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[nkarafo]

All the games look great, but DC is just bonkers in it's lighting, it's some of the best I've seen along with The Order which again pushed levels of realism.

Im not sure about how realistic the lighting is in this game. To me it looks too dark. You can hardly see most of the formula's rear side, half of it it's pitch black. In real life you would clearly see it with the weather conditions depicted in the gif. Just because the sun doesn't directly hit it, it doesn't mean it should be 100% black.

 

[nib95]

Im not sure about how realistic the lighting is in this game. To me it looks too dark. You can hardly see most of the formula's rear side, half of it it's pitch black. In real life you would clearly see it with the weather conditions depicted in the gif.

It's a dark cloudy day, with overcast conditions, of course the lighting is going to be moody. It's not like the game doesn't ever look bright or sunny.

You can see it very much depends on lighting conditions. For example, the canopy shadows from the wall, trees etc here, causing darker spots.

 

[nkarafo]

It's a dark cloudy day, with overcast conditions, of course the lighting is going to be moody. It's not like the game doesn't ever look bright or sunny.

Still, in the gif he quoted the lighting does not look realistic. Even during a dark, cloudy day it doesn't mean things get 100% pitch black under a shadow.

Also, in the gif you posted, at the last second you can see the inside of the car. And once again, it's shadow-y spots are way too dark and pitch black. In real life there are no pitch black spots in your car during a sunny day.

You can see it very much depends on lighting conditions. For example, the canopy shadows from the wall, trees etc here, causing darker spots.

Yes, i can see it. The problem is that all these shadows couse everything to go darker than in real life. Even on your second gif, there are moments of pitch blackness, during a sunny day. Just because something is under a shadow, it doesn't mean it has to be so dark.

 

[Dictator93]

It doesn't look any different in the 1080p/60FPS comparison videos.
These gifs are just an easy way to embed these finding into this thread because not everyone is going to watch every youtube video thats linked here.

Sorry, but that 60 fps excuse is funny and stupid. Let's say it's a webm format. What the difference would be except one game run smoother than the other?

You have the Youtube video in 60. And opinions would be the same - DC looks miles better.

Framerate isn't going to save that comparison. And I'm a huge framerate whore.

Neogaf brothers: it ain't an excuse... rather how one does fair comparisons. I am not defending Forza 6's honour or something lol.

Gifs are at best useful in some platformwarz thread... not one trying to pick out detail or represent things as they are.

The gifs in this thread are made from these videos.

People should use webm if they want to embed stuff, and or gamersyde for links: not even YouTube.

 

[eso76]

Guys at Evolution: i'm starting to worry about you.

I mean, we appreciate that, we really do, but stop working your collective ass off for free.

 

[strata8]

Still, in the gif he quoted the lighting does not look realistic. Even during a dark, cloudy day it doesn't mean things get 100% pitch black under a shadow.

It would if the camera was looking directly into a bright sky.

I don't think Driveclub is trying to replicate human vision. That sort of dynamic range would be impossible to replicate on a TV.

 

[Mabufu]

Still, in the gif he quoted the lighting does not look realistic. Even during a dark, cloudy day it doesn't mean things get 100% pitch black under a shadow.

Also, in the gif you posted, at the last second you can see the inside of the car. And once again, it's shadow-y spots are way too dark and pitch black. In real life there are no pitch black spots in your car during a sunny day.



Yes, i can see it. The problem is that all these shadows couse everything to go darker than in real life. Even on your second gif, there are moments of pitch blackness, during a sunny day. Just because something is under a shadow, it doesn't mean it has to be so dark.

Tell us where the light to illuminate the rear side would come from.

 

[Stillmatic]

Still, in the gif he quoted the lighting does not look realistic. Even during a dark, cloudy day it doesn't mean things get 100% pitch black under a shadow.

Also, in the gif you posted, at the last second you can see the inside of the car. And once again, it's shadow-y spots are way too dark and pitch black. In real life there are no pitch black spots in your car during a sunny day.



Yes, i can see it. The problem is that all these shadows couse everything to go darker than in real life. Even on your second gif, there are moments of pitch blackness, during a sunny day. Just because something is under a shadow, it doesn't mean it has to be so dark.

I'm pretty sure Evo are simulating looking through a camera, so exposure levels are different.

 

[leeh]

Im not sure about how realistic the lighting is in this game. To me it looks too dark. You can hardly see most of the formula's rear side, half of it it's pitch black. In real life you would clearly see it with the weather conditions depicted in the gif. Just because the sun doesn't directly hit it, it doesn't mean it should be 100% black.

I don't think they went for realistic. If I was going to nit pick, it seems like they've got the contrast up really high, like TV in the store high. It looks glorious though. Those dry marks on the floor, hnnng.

I really wish I could have a chance to play this, none of my friends even have it.

 

[dr guildo]

Still, in the gif he quoted the lighting does not look realistic. Even during a dark, cloudy day it doesn't mean things get 100% pitch black under a shadow.

Also, in the gif you posted, at the last second you can see the inside of the car. And once again, it's shadow-y spots are way too dark and pitch black. In real life there are no pitch black spots in your car during a sunny day.



Yes, i can see it. The problem is that all these shadows couse everything to go darker than in real life. Even on your second gif, there are moments of pitch blackness, during a sunny day. Just because something is under a shadow, it doesn't mean it has to be so dark.

Sunny day means by extension, more shadows, and more shadows mean more dark areas, and dark materials inside dark areas, could mean very dark (not pitch black) as observed in that gif.

Check your screen setting, maybe it's a story about full/ limited rgb.

 

[nkarafo]

Tell us where the light to illuminate the rear side would come from.

Get out during a cloudy day. Look at an object not directly hit by the sun. Is it pitch black to you?

I suppose if you were looking it through a camera it probably would. Otherwise light is reflected and scattered so you can see things.

I'm pretty sure Evo are simulating looking through a camera, so exposure levels are different.

Fair enough.

Sunny day means by extension, more shadows, and more shadows mean more dark areas, and dark materials inside dark areas, could mean near pitch black (not pitch black) as observed in that gif.

But in reality it's not as dark. You can still see clearly something under a shadow. But we established it's a camera effect and not how the eyes work so OK.

 

[Conduit]

People should use webm if they want to embed stuff, and or gamersyde for links: not even YouTube.

Suddenly gifs are the problem. Damn.

 

[dr guildo]

That landscape and scope !! Unique !
Lol@people saying DC is not impressive on sunny day...

 

[nib95]

Still, in the gif he quoted the lighting does not look realistic. Even during a dark, cloudy day it doesn't mean things get 100% pitch black under a shadow.

Also, in the gif you posted, at the last second you can see the inside of the car. And once again, it's shadow-y spots are way too dark and pitch black. In real life there are no pitch black spots in your car during a sunny day.



Yes, i can see it. The problem is that all these shadows couse everything to go darker than in real life. Even on your second gif, there are moments of pitch blackness, during a sunny day. Just because something is under a shadow, it doesn't mean it has to be so dark.

I respectfully disagree. It's an accurate lighting model, so if it's dark it's because the conditions presented it. It's not like those conditions aren't realistic either.

EDIT: And yes, I'm pretty sure Driveclub is simulating the look through a camera rather than direct vision, though our eyes do offer a different kind of, but still similar exposure compensation etc. When playing the game, it often has a a very life-like and honest look about it.

 

[GoldenCrow]

Im not sure about how realistic the lighting is in this game. To me it looks too dark. You can hardly see most of the formula's rear side, half of it it's pitch black. In real life you would clearly see it with the weather conditions depicted in the gif. Just because the sun doesn't directly hit it, it doesn't mean it should be 100% black.

It is a gif you don't get a full colour range only 256, so it is going to look like crushed blacks. The actual game has far more variety and you can see all the dark details. Like a person said above a gif isn't an accurate representation due to its format limitations.

Suddenly gifs are the problem. Damn.

Yes and no, they give a good overall impression but they are severely limited in what they can show so if you are going to argue details from a gif it is verging on utter stupidity.

 

[Dictator93]

Suddenly gifs are the problem. Damn.

lol, I have no stake in proving any game to be "better" looking than the other man (I alredy stated I think DC to be the best looking racer). You are inventing some narrative behind my posting about defending FM5, 6 or whatever.

If you knew my game, posting history, and platform preferences, you would not even wager such a silly comment.

 

[eso76]

Im not sure about how realistic the lighting is in this game. To me it looks too dark. You can hardly see most of the formula's rear side, half of it it's pitch black. In real life you would clearly see it with the weather conditions depicted in the gif. Just because the sun doesn't directly hit it, it doesn't mean it should be 100% black.

too dark doesn't mean lighting isn't realistic.
If you underexpose your pictures they'd be dark (duh) but wouldn't lose realistic quality, in the same way as being "too saturated" isn't Always a good excuse for a game not looking realistic (crank saturation up in a pic, and it would still look like an oversaturated real pic)

DC is going for a punchy color graded film look. I agree that it's often too dark, i constantly yell at my avatar to turn the fucking headlights on when the sun is setting because i can't see shit.

 

[Summer Haze]

God DAMN.

 

[Windom Earle]

I am not defending Forza 6's honour or something lol.

No? Comparing F5 cardboard crowds to "lackluster" DC trees (Still the best trees we have ever seen in a racing game) seems at least dodgy to me.

That which is the laughing stock of forza is a technological innovation elsewhere.

high detailed SSR, clouds, cars and shaders... lack luster vegetation in comparison.

 

[Mabufu]

Get out during a cloudy day. Look at an object not directly hit by the sun. Is it pitch black to you?

Sometimes, you gotta lack of surfaces to get the light reflected.
If you look at the gif and understand the situation, there's no way the light can reach the rear side of the car.

Maybe in real life it could by refracting through the clouds and getting a better incidence angle, maybe, but that is just a theory.

 

[Dictator93]

No? Comparing F5 cardboard crowds to "lackluster" DC trees (Still the best trees we have ever seen in a racing game) seems at least dodgy to me.

Yes, sprite trees do not look good if they remain sprites at any distance, same with sprite crowds. I am sorry you read a narrative into that.

 

[Dinjooh]

lol, I have no stake in proving any game to be "better" looking than the other man (I alredy stated I think DC to be the best looking racer). You are inventing some narrative behind my posting about defending FM5, 6 or whatever.

If you knew my game, posting history, and platform preferences, you would not even wager such a silly comment.

Can confirm, Dictator93 has a thing for cars that can fly.

 

[icecold1983]

That landscape and scope !! Unique !
Lol@people saying DC is not impressive on sunny day...

driveclub has the best rendering of large scale terrain i can think of at the moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=9&v=Rz_idcxuHzw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=74&v=cXEPjrj-3gA

i cant think of another game where the entire environment looks so convincing

more pics from the console SS thread

 

[Windom Earle]

Yes, sprite trees do not look good if they remain sprites at any distance, same with sprite crowds. I am sorry you read a narrative into that.

One game is using sprites in a really ugly looking way, the other masterfully. Just because the underlying tech is comparable, doesn't make the execution comparable. And again, other games wish to have trees as "lackluster" as Drive Club.

 

[TBiddy]

Just to make sure, is only the first gif teh biaz/doctored or the second one as well?

Videos:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cjQbiLk9GPQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=borC9k3dMbc

Could people claiming that it's cherry picked provide a better comparison vid/gif?

That gif should be deleted. It serves no purpose, as it isn't an accurate representation of what the games (Both DC and Forza) actually look like.

 

[Windom Earle]

That gif should be deleted. It serves no purpose, as it isn't an accurate representation of what the games (Both DC and Forza) actually look like.

So the videos are not real?

Or it could just be... Tricky to find tracks/locations that are similar in both games, ya know.

 

[AbandonedTrolley]

I don't think they went for realistic. If I was going to nit pick, it seems like they've got the contrast up really high, like TV in the store high. It looks glorious though. Those dry marks on the floor, hnnng.

I really wish I could have a chance to play this, none of my friends even have it.

Assume you don't have a PS4 then else you could grab the PS+ version?

 

[nib95]

One game is using sprites in a really ugly looking way, the other masterfully. Just because the underlying tech is comparable, doesn't make the execution comparable. And again, other games wish to have trees as "lackluster" as Drive Club.

Driveclub may be using sprites, but it's doing so in a very clever and immensely convincing way. Better than any other racer before it, by a wide margin. Examples.

 

[TBiddy]

So the videos are not real?

Or it could just be... Tricky to find tracks/locations that are similar in both games, ya know.

I specifically wrote "GIFS", not videos.

 

[1.21Gigawatts]

Gifs are at best useful in some platformwarz thread... not one trying to pick out detail or represent things as they are.


People should use webm if they want to embed stuff, and or gamersyde for links: not even YouTube.

I would make as high quality as possible webms for comparison if I knew how to do it. Having played both games live on a TV I think the differences become even more apparant the better the quality of the comparison is.
But these tiny gifs are the only thing you can do with nothing else but a browser and they still tell a true story, even though they leave out many details.

If someone here has the means to do it I would appreachiate a big ass high quality webm created from gamersyde footage.

 

[TBiddy]

I would make as high quality as possible webms for comparison if I knew how to do it. Having played both games live on a TV I think the differences become even more apparant the better the quality of the comparison is.
But these tiny gifs are the only thing you can do with nothing else but a browser and they still tell a true story, even though they leave out many details.

If someone here has the means to do it I would appreachiate a big ass high quality webm created from gamersyde footage.

The only true way to do it is to use direct feed videos, preferrably from gamersyde. And still then, it's not the same as actually playing the game.

 

[Conduit]

lol, I have no stake in proving any game to be "better" looking than the other man (I alredy stated I think DC to be the best looking racer). You are inventing some narrative behind my posting about defending FM5, 6 or whatever.

If you knew my game, posting history, and platform preferences, you would not even wager such a silly comment.

I don't care about your history post and platform preference. But yes, suddenly gifs are the problem. And funny thing is that there are some PCARS vs DC gifs. And guess what, NOBODY said that comparison is unfair cuz PCARS is 60fps, NOBODY. But for Forza 6 is the big problem. LOL!

 

[Dictator93]

I don't care about your history post and platform preference. But yes, suddenly gifs are the problem. And funny thing is that there are some PCARS vs DC gifs. And guess what, NOBODY said that comparison is unfair cuz PCARS is 60fps, NOBODY. But for Forza 6 is the big problem. LOL!

It is a problem in general, for any and every comparison.

I would make as high quality as possible webms for comparison if I knew how to do it. Having played both games live on a TV I think the differences become even more apparant the better the quality of the comparison is.
But these tiny gifs are the only thing you can do with nothing else but a browser and they still tell a true story, even though they leave out many details.

If someone here has the means to do it I would appreachiate a big ass high quality webm created from gamersyde footage.

A GAFer made an awesome .bat and automatic .webm conversion tool awhile back using FFmpeg... now only if I could find it for you.
EDIT: Tada I found it

 

[Conduit]

It is a problem in general, for any and every comparison.


A GAFer made an awesome .bat and automatic .webm conversion tool awhile back using FFmpeg... now only if I could find it for you.

I said : NOBODY said that comparison is unfair, NOBODY. But for Forza 6 is.

Guys, gifs are from now on strictly forbidden.

 

[icecold1983]

guys i dont think dictator even plays consoles. hes not trying to defend forza

 

[Dictator93]

I said : NOBODY said that comparison is unfair, NOBODY. But for Forza 6 is.

hrmm

guys i dont think dictator even plays consoles. hes not trying to defend forza

True, unless the sega genesis counts as a console in a thread like this. lol

 

[Summer Haze]

driveclub has the best rendering of large scale terrain i can think of at the moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=9&v=Rz_idcxuHzw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=74&v=cXEPjrj-3gA

i cant think of another game where the entire environment looks so convincing

more pics from the console SS thread

I agree. I remember the first time I saw Canada gameplay on Gamersyde and thinking that the sense of scale and presence of the environments was unparalleled.

 

[leng jai]

This is a big pet peeve of mine also. I don't think it needs to be massively brighter...just moderately. Especially on all the Chile tracks in cockpit and external view.

Even though there is a "Brightness" setting that was patched into Driveclub....it acts like the brightness level on our HDTV's...which is actually black level. Increasing "brightness" in DC therefore means washing out the image completely cause you're killing the games black level.

I have that issue with the game too - there's a murkiness that no TV settings can remove. It was the thing that struck me most when I first got the game. I wondered why they didn't go for an approach that adjusts the exposure of the scene in line with the way our eyes react to changing light levels. I guess it's a stylistic choice, but one that means I never find DC very attractive - for all it's technical wonder, the murk is the thing my eyes are most aware of - perhaps because I'm particularly sensitive to light levels due to an eye condition.

Yeah, I think it's part of the reason why DriveClub never got the same amount of attention before the inclusion of weather since the overcast conditions mask it completely.

 

[Synth]

So the videos are not real?

Or it could just be... Tricky to find tracks/locations that are similar in both games, ya know.

Actually. It's not that tricky, Driveclub has racetrack type environments as well, which is the closest you can get for comparable scenarios. These tracks are never selected for these sorts of comparisons though, because they're not the best looking that the game offers. Which is fine, but neither are the bland race tracks in FM6. The best trackside details for that game would be some of its fictional track layouts such as Rio or Prague etc. Comparing an area of Driveclub in a gif with large close by trackside details like huge trees, rocky mountains etc, to a race track environment of FM6 where there's nothing on either side of the course but a mile of grass is far from the best comparison that could be made between the two.

 

[Mr Moose]

guys i dont think dictator even plays consoles. hes not trying to defend forza

Yeah, I think he's just saying GIFs are tiny and shit quality.

I think DC looks pretty good in the shade.

(gameplay shot - HUD 0%)

 

[nib95]

guys i dont think dictator even plays consoles. hes not trying to defend forza

I agree. I also agree with his premise that GIF's aren't the best way to compare such things. If anything I think high quality (key word high quality) GIF's often tend to make make games look better in certain areas, not worse. Really this Forza 6 complaint is the first I've ever heard about someone claiming GIF's are an unfair format in the sense that they always make things look worse. Generally, despite the loss in colour depth and clarity, a high quality GIF's downsample can make games look cleaner and more palatable. Yes, you lose details, but it's also harder to make out flaws as well. Which is why older games fare especially well in GIF form. That said, the comparison GIF's above aren't very good quality, to the detriment of both games.

I do still think GIF's serve a purpose though, in the sense that they show a quick snapshot example, that is more accessible and easily digestible than loading up a video, hence why they are so popular.

 

[MilkyJoe]

Im not sure about how realistic the lighting is in this game. To me it looks too dark. You can hardly see most of the formula's rear side, half of it it's pitch black. In real life you would clearly see it with the weather conditions depicted in the gif. Just because the sun doesn't directly hit it, it doesn't mean it should be 100% black.

I'd agree. The lighting in DC looks amazing, but in this gif comparrisson it Looks over the top stylistic, like lighting on a CGI heavy movie.

Of all the racers so far the PC helmet cam gives the most realistic effect.

https://youtu.be/4aW6K1KPcE4?t=115

 

[viHuGi]

It would be cool to have a option on Driveclub to adjust cockpit view the way we like.

 

[Gestault]

WebM's are tons better than gifs for bite-sized motion clips, but since imgur's converter (the easiest I've come across) is still acting twitchy, it's sort of like "use what you have." It's very easy to use smaller, less detailed images to make a game look better than it would in front of you in terms of scene cohesion/IQ. That applies to all the games here.

I can say without a hint of reluctance that I've seen samples of all the games here that look better than those games generally look with a wheel/controller in-hand. It's sort of like why there's such a think as a highlight reel. Things get weird though when people who don't have experience with those games see mostly those curated bits and assume that's indicative of the full spectrum of visuals in a game. The converse is true as well: If people are cherry-picking rotten examples and keep bringing them up, it muddies the water just as dramatically. It's super easy to "character assassinate" a game, especially when you're familiar with it to know where to look.

Be consistent, and be sincere.

It would be cool to have a option on Driveclub to adjust cockpit view the way we like.

Even the default options are pretty nice, though. It's one of the few games with a good halfway point between in-car and a dash-cam. I could have sworn it did have options like that, but I can't remember for sure.

 

[Terbinator]

The hovercraft is real.

 

[nkarafo]

Driveclub may be using sprites, but it's doing so in a very clever and immensely convincing way. Better than any other racer before it, by a wide margin. Examples.

I played the game for a couple of days but i never knew the foliage effects look so good.

That's the problem. These are still pictures of close ups. During gameplay you have to deal with 3 things:

Fixed camera views with limited control.
Obnoxious motion blur.
30fps.

Because of all these, i couldn't make out the detail of those foliage effects during gameplay, unless there's something i don't get. Every tree looked to me like a patch of blurry pixels, pretty much like every 30fps racing game.

Now if this was a 3D adventure, it would be incredible because you control the camera, the pace, you can sit still and marvel at the graphics. In a racing game, the overuse of motion blur and the low frame rate pretty much covers all these details. You need high frame rates and a clear picture for these effects to appear under constant fast motion.

 

[Vicetrailia]

Even Gran Turismo will be beat by DC in graphics.

 

[DD]

I agree. I remember the first time I saw Canada gameplay on Gamersyde and thinking that the sense of scale and presence of the environments was unparalleled.

Dirt Rally also have something like that. It's bloody awesome.

 

[Fess]

Just to make sure, is only the first gif teh biaz/doctored or the second one as well?

[gifs and videos]

Could people claiming that it's cherry picked provide a better comparison vid/gif?

It's just cherry picking, they aren't doctored. Anyone can choose a track, car, lighting setting etc and make any game look bad compared to another game where you choose the track, car, lighting setting etc which make the game look bad. It's like using the photo mode but instead of saving the shots that you think look great you only save the ones you think look bad, just for... fun... or whatever. The most unbiased comparisons might be comparing the games from the pics in the photo threads, at least then all games are shown at it's best. But I guess this thread is about how the games look in gameplay.

Video comparisons are better but you can still do some cherry picking because lol why did they make FM6 run at like 15 fps in that video? Makes zero sense and I'm just laughing at the whole thing here, just play the game, it might not look like DC in stillpics but it looks phenomenal in motion.

I actually did an A-B comparison with Driveclub and Forza 6, switching hdmi inputs with the remote, when taking the photos in my last post when talking about the realistic dullness in DC. My take from that comparison is that the differences are not night and day as some say here, that only happens when you look at the framerates where FM6 obviously makes DC look like a stuttery mess, or when you're driving in the rain where DC obviously slaughters FM6 since the rain effects in DC is extreme well done. The best looking courses, cars, lighting conditions, etc in both games make them both look amazing. Personally I think FM6 looks a bit too close to DC considering it's 60fps, but until we see DC running with unlocked framerate we really don't know how far ahead DC really is, if it runs at like 45fps unlocked in the rain then FM6 isn't quite as impressive in 60fps from my point of view.

 

[Gestault]

I played the game for a couple of days but i never thought the foliage effects look so good.

That's the problem. These are still pictures of close ups.

I've gotta say, this was my experience with looking at foliage from a distance. I don't think it's anything to do with the framerate or motion blur, but the foliage blocks lose most of the their detail compared to closer shots like that from normal distances. It may be something to do with the AF levels (the same way road surfaces in console racers in general lose their detail the more acute the camera angle gets).

I still don't think that means it's a bad solution. Particularly when Evolution has done such a good job with making track-side details so close to the roadway for strong parallax.