Bel Marduk
Banned
GAF is mostly progressive. Clinton is not a progressive.
Why such little enthusiasm for Hilary Clinton?
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Right, but I'm talking about her past not her current promises. She's kind of weather vaney in a way. Personally I didn't like a few of her answers about that when faced with them in debates and interviews, too.
I actually pretty much agree with this quite a bit. I think I've actually stated it in Bernie threads before, too. What they would be able to actually accomplish would probably be insanely similar. Might be some slight differences in a few beliefs of supreme court nominees I suppose, but realistically yeah... probably effectively very similar.
Brian Griffin
Member
This. Until Bernie is out I'm all for him. I believe he sees the presidency as a way to help people and do good through his policies. I think Hillary just sees it as the next step for her career.
Establishment candidate with no convictions who has repeatedly been on the wrong side of history up until the moment that public opinion points in another direction (e.g. gay marriage.). She's Washington aristocracy. Would be nice to have a first female US president but I'll vote against her in the primary for the same reason I voted for Obama during her first bid.
Sure, but according to GAF only racists support Sanders.
Sure, but according to GAF only racists support Sanders.
Gore and Kerry were downgrades of Clinton. Mondale and Dukakis were downgrades to Carter. Johnson, Humphrey and McGovern were downgrades to Kennedy. None of them except for Johnson won. Hopefully Hillary breaks the cycle.
"Diamond" Hillary Clinton.
NullPointer
Member
Because I remember candidate Hillary in 2008.
Also don't think she's been tested as a candidate but she's assumed to be the best choice by default.
I'd also like to give the guy who is targeting campaign finance and wall street his time to make a case.
Also don't think she's been tested as a candidate but she's assumed to be the best choice by default.
I'd also like to give the guy who is targeting campaign finance and wall street his time to make a case.
CapitalismSucks DonkeyBalls
Banned
Oh absolutely. Unfortunately Bernie's rhetoric seems new and radical to most people.
Also, regarding Hillary, I'm going to go ahead and link to my Nostradamus comment to a thread a few weeks ago.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=190713066&postcount=83
from...
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=190713066#post190713066
Banal is the perfect adjective for how I feel about her. She is absolutely banal.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
That's why I suspect thing will heat up after the primaries. Saving that fuel. Or at least, I hope.
Edit: Also I have missed every democratic debate because they schedule them at such awful times for me. I should probably watch a recording.
My guess is it has to do with people's mindsets of "liking things before they were cool," preferring underdogs, and being disillusioned by politics. A lot of people also don't understand politics. You think Obamacare was rejected? Just wait until states are hit by the "socialist single-payer" system by a "socialist" President. Not only will the states absolutely refuse to support such a system, the people who consistently vote (think the 80+ year old demographic) will vote out anyone who supported such a policy (yeah good luck Democrats in the mid-terms). I probably agree a little bit more with Bernie than Hillary, but he'd be a disaster as President. The country straight up is not ready. He gets elected, Republicans absolutely refuse to play ball "because he's a socialist," none of what he wants gets passed, and Democrats are absolutely fucked in four years. You have to take baby steps. The youth being primarily liberal Democrats is good. That doesn't mean that we're ready for Bernie as President though. It would be way different if the youth came out to vote, but that either can't happen (due to obligations such as work, school, etc.) or won't happen (because it's too much work, or too cold, or some other BS excuse). If the youth wants to show the country that it has a voice and that it's ready for a President like Bernie, show up at mid-terms so that we stop voting for people who are taking us back to the Stone Age.
There's a step after being president?
Dude Abides
Banned
Her personality reminds boys in their 20s of the time their mom made them do their homework instead of playing Metal Gear.
gutter_trash
Banned
a) she is the forever establishment pick (which is true)
b) she is old (which is true)
c) she is perceived to be more on the Right of Obama (which is false, especially on healthcare)
d) she comes off as a career politician (which is true)
the list goes on.
I rather Hillary than any Republican
b) she is old (which is true)
c) she is perceived to be more on the Right of Obama (which is false, especially on healthcare)
d) she comes off as a career politician (which is true)
the list goes on.
I rather Hillary than any Republican
Because she isn't promising to be bring a revolution or change everything like Bernie is.
Bernie gets his support from the more fringe left part of the party that has felt mostly ignored, its not surprising that the fringe is enthusiastic about a candidate that finally lines up with their views.
Bernie gets his support from the more fringe left part of the party that has felt mostly ignored, its not surprising that the fringe is enthusiastic about a candidate that finally lines up with their views.
Perspicacity
Banned
She killed office Jim
God Dayumm
Banned
This is good because a president is supposed to work for the public. The US needs more of those instead of politicians working for their own interests and warped ideals
She feels like a step backward after Obama. She's old and establishment. And she's been in the public eye long enough that it's kind of hard to get a grip on her core ideals. Going from a young black Hawaiian dude to a white New York geezer? Her campaign is so wildly different than Obama's 2008, it's kind of remarkable. Pretty easy to see especially young people say "this isn't the Democrat party I signed up for".
Jacksinthe
Banned
I think she's just a robot arm for her buds in wall street. She's most certainly not beholden to her constituents, which people easily see through. I feel Bernie is the only logical choice, IMO.
Extra Sauce
Member
Voting for Hilary is like eating your vegetables.
LegendofLex
Member
A few reasons:
- Democrats are actually tending to move left, which means they value candidates whose track records trend more to the left. Hillary is very much a centrist candidate, even if she's starting to move left with the base.
- Her campaign has felt tirelessly focus-group-tested and rehearsed instead of authentic and passionate, which makes it hard for her to relate to the actual feelings of voters.
- She's still a symbol of big money in politics based on her personal wealth and campaign donor makeup, even if the policies she supports aren't as obviously aligned with big money as those supported by Republicans.
- People don't believe that anyone associated with the Obama administration will succeed at getting anything done in the current political environment (even though this is a pretty unfounded belief based on what Obama himself has gotten done).
- Democrats are actually tending to move left, which means they value candidates whose track records trend more to the left. Hillary is very much a centrist candidate, even if she's starting to move left with the base.
- Her campaign has felt tirelessly focus-group-tested and rehearsed instead of authentic and passionate, which makes it hard for her to relate to the actual feelings of voters.
- She's still a symbol of big money in politics based on her personal wealth and campaign donor makeup, even if the policies she supports aren't as obviously aligned with big money as those supported by Republicans.
- People don't believe that anyone associated with the Obama administration will succeed at getting anything done in the current political environment (even though this is a pretty unfounded belief based on what Obama himself has gotten done).
Because she's fake. Everything she does and says is a calculated move to further her own career. I firmly believe she's only running as a democrat because the dems have a lot better chance of winning the white versus the republicans. I don't believe anything she says or think she would get anything accomplished as a President.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
Healthy, but tastes meh?
CapitalismSucks DonkeyBalls
Banned
More like the mom that attempted to be cool and hip while your friends were over, before accidentally asking you if "these whitey-tighties were yours."
hydragonwarrior
Member
I find Bernie supporters to be louder and far more passionate in their defense of Bernie and likewise dislike of Hillary, so they stand out more.
Hillary supporters tend not to be loud - probably because there's less need to be as loud and passionate? I dunno. But for whatever reason, you see them stand out less.
Still, Hillary should be trying to get a base that defends her as loudly as Bernie supporters. I'd liken that to be something her campaign should work on - but i gather they won't get onto that path until they see start seeing a looming disadvantage against her in the polls.
Hillary supporters tend not to be loud - probably because there's less need to be as loud and passionate? I dunno. But for whatever reason, you see them stand out less.
Still, Hillary should be trying to get a base that defends her as loudly as Bernie supporters. I'd liken that to be something her campaign should work on - but i gather they won't get onto that path until they see start seeing a looming disadvantage against her in the polls.
Brian Griffin
Member
Ok, final step? Former presidents can still do a lot of great stuff.
Team Alucard
Banned
Which I believe is nonsense. She is a known commodity at this point. Her favorability among the base is around the high 80s/low 90s, compare that to Sanders where almost a whole 1/3rd of Democrats are undecided/have no opinion about him. The base is not going to "rally behind her" when she gets the nom because the base is already behind her! The far-left people on GAF and Reddit who hate her are not a meaningful or substantial part of the Democratic coalition.
This is absolute bullshit by the way. She had one of the most liberal voting records when she was in the Senate, and she was to the left of Obama on most issues in 2008.
LyleLanley
Banned
She's more like a meal that you usually eat but this time it's dressed up with some sprinkles or something to make it look different.
Muffdraul
Member
It's easy for me to assume that if she gets elected, things would be as good as they were under Bill. Pretty sure most of the whipper-snappers in here are too young to remember how good things were back then... especially compared to the administrations that came before and after. It was like living in fucking paradise in comparison.
I voted for her in the last primary, but I might as well have been flipping a coin between her and Obama, and in the end I was glad he won.
I voted for her in the last primary, but I might as well have been flipping a coin between her and Obama, and in the end I was glad he won.
They've all but come out and said that they've been prepping for the general this entire time, basically replicating Obama's 50-state strategy and fusing it with the best from her 08 campaign. You can see her try out attacks on the GOP, and more recently Trump, every now and again in the debates.
Liquidsnake
Banned
I weep for America if she wins. Hillary is a complete 180 degrees from Obama in every single way you can think of, and in every single way you cant think of.
Im curious to those who said they would be so happy, as to why?
Im curious to those who said they would be so happy, as to why?
gutter_trash
Banned
the word ''progressive'' is so loose politically that it is ridiculous.
Hillary is a Liberal, even more so than Obama
yeah, she may be more hawkish on foreign affairs but she is more progressive than Obama domestically
RPGCrazied
Member
Obama lite. Lol
But yeah, still though, I want Obama's policies to stay in place. You get any Republican in there, all of that is gone. 8 years worth of stuff, just gone.
I have a problem with that.
Big Baybee
Member
Why do people say this?
diablos991
Can’t stump the diablos
Because she is among the most corrupt of establishment politicians.
A vote for her is a vote for the status quo.
A vote for her is a vote for the status quo.
CapitalismSucks DonkeyBalls
Banned
Would you believe me if I told you that most of my conservative in-laws believe that Bill was the worst thing to happen to this country since WWII? I have to listen to them bitch and moan that Reagan isn't president anymore.
The last time there was a favorability poll was in December, so I'd imagine her numbers may be depressed a bit from there:
That 22% (I'd imagine it's a bit higher with a contested primary) will be completely evaporated if/when she wins the nomination. It'll push her numbers back in Obama '12 category of favorability, nationally.
You realize that she had a more liberal record in the Senate than Obama did right?
She doesn't really say anything to get excited about but that is probably a good thing. Democrats seem so caught up in the presidential election they forget a president really can't do shit on their own. Hillary seems more likely to get things done even if they aren't 100% what we/she wants. That's with all the hate baggage on the other side. I don't see Bernie getting a thing done with a republican majority in both houses. He doesn't have the connections or the know how in my opinion. He might have a career based on values that haven't budged but he hasn't accomplished anything.
Bill was my first vote. I preferred Tsongas (and miss Al Franken's impersonation of him on SNL), but still supported Bill when the time came. He wasn't perfect, but he did some good in that tough era, and his very good court picks are still helping us to this day.
Muffdraul
Member
Hell yes I'd believe it, no surprise there. But I wonder if they're aware that if Reagan was running today he'd get eaten alive as a pussy leftist.
teruterubozu
Member
I haven't seen one Hilary bumper sticker yet in my area. Lots of Bernie and even a few Trumps. I've even seen one Jeb! No Hillary arrow though.
NoblesseOblige
Banned
I don't base my happiness on my political leader. But I can definitely feel more progress is being made under democratic lead than republican. I just see Hillary getting the democratic ticket, but I'm fine with whoever earns it assuming it leads to the republicans being defeated.
DrFaustPhD
Member
If it came down to it, I would absolutely vote for Hilary over any of the GOP candidates.
But my lack of enthusiasm comes from a lack of trust and a belief that Hilary would throw legitimately important issues under the bus for popularity points or "because its the safe move"
I do not like her cozy-ness with Wall Street and bankers.
She's given me the impression that she has more interest in being powerful than helping the American people.
But my lack of enthusiasm comes from a lack of trust and a belief that Hilary would throw legitimately important issues under the bus for popularity points or "because its the safe move"
I do not like her cozy-ness with Wall Street and bankers.
She's given me the impression that she has more interest in being powerful than helping the American people.
Of course, well, except for the drone strikes.
gutter_trash
Banned
like on what issue specifically? 180 on what?
Because she'll mainly continue the policies that Obama put in place/build on those policies.
What issues is Hillary a complete 180 on Obama from?
I've seen a ton of Hillary bumper stickers. Anecdotes are fun!
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