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[Wreav]

You may or may not have seen Nilay's latest defense of the awful, awful ads that The Verge employs in his Welcome to Hell article.

The crux of his issue with ad blockers is that ads are generating the lion's share of operating cashflow for content creators throughout the web. This conversation is happening this week because of Apple supporting ad-blocking via extensions in their latest version of iOS.

Those huge chunks — the ads! — are almost certainly the part you don't want. What you want is the content, hot sticky content, snaking its way around your body and mainlining itself directly into your brain. Plug that RSS firehose straight into your optic nerve and surf surf surf 'til you die.

Unfortunately, the ads pay for all that content, an uneasy compromise between the real cost of media production and the prices consumers are willing to pay that has existed since the first human scratched the first antelope on a wall somewhere. Media has always compromised user experience for advertising: that's why magazine stories are abruptly continued on page 96, and why 30-minute sitcoms are really just 22 minutes long. Media companies put advertising in the path of your attention, and those interruptions are a valuable product. Your attention is a valuable product.

But what's happening now is that attention is shifting fast from desktop browsers — where Google's Chrome is dominant (and supports ad blocking!) — to mobile browsers. In particular, to Apple's Mobile Safari, which dominates usage statistics on mobile. There is no alternative web rendering engine on the iPhone; there's just WebKit, which Apple controls. The dominance of the iPhone and Mobile Safari give Apple "veto power" over the web, as John Gruber put it — a veto power which means Google's revenue platform is increasingly under the control of a major rival.

And with iOS 9 and content blockers, what you're seeing is Apple's attempt to fully drive the knife into Google's revenue platform. iOS 9 includes a refined search that auto-suggests content and that can search inside apps, pulling content away from Google and users away from the web, it allows users to block ads, and it offers publishers salvation in the form of Apple News, inside of which Apple will happily display (unblockable!) ads, and even sell them on publishers' behalf for just a 30 percent cut.

However, he totally glosses over the fact that advertising-only models are vanishing in different forms of media, like streaming music, video, phone apps, and time shifted tv.

The web, strangely, seems to be the last bastion of ad-only revenue reliance.

What do you think? Is the internet dying because of ad-blockers? Is it time for content creators to shake up their revenue models?

Also, this fucking guy...smh...

 

[kulapik]

He's just pissed because that way The Verge doesn't get ad revenue. Boo hoo.

Though I don't have problem not using Adblock if the ads aren't intrusive and annoying.

 

[User 100115]

If they make ads 100% virus free, not annoying popups that block out part or the screen or autoplay audio, then I would never use adblock again.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

I'd argue that the vast majority of "content" on the web isn't worth even the most trivial amount of money if it had to be paid for directly.

I'm interested to see what the next shift is in terms of monetizing things that aren't worth money.

 

[BigFwoosh]

Only reason I started using an ad blocker was because of the super annoying ads that cover up what you're trying to read, take up the entire screen, play videos, etc. I don't mind normal banner or text link ads, but since most sites seem to use the shitty ads that worsen my experience then I'm going to keep on blocking.

 

[Marvie_3]

If they make ads 100% virus free, not annoying popups that block out part or the screen or autoplay audio, then I would never use adblock again.

Exactly.

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Maybe stop with the animated ads, flash ads, page takeovers, in-video ads, etc. Stick to text and still, low bandwidth pictures for ads and less people will feel the need to use ad blockers.

 

[umop_3pisdn]

If they make ads 100% virus free, not annoying popups that block out part or the screen or autoplay audio, then I would never use adblock again.

Agreed. As it is it's pretty necessary.

 

[phanphare]

sounds like the ads are the problem if so many people are blocking them

 

[kunonabi]

If they make ads 100% virus free, not annoying popups that block out part or the screen or autoplay audio, then I would never use adblock again.

Pretty much. I shouldn't have to keep opening up task manager just to close a damn ad. Until that happens I have no issues blocking ads.

 

[Harlock]

The article start talking about adblocks, but in the end the main problem is mobile. People can't use other browsers or just stay using only facebook and whatsapp.

 

[werks]

Doesn't take away from what he is saying. If this was truly about the user then Apple would allow system level ad blocking in apps.

It's not hard to see what apples motive is when they will not block iAd and they are pushing Apple news which will also not block ads.

If Apple can starve content creators of revenue from the web, they will move to a more proprietary solution like apps or Apple news. Somewhere Apple can peddle their ads.

How long before m.neogaf is shut down and replaced by an iOS app, if I'm paying the server fees for this site I would be working on it right now.

And there lies the crux of the issue, the iOS app can have as obtrusive of an ad as it wants. Nothing will block it. Just get off googles network and move to iAds.

 

[Danneee]

I welcome a return to the mid to late 90s ad free gif filled internet!

 

[entremet]

My issue with ads is that they're not jut static images, which would make easier to tolerate, but this paragraph from Marco Arment explains it better than I could:

Web ads are dramatically different from prior ad media, though — rather than just being printed on paper or inserted into a broadcast, web ads are software. They run arbitrary code on your computer, which can (and usually does) collect and send data about you and your behavior back to the advertisers and publishers. And there’s so much consolidation amongst ad networks and analytics providers that they can easily track your behavior across multiple sites, building a creepily accurate and deep profile of your personal information and private business.

 

[Couleurs]

I don't mind ads. What I do mind are websites that are completely unable to show any restraint or refuse to police pop ups, redirects, long load times, and pages that shift all over the place while the 200 ads/scripts load and waste my data plan on my phone. So websites like The Verge have no one to blame but themselves for the mess they are finding themselves in. Meanwhile I'm happy to whitelist sites that don't abuse ads and are quick to take action to remove popups/redirects (like Neogaf).

 

[Doikor]

When ~50% of the loading time/bandwith/screen space is spent for adds yeah I will use an adblocker. Every time I install a new PC I browse the web for a couple minutes without one and then get to THAT page with a big half screen ad with animation and maybe even sound. That is the moment I go and install the adblocker again and enjoy a sensible experience on the web again.

 

[Fudgepuppy]

Youtube commercials is what made me start using Adblock. I went to the internet to get away from commercial-breaks.

 

[Interfectum]

Out of control ads has caused this problem in the first place.

With ad blockers on iOS people are seeing a 90%+ increase in speed. That's insane and advertisers need to solve that problem.

 

[Piston Hyundai]

If your audience is savvy enough to use ad-blockers, maybe your website should be savvy enough to employ different methods of monetization. Try that instead of demonizing the people who realize that browsing the Internet without blocking ads is like barebacking a prostitute.

 

[hydrophilic attack]

If they make ads 100% virus free, not annoying popups that block out part or the screen or autoplay audio, then I would never use adblock again.

.

 

[Clefargle]

I am ok with the web ad bubble bursting. I remember when banner ads were the only thing you had to worry about. They were so innocuous and minuscule that I never bothered wanting to be rid of them. But over the decades, web sites and online content companies have become so inflated that they need lots of ad revenue to pay them bills. Well, I'm ok with a few dying off to make a more sustainable and less in-your-face and mandatory advertisement

 

[LyleLanley]

Nilay and The Verge have to take a decent amount of blame for this. It's sites like theirs that served up obtrusive and bandwith/speed hogging ads without thinking about how it hurt the consumers experience. I'm sure most people would be fine seeing some ads for sites that they want to support but it felt like The Verge took advantage of that.

Also, fuck Nilay, the guy went on a fucking rant about how he was a rebel at heart and that he hated suits after one person made fun of his bracelet and now look at him. He's getting in Twitter arguments about why we're killing the web because we don't want to see his shitty ads.

 

[Siegcram]

If you blast me with autoplay videos of a hentai game or slide full page ads over what I'm reading, you bet I'll add-block your ass.

I have no problem with banners or even ads on Youtube or Twitch.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

The Internet ad business is only increasing in size and revenue every single year. It's a booming market...

 

[Interfectum]

Youtube commercials was what made me start using Adblock. I went to the internet to get away from commercial-breaks.

What's crazy is when you want to see a movie preview you are treated to an ad before hand. So you are watching an ad to watch an ad.

One time there was a short version of a movie preview as an ad for movie preview I was trying to watch. wut.

 

[SystemBug]

So does this mean we are allowed to use ad blockers on neogaf?

 

[Mimosa97]

That's what you get for trying to milk your site by cramming as many ads as you can. Give me non-invasive, non-audio ads (like here on Neogaf) and I won't use adblock while visiting your website.

 

[werks]

I don't mind ads. What I do mind are websites that are completely unable to show any restraint or refuse to police pop ups, redirects, long load times, and pages that shift all over the place while the 200 ads/scripts load. So websites like The Verge have no one to blame but themselves for the mess they are finding themselves in.

Because you are carefully black and white listing sites based on the ethics of their ads?

If the ads annoy you, just don't go. I guarantee that 99% of people that block ads on the verge also block ads on neogaf.

 

[shoplifter]

I'll give a shit about this when I don't have to take a 30+MB hit to my data plan every time I load a page on my mobile browser.

 

[NumberTwo]

If they make ads 100% virus free, not annoying popups that block out part or the screen or autoplay audio, then I would never use adblock again.

*Nods.* Sorry, but I'm not willing to take a gamble on just any site. I will support the ones that I frequently visit and have vetted (GAF, GiantBomb, Vox, etc...) but too many advertisers utilize these obnoxious methods that hamper my web browsing experience. And I don't have to put up with it.

 

[Gnome Scat]

I welcome a return to the mid to late 90s ad free gif filled internet!

 

[The Technomancer]

What do you think? Is the internet dying because of ad-blockers? Is it time for content creators to shake up their revenue models?

Yes, it has been for a while

 

[jelly]

Not the users problem. Websites took it too far and some sites still manage fine without doing a Verge, Windows Central etc. If your massive, full of poor articles or click bait trash trying to suck all traffic, profile users and need a billion 3rd party scripts, terrible ads to make ends meet or profit massively I have zero sympathy for you. Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

 

[razgriz417]

wonder when they'll write about script blockers? Isn't the verge one of those sites that have a huge footprint?

 

[Hari Seldon]

It is just laziness. They can run unblockable ads by having the ads be hosted on their own servers and not these shitty ass evil 3rd party ad servers. Think Twitch streamers that use a specific gaming chair or someshit. You cannot block that ad and you are always looking at it. As long as these 3rd party servers are tracking me all over the internet I will continue to ghostery and adblock.

 

[BadWolf]

Don't care.

 

[Jazz573]

I use an ad blocker. I do unblock certain sites I visit tho. Unfortunately I can't disable it on GAF because I tried it and my browser lagged like hell.

 

[Kickz]

I like the ads like the ones here on GAF, short and sweet

 

[DeathoftheEndless]

However, he totally glosses over the fact that advertising-only models are vanishing in different forms of media, like streaming music, video, phone apps, and time shifted tv.

Don't all of these things have ads?

Also, I feel like I've read your OP before.

 

[Majine]

Removing ads usually make for a better user experience, in both performance and look.

Solve that problem, and people will be less likely to adblock you.

 

[InfernoNR]

If they make ads 100% virus free, not annoying popups that block out part or the screen or autoplay audio, then I would never use adblock again.

Exactly. Anything that is popping up on my screen, covering up content that I'm trying to read or autoplaying video/audio is just so incredibly obnoxious. Any website that has those kinds of ads I stop visiting altogether. It's why I go to Accuweather and not The Weather Channel anymore

 

[John Kowalski]

I frankly think content creators on the internet don't have a long life ahead of them.

 

[numble]

Doesn't take away from what he is saying. If this was truly about the user then Apple would allow system level ad blocking in apps.

It's not hard to see what apples motive is when they will not block iAd and they are pushing Apple news which will also not block ads.

If Apple can starve content creators of revenue from the web, they will move to a more proprietary solution like apps or Apple news. Somewhere Apple can peddle their ads.

How long before m.neogaf is shut down and replaced by an iOS app, if I'm paying the server fees for this site I would be working on it right now.

And there lies the crux of the issue, the iOS app can have as obtrusive of an ad as it wants. Nothing will block it. Just get off googles network and move to iAds.

If they move to apps, they are likely to use the Google ad platform. If they move to apps, they lose the probably 70%+ of users that are browsing without an ad block system running. Android and Chrome have a larger market share and also allows ad blocking, and it hasn't moved the market in any way. What makes you think it would change now?

 

[Wreav]

Don't all of these things have ads?

Also, I feel like I've read your OP before.

They all have ad-free subscription options.

 

[ZeroX03]

If only there were ways to earn money outside of advertising, eh Nilay?

 

[Fliesen]

Youtube commercials is what made me start using Adblock. I went to the internet to get away from commercial-breaks.

funnily, i don't mind youtube ads whatsoever.

watching the first 5 seconds of some ad video so i can watch a 30min video without interruptions. Sure, why not.
On Twitch, i went turbo, because hopping from streamer to streamer is super annoying because you get an unskippable ad every single time.

 

[Opus Angelorum]

Removing ads usually make for a better user experience, in both performance and look.

Solve that problem, and people will be less likely to adblock you.

Unfortunately does that not push everything towards a subscription model?

 

[Wreav]

If only there were ways to earn money outside of advertising, eh Nilay?

What would you suggest for The Verge? An online shop with chunky bracelets with FUCK THE SUITS hand-embossed on the inner strap?

 

[chubigans]

Last week before the content blockers I couldn't even get onto the Verge with my iPhone...Safari timed out saying there were way too many redirects. I've never seen that before.

That website is the absolute worst when it came to ad serving and tracking. I can't believe how much better the internet is on my mobile iOS devices now with Crystal. This was a long time coming.

 

[Majine]

Unfortunately does that not push everything towards a subscription model?

Or experiences where ads are woven into the fabric of the content in a way that makes it feel organic.