Some Nintendo developer went online, someone said something about his mum and now he hates everything online. True Story! Hence Splatoon.
IGN: Splatoon's lack of voice chat is "cheap and lazy"
- Thread starter Oddduck
- Start date
Some Nintendo developer went online, someone said something about his mum and now he hates everything online. True Story! Hence Splatoon.
How the fuck can anyone say Splatoon can garner a community when you can't play games with friends or make private matches for competition purposes? A community is something fostered due to communication, cooperative goals and undertakings, and competition.
This is one of the first mulitplayer shooters where the community aspect is completely lobotomized in favor of mindless "fun". Thing is every multiplayer shooter worth a damn can be played mindlessly or with specific intent.
This is one of the first mulitplayer shooters where the community aspect is completely lobotomized in favor of mindless "fun". Thing is every multiplayer shooter worth a damn can be played mindlessly or with specific intent.
block tower
Member
I see your point but I disagree. I'd be willing to bet the demographics of who will actually be playing Splatoon won't reflect a child majority audience. I also don't think rating doesn't reflect maturity or age, I think it just represents the rating of the content found in the game. Excluding voice chat so children don't come in contact with negative plates basically concedes that Wii UbIS meant to be a child's console and if that's the case Nintendo should just go full LeapFrog and make child safe console instead of trying to balance an adult and child console when they do this fuckery even though the 3DS has communication options in rated E games. So I just don't agree with your point.
TheXfactor
Member
this franchise never had voice chat either, how do you know it needs it?
But yes I would prefer party voice chat
It was, but people don't like the decision because they know best.
Apparently Ghosts is still small, but active in Wii U, so probably not. Small? Maybe. Ghost? Probably not.
Unless we want a Self-fulfilling Prophecy...
Nintendo should take it a step further, and make everyone play with bots only. Otherwise someone's feelings might get hurt if little Jimmy get roller'd out of the game by these mean predatory, potentially racist/sexist/homophobic adults that can just never not shout expletives!
Even if it does,
if Nintendo had better options for setting up parental control for voice chat,
this wouldn't be an issue.
They really need to get on that, it's been done before, it's nothing new.
bender
What time is it?
Not really. Have the same teams play three sets of ten games. As soon you find two teams that have a similar skill set (both teams winning near 50% of the matches), give one team a 3rd party voice communication system and re-run the test. Look at the results to see what introducing voice chat did to the win percentages of both teams.
And so, this is rather pointless no? "If they don't do X, eventually in Y they will be gone!" This is such an empty statement that we may as well be talking about Microsoft or Sony.
This idea that these features are what really push sales is somewhat misguided. There are many, many more important factors to the WiiU's fate. If features and feature-sets were all that mattered, the Vita would be demolishing the 3DS which is, comparatively speaking, a crippled old man with a walking cane (though the N3DS is great for better use of Miiverse). The obvious reality is that the WiiU is crippled in many, many ways and the lack of some party functionality on the OS level is near the bottom of our worries.
I don't disagree with this. I don't agree with your conclusion on this being even remotely relevant in the grand scheme of things of why the WiiU has failed. Also, please, let me know when Microsoft and Sony implement a Miiverse, which is a social functionality for fostering a community that I find absolutely superior to what is available elsewhere at the moment.
The WiiU has OS level design deficiencies, even Iwata has said as much, in particular with voice chat and party/friend functionality. This is a concrete fact but its not something that people are really being influenced by on a mass scale when it comes to buying or not buying the console they barely even know exists.
Aside from the fact that they've made some of the best online games this gen.
I'm guessing you think this is really witty and funny
The gameplay is way more important, I think.
A lot of you are talking about how voice chat "limits strategic options" but what if the base game is deep enough to have enough strategy in it to satisfy its players? I play a ton of fighting games online like SF and VF and nobody ever talks. I play a lot of Destiny and people hardly communicate in random matchmaking. People are still playing those games. Those games are good.
If the game is good enough, (and by most accounts, the game plays very well) what's keeping it from developing its own sizeable community? A lot of us already enjoy the game based on the stress test, and a lot of us didn't really get bothered by the lack of voice chat. Maybe the game doesn't become an e-sport but instead evolves into something else like a Mario Kart-esque experience where people play for casual fun like a pick-up game of basketball.
I mean, who really knows how this game is going to pan-out? We don't know Nintendo's expectations for it either, so why bother reading the tea leaves?
You don't understand half of my arguements. The minimap is ON the gamepad. Looking at it there is NOT faster than saying any of those call-outs and if you seriously think putting the other team on respawn does not matter you have no clue what you're talking about. When you kill people, they explode into your color ink, so you DO have a reason to call them in addition to the X seconds of free time you get to spread ink AFTER killing them.
The minimap is a smaller version of the WHOLE map and yes, looking at the gamepad is detrimental. Looking away can easily be the difference between dying from someone who just superjumped onto you, or came around a corner when you were looking down and missed seeing ripples in the ink.
Also, how dense are you? I'm not talking about Splatoon for the example because it obviously isn't out yet - but if you look at ANY other FPS a team WITH voice will continue to dominate a team without voice if they have the same skill level, which is WHAT the hypothetical situation was about. Plenty of PC FPS and console FPS that are FASTER than Splatoon have voice chat for a reason and benefit from it. You not understanding simple hypothetical situations and inventing reasons doesn't take away from the validity of pro-VC arguments, it just makes you look silly.
Subtervotion
Member
Lack of voice chat in 2015 is easily one of Nintendo's biggest fundamental problems in my opinion.
For me personally, Nintendo is two generations behind in standard online components for their home console. Microsoft was doing voice chat in virtually every game back in 2004. There's really no excuse.
The main point for me is: video games can be a very social thing, especially with your friends. Why is call of duty so popular? Because of word of mouth. One person buys it and tells their friend they HAVE to buy it to play together. Wii U really doesn't have that dynamic. Is there any Wii U game you can tell your friend they HAVE to buy to play with you online? Not in my opinion. Sure you can play Mario Kart and Smash online, but then you have to talk on Skype. Wii U doesn't have a party chat system.
Nintendo just doesn't understand the dynamics of online social video games.
For me personally, Nintendo is two generations behind in standard online components for their home console. Microsoft was doing voice chat in virtually every game back in 2004. There's really no excuse.
The main point for me is: video games can be a very social thing, especially with your friends. Why is call of duty so popular? Because of word of mouth. One person buys it and tells their friend they HAVE to buy it to play together. Wii U really doesn't have that dynamic. Is there any Wii U game you can tell your friend they HAVE to buy to play with you online? Not in my opinion. Sure you can play Mario Kart and Smash online, but then you have to talk on Skype. Wii U doesn't have a party chat system.
Nintendo just doesn't understand the dynamics of online social video games.
I an see that, but I don't see how that still means no voice chat is okay, plus I actually think the game not- emphasazing kills and instead making the focus area control makes it far team focused than player focused. Even then if it mixes players there's no reason to have the new players communicate with each other, in fact it could be argue that having new teammates makes communication more of a requirement, since you don't know their playstyle.
Boring and asinine more than anything.
BigBadShamoo
Banned
That's most likely because of the franchise history where there was never voice chat to begin with so seasoned players have already adjusted. You can bet tho that if voice chat was implemented it would make beating those giant monsters a whole lot easier.
MH is a weird title to discuss this on, in the past you played MH locally thru ad-hoc so you could always use your voice to communicate to a player if need be. But now on a console where you guys probably aren't even in the same house probably poses a problem for quite a few players. There's really no arguing it lack of voice chat is a terrible decision. MH4U is selling based off of franchise history and knowledgeable players. Splatoon doesn't have that in fact it has the complete opposite where majority of players of that genre are used to voice chat.
Again it isn't anything to do with the Wii U being a children's console; you can purchase a Call of Duty on it, you can purchase other mature games. It's about Splatoon being targeted towards a young audience (as well as the strong mechanics appealing to an older one). It carries a 'Child's first online shooter' vibe that makes this decision understandable.
As I said before it's a concession Nintendo decided to make because of pursuing that demographic (I would imagine). It isn't 'The Wii U is a baby's console', although it doesn't dispel the notion that first-party Nintendo games are primarily for children.
It has D-Pad communication commands, so not quite.
It's already happening this "generation". Wii U says hi.
Well in that case, I demand that Nintendo takes out the useless option for downing other players, and replaces it with voice chat.
I see your 2013 and raise to 2009.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
What the fuck man
I've encountered young kids (10-12 years old) in MH3U. I didn't make big friends with them but I voice-chatted with them while we were playing. There's nothing creepy about that. Jesus.
Whoa really? What is this in reference to? How embarrassing.
Really? MH3U had voice chat. Hell I think MH Tri did too but I didn't have a mic then, but on the Wii U the gamepad's built-in mic works just fine.
If MH4U doesn't have voice-chat, it's a step down.
It's had voice chat in the past. MH4U does not have it.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
Oh, you mean the thing that was flooded with dick pics and other obscenities? The Miiverse exposes children to more weird shit than XBL or PSN combined.
They should get rid of it. Think of the kids, man.
Neff
Member
It's only detrimental if you take a silly time to do it. Remember that everyone will also be operating under the same 'handicap' you are. It's what you make it.
Now this is a pointless strawman. I'm trying to have a sensible discussion and you throw out this garbage.
MatrixMan.EXE
Member
So, because it's not the specific reason as to why Wii U is failing, it shouldn't matter? In the grand scheme of things, like I say, it's just one piece of the big puzzle that's stopping Nintendo from pulling themselves out of this rut they're in with the Wii U.
They don't have the games people want, they don't have the features people want. If you think its good business acumen to completely ignore what your competitors are offering, especially when you're in such a precarious position then I hope you never run a business.
Miiverse is great, yeah, but whats that got to do with being able to socialise with your friends while playing a game, when Phones, Tablets, Vita, consoles and PC offer the feature? How is that acceptable. And the Miiverse example is terrible because the level of immaturity and constant seedy content being posted on their outdoes any damage a simple voice chat function would do.
At the end of the day, if you're not offering an experience comparable to your competitors then you have to adapt.
Miiverse has dick pics?
Thing is, the social aspect is being leveraged for nothing. "Fun" is not being increased in return. The community will be built in spite of the game, when the game could instead better accommodate its playerbase.
wait Mario Kart doesnt have chat either?
can you at least create a party chat like on ps4/xbox?
spindashing
Banned
CoD numbers are irrelevant.
What are you talking about?
MH3U had voice chat.
I know. I was just saying that voice chat isn't one of the reasons Wii U isn't selling.
I'm aware that pros can use ping to synchronise attacks.
Splatoon also has presets that could be use in the same way.
I am gonna raise you 1996-2008.
Man, you might have to sit down for this one...
He was talking about how a minimap wouldn't work and I agree it doesn't work in the current state. Putting it on the main screen like every other game does for good reason would be better than putting it on my lap on a secondary device. What I make of it is its a dumb decision forced to shoehorn in functionality on the gamepad when it would be more useful on the screen.
Him not understanding my argument and what a minimap is doesn't make my argument irrelevant and just because everyone's under a handicap doesn't make it a dumb decision.
Night Angel
Member
I'm sure it sold because it didn't have voice chat.
And noone complained about the lack of voice chat.
Fuck.
BigBadShamoo
Banned
That is beyond is retarded. I KNOW that pissed off a lot of players.
See the way Nintendo itself and other companies view nintendos online infrastructure is rediculous! I will never buy the Wii U now. I can't believe they actually removed voice chat. This is actually a growing terrible trend on the Nintendo console.
What a train wreck.
To those who mentioned genre that doesn't matter.
All that matters is that the game gave you the means to progress while doing tasks without voice chat together. The irony is strong that you guys seem to be the types who loved Journey but are getting overly dramatic over another game lacking it. If you lived without it in Journey you can do the same in this game even though it isn't ideal.
They aren't. You don't have a grasp on your own stance.
Newtype-001
Member
very very rarely id guess. Ive seen it once since ive been on miiverse but it was stamped out fast.
NoMoreTrolls
Banned
Oh sorry, one of them had voice chat. One. Maybe even two! Point still stands, don't be obtuse
This is insane. What is wrong with some of you guys in this thread?
Never did I say it doesn't matter, I said it was one of the last concerns that need to be addressed in regards to the fate of the WiiU. I disagreed with its relevance, not its existence. There are other features that are far more important that need to be fixed first, some of which would solve the problem by their simple inclusion.
My original comment about going into the "other isle" was about over embellishing a point.
What? Miiverse is also about socializing while playing a game, in fact that's one of its underpinnings as a service.
Ehh. Sales would indicate otherwise.
Zen_Arcade
Banned
I didn't say it was the only reason. But you're lying to yourself if you don't think that there are people who aren't buying the system because of the lackluster online features. This leads to lackluster online communities in a lot of cases, and is part of the reason Nintendo has other problems that hinder the Wii U, like lack of third party support.
If a person enjoys third party games and they only have the option to buy one console, they're going to pick the console with the robust online features, so it isn't a total bitch just to play and communicate with their friends. No one gives a shit about the Call of Duty Miiverse community, it adds little to nothing to the actual game. They care about basic shit like easily chatting with their friends in games.
Honestly, how many people here did you see when the PS4 and One launched that mentioned that a HUGE reason that they were picking the console they were picking is because that's what their friends were buying and they wanted to play with them. Because I remember it being a whole lot. I know it influenced my decision. Perhaps the biggest factor in the 360's success was how fluid and easy they made online gaming for consoles. Not to mention that there is no reason the Wii U couldn't have had both.
Again you're really lying to yourself if you think that people aren't buying PS4's and One's because they do more then simply letting you play video games.
MatrixMan.EXE
Member
No, you cannot. And you can only chat in Smash Bros in the pre-game lobby.
He was talking about his personal experience. No need for the condescending exaggeration. Quite a few people in this thread said they don't like online voice chat for the same reasons and appreciated the devs keeping it out.
FUNKNOWN iXi
Member
Really? Miiverse is the hub of strange behavior. Lots of great stuff, but equally, if not more garbage polluting our children.
It's about creating a system where people can build a home with their friends on, but all we ever get is antisocial design decisions. With the current mentality of Nintendo, they are destined to always be that "other" console.
If thats what wasactually happening, then maybe you would have a point. But its not.
Splattoon doesnt offer some visual information, it offers ALL THE INFORMATION, and it updates in real time, 60fps (Or maybe 30 for the gamepad doesnt really matter).
Where your team is, what and where they are shooting, where each splotch of paint lands, in real time, where ALL your enemies are, where they are shooting, each drop of what they are covering, ALL IN REAL TIME.
It is every single peice of information that is happening, and it is updated in real time.
Anything you say as a person, is already obsolete by the time you finish saying it in comparison to the real time updating of the game pad.
Kill/death counts dont matter, you dont get points, you dont lose points, and you can teleport to anywhere a team mate is at, or just start covering again from your base that got hosed. Killing people doesnt matter.
Again
Killing the opposing team doesnt matter. Its fun, but t doesnt matter. All stratagems revolving around the traditional concept of engaging and destroying the opposing team are pointless for splatoon. Getting multiple people who dont understand this angry enough to waste their time getting revenge on you instead of covering ink however....
And yes, again, Nintendo being your free phone service is nice. But thats all it is. Its a nice feature. I dont use on any of my consoles and I stopped using it on PC's years ago. Its just something I dont really care about anymore. When I want to talk to a freind, I will call them, most of my freinds have different hobbies that I participate in, not many play games, and those that do, dont really care for online multiplayer games. I had one person, who I would talk with, with mh, and we would shoot the shit, and it was nice. Mh4, doesnt let us do that anymore, but we still play, and we both enjoy it a hell of a lot, because its one of the best core MH experiences made.
The actual meat of a game, is something I care about very much, and seeing it being so downplayed for an arbritrary feature, is something I see as completely assinine, and I view standardization as a poison to my hobby.
The features arent the only things being standardized across platforms.
I'd like you to find me the place where I said anything even remotely to this affect.
Subtervotion
Member
Wii U does not have party chat. Mario party and smash have chat in the menu, but not while playing.
I'm the only person in my circle of friends that has a Wii U And I have no reason to urge my friends to buy one. We wouldn't really be able to play together any way. My cousin has a Wii U though, but we never play anything together. Sure I'd love to play Mario 3d world co-op, pikmin 3, and even smash 2v2, but without voice chat (or in the first two games case - the ability to play online) there's really no point.
My friends do however have PS4 because we all decided we wanted to play games online together. Funny how that works.