CNN poll : Donald Trump now competitive in general election
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Messofanego
Banned
That was the overriding belief in every GAF thread about Trump. That all these results didn't mean shit generally.
Please tell me it still doesn't.
Trump would destroy Bernie like Reagan vs Mondale 84.
Anyone who's followed Hillary's very long career throughout its years could tell you two things: she genuinely wants to be president, and she genuinely wants to do good on issues that she cares about. Painting her as a power hungry bitch who will say whatever it takes to be president misunderstands her and the issues that she cares about and has been advocating for since before she lived in the White House.
I'm not voting for her in the primary, but the narrative that Hillary-Is-A-Power-Hungry-Bitch-Who-Doesn't-Give-A-Shit-And-Just-Wants-To-Be-President is tired and wrong.
Of course he is. Almost every single person who's ever run for president in modern history believes that they should be president and want to win.
LegendofJoe
Member
The American people are starting to completely rebel against the political status quo. A lot of us are being led in the wrong direction, but I won't deny that this has been a long time coming. Trump isn't the right guy to harness our frustrations and lead the movement to restore our democracy, but I genuinely think that is what he wants to do. The more people we have like that in the political spotlight (Sanders, Lessig, Warren, etc.) the better.
America is coming for you K Street.
America is coming for you K Street.
Rabbi_Vole
Banned
Trump is far right?
gutter_trash
Banned
LOL for real. Probably the only Pro-Choice Republican candidate on that stage
I don't think anyone can deny Trump is doing much better than was ever expected of him. At the same time, we're still months away until we reach the point where polls actually matter. And even then, for Trump to get the nomination, let alone the presidency, would require probably the greatest statistical upset in modern electoral history.
Pretty much with you on this. My support for Trump & Sanders is for these reasons. I also think Trump & Sanders are genuine in the intent and values they bring. I'm up to walk down either of these paths...Just not the Hillary/Bush roads...Hopefully the political space can get shaken up so future candidates who are not politicians can get on board.
No surprise there, that high-powered lawyer of his, Frito Pendejo, has been running Not Sure's campaign like a well oiled machine. That guy's definitely gonna get a cabinet spot.
"I like money"
Yeah, Trump is terrible, but refreshingly openly so. While all others but Sanders are spinning around like Beyblades, he is just telling shit he really believes. I respect that a lot.
NickFire
Member
I thought this was all a publicity stunt before, and still think it started that way deep down. But with the lack of other republicans with energy, I'm starting to become convinced he really may get the nomination no matter how badly the establishment doesn't want him to.
I'm also thinking a platform of no more h1b's for 5 years (if he is genuine) and ending welfare for illegal immigrants by deporting them will resonate with a lot more democrats than Hilary or Bernie would want to admit. For most people who are unemployed or underpaid, when they hear one person speak broadly about making the economy better, and the other has a well known history of making money, and is now specifically stating they will make the economy better for Americans by forcing companies to hire Americans and by getting rid of non-Americans from competition for American jobs, the choice is kind of a no brainier even if they are afraid to share it on social media.
With respect to the suggestion that Hispanic people won't vote for him, I also wouldn't be surprised if that turns out untrue. Hispanic voters are not illegal aliens, and If he can convince them their lives wil markedly improve by reducing the competition for the jobs they want, then all bets are off.
No matter what happens though, Trump's rise and the rejection of Bush by the republicans is fascinating.
I'm also thinking a platform of no more h1b's for 5 years (if he is genuine) and ending welfare for illegal immigrants by deporting them will resonate with a lot more democrats than Hilary or Bernie would want to admit. For most people who are unemployed or underpaid, when they hear one person speak broadly about making the economy better, and the other has a well known history of making money, and is now specifically stating they will make the economy better for Americans by forcing companies to hire Americans and by getting rid of non-Americans from competition for American jobs, the choice is kind of a no brainier even if they are afraid to share it on social media.
With respect to the suggestion that Hispanic people won't vote for him, I also wouldn't be surprised if that turns out untrue. Hispanic voters are not illegal aliens, and If he can convince them their lives wil markedly improve by reducing the competition for the jobs they want, then all bets are off.
No matter what happens though, Trump's rise and the rejection of Bush by the republicans is fascinating.
Extra Sauce
Member
You should probably care about results, too. Words and actions are two different things.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Analysis: Trump supporters are really stupid:
http://www.cato.org/blog/does-donald-trump-really-do-best-among-less-educated-voters
http://www.cato.org/blog/does-donald-trump-really-do-best-among-less-educated-voters
Steve Youngblood
Member
Even setting aside my own politics for a moment, it's not something I can really respect. What else can he do? Trying to play the game in the traditional sense isn't going to get him anywhere, as he has no substantive platform to run on. So being perceived as a "straight shooter" in an era where some are getting increasingly frustrated with perceived (note that word) political correctness is about all he has to gain any traction.
I honestly don't fault people for finding it entertaining. But it's hard for me to agree that it is deserving of any respect. His plan to make America great again seems like a complete non-starter, and also seems to ignore completely any of the lessons that should have been learned in the last election. I remember one of the main narratives coming from 2012 was "Republicans really need to make in-roads to do better with Latino voters." And what's Trump touting? A bigger, better wall to keep illegals out. Yeah, that should curry favor with an important demographic that the right is struggling to court.
I continue to be flabbergasted that people get so swept up in polling at this stage. I mean, I won't pretend to be Nostradamus and as such I won't completely write off anything. But I'd be shocked if Trump is still in contention by the time the Iowa primaries roll around, and if he wins the nomination, I'll eat my hat*. Polling at this stage of the game is so inconsequential that I can't believe that anyone puts any stock into it at all. I'm not going to go back several elections and do any actual research right now, but in the last election, Bachmann, Perry, Cain, and Gingrich were all frontrunners at one point or another. Then time pressed on and they proved to be non-starters, and you wind up with Romney winning the nod.
*Steve Youngblood reserves the right to substitute a comically small hat made of food a la Michael Pachter in lieu of eating an actual hat.
NickFire
Member
So you're calling the less educated really stupid, huh? If this was a different thread that would be a racist statement. It would also be logically false. The less educated are not stupid to side with the man saying he will reduce competition for jobs / reduce labor sources to increase pay for Americans. Rather, they are siding with who they think will benefit them directly. It may not be politically correct, but it's not stupid.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Hmm, yeah, for some reason it's not racist to call non-college graduating dudes who support a white supremacist stupid. Maybe cause they're voting for a racist who wants to deport 11 million Americans because they're brown.
And if they're poor, they're even dumber because Trump's tax policies will kill them, lol.
cpp_is_king
Member
I think he actually wants to deport them because they're here illegally, not because they're brown. He's also not a white supremacist. I don't see him attacking anyone because of their race, only because of their legal status. And even if it were because of their race, the fact that he's not attacking blacks, asians, indians, europeans, or africans would indicate that he is not a white supremacist, as you claim.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Hmm, yes, Trump didn't become politically notable for demanding to see a black man's birth certificate for the last 7 years, yep, that never happened.
Donald "Laziness is a trait in blacks" "I have a great relationship with the blacks" "you won't see another black president for ages" Trump (who has been sued for racist housing policies) is not a racist, no way.
Hey, I'm educated as fug.
Tbh, I'm expecting long term goals, not immediate policies right now. A lot can change between now and a year from now, I don't even think its fair to ask for very detailed policies. And that's what Trump has been trying to say as well. I'm not seeing many other candidates offer detailed policies at this stage either.
Donald Trump isn't far right. He's just an asshole. His policies are some of the most liberal in the Republican Party, but he's got a lot of bark.
There are a grip of younger republican state senators and governors who are poised for genuinely exciting careers in the next 20 years... however none of them are running.
But really, it's up to Bush and Walker to lose this race, if Trump takes it by default because they're so terrible it's on them.
cpp_is_king
Member
I think you need to calm down and take a deep breath. You're getting a little worked up
Now that you're calm and seated, are you suggesting that all Truthers are white supremacists?
FinalStageBoss
Banned
Lmao@ some of y'all acting like this racist clown actually has a shot.
NickFire
Member
Are you for real? Just because someone dislikes a president who happens to be black does not mean they dislike the president for being black.
cpp_is_king
Member
First thing I found when googling.
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/fusion-misattributes-racist-quote-to-donald-trump/article/2567872
Maybe he said it, maybe he didn't. But I'm not going to take the word of a random anonymous person from 25 years ago with no other witnesses.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
I think you need to calm down and take a deep breath. You're getting a little worked up
Now that you're calm and seated, are you suggesting that all Truthers are white supremacists?
Yes, all Birthers are white supremacists. Including you if you're a Birther. I'm very calm.
Steve Youngblood
Member
I think you need to calm down and take a deep breath. You're getting a little worked up
Now that you're calm and seated, are you suggesting that all Truthers are white supremacists?
"White supremacist" is kind of a harsh accusation to throw around, so I don't know if I'd go that far. However, I also think it would be extremely disingenuous to act as though race isn't an important factor in that movement.
You don't demand to see a birth certificate from a president just because you dislike him.
I think you need to calm down and take a deep breath. You're getting a little worked up
Now that you're calm and seated, are you suggesting that all Truthers are white supremacists?
There is a mighty strong correlation between "Birthers" and "Idiots who are too stupid to realize they're actually super racist".
cpp_is_king
Member
I'm not a Birther. But you are definitely an odd person if you believe that all birthers are white supremacists. I'm not sure if you actually know what a white supremacist is.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Okay, I think NickFire and cpp_is_king think that the only people who are racists are people who actually have lynched black men. This has been a fascinating look into the ideology of Trump voters.
Thing is, if they're smart enough to know how ridiculous being a birther is, I'm not going to give them the benefit of the doubt.
So either:
1) Really Dumb
or
2) Racist
Not much wiggle room there.
NickFire
Member
People look for dirt on political opponents any way they can.
cpp_is_king
Member
I think I get it now. You think that "racist" and "white supremacist" are synonyms.
Nice
Was Bams a political opponent of Trump back when he was spewing his birther nonsense?
I honestly forget. I didn't pay much attention to the clown back then.
Calm, calm people. Lets not hurl accusations at each other.
In more related news, Time visited Trump.
http://time.com/trump/
In more related news, Time visited Trump.
http://time.com/trump/
Messofanego
Banned
I'd definitely suspect a birther to hold racist views, therefore be a racist. Maybe not white supremacism aka KKK or neo Nazis but definitely suspicious of being racists.
cpp_is_king
Member
The text you quoted says "white supremacists". You used the word "racist". Do you also think theyr'e synonyms?
Messofanego
Banned
Sometimes they are.
Steve Youngblood
Member
OK. But I kind of feel like the specific kind of dirt being sought is relevant here. It's kind of a silly accusation to begin with, but it is beyond absurd to claim years into a sitting president's term that he may not be legally qualified to hold that post. Maybe while the election is going on I can kind of see reading something and thinking that it may be plausible. We all have our bonehead moments in terms of being gullible and taking something we probably shouldn't at face value. But believing that something as simple and obvious as this wasn't properly vetted for years?
This isn't your standard type of dirt. It's a silly accusation and the fact that it was targeted at Obama and not anyone else should tell you why some were so eager to believe and worse continue to believe it for so long should lead one to easily realize that race must be the main, if not only concern at play.
Yea, I think calling him a white supremacist is probably extreme, calling him a racist though is 100% accurate.
NickFire
Member
Well, at least we know not all of the really stupid people vote for trump.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Even if there's a difference, haven't you fundamentally got to the point you're arguing you're not a white supremacist, just an ordinary racist? Is that really the best route to take?
How many other sitting presidents were accused of being born outside the U.S.?
This wasn't typical digging for dirt, this was blatant racism.
NickFire
Member
I don't blame you for thinking that way, and for all I know you may be right. But I can't ignore the absolute hatred being cast by the extreme left and extreme right against each other the last 8 years during a serious recession, and think that ideological hatred may have played an equal or greater role than where racism.
cpp_is_king
Member
No, they're not.
White supremacy is a much stronger term. White supremacist invokes images of lynchings, burning crosses, swastikas shaved into peoples' heads.
White supremacy has historically been about black people, although technically it is the believe that whites are superior to EVERY other race.
Racism is a much, much weaker term. It refers to a belief held by anyone including non-whites that people of a particular race (possibly even including ones' own race) are inferior in one or more aspects. The underlined part is important. A racist person can believe that a different race is stupider. Or uglier. Or lazier. Or stinkier. But believing that a different race is inferior in one single aspect is enough to qualify someone as racist.
A vast majority of racist people do not want to go hang people on the cross, or tie them to a truck and drag them around, or lynch their families. They just don't like one single aspect about people from one other race.
So equating racism and white supremacy is a fucking embarrassment and you should be ashamed of yourself.
It's ridiculous that I have to sit here and write a post that appears to be me defending racism. I'm not. But they are not even on the same fucking level of anything. White supremacists should be put down. Racists should simply be educated.
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