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[Angry Grimace]

If you were paying attention, she had a flashback where it showed Luke dumping her off on a desert planet, so she was probably born even more gifted than either he or Anakin were. And he and Anakin were incredibly force sensitive. Anakin self-taught himself podracing as a little kid, Obi-Wan and Qui-Gon were like 'wtf'. She is also missing all of her memories since she thinks Luke is a myth, except at the end where she seems to understand and they stare at each other, and he looks grief-stricken.

She's also far from a master Jedi, her lightsaber skills were crap, she spent 80% of the fight running away from Kylo Ren and then after he's had tons of blood loss and tries to convince her to join him, she gets in a few lucky strikes.

Rey learning the Jedi Mind trick in 5 minutes was a little silly (but the sequence was fun) and they established very quickly that both Finn and Rey were at least competent in hand to hand fighting anyways (with Rey beating up the goons and showing that the First Order were competent and trained at hand-to-hand combat).

 

[Kuros]

How about the real option of his dad being a human?

Ah yeah, Shmi was a liar is option 3.

 

[JB1981]

It only just happens to conveniently separate the two during a climatic moment.

I guess the area they were fighting should have gone untouched

 

[Cat Party]

It only just happens to conveniently separate the two during a climatic moment.

Just as convenient as Darth Vader's tie fighter being knocked away from the exploding Death Star. Come on, it's a movie.

 

[TheOctodad]

Why do people keep calling Kylo, "Ren?" That's like calling Vader, "Darth."

 

[Ishida]

There's a few now non-canon books that go into it. In Plagueis' attempts to create life, he inadvertently created Anakin or the force did as if to "strike back".

There's also Palpatine's story about Plagueis from Revenge of the Sith that strongly hints that's the case:

"Darth Plagueis was a Dark Lord of the Sith so powerful and so wise, he could use the Force to influence the midi-chlorians to create life."

Anakin had no father, it adds up.

It's actually a quite interesting theory, I like it. But I would really want to hear something official. Still, Anakin being created for Sith purposes, then joining the Sith, then destroying them is actually a quite nice story.

 

[WadiumArcadium]

what the fuck are the knights of ren? they had nothing to with star wars episode VII

Didn't you see the vision of Kylo and the other Knights after presumably wiping out Luke's academy?

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

I've said this a ton, but Ren was pretty much a disappointing villain to me all around. What could have been. I would have literally taken the tripe "evil guy from nowhere" or "ancient awakened evil returns" over the brat kid of Han.

Man he is such a good villain.
Ill tell you why I really love him. He shows why anyone would be tempted by the darkside. The darkside rewards letting your emotions spiral out of control and get the best of you which would be very appealing to any kid with a bit of a odd bent. He isn't a bad ass or at the height of his power in TFA. Instead we get to see what happens when you make the choice Luke wouldn't. Kill your father. Destroy all ties to your loved ones. Embrace the darkness. Because he is still so young he doesn't have a firm grip on his powers and is panic striken about making this sacrifice and still not living up to Vader. I think he is such a refreshing villain compared to the normal one dimensional tripe we get.

 

[Rixxan]

i guess it didn't hit me at first, but it really is sad that chewie lost han

oof

 

[More_Badass]

...

Seriously

I can't fathom how people can look at the Oldboy fight and think it's great. Sure, it's one take, but it's the ridiculous "stand around and fight one at a time" BS x 1000. The fighting choreography isn't even that good

 

[MMarston]

It's really not even worth engaging with him. He quoted a negative review of the film before release and said he was looking forward to writing something exactly like that once he actually saw it:

well, this certainly demotivates me from doing any interactions with him

 

[Ishida]

Ah yeah, Shmi was a liar is option 3.

Or maybe she was just playing with technicalities like Obi-Wan was on Ep. IV. Maybe Anakin's father was just a deadbeat dad who abandoned them. So Shmi was technically true, "there was no father".

 

[Brakke]

The Dark Side struggle is, like, THE struggle though? Why would they resolve that in the first film? She gets her first taste, but she has yet to find out who or what she's really made of.

They don't have to resolve it, but they don't even open it. Rey doesn't even get a second to comtemplate whether to kill him or not. The movie never asks her if she's going to kill him.

This is like asking why the Terminator had to get its legs blown off at the end of the first movie.

In the first Terminator, the Terminator is a force of nature. A thing that exists to be defeated. Hobbling him is fine. Hobbling Ren is weird because it turns him into a jobber. He exists in that fight so that Rey can win. Turns him into a means when we really want to see him as an end.

So Rey wouldnt have died in the confrontation. Ta Da!

There's a million ways to do that.

Beat Ren emotionally. He psyches himself up for the fight, yelling at her about how Han abandoned him. Rey keeps talking about Han's capacity for love or about Han's regret. Ren goes on tilt, Rey stays calm.

Injuring Kylo is a contrivance and it's not satisfying to lots of people. It's a weird choice, it basically doesn't "work".

 

[Gonzalez]

Ren was fucking punching his own wound like 5 times. You'd think that would have gotten the point across.

That hitting the injury shit was straight out of the Kenta Kobashi limb psychology playbook.

 

[FloatOn]

I hated it and didn't get an epic feel at all.Easily the worst film out of them all for me.

Harrison Ford should stop acting.

you should feel bad for posting this

 

[ReadingRambo]

It's really not even worth engaging with him. He quoted a negative review of the film before release and said he was looking forward to writing something exactly like that once he actually saw it:

Yep. Dude's been on a mission.

 

[Ishida]

you should feel bad for posting this

No, he shouldn't. Too bad he couldn't enjoy it, but your opinion is not somehow better than his.

 

[MMarston]

I hated it and didn't get an epic feel at all.Easily the worst film out of them all for me.

Harrison Ford should stop acting.

you can't just go saying that w/o giving us some more deets buddy

No, he shouldn't. Too bad he couldn't enjoy it, but your opinion is not somehow better than his.

this is also true

 

[Kuros]

i guess it didn't hit me at first, but it really is sad that chewie lost han

oof

Chewie should have had a scene with Leia at the end. It was nonsense that he walked straight past her.

 

[Interfectum]

I've said this a ton, but Ren was pretty much a disappointing villain to me all around. What could have been. I would have literally taken the trite "evil guy from nowhere" or "ancient awakened evil returns" over the brat kid of Han.

I completely disagree. His character arc has so much potential now. Probably one of the more interesting characters that's been in a Star Wars movie, IMO.

 

[Skellig Gra]

what the fuck are the knights of ren? they had nothing to with star wars episode VII

It's like a Marvel movie. 1/3 of the movie is setting up other movies.

 

[injurai]

Too bad that shot made no freaking sense in the movie.

Beautiful shot, shouldve been cut.

Yeah it did. The tie fighters were being scrambled to fight off Black Squadron's bombing run.

 

[TheOctodad]

Man he is such a good villain.
Ill tell you why I really love him. He shows why anyone would be tempted by the darkside. The darkside rewards letting your emotions spiral out of control and get the best of you which would be very appealing to any kid with a bit of a odd bent. He isn't a bad ass or at the height of his power in TFA. Instead we get to see what happens when you make the choice Luke wouldn't. Kill your father. Destroy all ties to your loved ones. Embrace the darkness. Because he is still so young he doesn't have a firm grip on his powers and is panic striken about making this sacrifice and still not living up to Vader. I think he is such a refreshing villain compared to the normal one dimensional tripe we get.

Agreed, he shat all over soulless villains like "Ultron." I'm tired of these one-dimensional "badass" bad guys.

I feel like Kylo as a villain is timely as well. We basically have someone who is struggling with mental health and a need to belong. Kylo is the image of how many young men get recruited into terrorist organizations - meaning, power, anger.

 

[Gonzalez]

you should feel bad for posting this

He has a free opinion. So do you, until you leave for Canada.

 

[Ophelion]

It's actually a quite interesting theory, I like it. But I would really want to hear something official. Still, Anakin being created for Sith purposes, then joining the Sith, then destroying them is actually a quite nice story.

Such a good and interesting arc that plays against expectations that since it came from the pen of George Lucas, I've got to imagine it was completely unintentional.

 

[Divvy]

Faraci's demands for VIII



It's a good read and brings up some fair points.

Good article

That bizarre scene with Leia walking past Chewie to hug Rey made no sense to me. You'd think she's want to console with Chewie over their mutual loss.

Give us a galaxy with some galactic distances. Do all the events in The Force Awakens take place on planets right next to each other? You'd think so, considering the fact that characters can jump into ships and be across the entire galaxy in moments. There's a scene where Kylo Ren is watching the Starkiller Base death beam go in front of his Star Destroyer and still manages to arrive at Maz Kenada's planet before the beam strikes its target! And by the way, everybody on that planet can see the destruction of a distant star system in real time, despite the speed of light not working that way. Even Lucasfilm's Pablo Hidalgo sort of threw up his hands at this one:

This is the same problem JJ's Star Trek movies had. Spock watching Vulcan explode from another star system somehow, and the Enterprise warping from Qonos to Earth within minutes. He doesn't seem to care at all about establishing spacial distances.

Give us space battles. Almost every single aerial action scene in The Force Awakens takes place not just in-atmosphere but at very low altitudes. One of the charms of Star Wars has always been battles that rage against the backdrop of a starfield, and I want more of that in Episode VIII. The Force Awakens has one very short space battle - when Finn and Poe steal the TIE Fighter - and literally one shot of space battle in the assault on Starkiller Base. This is called Star Wars, not In Atmosphere Wars, guys.

This is kind of a petty criticism, but I want to say that I wish JJ would linger on space battle shots longer instead of cutting so quickly all the time. It doesn't give the viewer enough time to take what's actually transpiring, or who's involved with what skirmish. Same thing happened with Star Trek. To me, the one extended shot with Poe shooting down like 7 Tie fighters was one of the best and most exciting of the movie. Hopefully we get more like that in the next one.

Also, just another minor personal nitpick, but why do stormtroopers even wear armour anymore? Is there anything they don't just get one shot by? Maybe if they took off those suffocating helmets, they could actually hit their targets. Then again, I assume it's purely for intimidation factors.

 

[Ishida]

Chewie should have had a scene with Leia at the end. It was nonsense that he walked straight past her.

This really bothered me.

Such a good an interesting arc that plays against expectations that since it came from the pen of George Lucas, I've got to imagine it was completely unintentional.

I'm not on the "Lucas is a hack" hate bandwagon, so I believe it would be intentional if it was true.

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

It's really not even worth engaging with him. He quoted a negative review of the film before release and said he was looking forward to writing something exactly like that once he actually saw it:

Wow. I wasn't looking forward to not liking the movie but that review shared similar feelings I had about the film before release. I was being sarcastic because I know people were going to this if I had similar feelings and I was right. How "fun"
If you actually upset by that then put me on ignore.

 

[Einchy]

It's really not even worth engaging with him. He quoted a negative review of the film before release and said he was looking forward to writing something exactly like that once he actually saw it:

Haha, and when I called him out on going into the movie wanting to hate it he acted like he had no idea what I was talking about.

[edit]

^ lol

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

Agreed, he shat all over soulless villains like "Ultron." I'm tired of these one-dimensional "badass" bad guys.

I feel like Kylo as a villain is timely as well. We basically have someone who is struggling with mental health and a need to belong. Kylo is the image of how many young men get recruited into terrorist organizations - meaning, power, anger.

Absolutely. Thats a great connection I hadn't thought of.

 

[aliengmr]

I don't know what's there to explain. It's already been long established that one's aptitude to use the Force is something you're born with.

Rey's just the potentially most powerful Force user we've ever seen.

Or its just as simple as "The force is calling, let it in". Luke had trouble with this, where as Rey seems to just accept it.

I don't think she has a lot of power so much as she taps in to her power better than most.

 

[Trigonometrize.]

It's tough to break people's head canon. People have made the force into some ultimate god mode thing that requires decades of training to get gut.

They can't handle seeing someone who trained so long get defeat no matter the scenario. To them, force trumps all no matter what. Except for years of training, lol.

I also get the impression that Kylo is young and hasn't been training for that long, he's just powerful because he's force latent as is Rey. I mean, he's no newbie, but this dude isn't 50 year old war hardened Darth Vader.

 

[Armaros]

Agreed, he shat all over soulless villains like "Ultron." I'm tired of these one-dimensional "badass" bad guys.

I feel like Kylo as a villain is timely as well. We basically have someone who is struggling with mental health and a need to belong. Kylo is the image of how many young men get recruited into terrorist organizations - meaning, power, anger.

You can tell some people just wanted Vader again.

 

[Rixxan]

maybe she could sense that he wanted to be alone? dunno

he felt ashamed he couldnt save him?

imma give that a pass

 

[FloatOn]

He has a free opinion. So do you, until you leave for Canada.

good lord, my fan club strikes again

this was a shit post to the core. no explanation was given for why he said what he said and I find it offensive that someone should express such negativity without clarification.

 

[Arkeband]

Yep. Dude's been on a mission.

It must suck to that jaded. I fully expected this movie to suck, and I had zero faith in JJ Abrams or his lens flares, but I'd easily put this on par with ANH or ESB, even with its incredibly uninspired story beats. It's just a fucking fun movie to watch. It serves as both a reboot and a continuation. It also had the balls to kill off a major character.

This is a Star Wars movie I would be proud to have my future kids become interested in the series with. Unless Episode 8 completely wastes the potential put forth here, I see the sequel trilogy eventually surpassing the OT for all but the staunchest of nostalgia fans.

 

[Jaleel]

It's a weird choice, it basically doesn't "work" FOR ME.

Fixed and sorry bout that.

 

[Sephzilla]

So,




As I understood it...



... "ben" the master apprentice of cookie, son of Leia, trained by Luke, able to stop a blaster shot mid-air, strong enough to soak a shot to the torso and punch the wound, was bested by the oblivious and untrained daughter of Luke.





I felt this movie was made for a generation much more forgiving than mine (I'm 30ish)

This movie was apparently made for a generation that is able to comprehend observational storytelling instead of needing exposition to explain everything. Kylo was wounded from getting shot by Chewbacca and was also flustered from just murdering his father.

 

[Ether_Snake]

Some notes.

1- The vision has Luke looking defeated/sad next to R2 in front of a burning fire is before the scene where Kylo and co. are surrounded by dead bodies.
- This indicates that Ben might have killed some jedis before joining the order, but not all of them.

2- Luke would have managed to deal with Kylo if he was there when all jedis get killed, or at least wounded, but Kylo has no obvious wound. My guess is Luke left to find the temple and left the order on its own because it could manage itself, looking for answers and/or looking for Ben before going for the temple. They might have even forced Luke to leave them.

3- Kylo comes back with the knights to hunt down the remaining jedis or church members, look for Luke, whatever, but in the vision we see someone try to hit Rey and he gets killed by Kylo. Why is Rey saved by Kylo? Were the jedis fighting among themselves? Did they drink kool-aid? Was that last jedi trying to kill Rey so the first order wouldn't get their hands on her?

Could be interesting for Kylo to tell Rey the jedis tried to kill her, that her real family is with him and Snoke.

 

[rekameohs]

I don't see redemption in store for Kylo Ren.

 

[Ishida]

good lord, my fan club strikes again

this was a shit post to the core. no explanation was given for why he said what he said and I find it offensive that someone should express such negativity without clarification.

Even if it was a shit post, you should not feel offended by something like that. Or you should, if you want... But it's kind of trivial.

 

[Ophelion]

I'm not on the "Lucas is a hack" hate bandwagon, so I believe it would be intentional if it was true.

I don't know that I would even go as far as to say that he was a hack, but the sort of storytelling he's into does not have that kind of nuance to it. He was very up front about Star Wars being modern fairy tales. These were never meant to be complex stories that defy type. They are built from the ground up from tropes.

I just don't think it's something he'd do on purpose is all I meant. It wasn't meant nearly as sneeringly as you imagined it to be, though in retrospect I can totally see how it could be taken that way.

 

[The Librarian]

I tthink the problem is about the Force moment as it comes off as her just dominating him rather than him being exhausted.

Right. She's extremely strong with the Force. Why is this so hard for some people to accept?

 

[BruceLeeRoy]

This movie was apparently made for a generation that is able to comprehend observational storytelling instead of needing exposition to explain everything. Kylo was wounded from getting shot by Chewbacca and was also flustered from just murdering his father.

Seph I wanted you to weigh in on the whole ROTJ Vader saving Luke from the darkside/by killing palpatine.

What are your thoughts?

 

[Angry Grimace]

Why do people keep calling Kylo, "Ren?" That's like calling Vader, "Darth."

Only a master of evil, Darth

 

[Snkfanatic]

Chewie should have had a scene with Leia at the end. It was nonsense that he walked straight past her.

That really stood out to me, not sure why they did it like that....

 

[Gonzalez]

good lord, my fan club strikes again.

I'll never forget that thread.

Like Finn, you will always be a traitor in my eyes.

 

[PrivateWHudson]

Yeah, that's one thing that is hard for me to fathom, given that Luke, who'd had more training at the beginning of ESB, really struggled to force grab his lightsaber when the Wampa was coming for him. But I'm probably being too critical.

No he didn't. All he could do is deflect a couple of blaster shots and put a missile in a hole by feeling the force and not relying on his slow visual senses or the computer.

 

[bonesmccoy]

It's actually a quite interesting theory, I like it. But I would really want to hear something official. Still, Anakin being created for Sith purposes, then joining the Sith, then destroying them is actually a quite nice story.

I like it too, but it's one of those things where I think the folks running the show now should back away from. Having it as a mystery is nice, fun, interesting.

Giving a definitive answer makes it Midicholrians 2.0.

 

[peanutbutterlatte]

That really stood out to me, not sure why they did it like that....

Not wanting to share mutual grief because they know they both knew Han like nobody else and they'd just break down in front of everybody when they're both meant to be strong Resistance fighters (and Leia a general?)

Like many niggles, theres a way to justify it without identifying it as an issue.