Witcher 3 downgrade arguments in here and nowhere else
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FinalStageBoss
Banned
what the fuck is going on in this thread
Ratcabbage
Member
Thanks for this. Just watched it. You're right, looks really good. I haven't followed this entire thread so is this video something people are claiming is pre or post downgrade? If it actually looks like that, downgrade or not, it will be hard for me to complain.
I do, however, feel we need to call out CDPR if the game comes out and doesn't jive with the pre-release footage they've shown. If you order kobe beef based on a sample you're given and you end up getting filet mignon, you should complain, regardless of how tasty the filet mignon is. (I can already tell this analogy is going to get skewered!)
I guess it depends on why you want to go PC.
Sure if you're getting into PC to get significantly better performance than consoles, you should be prepared to spend at least around $800, but I feel like too many people see this as the only reason to go PC. What if someone's primary concern is just to play a bunch of games that happen to be PC-only, but may not necessarily be high-end? LOL, DOTA 2, Endless Legend, Path of Exile, and Crypt of the Necrodancer aren't on consoles, but might run just fine on a $500 desktop with the right parts. Maybe someone just wants to be able to buy digital games without worrying about DRM (GOG, Humble Store, etc.). Or what if somebody just wants to play Skyrim with mods as inexpensively as possible?
I feel like PC manufacturerse and PC game retailers need to start advertising the other values of PC gaming outside of just the extra raw power. I paid $1k for a decent system back in 2013, but to tell you the truth since then most of the games I've been playing on it have been pretty low-end but fun games that just aren't available on consoles.
Arguing about a game before its actually available for scrutiny. Mind you the game has been downgraded, that part is clear, but all this arguing is pointless until we actually get hold of the game itself.
what do I click to download it? is it torrent only or can I live watch it?
NoMoChokeSJ
Banned
What does any of the build a PC for less than a PS4 talk have to do with Witcher 3 graphics downgrading?
There really isn't much legitimate downgrade talk to be had until we have actual game in hand. 4chan throwing together shit pictures for shits and giggles eventually runs out of steam.
While I have no doubt they had to make some compromises it speaks volumes that it takes basically the best Cards on the market to even get 1080P and most of the time 60FPS. Uncompromised Vision would likely require video cards that don't exist yet
viveks86
Member
The downgrade claims were originally made on this footage and CDPR basically debunked it by releasing this HQ version. The more recent downgrade claims in the OP actually use footage from this as a reference for "pre-downgrade". If people think this quality isn't good enough for their open world game, then they can go back to their dream castles where no such game exists and cry forever.
I too think CDPR needs to be called out if the final game does not match pre-release footage, and I too 'feel' there has been a downgrade of sorts. But guess what, this IS pre-release footage. 9 months old, in fact. This isn't cherry picked. And it looks consistently incredible. If the game doesn't live up to this, they deserve to be called out. If it does live up, we as a community need to feel ashamed for perpetuating unbridled paranoia and FUD.
LookAtMeGo
Member
Looking forward to the comparisons. I wish I could enjoy this game at its full potential but eh, its lookin good on the PS4. This is going to be a sight to behold at 4k60 for some of you. Im jealous. I think the downgrade will seem minimal under those conditions.
is there any way to watch this as it downloads? or torrent only?
UpDownLeftRight
Banned
That's a solid point that I won't argue covers the vast majority of average consumers, but a small percentage will always catch the footage once in a while, especially in the modern age of social media where everything comes with a share button. I can remember years ago when I would fit well into the bracket of average consumer and falling foul to practices like these once in a while, despite it being considerably less common.
The percent affected are likely insignificant in the end though admittedly.
viveks86
Member
Not really. You will have to complete the download as torrents rarely download contiguous blocks.
But thats silly. There no debate.
You know, part of thinks this trend is weird. I would think that pre-release footage would look worse than final footage. Because it's a work in progress right? It should look rough, early and clearly WIP. Instead, its smooth, clean and super high end. That just makes it "feel" worse, you know?
Eh, I'm rambling. I'm not really upset. It's stupid, but so is any other misleading advertising that companies get away with. It all sucks. =/
Eh, I'm rambling. I'm not really upset. It's stupid, but so is any other misleading advertising that companies get away with. It all sucks. =/
Head.spawn
Junior Member
Well you do lose a portion of some games and can't play some games entirely if you don't fork over that extra $50 on a yearly basis with a console.
DOWN
Banned
Excuse me?
WordsintheWater
Member
PC warriors and console warriors are cut from the same cloth and we all know which side you're on.
This shit is fucking ridiculous, let people enjoy and play on what they want, why must we debate who's better?
To me that gameplay demo does in fact look better than what we've been seeing in the past few weeks.
wrong forum!
viveks86
Member
ITT: PC peasants showing their superiority over console peasants. Your sub $1000 PCs suck. There, I've said it. Go cry in your corner now. So here are your options: shut the fuck up, show everyone some respect, or get in line and bow to the real PC master race. Geez, I'm sick of this juvenile, off-topic, bickering. Grow up y'all.
In a perfect world this makes sence
I really don't get the point of target renders with games. I know its to create excitement but I think the excitement for games this big already is there. They could have shown us something that looked much worse than what they were aiming for all we all would have accepted it for what it is and eagerly await it.
This bait and switch only hurts the hardcore gamers (I hate the term) like ourselves, the people they should be catering too. Its not entitlement, we are their bread and butter .
WordsintheWater
Member
I think you mean 'can' lol
Gormenghast
Member
Especially because the game was supposed to be released a year ago and 970s and 980s didn't even exist. So you'd have to run, and run well, on 770s and 780s.
Yeah.
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
lifeexpectancy
Member
Why must we always reduce ourselves to whining about graphics? It's exactly attitudes like this that are the reason devs tend to over-promise, because they know that if the game doesn't look amazing in the early reveals, no one will be interested in it because graphix. I can't say with any certainty in this case, because you know the game ISN'T OUT YET, but yeah, IF it's been downgraded then shame on them, but it's no skin off my nose to be honest.
There's this game called Shovel Knight. It's pretty great. It's fantastic, as a matter of fact. Which is weird, because it doesn't have any uncanny-valley-pushing graphics or anything like this. It's quite shocking that a game without crazy graphics is still fun, right? There's another one called Ori and the Blind Forest, which looks better than the knight with the shovel, but it's still not whiz-bang 3D polygon packing anti aliasing (or whatever it's called), sliders to the max graphically. But it's the best game I've played in over 20 years. It's so weird!
/s
Seriously though, despite the fact that I agree devs shouldn't over-promise and under-deliver, can we stop worrying about how awesome the graphics are and play the game for the most important aspect, its gameplay/fun factor?
sheesh.
There's this game called Shovel Knight. It's pretty great. It's fantastic, as a matter of fact. Which is weird, because it doesn't have any uncanny-valley-pushing graphics or anything like this. It's quite shocking that a game without crazy graphics is still fun, right? There's another one called Ori and the Blind Forest, which looks better than the knight with the shovel, but it's still not whiz-bang 3D polygon packing anti aliasing (or whatever it's called), sliders to the max graphically. But it's the best game I've played in over 20 years. It's so weird!
/s
Seriously though, despite the fact that I agree devs shouldn't over-promise and under-deliver, can we stop worrying about how awesome the graphics are and play the game for the most important aspect, its gameplay/fun factor?
sheesh.
I play quite a bit on console. Have a decent pc but not great. Bout the same power as a ps4 if not maybe a lil less. Don't feel like im defending my decision to play alot of games on console. There are only 2 reasons in my mind for doing it
1. Exclusive titles.
2.To play with friends.
#2 seems like the best reason IMO. I love multiplayer games... especially with friends. Now some have said to me befor, "play on pc and you will connect and meet others to play with there." This maybe true. But these are mostly friends IRL that I play with on console. A huge percentage actually. I'm 28 but most of my friends still game. Others have told me to play the game on console with friends and by myself on PC. Thats a pretty ludicrous suggestion if you ask. Paying twice as well as maintaining 2 profiles/game saves.
On topic though, downgrades suck. Nobody wants that. But when the game isn't even out yet, you can't jump to that conclusion. Plus, I haven't heard one reviewer that had played the game in a preview during the past month mention a downgrade. All actually point out how great it looks.
We've gotten to point in this industry where this stuff is going to happen. Actually we have been there for awhile now . For on major reason, games getting revealed years in advance. It's a little unjust to expect every game to look as good if not better than it did 2 years before release. Especially considering those vertical slices are shown mostly before all the systems are in place for that particular slice. Meaning all the background systems for certain pieces of gameplay. Its quite ignorant of the people to say bullshots are done for devious purposes like game sales. How many people are buying a game today because of footage they were shown of it years ago? I bet zero on this forum are. And about the same who aren't frequent gamers, because they most likely never saw that footage anyways.
Either way game still looks good, and all accounts have told of it being great gameplay and story as well. So ill buy either way. Still looks worth the buy to me, and I have been following this game closely since it was announced. Im stoked for it regardless
Sanctuary
Member
There's a reason most people upgraded beyond the NES and also why many don't particularly care for most "indie" (retro) games.
There is no jumping to conclusions involved, it's clear as day there has been a downgrade.
Hopefully it doesn't get locked. I don't want this stuff to infect other Witcher 3 threads.
lifeexpectancy
Member
You're right, there's a reason, I just think it's silly. Graphics are not the end-all-be-all of gaming. The folks that pass over these games just because of "graphix! Bro!" are doing themselves and the general gaming community a disservice.
Sanctuary
Member
Constantly misspelling graphics (while also spelling it correctly in the same post...) doesn't make you cool. No, graphics aren't the "be-all and end-all", but trying to go the reverse direction with it and act as if they don't matter at all is a pointless argument.
Just finished downloading this, started watching and thought "looks pretty good", then "WORK IN PROGRESS" popped up at the top.
The average consumer will pick up Call Of Duty not The Witcher 3. Who cares what the average consumer thinks? Neogaf is a forum for enthusiasts.
That's a funky username .
LurkerPrime
Member
Because everyone needs to be a winner. PC gamers tout the hardware; console gamers have the low price; handheld/mobile gamers have their experiences; 'tis only browser-gamers that are left out in the cold with nothing of their own.
But, really, what sort of question are you asking? The entire basis of this thread is WAS THE WITCHER 3 BETTER BEFORE?! It doesn't matter that things change in development. It doesn't matter that it obviously wasn't representative of the final product while in alpha. The only thing that matters is that the games industry is based on lies & deceit when it comes to marketing their products - especially for high-profile releases - and that they are called out on it at a whim by consumers. Not all the time, but enough to be bothersome.
Now, everyone needs to decide something when it comes to pre-release footage: is it promotional footage used to market the game, OR are bullshot to the moon materials forever representative of the final product? Because all this flip-flopping is tiring, especially when it's going to happen to pretty much every. single. high-profile. game. on the horizon, and probably the future as well. Downgrades, as they are called, are such an endemic situation that everyone needs to collectively decide whether it's an important issue or normal operating procedure. No more selective dilly-dallying.
And, please, ignore whatever developers/marketers say. They're trying to sell a product, and as such they will only show it in the best light. It's at a consumer's own peril to get caught up in marketing hype. Reviewers exist for a reason. Ultimately, it's an issue of trust - because the end product is in no way indicated by the marketing that precedes it.
lifeexpectancy
Member
Not trying to be cool. It's sarcasm, and until people realize that graphix aren't the end-all-be-all, the point (opinion) stands. Yes they matter, but in the case of retro games it's intentional and fine, and in the case of Witcher 3 a minor downgrade from expectations doesn't mean the game is trash (which is what some people act like).
Should devs be honest? Yes. Are graphics the most important thing about a game? No. I'd argue they're the least important factor in the overall game's good/bad rating.
Head.spawn
Junior Member
It's great that you like those games, but I think you picked the wrong thread to try and be condescending and whine about people whining about graphics. Maybe any other thread that isn't absolutely about graphics would suit your purpose.
It looks the same. It's just a different time of day. Right?
Maybe it's just compression and a different season.
I dont disagree on the draw distance/foliage. However, if that is the same location, it underwent some drastic landscape changes from wheat fields to patches of forest.
Also, lol at "no atmosphere".
lifeexpectancy
Member
I'm not trying to be condescending (hell I even intentionally put /s in that post so that people wouldn't think I was trying to talk down to them, and was merely being sarcastic about the issue at hand), or to thread whine as you're insinuating. I'm simply stating my opinion that this Witcher 3 'issue' is over-inflated at best. I'm quite sure the game will stand on its own despite any minor quibbles and pixel counts, or shader counts, or whatever, between what was shown before and what releases at retail.
At any rate, discussing my posts isn't the same thing as discussing what is at issue in the thread itself, so that's the last I'll say on it. Think what you will about the intent behind my prior posts. I've stated my opinion and shall move on from the thread so the furor can continue unabated.
I was going to regurgitate some things I studied in marketing, but the above is spot on and just quoting it is more sensible.
It looks the same. It's just a different time of day. Right?
Maybe it's just compression and a different season.
We've been over a ton of this shit, but I'll just say everything in that comparison except maybe the foliage and draw distance is subjective.
That "great atmosphere" and "no atmosphere" is just the removal of the sharpening filter and a complete reworking of the game's color palette. Personally I prefer my games to have actual color in them. The top screenshot looks mostly brown.
Sanctuary
Member
Gormenghast
Member
Probably because distant vegetation hides much better geometry problems. Without trees in the way the pop-in would be much more evident.
It looks the same. It's just a different time of day. Right?
Maybe it's just compression and a different season.
yeah this look the same location. I guess this confirm that they removed the 3d grass/foliage completely from the game and it's not just different type of foliage in the first location.
They should've kept that as option for PC at least.
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