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Greece Agreement Reached

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We are not talking about a game here, where you stay in the bench for a while and then get back in the game. There is no such thing as a "temporary" grexit. Realpolitik, as you would say.

Anyway, make no mistake, i also am in favour of a grexit but for completely different reasons than Shauble's agenda.


P.S. Interesting graph:
bbavs21.jpg
 
My words exactly! said:
We are not talking about a game here, where you stay in the bench for a while and then get back in the game. There is no such thing as a "temporary" grexit. Realpolitik, as you would say.

Anyway, make no mistake, i also am in favour of a grexit but for completely different reasons than Shauble's agenda.

]
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Grexit will likely cause even worse collapse of standards of living in Greece though. It will just end a lot sooner and they might start to recover after couple years instead of decades.
 
Drazgul said:
The only thing they could've done is leave the govt. which would've accomplished nothing, the deal would've gone ahead in any case.
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It would have put on a good show and mess with the political landscape. It's not like they have anything productive to add anyway. Even if True Finns suddenly got a dictatorship, the status-quo would continue.
 
Germany will push for Grexit+debt relief to send the message to the rest of the south that if they want debt relief they have to leave the union... "temporarily ".

Nice threat.
 
Crab said:
smh

There is no point in talking to you if you do not understand at an even basic level the things being talked about here. Germany has a trade surplus with non-Eurozone countries because the rest of the Eurozone drag the Euro down relative to Germany. Equally, Germany drags the Euro up relative to other Eurozone countries, so the currency is too strong for them, so they run a trade deficit with non-Eurozone countries. Because they do not control their own currency, this means they have no capacity to government run deficits without experiencing net money outflow (this is the damage Germany's trade surplus does to the Eurozone). This is the entire problem Greece is facing right now.

(the internal Eurozone trade balances are also affected, but simply because everywhere works in Euros, all Euros flow to the point of highest returns which is not Greece).
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It's adorable how you basically just reposting stuff from 2 or 3 blogs.
But the surplus discussion is indeed a red hering discussion. Because cause and effect are switched.
Also adding the own currency would fix everything claim, not bad. Ignoring the fact that countries like Greece or Spain running deficits for decades and long before they joined the Eurozone.
 
PdotMichael said:
The surplus is a result of trading outside of the Eurozone. In fact Germany's trade balance within the Eurozone is quite balanced and you are basically claiming that they should run a large trade dificit just to compensate for its export success outside of the union.
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Germany has a weaker than warranted currency due to sharing it with other economies, resulting in inflated exports and depressed consumptions.

Greece has a stronger than warranted currency due to sharing it with other economies, resulting in deflated exports and inflated consumptions.

Of course the consequences of those facts go far, far beyond the eurozone, obviously.
 
Ether_Snake said:
Germany will push for Grexit+debt relief to send the message to the rest of the south that if they want debt relief they have to leave the union... "temporarily ".

Nice threat.
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I'm not sure why you keep mentioning Germany almost all your posts, yes big bad Germany, is also the country spending the most in all of this.
 
norinrad said:
I'm not sure why you keep mentioning Germany almost all your posts, yes big bad Germany, is also the country spending the most in all of this.
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I gave up wondering if his posts do still fall into a kind of moderate / acceptable category for greek's views or if it is already right-wing extremists stuff
 
PdotMichael said:
Also adding the own currency would fix everything claim, not bad. Ignoring the fact that countries like Greece or Spain running deficits for decades and long before they joined the Eurozone.
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You're the one who is ignoring the fact that countries like Germany and France have been running deficits since forever. A country is not trying to make a profit, that's not how it works.
 
PdotMichael said:
It's adorable how you basically just reposting stuff from 2 or 3 blogs.
But the surplus discussion is indeed a red hering discussion. Because cause and effect are switched.
Also adding the own currency would fix everything claim, not bad. Ignoring the fact that countries like Greece or Spain running deficits for decades and long before they joined the Eurozone.
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2 or 3 blogs, yes, and not my degree and masters. Okay, sure. This is an entirely pointless conversation. You don't understand the things you're talking about, which is okay, fine, they're complicated things, but you make no effort to understand them, either, which makes this a waste of my time and yours.
 
I just remembered something interesting about my holiday, in regards to the whole electronic payments discussion. I was in Scotland for two weeks and except for Edinburgh, I was told specifically either that they don't accept cards or that they would preffer cash for accommodations. And guess what? I haven't received one invoice for those.
 
KingSnake said:
I just remembered something interesting about my holiday, in regards to the whole electronic payments discussion. I was in Scotland for two weeks and except for Edinburgh, I was told specifically either that they don't accept cards or that they would preffer cash for accommodations. And guess what? I haven't received one invoice for those.
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Tax evasion in small businesses is widespread everywhere cash is used. For tourists it is more lucrative because they don't expect you'll know/try to complain to the authorities about it. That surprises me though. Most places I've been to in the UK (admittedly I have never been to Scotland) take cards. When was it that you went to Scotland?
 
Theonik said:
Tax evasion in small businesses is widespread everywhere cash is used. For tourists it is more lucrative because they don't expect you'll know/try to complain to the authorities about it. That surprises me though. Most places I've been to in the UK (admittedly I have never been to Scotland) take cards. When was it that you went to Scotland?
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Two-three weeks ago. Admittedly, this happened outside of the big cities, but quite visited area like Isle of Skye and Loch Ness.
 
KingSnake said:
The article that Krugman links:

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/07/15/opinion/germanys-destructive-anger.html

reflects pretty much a lot of the discussions with the Germans in here.
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Definitely. That's why I don't engage in conversation about this anymore outside of this thread. Germans get really defensive immediately. (We're saving you and now we are the villains? We're still the Nazis?) Greeks on the other hand immediately go into "they want to sell our country!" mode.

But regarding the Germans, yeah, just look at this thread.
 
oti xero said:
Krugman getting hate mail by angry Germans.

http://mobile.nytimes.com/blogs/krugman/2015/07/15/angry-germans
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This came to mind: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbcctWbC8Q0

It's disgusting that they accuse him of being Jewish... but hey, at least Jews know better economics than Germans. ;)

It's also ironic that they cry about being "demonized", even though they don't mind demonizing those pesky "lazy Greeks". :P

oti xero said:
Apparently former FinMin Steinbrück (socialist) is also for a Grexit as BILD reports. Some people in the comments want to see Merkel in jail.

http://www.bild.de/politik/inland/p...echen-rettung-41818168.bild.html#ugc-41818166
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Merkel? Really?

Why not Schäuble? That guy is a criminal for accepting bribes.

AndyD said:
Can you explain? How can they not collect the tax?
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That's not what I said. :|
 
fanboi said:
Ahahaha... Saying Crab repost stuff from blogs...


... It isn't blogs, it is from another forum.
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Indeed. Crab and Kab's forum of True Things We Know, to which you are not invited, even though it's really fun and we have hookers and blackjack.
 
Crab said:
Indeed. Crab and Kab's forum of True Things We Know, to which you are not invited, even though it's really fun and we have hookers and blackjack.
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It's obvious that you are quoting from the events of Europa Universalis IV and Games of Thrones, stop lying around.
 
Theonik said:
They are eating the VAT increase. ie dropping their prices so the end price is the same under the new VAT. They can compensate the leaner margins by their volumes.
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It's the same thing with TUI (another German company) and hotel prices. People thought it was a conspiracy theory and here we are.

German companies can easily eat the VAT increase, thanks to their enormous trade surplus. Too bad everyone else can't do the same! :\
 
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