendo reason

 

[Smashman45]

Here ya go. =) GameXplain Analysis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MGlHnwVDmc

 

[Ihaa]

But I didn't mark death mountain - we don't even see it here. I just marked another mountain. Death Mountain is waaaay to the north.

I meant near the end of the gameplay demo.

 

[Nanashrew]

GameXplain's analysis is up!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MGlHnwVDmc&feature=youtu.be&a

EDIT: beaten.

 

[Lunar15]

If the game is seriously inspired by Mononoke, perhaps he's banished from his village? The presence of his hood seems to imply that he's an outlaw or outsider of sorts.

Plus he has a ponytail, ripe for cutting.

 

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Here ya go. =) GameXplain Analysis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MGlHnwVDmc

Time to get cozy

 

[TDLink]

I still think the game can start in your village, just don't make Link have to do hundreds of chores to progress the narrative, make them optional or just minigames.

What about if you have to go with a caravan to hyrule castle, the starting village have all the people that tells you mechanics like z targeting or how to use your items in a way that you just can skip. During the travel the caravan gets attacked by one of those monsters from the E3 trailer.

Link is the only one that escapes but he enters in a cavern (this would be your tutorial dungeon) wer he discovers this mysterious arrow head that can defeat the monster, after defeating the boss you discover that everyone from the caravan got kidnapped or something and is your job rescuing them and try to figuring out what happened to the kingdom at tbe same time.

There you have your exposition without being three hours long, without innessesary tutorials

Spoiler

unless you need them

and an open world design from there.

I mean, that would work too (and definitely be better than the traditional way of doing things). However, I still just think it would be way cooler and more effective if we were dropped straight into the dungeon. There's no real reason not to do it.