Destiny |OT23| This Train is Bound for Mercury

Zoba said:
Destiny isnt a game like CoD or Halo where you can pick it up exclusively for the cooperative or competitive content and vice versa. It ought to be, but it just isnt.

Therefore, i dont really believe in the "i dont play PvP" mindset anymore than i do if it were said about PvE. It's literally half of the game. I understand that PvE content requires a different set of skills - all you need is trial and error and proper gear to win - whereas PvP is largely dependent on skill. Nevertheless, i cant imagine id ever be satisfied with this game if i chose to ignore half of it. There simply isnt enough in that half. Or rather, you play one half when the other gets boring. Some of my clanmates grown when they see me doing a Raid and im just like "Yo i didnt buy this game to sweat in Skirmish all day".

Ghaleon dont hate me lol. I want the Faction mark conversion as much as anyone.
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If you're already doing 3x9 weekly PoEs, and then NFs as well because why not, there's already enough where for me the game feels like work. I don't feel much pressure to play ToO, especially since I know that the guns will probably be replaced in the next expansion anyway (and thankfully there are no trophies attached to any of this stuff).
 
So are you supposed to be able to invite people to PoE or not? The option was greyed out when my hunter buddy went to tower to grab more synth. It was pretty frustrating. I figured out a workaround, but I'm not sure if I was working around a bug or an intentional mechanic.
(Sent the invite while wiping/immediately after - only time it would work)

So PoE 34. Wow. Between the enemies freezing on their spawns and then all unloading on us at once, Variks teleporting us arbitrarily, generally while we were launching supers or rockets, and primary weapons appearing to just stop doing damage altogether at random, I almost miss raids lol

I mean at least then we had checkpoints to fall back on so we could reboot and try to clear the bugs.

And Bungie, please, if you want us to rush through it just make it easy.
Fuck off with this teleporting bullshit. Seriously. Walk into arena, fire two rockets, reload and then teleport to facing a wall while firing the next one. At least point me at the pack of enemies in the middle instead of spawning me at the periphery of the arena facing outward.
 
LiK said:
True, but I think with a bit of practice everyone here can play real good in ToO. Not that much harder than Skirmish to me. The pressure is definitely higher for flawless victories but that's the only difference to me, personally.
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I agree.

zewone said:
Then they shouldn't play ToO.
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Right, but it's not like they don't deserve the chance to be carried. Everyone does, regardless of skill.

Ken said:
Then don't do ToO?
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No shit, I'm just giving a possible reason to Lik's question
 
I learned how to snipe by failing at ToO and practicing during the week to grind Passage Coins. I'm no Zoba but I'm now consistently performing far better than I used to.

This is the first IB where I average over 1.2 K/D and a healthy score every match. I haven't and probably won't see Meecury but I'm satisfied at making progress.

This is my first FPS, since I don't really like the genre. PvE was easy to pick up but I'm just now going through the ropes of in March decision making. Do I engage or retreat? What's worth calling out? What patterns are enemies likely to repeat and which will become traps if I try to follow?

I'm having a lot of fun discovering PvP and becoming decent at it.
 
Zoba said:
Destiny isnt a game like CoD or Halo where you can pick it up exclusively for the cooperative or competitive content and vice versa. It ought to be, but it just isnt.

Therefore, i dont really believe in the "i dont play PvP" mindset anymore than i do if it were said about PvE. It's literally half of the game. I understand that PvE content requires a different set of skills - all you need is trial and error and proper gear to win - whereas PvP is largely dependent on skill. Nevertheless, i cant imagine id ever be satisfied with this game if i chose to ignore half of it. There simply isnt enough in that half. Or rather, you play one half when the other gets boring. Some of my clanmates grown when they see me doing a Raid and im just like "Yo i didnt buy this game to sweat in Skirmish all day".

Ghaleon dont hate me lol. I want the Faction mark conversion as much as anyone.
Click to expand...

I think if you are good at PvP you'll inherently have the skills you need for PvE but it doesn't work the other way. PvE you can be slower and more meticulous but you still need skill, its just not a skill that translates to PvP. I think calling PvE purely trial an error is selling it short, some of the raid mechanics are pretty difficult and require more teamwork than some ToO matches. Just because people see bosses as an equipment check and not a skill challenge doesn't remove the fact that there are a lot of people running things without cheese and getting by on skill.

And yeah this is my first true PvP experience. I'm +1 k/d in Iron Banner but I'm like 0.6 k/d in ToO, it's a different level.
 
Rhaegar said:
Congrats! Were you just rushing sniper nests the whole time?
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We didn't really have a set in stone strat, changed from game to game. If they went left, we'd go left. If they went right, we'd go right. We did different stuff every game. Main thing is staying together and team shotting, and then rushing the orb so they can't get the respawn.
 
ocean said:
I learned how to snipe by failing at ToO and practicing during the week to grind Passage Coins. I'm no Zoba but I'm now consistently performing far better than I used to.

This is the first IB where I average over 1.2 K/D and a healthy score every match. I haven't and probably won't see Meecury but I'm satisfied at making progress.

This is my first FPS, since I don't really like the genre. PvE was easy to pick up but I'm just now going through the ropes of in March decision making. Do I engage or retreat? What's worth calling out? What patterns are enemies likely to repeat and which will become traps if I try to follow?

I'm having a lot of fun discovering PvP and becoming decent at it.
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thats a valid point. i didnt overlook it but maybe i should be more conscious of the fact that Destiny may be many people's first shooters and by extension first experience with PvP

I just couldnt personally play the game for one aspect. Its part of the reason i buy so few games.
 
Zoba said:
Destiny isnt a game like CoD or Halo where you can pick it up exclusively for the cooperative or competitive content and vice versa. It ought to be, and perhaps they wanted it to be (and it has improved), but it isnt quite there yet. Bungie designed so many aspects of it to push players to experience both sides.

Therefore, i dont really believe in the "i dont play PvP" mindset anymore than i do if it were said about PvE. It's literally half of the game. I understand that PvE content requires a different set of skills - all you need is trial and error and proper gear to win - whereas PvP is largely dependent on skill. Nevertheless, i cant imagine id ever be satisfied with this game if i chose to ignore half of it. There simply isnt enough in that half. Or rather, you play one half when the other gets boring. Some of my clanmates groan when they see me doing a Raid and im just like "Yo i didnt buy this game to sweat in Skirmish all day".

Ghaleon dont hate me lol. I want the Faction mark conversion as much as anyone.
Click to expand...
I'm in the same boat as you.

The fact that someone can label themselves as PVE players is a bit ridiculous to me.

If I only played PVP exclusively do you know how much of a disservice I'd be doing to myself? Vice versa as well.

People's expectations can be a bit out there too. If I asked to have someone carry me through PoE 35 and kill Skolas for me while I just spent a majority of time dead people would laugh at me.

The obvious answer if I wanted the PoE 35 rewards would be to practice and make myself an asset to a 3 man team.
 
I never played pvp seriously before a few weeks ago - and it was thanks to reading this thread - and now it's probably my favourite part of destiny. It's just great fun and a real rush at times.

-
As a newly minted 34 (thanks Lord Saladin!) what's this week's 34 prison like? Is it a grind or is it enjoyable and challenging?
 
lt519 said:
I think if you are good at PvP you'll inherently have the skills you need for PvE but it doesn't work the other way. PvE you can be slower and more meticulous but you still need skill, its just not a skill that translates to PvP. I think calling PvE purely trial an error is selling it short, some of the raid mechanics are pretty difficult and require more teamwork than some ToO matches. Just because people see bosses as an equipment check and not a skill challenge doesn't remove the fact that there are a lot of people running things without cheese and getting by on skill.
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i was merely simplifying to avoid a tangent, but you're correct. they require different skills and approaches and i understand when they dont transfer over. it just confuses me somewhat when people feel locked out of an aspect they feel theyre unable to play for whatever reason, especially if there are people willing to help in spite of them.
 
Yeah, I'm not much of a PvP guy. Only ever played the cod games for the single player. My brothers were all about Multi though. Only multiplayer games I ever got into are the battlefield games, Uncharted multiplayer, and destiny.
 
lt519 said:
I think if you are good at PvP you'll inherently have the skills you need for PvE but it doesn't work the other way. PvE you can be slower and more meticulous but you still need skill, its just not a skill that translates to PvP. I think calling PvE purely trial an error is selling it short, some of the raid mechanics are pretty difficult and require more teamwork than some ToO matches. Just because people see bosses as an equipment check and not a skill challenge doesn't remove the fact that there are a lot of people running things without cheese and getting by on skill.
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Main difference is that trial and error can literally teach you how to overcome anything in PvE since encounters will always be the same. Same enemies at the same timers at the same spawn locations. A strategy that works once should work always.

PvP is inherently different as no two matches will be the same. Sure some spots will be ideal for sniping and you can prepare to counter that, but sometimes it'll be one bad sniper. Other times it'll be two good ones. Sometimes you'll be up against blink shot gunners, other times against distant Thorns. A strategy can be perfect against one team and useless against the next.

Basically, PvP requires far more detailed assessment of the situation and an adaptability that doesn't really have a PvE equivalent.
 
sploatee said:
As a newly minted 34 (thanks Lord Saladin!) what's this week's 34 prison like? Is it a grind or is it enjoyable and challenging?
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Surprisingly it was boringly easy, but the boss can be a pain in the ass.

His health regen mechanic is a bit much when things get hectic.
 
Zoba said:
Destiny isnt a game like CoD or Halo where you can pick it up exclusively for the cooperative or competitive content and vice versa. It ought to be, and perhaps they wanted it to be (and it has improved), but it isnt quite there yet. Bungie designed so many aspects of it to push players to experience both sides.

Therefore, i dont really believe in the "i dont play PvP" mindset anymore than i do if it were said about PvE. It's literally half of the game. I understand that PvE content requires a different set of skills - all you need is trial and error and proper gear to win - whereas PvP is largely dependent on skill. Nevertheless, i cant imagine id ever be satisfied with this game if i chose to ignore half of it. There simply isnt enough in that half. Or rather, you play one half when the other gets boring. Some of my clanmates groan when they see me doing a Raid and im just like "Yo i didnt buy this game to sweat in Skirmish all day".

Ghaleon dont hate me lol. I want the Faction mark conversion as much as anyone.
Click to expand...

Lol...don't play PVP (in this game).

Seriously though, I enjoy watching you and others play it but I personally can't stand PVP in this game....I think it's a laggy, unbalanced mess.

Except when I force myself to for the rewards. I played IB long enough this week to get an E-light to ascend my VoC.
 
I'm down for PoE 32 after this last Daily Rumble. Won the one on my Hunter and my Lock, wonder if I can score the hat trick.
 
Zoba said:
i was merely simplifying to avoid a tangent, but you're correct. they require different skills and approaches and i understand when they dont transfer over. it just confuses me somewhat when people feel locked out of an aspect they feel theyre unable to play for whatever reason, especially if there are people willing to help in spite of them.
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Agreed, but I do think ToO is an entirely different beast. It's scared a lot of people off and getting carried isn't fun for some people so they feel locked out of the gear. It's also not easy to get on a carry list, I tried a few times and just gave up, you guys do great work but can only get through so many people and it is a little clique-ish in here sometimes.

I tried to make the argument a page back that the gear really isn't important. For example the Jewel of Osiris (Adept) and the Six Dreg Pride II are practically the same thing except one has a PvP perk and one a PvE perk. If you aren't a big PvP player then you really don't need all that ToO gear and vice versa. Before House of Wolves it was an issue because before Iron Banner people that mainly played PvP had to do raids to get the high level gear and weapons. They did a good job with this expansion allowing you to play whatever you enjoy most. If that's a 80/20 split in one direction then that's that persons choice.

Nobody should feel like they have to run PvP, and I don't think they do. I think that's the issue here, otherwise people wouldn't feel "locked out."

ocean said:
Basically, PvP requires far more detailed assessment of the situation and an adaptability that doesn't really have a PvE equivalent.
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100% agree but look at last week when 90% of this board couldn't beat Qodron without burning him down even though they knew exactly what was coming. I was pretty prideful in the fact that I took him down "legit" using skill and teamwork with my buddies IRL. I played with quite a few people that just couldn't stay alive long enough to damage anything and they were detriments to their teams. Just like I would be to a ToO team (;
 
zewone said:
I'm in the same boat as you.

The fact that someone can label themselves as PVE players is a bit ridiculous to me.

If I only played PVP exclusively do you know how much of a disservice I'd be doing to myself? Vice versa as well.

People's expectations can be a bit out there too. If I asked to have someone carry me through PoE 35 and kill Skolas for me while I just spent a majority of time dead people would laugh at me.

The obvious answer if I wanted the PoE 35 rewards would be to practice and make myself an asset to a 3 man team.
Click to expand...

the learning curve for a PvE encounter is different though. Gear check first, encounter knowledge second, teamwork and execution third. all of that encompasses the skill for beating an encounter and that encounter will always be static for you to attempt and perfect

PvP is in many ways the opposite. It's an inherent part of the difference.

House of Wolves has made some steps to give both crowds an avenue to the top, but unfortunately one half has a better half than the other. Bungie deserves the criticism, but this isnt exactly new to the game considering that the PvE side was lobsided for a while as well.

Im not trying to blame the players. I just personally wouldn't pick up a game like this for one aspect. The PvP frustrates me to no end, but if it wasnt there i wouldnt be either. Not if Destiny's entire PvE content was how it is now. Running from arc burn dregs isnt exactly stimulating gameplay.
 
Forerunner said:
Yeah it's pretty good! Probably replace my Hammer with it. Still debating if I should reroll it, the mid perks kind of suck.
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For middle perk I use Casket Mag (stability loss is nothing major, and can use smooth ballistics.. can also use gunslingers trance) but maybe armor piercing works fine too.

Its better than Hammer imo. Higher ROF + stability and impact is hardly lower. I think this one has better TTK.
 
Zoba said:
the learning curve for a PvE encounter is different though. Gear check first, encounter knowledge second, teamwork and execution third. all of that encompasses the skill for beating an encounter and that encounter will always be static for you to attempt and perfect

PvP is in many ways the opposite. It's an inherent part of the difference.

House of Wolves has made some steps to give both crowds an avenue to the top, but unfortunately one half has a better half than the other. Bungie deserves the criticism, but this isnt exactly new to the game considering that the PvE side was lobsided for a while as well.

Im not trying to blame the players. I just personally wouldn't pick up a game like this for one aspect. The PvP frustrates me to no end, but if it wasnt there i wouldnt be either. Not if Destiny's entire PvE content was how it is now. Running from arc burn dregs isnt exactly stimulating gameplay.
Click to expand...

Yeah the crux of it seems to be that's its lopsided. I would absolutely LOVE an elemental primary for PvE, yet that's an elite PvP reward. Unless I'm missing something elemental damage is largely irrelevant for PvP.
 
Zoba said:
the learning curve for a PvE encounter is different though. Gear check first, encounter knowledge second, teamwork and execution third. all of that encompasses the skill for beating an encounter and that encounter will always be static for you to attempt and perfect

PvP is in many ways the opposite. It's an inherent part of the difference.

House of Wolves has made some steps to give both crowds an avenue to the top, but unfortunately one half has a better half than the other. Bungie deserves the criticism, but this isnt exactly new to the game considering that the PvE side was lobsided for a while as well.

Im not trying to blame the players. I just personally wouldn't pick up a game like this for one aspect. The PvP frustrates me to no end, but if it wasnt there i wouldnt be either. Not if Destiny's entire PvE content was how it is now. Running from arc burn dregs isnt exactly stimulating gameplay.
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Definitely.

I've said in the past that going 9-0 requires a lot more skill than clearing Skolas, so the fact that rewards are better isn't a problem to me.
 
Looking to do either some IB or a 32 PoE. I'd like to try out ToO also, but as a 33 with not fully upgraded weapons I think I'd be doing more harm than good.
 
PedroLumpy said:
Yeah the crux of it seems to be that's its lopsided. I would absolutely LOVE an elemental primary for PvE, yet that's an elite PvP reward. Unless I'm missing something elemental damage is largely irrelevant for PvP.
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I just got a solar hand cannon yesterday from PvE that is basically fatebringer without the firefly perk. But it does have Army of One. If you look closely, almost every PvP weapon/gear has a PvE equivalent this time around. You can say PvP is guaranteed and PvE is random but you still have RNG on Mercury and RNG of match making and running into Zoba :P
 
For me it's really about time.

When I'm done doing all the PvE Destiny content I have very little time left for video games, and I usually don't even really have time to do the old raids anymore either, and the only game I've played since Destiny came out is Destiny lol.

I have a lot of other things going on in my life, and I sometimes hang out on GAF on the weekends and read about everyone getting ToO teams together or IB teams and I'm like... I wish I had time for that!

Otherwise I like PvE and PvP in Destiny.
 
PedroLumpy said:
Yeah the crux of it seems to be that's its lopsided. I would absolutely LOVE an elemental primary for PvE, yet that's an elite PvP reward. Unless I'm missing something elemental damage is largely irrelevant for PvP.
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Eh, you can get elemental primaries from Skolas. It's not a big deal, except that you can get a useless Fallen perk on it.
 
PedroLumpy said:
Yeah the crux of it seems to be that's its lopsided. I would absolutely LOVE an elemental primary for PvE, yet that's an elite PvP reward. Unless I'm missing something elemental damage is largely irrelevant for PvP.
Click to expand...

the distribution is fine. both parts of the game give you "equal" rewards. its the frequency that sucks. In the time it takes to get two elemental primaries from Trials on top of other weapon drops, you can go a whole PoE without grabbing anything but a Queen weapon and some cores. That's some BS, especially when nothing drops from Skolas
 
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