That's actually all of it.
"I have...letters from dozens of women who've abandoned their dream" (Brianna Wu)
- Thread starter The Technomancer
- Start date
- Status
That's actually all of it.
NeoGaf is a hotbed of censorship then. I doubt you could find a thread where a poster doesn't express some form of criticism or desire for change in even the most beloved franchise.
TheSpaceBetween
Member
This whole situation is just absolutely repulsive. It makes me sick to my stomach. It's a stain on the medium.
The way you wrote this makes it seem like pretty much all criticism is a call for censorship.
Every review of a video game is censorship. Ban reviews.
Feel free to call someone a cockgobbling n*****/f** at random, but it IS against the rules to make off-topic threads, post illegal types of porn, or organize raids.
Crash Station
Member
Watched some of Parkourdude's stuff. This guy is 100% insane. Either that or a troll with a lot of time/money that can set up a fake car crash. If it's the former, which it pretty much has to be, a restraining order should be at the very bottom of the list of things he needs to be hit with. He's a danger to himself and others.
And of course he has over 1700 subscribers :/.
And of course he has over 1700 subscribers :/.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
You could always ask her via Twitter or email
This video is such a weird rabbit hole:
Brianna Wu tried to assassinate me via street racing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYPC-YMdJFI
Linked to this channel:
Deagle Nation
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPH1sSxu3It51PuY3_gxSIw
and wierd viedoes like:
My mom kicked me out AGAIN, and I will save Tupac
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wpbm6yGuG5g
Day 7: Nothing is Real.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2MP8PEImX8
And this channel:
The Deagle Nation War Library
https://www.youtube.com/user/DeagleNationLibrary/featured
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUVixBNj9Yo
Just... just... wow.
Brianna Wu tried to assassinate me via street racing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYPC-YMdJFI
Linked to this channel:
Deagle Nation
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCPH1sSxu3It51PuY3_gxSIw
and wierd viedoes like:
My mom kicked me out AGAIN, and I will save Tupac
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wpbm6yGuG5g
Day 7: Nothing is Real.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2MP8PEImX8
And this channel:
The Deagle Nation War Library
https://www.youtube.com/user/DeagleNationLibrary/featured
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUVixBNj9Yo
Just... just... wow.
Vallen Chaos Valiant
Banned
No one has any problem with the games she develops. We have a problem with how she is trying to censor games she has no hands in. I have no intention to tell her how she should make HER game, so what gave her the right to tell me I am bad for playing my games?
When she labels the content she dislikes in a moral argument, yes. Any time you criticise something from the moral angle, you are trying to censor it.
Criticism=normal.
"You are a bad person for enjoying what I consider to be immoral"=censorship
You seriously think changing one's perspective with criticism is worse than legislation banning video games from even entering a country?
Zoe Quinn hasn't done that at all.
LegalEagleMike
Member
SuperEpicGuy
Banned
This is farcical. Go look at the Steam and metacritic user reviews for her game. It is filled with literally the opposite of what you just said.
Also, what are some examples of her trying to censor games?
Who's "we"?
SolicitorPirate
Member
Wat. That's your trend? Dude, I'm Australian. I can literally walk outside my office right now and would be able to buy GTA V from like three different stores all within a 5 minute walking distance.
Target not selling GTA is meaningless since the only people buying games there are grandparents looking for Christmas presents.
Alright, there's two points here, and I'll address them separately.
1) People are making games that appeal to them. Look at stuff like Gone Home and Life is Strange! And you know what happens? GG types and others keep saying to "make your own game," and when they do, the brigade the shit out of it and try to prevent them from being a success! Hell, just look at the Steam forums of Life is Strange!
2) That is absolutely fucking ridiculous and you know it. Criticism is not censorship. Literary criticism has existed for as long as literature has existed. Are you telling me all the novels, essays, plays and others we have today have been censored to oblivion? Criticism does not have the power to censor. It also brings issues to the fore and it is up to the artist to act on or ignore it.
Where did she do this?
LegalEagleMike
Member
I was wondering as well.
When has anyone ever said that. Actual sourced quotes please.
Paper Sparrow
Member
Link?
Please don't. Placing women on pedestals doesn't help anyone.
lol internet
Banned
Oh hey, what's going on in this thr-...*slowly backs out*
Well, I don't want to make assumptions, but its sounding like...
Of course I'm sure that Vallen Chaos Valiant would never go so far as to harass and threaten people, and will instead continue to discuss things in a mature, reasonable fashion.
piratepwnsninja
Member
This make me cry as a developer, a gamer, a father and a former child who almost had his dreams of getting into the industry crushed by teachers who said "That isn't viable" or "That will never happen."
Was considering slipping that in. Mitchell and Webb are treasures.
So if I were to criticize The Birth of a Nation for being a racist propaganda glorifying the Ku Klux Klan, I would be censoring it?
Criticism is not censorship.
Aaronrules380
Member
How is it that every time I hear about the stuff Gamergate is up to they somehow manage to come across as even more awful each time. Like you'd expect that they'd get to a point where they've reached some sort of ceiling where nothing they did seemed worse than the last shit they did, but somehow they manage to succeed
http://wiki.teamgamerfood.com/mediawiki/index.php?title=Elijah
Surely there's mental issues here...
That site also lists his OK Cupid profile. Read it for the LOL's!
Surely there's mental issues here...
That site also lists his OK Cupid profile. Read it for the LOL's!
Vallen Chaos Valiant
Banned
I never said that a game has the right to be successful. Most games ever made, fail. I don't know why you think just because you made the game that you want to make, that it means it would also be successful. Commercial success has nothing to do with creator's choice of product.
Making a successful game is hard enough. If you want to succeed commercially AND make the game that you want to make, good luck you will need it. My point is that you can make any game you want, but making a living off it is an unrelated issue.
GG attacking games they deemed their enemies? That's internet being internet. Some people have too much free time. I just play games, I have no intention to attack complete strangers as long as I am left alone. But the "male privilege" thread on Gaf a while back grind my gears, as such I decided to say something.
KoopaTheCasual
Junior Member
I would rather go back to the days when "gamers" were characterized as nerds and techy shut ins. Nowadays thanks to GG, it seems like the "gamer" public identity is quickly morphing into unstable man-children that can't stand the word 'feminism'.
Just wanted to say I really appreciate your concise take on the GG identity. (IMO) it rings very true.
Imru al-Qays
Banned
This is a valuable point, and it's relevant to more than just gender in gaming arguments. We're at a sort of troublesome moment in our culture where mainstream left-wing discourse has been adopting and valorizing various illiberal intellectual tendencies. That's where this spate of articles in mainstream left-wing publications worrying about the consequences of the resurgence of political correctness etc etc is coming from.
There's a latent sense in Gamergate discussions that any attempts to understand the movement in anything but wholly negative terms, any attempts to problematize the arguments made "against Gamergate," signify an underlying sympathy towards or affiliation with Gamergate, or an opposition to gender equality.
It's crippling to any worldview to be unable to distinguish between reasonable and unreasonable criticism, to be unable to restrain itself from gradually expanding the domain of "unreasonable criticism" until there is nothing else.
Why is that not censorship then?
Aaronrules380
Member
Yeah I'm fine being a nerd and a techy shut in. Those words actually describe me very well, and I've accepted them as part of my identity. I really hate how stuff like this can mean that I could easily come off in a negative light just for sharing my hobbies (Even though in general I imagine my niche tastes are generally not the games most people in Gamergate actually gravitate towards)
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
Imru al-Qays;151699682 said:
This is a pretty concise summary of Gamergate
Imru al-Qays
Banned
Absolutely. But it's also a very good summary of a lot of anti-Gamergate, and that's much more troubling. Any reactionary movement, which Gamergate certainly is, can be expected to be illiberal and totalitarian. That's just the nature of the beast. Left-wing illiberalism is much harder to come to grips with, at least for me.
You put yourself in the hole of being associated with them by claiming that a victim is the one causing the problems. It's not hard to figure out why people are grouping you in that manner. It's not about having a differing opinion, it's about being tone deaf to reality. You actually claimed she - an actual game developer - is making it harder for women ... Wow.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Imru al-Qays;151699922 said:
Are you still on the "not all GamerGate is bad therefore people who talk about GamerGate as if it was all bad are the real bad people" kick?
Haha, this was great
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
Imru al-Qays;151699922 said:
lol no
I see you have trouble letting that go, though,
Completely irrelevant when mountains of GTA sit on every other store shelf, overflowing every JB Hi-Fi, EB Games and whatever else people in Australia actually buy games from.
Hell you can even get it digitally if you want to. No one is preventing you from buying it. Target are within their powers to sell and not sell whatever they choose. They're a private business.
If you're Australian and posting this: I wonder why you even care. If you're not: Do you research on the actual impact and effect of something like this (read: absolutely fucking none) before toting it as an inane talking point.
Vallen Chaos Valiant
Banned
Well of course. Live and let live is how I operate. I have nothing to do with GG nor do I want anything to do with them. However, I AM a male, a gamer, and recently have seen repeated posts discussing how privileged I allegedly am. I can see perfectly well why GG exists; because the perception is that the gaming Media has ran with it and is implying censorship is needed, because male gamers were always a lower class of human and we need to be told what we can enjoy in private.
You can say I am making this up, that I am delusional. That gamers had never been mistreated despite talks in this very thread that used the "N" word un-ironically. Well you can say any number of things, but you can't change feelings. Feeling are hurt here, and it isn't going to get any better by villafication of male gamers.
Yes, GG are horrible people. But I don't see people criticising GG without also insulting all male gamers at the same time. As I say, I am used to this unfair treatment. Just... don't tell me how lucky I am. That IS adding insult to injury.
Imru al-Qays
Banned
Gamergate is what it is: a hard core of reactionaries, many of them deeply troubled, many of them engaged in illegal activity, none of them engaged in anything helpful for anyone. My issue has always been using that as a cudgel to attack other people.
Aaronrules380
Member
Understanding the movement is easy, and most people are very aware of why they act like they do. But that doesn't mean we should accept or tolerate the behavior. It might mean we should reevaluate the approach we're taking and find a way to act that will seem less threatening to them while still serving our purposes. GamerGate is a highly insular, incredibly defensive and closed group. Because they feel threatened, and because of group think within the group, it's come to a point where you can't really use facts or logic to reason with them. Arguing with these things just makes them defensive, which ultimately just leads to them reinforcing their beliefs inside their own heads. Which isn't to say we should do nothing, but just that we should think about what the best course of action is. In general, it's probably best to use GamerGate to spread awareness of the issue's existance, while focusing on educating kids. Most of the people at GamerGate will never be convinced by us, so it's better to find ways to prevent as many people as possible from becoming that type of personImru al-Qays;151699682 said:
Freeman
Banned
The fact that she lives in a country with freedom of speech?
Dragonborn
Member
Unless I misundestood him, he didn't say she was the cause it. He was merely pointing out that stuff like that doesn't help, which I agree with
If you are defending Gamergate, or perpetuating the same arguments as Gamergate, or prioritizing your feelings or opinion over the terrorism of the female targets of Gamergate, or think it's important that you state your opinion without sitting down and educating yourself on this sensitive and toxic issue, then you are committing bigoted actions and contributing to sexism in video games, unwittingly or not.
Fuck Gamergate.
Fuck Gamergate.
SolicitorPirate
Member
Jesus Christ, there's no taking off the blindfold, is there?
Again, I point out the fact gators deliberately attempt to brigade and downvote games that are socially conscious because they are socially conscious, not because they are bad games.
And please, for the love of god, explain to me in terms that human beings would find reasonable, why it is in any way acceptable that fucking death threats are just "the internet being the internet."
Finally, male privilege is real and a thing that does exist! You can recognise its existence and even the fact that you enjoy its benefits without somehow taking that as an attack on yourself! I'm a lawyer, and I know for a fact that I had an easier time getting where I am than my female colleagues. That doesn't negate the effort I put in or what natural talent I have, nor does it invalidate the work I've done, but I'd be lying to myself if I said I didn't have an easier time getting here than a woman of equal ability.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Imru al-Qays;151700393 said:
What other people? And what is your problem with GG discussion being on "entirely negative terms" if, as you say here, there's nothing positive about it?
- Status