Fraternity chanting the n-word

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Enron said:
I disagree - I think stuff like this is small potatoes compared to actual hate and discrimination.
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You heard it here first, folks.

Chanting racial slurs and saying there will never be a person of that race in your organization...

doesn't count as actual hate and discrimination
 
I have a question for those who think this chanting is not so bad, and they shouldn't have really severe consequences because they're just stupid kids.

If a 19 year old frat boy is given a reprimand for getting caught doing what he did, what will he teach his son?

"Yeah we were saying some chant about black people and they kicked us out. Let this be a lesson for you son. Don't get taught saying nigger on camera."
 
DJwest said:
You can't be serious. These racist idiots will end up in positions of power where they will have the ability to affect thousands of lives, including people they would have hanged on a tree. Jesus Christ.
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Yeah, something tells me that joking about hanging someone on a tree isn't exactly the same thing as actually wanting to do it.

You have people in this thread who want to wreck these kids lives because they said some racist shit at age 19? 20? And as if something like this is really indicative of the kind of person you will end up being. People mature, people change.

I am all for punishing behavior like this if it crosses into the realm of being physical or menacing. This? This is not something that I'm going to kick some kid out of school for, or to make it impossible for him to get into school anywhere else.

Their frat should and did get suspended form campus, and it shouldn't come back for a long long time.

Even if you did want to punish these kids on an individual level, how would you even go about identifying them other than the one or two prominently featured in the video? Kick them all out?
 
freeofgreed said:
Whose to say that they aren't and that they will change? I don't think there should be second chances in this case. These guys have done nothing to show that they deserve it. Lets let someone who isn't a racist be in a position of power instead of taking a chance on someone who is in the hopes that he might change.
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I disagree. They're white. White people are a blank slate and can always be forgiven or change. Hence why the stupid question of "What is white culture?" always comes up. No stereotypes to live up to!
 
Labor said:
...

They'll regret being caught, yes.
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Am I to understand you haven't done anything stupid as a teenager that you're ashamed of? Ever?

Of course they'll regret being caught, but there's a good chance they'll regret saying racists thing in the first. I'd rather these dumbasses be rehabilitated and learn from their mistakes than be punished and have nothing come of it.
 
Enron said:
Yeah, something tells me that joking about hanging someone on a tree isn't exactly the same thing as actually wanting to do it.

You have people in this thread who want to wreck these kids lives because they said some racist shit at age 19? 20? And as if something like this is really indicative of the kind of person you will end up being.

I am all for punishing behavior like this if it crosses into the realm of being physical or menacing. This? This is not something that I'm going to kick some kid out of school for, or to make it impossible for him to get into school anywhere else.
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Dude, wtf. If they're young adults, then they've had plenty of time to grow up. Stop defending this nonsense. Just having chants like this is harmful as it perpetuates an extremely antiquated and harmful mindset. This is straight up hate speech. People who use hate speech ned more than a slap on the wrist for the message to get across that no, hate speech is not ok.
 
well being caught on camera is pretty much punishment enough this is going to make it's rounds through the media and they will probably be slaughtered through that.
 
Frog-fu said:
Am I to understand you haven't done anything stupid as a teenager that you're ashamed of? Ever?
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Nothing even close to singing a racist chant gleefully. Believe it or not, not everyone grows up an asshole.

You're going out of your way to defend people who wouldn't mind seeing you turn into strange fruit
 
I think they should be expelled and banned for life from any frat. They'll get into another college eventually, though it will probably cost their parents a new library or university hospital wing.
 
Crud said:
I don't get the song like why? Why are people so excited about not having black people around?
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Think of it as excess. Like white people feeling uninhibited. Just like passing around whatever drug they can find, they share a bit of the old racism for kicks.

It doesn't matter whether they would actively discriminate. They've learned somewhere that saying nigger is funny, and that's tragic.
 
"the best way to make sure racist behavior stops is to make sure there aren't any consequences for it"
 
Frog-fu said:
Am I to understand you haven't done anything stupid as a teenager that you're ashamed of? Ever?

Of course they'll regret being caught, but there's a good chance they'll regret saying racists thing in the first. I'd rather these dumbasses be rehabilitated and learn from their mistakes than be punished and have nothing come of it.
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19/20/21 isnt a teenager age though...
 
Enron said:
Yeah, something tells me that joking about hanging someone on a tree isn't exactly the same thing as actually wanting to do it.

You have people in this thread who want to wreck these kids lives because they said some racist shit at age 19? 20? And as if something like this is really indicative of the kind of person you will end up being. People mature, people change.

I am all for punishing behavior like this if it crosses into the realm of being physical or menacing. This? This is not something that I'm going to kick some kid out of school for, or to make it impossible for him to get into school anywhere else.

Their frat should and did get suspended form campus, and it shouldn't come back for a long long time.

Even if you did want to punish these kids on an individual level, how would you even go about identifying them other than the one or two prominently featured in the video? Kick them all out?
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Well good thing you aren't in charge as both the school and frat believe this is an inexcusable action. Hopefully tomorrow we'll hear more from the school on this and these "kids" are kicked straight to the curb.
 
Speevy said:
I have a question for those who think this chanting is not so bad, and they shouldn't have really severe consequences because they're just stupid kids.

If a 19 year old frat boy is given a reprimand for getting caught doing what he did, what will he teach his son?

"Yeah we were saying some chant about black people and they kicked us out. Let this be a lesson for you son. Don't get taught saying nigger on camera."
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So people who don't want to get caught doing something wrong should never be punished? How many hoops did you jump through to reach that conclusion?

If he isn't racist and/or could actually achieve introspection, he would tell his son that he was kicked out of college for being racist and that there's no excuse for his behavior and he's glad someone finally held him accountable for his actions.
 
Frog-fu said:
Am I to understand you haven't done anything stupid as a teenager that you're ashamed of? Ever?

Of course they'll regret being caught, but there's a good chance they'll regret saying racists thing in the first. I'd rather these dumbasses be rehabilitated and learn from their mistakes than be punished and have nothing come of it.
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As someone whose in that age group and currently in University. No I have never done anything remotely similar to that. Also being in an environment where I'am surrounded by people like this, no I don't think they'll change in the slightest.
 
Frog-fu said:
Am I to understand you haven't done anything stupid as a teenager that you're ashamed of? Ever?

Of course they'll regret being caught, but there's a good chance they'll regret saying racists thing in the first. I'd rather these dumbasses be rehabilitated and learn from their mistakes than be punished and have nothing come of it.
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19-21 year olds are teenagers now? Also NO, I did not chant racist nonsense as a teenager. Why would you even ask that?
 
freeofgreed said:
Well good thing you aren't in charge as both the school and frat believe this is an inexcusable action. Hopefully tomorrow we'll hear more from the school on this and these "kids" are kicked straight to the curb.
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I knew this was going to fucking happen. Words being put in my mouth.

I didn't say this was "inexcusable". It certainly isn't. But I don't think the punishment should be an expulsion from school and have this follow them around should they try to get into school anywhere else.
 
Enron said:
I disagree - I think stuff like this is small potatoes compared to actual hate and discrimination.

I don't think i'm willing to stick a "do not admit this guy to your school" on someone's record because they laughed at a racist chant or joke when they were 19.
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And the streak of defense force for everything continues
 
Lead Based Paint said:
So if people who don't want to get caught doing something wrong should never be punished? How many hoops did you jump through to reach that conclusion?

If he isn't racist and/or could actually achieve introspection, he would tell his son that he was kicked out of college for being racist and that there's no excuse for his behavior and he's glad someone finally held him accountable for his actions.
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By kicked out, I mean the fraternity house. No one has been kicked out of college yet.

I'm arguing against those who say this shouldn't happen.
 
Frog-fu said:
Am I to understand you haven't done anything stupid as a teenager that you're ashamed of? Ever?

Of course they'll regret being caught, but there's a good chance they'll regret saying racists thing in the first. I'd rather these dumbasses be rehabilitated and learn from their mistakes than be punished and have nothing come of it.
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Eh, they're college aged adults. They're old enough to vote and to serve in war.

They don't know not to chant that?

Then again, I don't know what their pledge process is. I bet that chant was shoehorned somewhere.
 
UO would be stupid not to jettison the kids involved here. The "kids" involved would be better served w/ a lesson early in life anyway.
 
JBourne said:
I'm a little surprised to see people defending this. Only a little, though.
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Nobody is actually DEFENDING this, though. Just arguing about what kind of punishment should be meted out. Of course, if you disagree with the prevailing sentiment, you are 10 hitlers.

DoktorEvil said:
Then again, I don't know what their pledge process is. I bet that chant was shoehorned somewhere.
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Yeah, there's about a 0% chance this is something they just came up with on their own.
 
Why are people so racist? It's the 21st century and this shit is still going on? I mean, I live in Mississippi.. LORD KNOWS I SEE IT EVERY SINGLE DAY OF MY LIFE. :/ Pathetic. I mean, geeze, there are sorry black people... but then there are sorry white people too. Why do we have to single the african folk out like that? It's bullshit. Glad the chapter closed.
 
Frog-fu said:
Am I to understand you haven't done anything stupid as a teenager that you're ashamed of? Ever?

Of course they'll regret being caught, but there's a good chance they'll regret saying racists thing in the first. I'd rather these dumbasses be rehabilitated and learn from their mistakes than be punished and have nothing come of it.
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This is gold.
 
Chairmanchuck said:
19/20/21 isnt a teenager age though...
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At the risk of being accused of "defending" these guys (which I emphatically am not), it's not uncommon to live a sheltered, non-adult life in the US until age 30 with very few social implications. It serves as an incubator for the sheer ignorance on display here.
 
Enron said:
I knew this was going to fucking happen. Words being put in my mouth.

I didn't say this was "inexcusable". It certainly isn't. But I don't think the punishment should be an expulsion from school and have this follow them around should they try to get into school anywhere else.
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Again good thing your not in charge. They should absolutely be kicked out and this should definitely follow them. Sorry, but I have zero sympathy for racists. Unlike you I only sympathize with people who deserve it.
 
CrushDance said:
I disagree. They're white. White people are a blank slate and can always be forgiven or change. Hence why the stupid question of "What is white culture?" always comes up. No stereotypes to live up to!
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White people are like Teflon - pretty much nothing sticks to them.

When people call for racial profiling, they are calling for brown people to be scrutinized for terrorism, black people to be scrutinized for violent crimes, Hispanics to be scrutinized for illegal immigration, etc.

They don't even think to scrutinize white people for sex crimes, white-collar crimes, mass shootings, etc.

I hate racial profiling, but I would hate it a little less if it were applied to EVERYONE, not just people who aren't white.
 
Labor said:
Nothing even close to singing a racist chant gleefully. Believe it or not, not everyone grows up an asshole.

You're going out of your way to defend people who wouldn't mind seeing you turn into strange fruit
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Neither have I, to be honest, but the point I'm trying to make is that not everyone that's an asshole in the late teens to early twenties stay that way.

I'm not defending what these kids did. I don't know them, but I do know what it's like to be young and stupid. Hell, I still am, and I also know that we gain little from purely punitive measures. Yeah, it'd feel nice for a little while if these priviliged dickheads got kicked out of school and humiliated, but then what? They've still got their entire lives to live, they're still going to contribute to society one way or another. Are they going to stop being racist? I'd like to think so, plenty of racists reform. It's 2015, racism is still alive and well in the world, but it's on the decline, and these kids - and they are still kids as far as I'm concerned considering they haven't actuall begun real life yet - are young, and I sincerely doubt their chanting is anymore genuine than the chanting of old football chants (soccer for you Americans).

I'd rather we cure the ignorance then deny them an education altogether. Perhaps I am too much of an idealist, but honestly, I don't think kicking them out is going to accomplish much. It's not an effective deterrent, history has proven as much.
 
Enron said:
Even if you did want to punish these kids on an individual level, how would you even go about identifying them other than the one or two prominently featured in the video? Kick them all out?
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The are options here now that the chapter is dead:

  • Kick no one out.
  • Kick out the identifiable chanters on video. Those that managed to hide their face get off scot free.
  • Kick out everyone known to be on the bus. This includes the filmers regardless of their intent in filming and posting the video and the frat members' dates.
  • Kick out every member of the frat.
You know which GAF will choose.
 
Enron said:
Nobody is actually DEFENDING this, though. Just arguing about what kind of punishment should be meted out. Of course, if you disagree with the prevailing sentiment, you are 10 hitlers.
Yeah, there's about a 0% chance this is something they just came up with on their own.
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So you're saying that frats and sororities don't do extra dumb bullshit during pledging?

School only has to make an example out of the visible SAE members and expel them, an the others will fall in line and never do that again.
 
Sometimes I wonder how people like these can even study in college. I mean how dumb can you be that you can't even recognize what you are saying.
 
S-Wind said:
White people are like Teflon - pretty much nothing sticks to them.

When people call for racial profiling, they are calling for brown people to be scrutinized for terrorism, black people to be scrutinized for violent crimes, Hispanics to be scrutinized for illegal immigration, etc.

They don't even think to scrutinize white people for sex crimes, white-collar crimes, mass shootings, etc.

I hate racial profiling, but I would hate it a little less if it were applied to EVERYONE, not just people who aren't white.
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White dudes hold the record for creepy crimes.
 
Don't dogpile Enron, he's just giving his opinion. Not wanting people's lives ruined for the rest of their lives over a song doesn't make him racist. I'm in favor of expulsion, but I do see what he's trying to say.

Also, that 10 Hitlers line was funny.
 
Enron, you've jumped the shark here.

These are adults of voting age who are gleefully singing about the lynching of people due to the color of their skin.

In 2015.

This is not a case of boys will be boys or a youthful indiscretion.

This is who they are. This is who they are proud of being.

They do not have a place at a university or quite frankly in modern society.
 
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