SystemUser
Member
Halo 3 had illumination on the larger projectiles (plasma weapons, rockets) and the grenades. I think they turned it off for Halo 4 though.
IGN: Nathan Drake will use identical model in cutscene and gameplay.
- Thread starter Khalifa Jayy
- Start date
Halo 3 had illumination on the larger projectiles (plasma weapons, rockets) and the grenades. I think they turned it off for Halo 4 though.
These pictures are great. The muzzle flash and tracer lighting looks great. Lots of little details that I haven't noticed at a glance.
gamerMan
Member
To be fair Naughty Dog said they are using the same model, not the same lighting. In the panel, they said that the lighting in the game won't be able to show off as much detail in the model. I am agreement with Digital Foundry here as currently the lighting in the game is nowhere as complex as the lighting in the E3 teaser. IMO, the E3 teaser looked like CG lighting, but the game play footage didn't. Perhaps they have the ability to scale the shaders and lighting depending on the scene complexity. The lighting could change when the game is released.
I decided to fire up Maya and build a simple scene to show how complex lighting can change a whole scene or model. Please excuse how ugly and low quality the scene is.
Both scenes have the same models and the time of day is the same. However, the scene on the right has much more complex lighting and shaders.
I decided to fire up Maya and build a simple scene to show how complex lighting can change a whole scene or model. Please excuse how ugly and low quality the scene is.
Both scenes have the same models and the time of day is the same. However, the scene on the right has much more complex lighting and shaders.
No it doesnt. Who told You that? You can move camera freely in every situation except for cutscenes.
And all NPCs are interactive.
The reason is art requirement and sometimes LoD management.
Star Citizen is going for fidelity beyond current gen and is completely open world game.
--------
I understand Your point, but in situations where You simulate complex geometry with shader, the shader is less expensive solution.
This the reason we have bump-mapping, shader decals, wrinkle shaders, Parallax Occlusion Mapping and PADM.
Halo Reach, Crysis 2 to name few.
Crysis 3:
---
Original Doom 3 actually cast shadow for EVERY projectile
Stencil shadows are bonkers when used right.
ResidentDante
Member
Halo Reach, Crysis 2 to name few.
Crysis 3:
Doom 3 BFG did this too.
grandwizard
Member
And Quake 3.
Cyborg
Member
A downgrade for sure but they have a year development ahead! I think they will come close but not with 60fps.
Before I get attacked: The way it looks right now is amazing one of the best looking games!
keltickennedy
Member
Halo Reach, Crysis 2 to name few.
Crysis 3:
---
Original Doom 3 actually cast shadow for EVERY projectile
Every bullet, really? Damn. It's been a while since I've seen the game but I only remember that sci-fi blue projectile rifle, and that was impressive. I haven't played or seen Crysis beyond the first game, but I wouldn't be surprised.
Overall I meant more from something more like actual rapid-fire bullets; the type you can barely catch with the naked eye if not for the tracer-round like trail, not rockets/slower projectiles -- Uncharted definitely had that kinda stuff before. If you can see it approaching, it's worth it to add the extra illumination but the level that they do in the Uncharted 4 demo is almost subtle. I didn't even notice for a while. And about gunfire in general, UC4's looks and sounds SO much better than the previous games. Guns in the previous Uncharted games sound tinny and fake as hell compared to the demo.
Here are some screens of Drake from actual gameplay during that demo. All three of these pictures look quite a lot better than the Drake shown close up in the beginning of the demo in my opinion.
This is most likely due to the flat lighting in the beginng. Even the actual playable model of Drake looks closer to the E3 teaser than the one used in that fake image:
This is most likely due to the flat lighting in the beginng. Even the actual playable model of Drake looks closer to the E3 teaser than the one used in that fake image:
GIANKRATOS
Member
They have a track record.
Game is still going to be super fun, just don't expect best graphics ever.
His chest hair is gone. Preorder cancelled.Here are some screens of Drake from actual gameplay during that demo. All three of these pictures look quite a lot better than the Drake shown close up in the beginning of the demo in my opinion.
This is most likely due to the flat lighting in the beginng. Even the actual playable model of Drake looks closer to the E3 teaser than the one used in that fake image:
Blue Steel Drake.
...and Ferrari, LeTigre.
Cave Johnson
Member
They have a track record.
Game is still going to be super fun, just don't expect best graphics ever.
Every ND thread should start by banning the use of said image above.
Ops so the game isn't as good as that reveal after all
Ricky Ricardo
Member
Why is it that suddenly, the footage of Uncharted 4 that came out during E3 2014 is now most definitely just a cutscene, pre-rendered footage, etc ...
... when it was being hailed for months as actual in-game footage?
Help me understand.
... when it was being hailed for months as actual in-game footage?
Help me understand.
Omnipunctual Godot
Member
I think it was done in-engine, but it might be another Killzone 2 reveal type of scenario, where the game would run at 5 FPS. Who knows, though?
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
But accordig to IGN ND said they're using the same model in cutscenes and ingame, the model is not the same if you ask me.
Also, many people said the game is going to look like that E3 teaser ingame.
I'm still positive that they'll pull of that quality at 60FPS ingame, not only in cutscenes
LegendofDragoonLives
Member
Yes, they also have a track record for having the best graphics on consoles. It already looks like the 3rd best graphical showpiece on next gen consoles, though I do hope they improve it just a little bit as well.They have a track record.
Game is still going to be super fun, just don't expect best graphics ever.
adamantypants
Member
You guys forgot Magnum
jacksepticeye
Member
As others said, shaders make a big difference. So much so that they will look like different models
Arkam
Member
Glad to see they have caught up to Ocarina of Time on the N64...
Seriously, we are well passed the point of there being any need for using separate assets for narrative. In game assets have been fantastic for for nearly a decade. Plus CG trailers/cutscenes are a HUGE waist of budget imo. Have not found another way to see $400k of my budget in a 30s clip... that didnt look much better than in game...
Seriously, we are well passed the point of there being any need for using separate assets for narrative. In game assets have been fantastic for for nearly a decade. Plus CG trailers/cutscenes are a HUGE waist of budget imo. Have not found another way to see $400k of my budget in a 30s clip... that didnt look much better than in game...
VFX_Veteran
Banned
To be fair Naughty Dog said they are using the same model, not the same lighting. In the panel, they said that the lighting in the game won't be able to show off as much detail in the model. I am agreement with Digital Foundry here as currently the lighting in the game is nowhere as complex as the lighting in the E3 teaser. IMO, the E3 teaser looked like CG lighting, but the game play footage didn't. Perhaps they have the ability to scale the shaders and lighting depending on the scene complexity. The lighting could change when the game is released.
I decided to fire up Maya and build a simple scene to show how complex lighting can change a whole scene or model. Please excuse how ugly and low quality the scene is.
Both scenes have the same models and the time of day is the same. However, the scene on the right has much more complex lighting and shaders.
Excellent demostration!!
There's an obvious drop in quality from the original trailer. The game still looks great for being so early. After thinking about it, of course I'll buy it but this leaves a bad taste in my mouth. There was a lot of pressure on ND to absolutely WOW everyone and the E3 reveal did just that... but the gameplay was a lot more in line with what we are used to this gen graphically.
Cool or whatever, but they really shouldn't do this... If they're aiming for physical accuracy.
VFX_Veteran
Banned
The reason they have that is because they'd rather shade a surface with 150 verts as opposed to 1,500 verts. It's not just because you added more triangles that the game becomes tax'd perse. I'm not saying there is no triangle budget. I'm sure there is.. but the shading budget is a lot stricter.
Original Doom 3 actually cast shadow for EVERY projectile
Yep! Not only that Quake 2 had per-bullet lighting on their guns and that is years old.
VFX_Veteran
Banned
That's because they don't make every bullet a light source. That's another way of getting more performance out of the game. I looked at that demo and it's not happening for every bullet like Crysis 3. It's almost like they have a random number generator and picking a random bullet to be a light source out of several shots (at least for the enemies).
VFX_Veteran
Banned
Thats' called texture decals. Again, that's been done before. ND is putting a lot of niceties into the gameplay instead of pushing for a big jump in visuals. And that's OK in my book.
keltickennedy
Member
IN-ENGINE footage. Seriously...a lot of people are coming across as pretty dense. The E3 reveal was never in-game footage. It was a teaser specifically made for E3 for Naughty Dog to say, "hey..this is the tone we are setting for the game and here is what we can do using the PS4 to render a scene."
"The following trailer was captured directly off a Playstation 4".
They are going to be using the same model. The first teaser has nothing to do with what they are doing with the game now moving forward.
They have always put a ton of detail into drake, but for instance, the vegetation system (moving and reacting to wind) was developed first and then they had the idea of applying it directly to drake himself (Hair, chest hair, clothes).
Did we learn nothing from the Killzone trailer prior to the launch of the ps3? These graphic showcases have been Sony's shtick since the first whispers of the ps1 when they would show us charts instead of prerenders.
and much like before, I expect the game will not look as good as the trailer but still look amazing.
and much like before, I expect the game will not look as good as the trailer but still look amazing.
keltickennedy
Member
The Killzone footage is a bad comparison. It was never an in-engine cinematic.
Thanks. You just proved the point I was making.
blankempathy
Member
Either way you slice it its a downgrade from the e3 trailer. I wish video game companies would just be more upfront.
so none of you is going to tell us, why that picture apparently doesn't show a downgrade?
and don't say different time of day or stuff like that.
perhaps, but it's the same scenario where a developer was showcasing the games graphics with a video that is better than the game will ever look during gameplay. If I remember correctly, killzone was originally said to be ingame but later after much fuss they admitted it was prerenders.
The funny thing is that they have always done this with Uncharted, looking back at Uncharted 1 you might say 'well getting wet like that is cool, but couldn't they have cut stuff like that and pushed overall things a little bit more?', yet they still ultimately create the best looking games on consoles. What we have seen of 4 seems very Uncharted 1 even , imo, just expanded with all the experience they have attained. IF they make more uncharted games after this, we're going to see the same kind of crazy jumps that Uncharted 1-2-3 had in terms of rendering. Can't wait for 4 and whatever games they do next.
Yeah it's absolutely a situation where details on the character will progressively come online the closer you get to the model. During their PSX showing you can see this happening when they show Drake getting wet. As the camera comes closer you can see the fine detail cloth shader fade in.
Yeah it's absolutely a situation where details on the character will progressively come online the closer you get to the model. During their PSX showing you can see this happening when they show Drake getting wet. As the camera comes closer you can see the fine detail cloth shader fade in."]
Yeah it's absolutely a situation where details on the character will progressively come online the closer you get to the model. During their PSX showing you can see this happening when they show Drake getting wet. As the camera comes closer you can see the fine detail cloth shader fade in.
LINK
Go back slightly earlier to see just how good the model/shaders are on that super close up at the start of the demo, it actually looks a ton better than any of the released trailer footage.
keltickennedy
Member
Dense.
And dense...
gotta tame the beast before you let it out of the cage
lol
Spyder_Monkey
Banned
No it wasn't.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
To be fair Naughty Dog said they are using the same model, not the same lighting. In the panel, they said that the lighting in the game won't be able to show off as much detail in the model. I am agreement with Digital Foundry here as currently the lighting in the game is nowhere as complex as the lighting in the E3 teaser. IMO, the E3 teaser looked like CG lighting, but the game play footage didn't. Perhaps they have the ability to scale the shaders and lighting depending on the scene complexity. The lighting could change when the game is released.
I decided to fire up Maya and build a simple scene to show how complex lighting can change a whole scene or model. Please excuse how ugly and low quality the scene is.
Both scenes have the same models and the time of day is the same. However, the scene on the right has much more complex lighting and shaders.
Fascinating. Makes a lot of sense.
Halo Reach, Crysis 2 to name few.
Crysis 3:
It's not an effect you have seen regularly on small, incredibly fast moving projectiles like tracer fire from regular firearms, is what I assume he meant. Obviously we've had projectiles lighting their surroundings for years and years in games, but they are usually larger, slow moving, "energy" type weapons. It's just a nice small detail to have the tracer light up something as it whips by in the blink of an eye, most games wouldn't even bother.
This is more or less exactly what I was explaining the other day, and met with some objection. You can get a similar result by simply changing the lighting itself and keeping everything else in the scene identical (models, shaders, materials). Taken to extremes, just using one flat ambient light will look horrendous vs. several lights in good position with nice falloff and varying intensities for highlights and fill lighting. To less extremes, a cutscene with strategically placed lighting will tend to look better than a gameplay segment with one main light source that needs to catch the player anywhere they move the character/camera.To be fair Naughty Dog said they are using the same model, not the same lighting. In the panel, they said that the lighting in the game won't be able to show off as much detail in the model. I am agreement with Digital Foundry here as currently the lighting in the game is nowhere as complex as the lighting in the E3 teaser. IMO, the E3 teaser looked like CG lighting, but the game play footage didn't. Perhaps they have the ability to scale the shaders and lighting depending on the scene complexity. The lighting could change when the game is released.
I decided to fire up Maya and build a simple scene to show how complex lighting can change a whole scene or model. Please excuse how ugly and low quality the scene is.
Both scenes have the same models and the time of day is the same. However, the scene on the right has much more complex lighting and shaders.
gamerMan
Member
Excellent demostration!!
Thanks.
Thanks for pointing this out. Typically, a "capture" is not done in real time, it is written to a file and played back. So while it was rendered on a PS4 using the Uncharted 4 engine, it was most likely not real time or the frame rate was poor. Hence, it was captured to a file and stitched together at an acceptable frame rate.
BigTnaples
Todd Howard's Secret GAF Account
1.21Gigawatts
Banned
Its a prerendered cutscene. There is literally no reason why anyone would downgrade a prerendered cutscene. They just changed the lighting conditions.