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[PopeReal]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192624287]It's a lose lose situation. You can't be opposed to this and walk away with people's respect no matter how you say it. If you try to say they're being disruptive and damaging, you're either racist or your arguments are dismissed entirely. If you live in east bay and just hate being late for work you're an asshole for not caring more.

There's innumerable causes worthy of attention. Yours isn't so important that you get to decide what other people have to deal with. Find a better way than disrupting people's lives. Even abortion protesters let people into planned parenthoods if you walk through them. And I think people notice them. I've walked through Iraq war protestors stomping on American flags before. I sure as hell noticed them.

And yet the supporters of these protestors are acting like this is the only remaining option to get people's attention, a final desperate plea to a world blind. Just because someone disagrees with you, that doesn't make them ignorant or a troll.

Form a crowd outside a police station or something more symbolic than being an ass to tens of thousands of people that have better things to do.

Remember that guy that blocked a highway to propose to his girlfriend? I bet that cause was super important to him. How come he didnt get any support?[/QUOTE]

That is the point of protests. This is important. People are dying, this isn't the guy proposing to his girlfriend or whatever the fuck you were talking about.

And yes people have better things to do! The status quo doesn't care about police brutality. It doesn't affect them. You have to make them pay attention.

Would I be correct in saying that how people protest is of much more concern to you than the actual cause? I mean it sounds like bothering you is more important than things changing. I don't want to sound harsh but that is how your post comes off.

 

[The Kree]

Fucking really?

Yes, he really equated a marriage proposal to a police brutality protest.

 

[Lo_Fi]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192624287]
Form a crowd outside a police station or something more symbolic than being an ass to tens of thousands of people that have better things to do. [/QUOTE]

And tens of thousands+ of black people have better things to be doing than worrying about being shot by cops for walking down the street.

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192624287]
Remember that guy that blocked a highway to propose to his girlfriend? I bet that cause was super important to him. How come he didnt get any support?[/QUOTE]

Oh wow, missed this edit.

Are you a troll?

 

[mr2xxx]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192624287]It's a lose lose situation. You can't be opposed to this and walk away with people's respect no matter how you say it. If you try to say they're being disruptive and damaging, you're either racist or your arguments are dismissed entirely. If you live in east bay and just hate being late for work you're an asshole for not caring more.

There's innumerable causes worthy of attention. Yours isn't so important that you get to decide what other people have to deal with. Find a better way than disrupting people's lives. Even abortion protesters let people into planned parenthoods if you walk through them. And I think people notice them. I've walked through Iraq war protestors stomping on American flags before. I sure as hell noticed them.

And yet the supporters of these protestors are acting like this is the only remaining option to get people's attention, a final desperate plea to a world blind. Just because someone disagrees with you, that doesn't make them ignorant or a troll.

Form a crowd outside a police station or something more symbolic than being an ass to tens of thousands of people that have better things to do.

Remember that guy that blocked a highway to propose to his girlfriend? I bet that cause was super important to him. How come he didnt get any support?[/QUOTE]


I've sat here for minutes trying to find a way to respond to this foolishness, but if you want to equate the two be my guest.

 

[benjipwns]

I heard that guy was a jerk.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Edit: Edited to reduce snark.

Don't even worry about it, being disingenuous is perfectly acceptable in the service of defending a worthy cause.

Again, I'll make the ethical appeal and ask why it isn't fine for major highways to just be shut down 24/7? Just rotate in different causes like civil war in the Congo, violence against women in Egypt, human trafficking in Eastern Europe and Southeast Asia. How about the drug war in Mexico? Abuse of the homeless? Mistreatment of children in foster homes? Political assassinations in the Philipines? Slave labor in Afghanistan?

Why not? How about forming a ring around grocery stores? Gas stations? I bet people would notice that. People are dying every day, just like you said! Isn't it our moral imperative to show our support?

Maybe I've just lost my mind.

 

[benjipwns]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192624878]Again, I'll make the ethical appeal and ask why it isn't fine for major highways to just be shut down 24/7?[/QUOTE]
Because people would want something done about it.

 

[PopeReal]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192624878]Don't even worry about it, being disingenuous is perfectly acceptable in the service of defending a worthy cause.

Again, I'll make the ethical appeal and ask why it isn't fine for major highways to just be shut down 24/7? Just rotate in different causes like civil war in the Congo, violence against women in Egypt, human trafficking in Eastern Europe and Southeast Asia. How about the drug war in Mexico? Abuse of the homeless? Mistreatment of children in foster homes? Political assassinations in the Philipines? Slave labor in Afghanistan?

Why not? How about forming a ring around grocery stores? Gas stations? I bet people would notice that. People are dying every day, just like you said! Isn't it our moral imperative to show our support?

Maybe I've just lost my mind.[/QUOTE]

Well obviously the proper flow of traffic is such an important issue to you.

 

[The Kree]

I'm prepared to shut down the highways in protest of traffic jams caused by protests. Are you?

 

[Farsi]

I'm absolutely sure that the peaceful protests like the ones that happened in Oakland yesterday and everywhere else in the country are having much more of a positive impact on society than this hooliganism.

All this does is turn people off.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Well obviously the proper flow of traffic is such an important issue to you.

Something just isn't clicking in my head about why these protestors have the right to interrupt so many other people. It just doesn't make any sense to me no matter how I try to wrap my head around it. And I do agree with their cause.

But clearly I'm not getting any closer to understanding where the majority of this thread is coming from so I'll just leave it here for now.

I'm not trying to be a jackass, I'm just getting annoyed at being dismissed rather than discussed with. I feel like I'm missing something.

 

[Lo_Fi]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192624878]Don't even worry about it, being disingenuous is perfectly acceptable in the service of defending a worthy cause.

Again, I'll make the ethical appeal and ask why it isn't fine for major highways to just be shut down 24/7? Just rotate in different causes like civil war in the Congo, violence against women in Egypt, human trafficking in Eastern Europe and Southeast Asia. How about the drug war in Mexico? Abuse of the homeless? Mistreatment of children in foster homes? Political assassinations in the Philipines? Slave labor in Afghanistan?

Why not? How about forming a ring around grocery stores? Gas stations? I bet people would notice that. People are dying every day, just like you said! Isn't it our moral imperative to show our support?

Maybe I've just lost my mind.[/QUOTE]

I'm not saying you have to go out and protest with them. Just don't get mad at them when their protests inconvenience you. That's the point of protests. For people to notice it.

I'd be fine with people protesting for more causes. Maybe something would actually change.

Let's say you have a job that pays you minimum wage. You work at a grocery store. People come in and buy some groceries, and pay what's expected. You work there for a while, 5 years in fact. The same customers are coming in, but you're still getting paid the same amount, 5 years later! Gosh, can't they see that you've been working there for 5 years?!?!? Why haven't they started paying you extra?!!? Oh wait. Your boss is the one who controls that. Blame him. Ask him for a raise.

People in this thread are getting mad at protestors for their protesting. They're just doing what's necessary. Don't get mad at the protestors, get mad at the system and the racism ingrained in our justice system that caused people to take drastic measures like *gasp* making you late for work one day. When you're sitting in traffic it's easy to get mad at the person that's literally blocking your way, but you should be thinking about the system that caused that person to be there in the first place. They don't want to be there just as much as you don't want to be.

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192625283]Something just isn't clicking in my head about why these protestors have the right to interrupt so many other people. It just doesn't make any sense to me no matter how I try to wrap my head around it. And I do agree with their cause.

But clearly I'm not getting any closer to understanding where the majority of this thread is coming from so I'll just leave it here for now.

I'm not trying to be a jackass, I'm just getting annoyed at being dismissed rather than discussed with. I feel like I'm missing something.[/QUOTE]

You're missing the part where black people are getting shot by cops for walking down the street. It doesn't matter if the protestors have "a right" to interrupt so many other people. Sometimes you have to be a tad annoying to get huge assholes to stop being huge assholes.

 

[benjipwns]

I'm prepared to shut down the highways in protest of traffic jams caused by protests. Are you?

No, I don't actually care about that issue enough.

 

[mr2xxx]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192625283]Something just isn't clicking in my head about why these protestors have the right to interrupt so many other people. It just doesn't make any sense to me no matter how I try to wrap my head around it. And I do agree with their cause.

But clearly I'm not getting any closer to understanding where the majority of this thread is coming from so I'll just leave it here for now.

I'm not trying to be a jackass, I'm just getting annoyed at being dismissed rather than discussed with. I feel like I'm missing something.[/QUOTE]

As has been posted thousands of times, you are the white moderate MLK is talking about.

I must make two honest confessions to you, my Christian and Jewish brothers. First, I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says: "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I cannot agree with your methods of direct action"; who paternalistically believes he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by a mythical concept of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait for a "more convenient season." Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Lukewarm acceptance is much more bewildering than outright rejection.

I had hoped that the white moderate would understand that law and order exist for the purpose of establishing justice and that when they fail in this purpose they become the dangerously structured dams that block the flow of social progress. I had hoped that the white moderate would understand that the present tension in the South is a necessary phase of the transition from an obnoxious negative peace, in which the Negro passively accepted his unjust plight, to a substantive and positive peace, in which all men will respect the dignity and worth of human personality. Actually, we who engage in nonviolent direct action are not the creators of tension. We merely bring to the surface the hidden tension that is already alive. We bring it out in the open, where it can be seen and dealt with. Like a boil that can never be cured so long as it is covered up but must be opened with all its ugliness to the natural medicines of air and light, injustice must be exposed, with all the tension its exposure creates, to the light of human conscience and the air of national opinion before it can be cured.

 

[PopeReal]

[QUOTE="God's Beard!";192625283]Something just isn't clicking in my head about why these protestors have the right to interrupt so many other people. It just doesn't make any sense to me no matter how I try to wrap my head around it. And I do agree with their cause.

But clearly I'm not getting any closer to understanding where the majority of this thread is coming from so I'll just leave it here for now.

I'm not trying to be a jackass, I'm just getting annoyed at being dismissed rather than discussed with. I feel like I'm missing something.[/QUOTE]

Read some of my previous posts in response to others. I am not dismissing you. I am just confused as to why blocked traffic is such a huge deal.

 

["God's Beard!"]

Mookie shouldn't have thrown the trash can through the pizza shop's window.

 

[Massive Duck. C.M.]

If you care about your cause. I suspect that yes you should care about how you're perceived by the general population. This is one of the biggest flaws with liberal protest movrments, everything begins and ends with "Raising Awareness" with little or no concern over public opinion nor results. They've been doing these sorts of protests for going on a year now and have no policy changes to show for it. If things are as urgent as you claim, I'd say the protesters might want to consider something else.

What immediate and effective yet completely non-disruptive protest methods would you suggest

 

[airmangataosenai]

Well obviously the proper flow of traffic is such an important issue to you.

Spare me your moral grandstanding, he's right and anyone who actually cares about positive social change knows it. Disruptive protests done in the name of supposed moral superiority which produce no results other than making those involved feel important aren't worth much.

 

[BudokaiMR2]

This is amazing. You've created a scenario that is pure bait. Like there's nothing about this scenario that doesn't scream, "got you!!!!"

It's no fun if you guys don't let the bait float around for someone to pick it up. =(

That first post in here was just some snarky bs because the conversation seemed to be going nowhere, but the FB post from that asshat of a sergeant convinced me to actually post something serious.

I have no problem with protests inconveniencing people or various services. As people have said this is one of the very few ways to get shit done in what is a completely fucked and broken system. And as a father I can kind of understand some of the hypothetical wariness or whatever you want to call it here, but that sort of thing is negligible at best and there is no ill intent on the protesters part to fuck up everyone's lives.

However, I do think the idea of just copying the methods of MLK are a little short-sighted.
Not sure if it has been talked about, but I have a feeling that similar protests by MLK probably had a goal of disrupting not just civilian lives but government services. It was a different time with more analog ways of getting things done as far as infrastructure is concerned. I may be completely wrong here obviously. Feel free to correct me if so.

In this case I just don't feel like they are really disrupting anything important enough to generate any sort of meaningful change, and are just creating more dissent among the populace which can only work against them in the long-term.

In an ideal situation, I would personally see a more 'hacktivist' style approach to be more impactful. Something similar to what Anon did during Ferguson, when they were leaking identities of KKK members. Although if I remember right they did get a bunch of stuff wrong in that campaign in the end.

 

[airmangataosenai]

What immediate and effective yet completely non-disruptive protest methods would you suggest

I imagine pursuing sponsoring legislation in state legislatures and collecting signatures for ballot initiatives would be a good start Blm published a list of goals several months back and it seems like ahold place to start. I'd like to imagine they'd beagle together some of theirchanges through that way along with a started campaign.

 

[PopeReal]

Spare me your moral grandstanding, he's right and anyone who actually cares about positive social change knows it. Disruptive protests done in the name of supposed moral superiority which produce no results other than making those involved feel important aren't worth much.

I notice you ignored my previous response to you. Feel free to address it before I will bother answering this one.

 

[mAcOdIn]

It's no fun if you guys don't let the bait float around for someone to pick it up. =(

That first post in here was just some snarky bs because the conversation seemed to be going nowhere, but the FB post from that asshat of a sergeant convinced me to actually post something serious.

I have no problem with protests inconveniencing people or various services. As people have said this is one of the very few ways to get shit done in what is a completely fucked and broken system. And as a father I can kind of understand some of the hypothetical wariness or whatever you want to call it here, but that sort of thing is negligible at best and there is no ill intent on the protesters part to fuck up everyone's lives.

However, I do think the idea of just copying the methods of MLK are a little short-sighted.
Not sure if it has been talked about, but I have a feeling that similar protests by MLK probably had a goal of disrupting not just civilian lives but government services. It was a different time with more analog ways of getting things done as far as infrastructure is concerned. I may be completely wrong here obviously. Feel free to correct me if so.

In this case I just don't feel like they are really disrupting anything important enough to generate any sort of meaningful change, and are just creating more dissent among the populace which can only work against them in the long-term.

In an ideal situation, I would personally see a more 'hacktivist' style approach to be more impactful. Something similar to what Anon did during Ferguson, when they were leaking identities of KKK members. Although if I remember right they did get a bunch of stuff wrong in that campaign in the end.

I think the lack of a "scarier" sister movement hinders these actions. In the past people felt threatened, what's the alternative now if you don't listen? Nothing. No boogeyman to point to and say it's either our way or theirs.

 

[Lo_Fi]

National holidays celebrating that time you got to work on time: 0
National holidays celebrating MLK, a man who protested against oppression, and in the process inconvenienced people and their work schedules: 1

Society and history have spoken, and they don't care if you get to work on time.

 

[FunkyMunkey]

so do the people who support this think it does the movement more good than harm? i would wager the slight opposite, as i don't subscribe to the "all attention is good attention" belief. also as someone who supports the cause and rationale behind blm, i can also understand how many would treat this sort of protest as being more bad than good, as people are already pissed as fuck driving in traffic and exacerbating that anger with more delays isn't going to win positive support. it's a bit different than sit-ins or other peaceful protests at often relevant places or targeting certain businesses or people or (govt) buildings.

also, i can see the parallels people are drawing to the civil rights movement but i also think this movement is slightly different as the issues it's addressing aren't quite as surface and obvious as back then. with segregation and such it was plain as day and no question if it was occuring (yes i know some still denied it), while there are people who (stupidly) deny current black targeted violence and treatment by police. im not saying it's right by any means, just that it is sadly more of a murky topic for the general public to digest.

im obviously not sure what the right means to protest is or the most effective in a supportive light, but going to an area of daily life where the general public are already frustrated and angry and making them more so, i don't know

 

[airmangataosenai]

I notice you ignored my previous response to you. Feel free to address it before I will bother answering this one.

Check the post I made right below my last message, it suffices as a response to your post just as well as I outline exactly what I mean by policy change. Now feel free to respond.

 

[PopeReal]

Check the post I made right below my last message, it suffices as a response to your post just as well as I outline exactly what I mean by policy change. Now feel free to respond.

Question 1: Does that legislature directly relate to the ability of law enforcement to kill unarmed black Americans with impunity?

Question 2: Does blocking traffic affect you so negatively that you are willing to distance yourself from BLM?

 

[Chariot]

People should absolutely tell the black protesters to get out of the way - right after they told that to the people who are sitting in the way of black lives for centuries, constantly interupting, inconvincing and stopping their lives. Sometimes forever.

I am okay with this as they seem to keep the emergency lanes free. Of course it's annoying, that's the point. It's hardly a taste of what a lot of people of colour in america have to endure on a daily basis on the street upwards the hill of society.

 

[XAL]

You're missing the part where black people are getting shot by cops for walking down the street. It doesn't matter if the protestors have "a right" to interrupt so many other people. Sometimes you have to be a tad annoying to get huge assholes to stop being huge assholes.

Shouldn't they be protesting outside of police departments and government buildings or events? You know, places where people that can actually do something reside and or where people can engage with you person to person? Instead of shutting down roadways, freeways, and public transportation that people, black or otherwise, rely on greatly to ensure that they can hold down a job or keep their family together or for ems workers to get people to hospital?

I get that they want to be heard, but most average people in the bay area support blm to a high degree. So this is a case of, let's disrupt and potentially endanger the lives of people that most likely already have our back and?....like what the fuck is the logic, shitting on people that support you?

Is a disruptive protest headline that's forgotten in less than a day really worth all the potential harm the "protest" can do to people that can't directly change anything?

I draw the line of protest at endangering the average person's health and livelyhood.

 

[airmangataosenai]

Question 1: Does that legislature directly relate to the ability of law enforcement to kill unarmed black Americans with impunity?

Question 2: Does blocking traffic affect you so negatively that you are willing to distance yourself from BLM?

1.) You mean initiatives like community policing/accountability, police training standards, and independent investigations into police shootings? I would imagine it should have done impact given that these are supposed to be enshrined as the path forward by the movement.
2.) It's the same as Occupy Wall Street. I sympathize withagree with most of their goals but I see they are likely to fail due to poor planning and tactics. I'm commenting on that, nothing more. I don't know how old you are, but after a certain age most people realize a sense of moral righteousness isn't enough to create the change you desire.

 

[Siegcram]

I could totally see some of GAF be on the "yeah, why don't they eat cake" side of the argument if it had been around in 1789.

Then again, there's been plenty of threads going this exact same way, so I'm not surprised. Equating BLM and their cause to a douchebag wedding proposal was a new and unexpected low though, I'll admit.

 

[mAcOdIn]

so do the people who support this think it does the movement more good than harm? i would wager the slight opposite, as i don't subscribe to the "all attention is good attention" belief. also as someone who supports the cause and rationale behind blm, i can also understand how many would treat this sort of protest as being more bad than good, as people are already pissed as fuck driving in traffic and exacerbating that anger with more delays isn't going to win positive support. it's a bit different than sit-ins or other peaceful protests at often relevant places or targeting certain businesses or people or (govt) buildings.

also, i can see the parallels people are drawing to the civil rights movement but i also think this movement is slightly different as the issues it's addressing aren't quite as surface and obvious as back then. with segregation and such it was plain as day and no question if it was occuring (yes i know some still denied it), while there are people who (stupidly) deny current black targeted violence and treatment by police. im not saying it's right by any means, just that it is sadly more of a murky topic for the general public to digest.

im obviously not sure what the right means to protest is or the most effective in a supportive light, but going to an area of daily life where the general public are already frustrated and angry and making them more so, i don't know

I'm a white guy and I'm down for them protesting like this.

I do think some people get turned off by this but I also think they're unimportant. Either they are against the protester's goals already or are of such flimsy morals that having them as an ally is meaningless. Also, I think inconveniencing everyone is the only way to get shit done, I don't think it's really about convincing people so I don't think it's that the public seeing the protests that does the trick, more along the lines of hoping the public gets tired of them and demands the powers that be to solve the problem so their inconvenienced lives can return to normal.

 

[PopeReal]

1.) You mean initiatives like community policing/accountability, police training standards, and independent investigations into police shootings? I would imagine it should have done impact given that these are supposed to be enshrined as the path forward by the movement.
2.) It's the same as Occupy Wall Street. I sympathize withagree with most of their goals but I see they are likely to fail due to poor planning and tactics. I'm commenting on that, nothing more. I don't know how old you are, but after a certain age most people realize a sense of moral righteousness isn't enough to create the change you desire.

Thank you for your answers, I will look into the initiatives.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

It really seems like a traffic jam on one bridge for one day is a bigger problem to some people than centuries of oppression, abuse and murder. Too busy arguing over methods of achieving awareness to even bother discussing the larger issue for the most part it seems. Not one person likely died over this or lost a job or had any real significantly negative impact on anyones life. The only takeaway for many people here will be "look at these idiots". Its not surprising givin the current state of affairs in the country.

 

[Sushi Nao]

I imagine pursuing sponsoring legislation in state legislatures and collecting signatures for ballot initiatives would be a good start Blm published a list of goals several months back and it seems like ahold place to start. I'd like to imagine they'd beagle together some of theirchanges through that way along with a started campaign.

Y'know, take it real slow and quiet

Despite money, opportunity and the vote being taken away from black communities every day

To the point that the political process seems designed to exclude them

Uh oh, another loved one murdered. Oh well

And another
And another
And another
And another
And another

Slow enough for ya? Wouldn't want to offend

And another
And another

 

[excelsiorlef]

I'm absolutely sure that the peaceful protests like the ones that happened in Oakland yesterday and everywhere else in the country are having much more of a positive impact on society than this hooliganism.

All this does is turn people off.

Yeah that's not a dog whistle at all. There was no violence on the bridge but yes by all means continue on, next stop is calling them thugs for stopping traffic right?

 

[KarneeKarnay]

I support what they are trying to achieve. Not the location.

If you wanted to do this. Why don't you do this on the front steps of a government building, or outside a police station or in a public space. Not on the a public highway.

You can argue about this only delaying peoples commutes, but you can argue that ambulances, fire trucks, police can't get to places they need to be. Peoples lives could be at stake and this protest blocking the street is solely responsible for any deaths caused by delays. Not the corrupt or racist police. The protesters who blocked the road.

I'm not going to pretend that I understand what black people go through. I don't. But I can tell you I can sure as hell relate to a paramedic who can't get to the hospital because they blocked the road.

 

[Chariot]

I support what they are trying to achieve. Not the location.

If you wanted to do this. Why don't you do this on the front steps of a government building, or outside a police station or in a public space. Not on the a public highway.

You can argue about this only delaying peoples commutes, but you can argue that ambulances, fire trucks, police can't get to places they need to be. Peoples lives could be at stake and this protest blocking the street is solely responsible for any deaths caused by delays. Not the corrupt or racist police. The protesters who blocked the road.

I'm not going to pretend that I understand what black people go through. I don't. But I can tell you I can sure as hell relate to a paramedic who can't get to the hospital because they blocked the road.

I believe besada wrote that the emergency lane was kept free. So ambulances and firefighters would've been abke to get through.

 

[excelsiorlef]

also, i can see the parallels people are drawing to the civil rights movement but i also think this movement is slightly different as the issues it's addressing aren't quite as surface and obvious as back then. with segregation and such it was plain as day and no question if it was occuring (yes i know some still denied it), while there are people who (stupidly) deny current black targeted violence and treatment by police. im not saying it's right by any means, just that it is sadly more of a murky topic for the general public to digest.

Both are similar pro-segregation people thought it was right and just pro-police people think they are right and just.

Both blame black folk.

 

[Sushi Nao]

I support what they are trying to achieve. Not the location.

If you wanted to do this. Why don't you do this on the front steps of a government building, or outside a police station or in a public space. Not on the a public highway.

You can argue about this only delaying peoples commutes, but you can argue that ambulances, fire trucks, police can't get to places they need to be. Peoples lives could be at stake and this protest blocking the street is solely responsible for any deaths caused by delays. Not the corrupt or racist police. The protesters who blocked the road.

I'm not going to pretend that I understand what black people go through. I don't. But I can tell you I can sure as hell relate to a paramedic who can't get to the hospital because they blocked the road.

Both sides of the bridge have their own emergency services and don't need to cross. They also didn't block the emergency lane.

How do you feel about it now?

 

[benjipwns]

Why don't you do this on the front steps of a government building, or outside a police station or in a public space. Not on the a public highway.

Would you have noticed?

 

[Al-ibn Kermit]

The problem with non-disruptive protests is it doesn't force people to take a side where they either increase persecution of the minority group in order to get them to fall in line or they submit to their demands for more equal treatment and opportunities. Yes those are the only two options.

The good thing about this type of protest is that it shows that only a few protesters have to be willing to get arrested in order to cause a noticeable disruption for most of the commuters in the Bay Area. The whole point of their protest was to raise public interest in the issue as obviously most people would rather sweep unjustified police shootings under the rug. Just look at how it's nearly impossible to convict a police officer of anything even when there's overwhelming evidence that they did the wrong thing.

 

[KarneeKarnay]

Both sides of the bridge have their own emergency services and don't need to cross. They also didn't block the emergency lane.

How do you feel about it now?

Better about it. I still believe it could have achieved a better result elsewhere.

Would you have noticed?

It depends on where and probably. A bunch of protesters chain themselves of the senators house or the county court house.

The fact that people in this thread have put down they would have been more disgruntled than supportive, should indicate that this has not had the desired effect of winning over supporters.

 

[Siegcram]

The fact that people in this thread have put down they would have been more disgruntled than supportive, should indicate that this has not had the desired effect of winning over supporters.

All it indicates is misplaced priorities. Hardly the protesters' fault.

 

[Sushi Nao]

The fact that people in this thread have put down they would have been more disgruntled than supportive, should indicate that this has not had the desired effect of winning over supporters.

So in the end, it's about how white people feel about it that's the true indicator of its worth?

It's difficult to recognize oneself as a perpetuator of systemic racial injustice, but sometimes you gotta take a step back and look at why the narrative is what it is.

This means, in this case, that how black people feel is more important, and we need to listen to their exeriences.

I would hope one wouldn't go into a feminism thread, full of women genuinely expressing their experiences of gender inequality, and say "hey ladies, I respect what you're doing, but can't you do it quietly in the kitchen?"

 

[KarneeKarnay]

All it indicates is misplaced priorities. Hardly the protesters' fault.

That's the audience the protesters are aiming at though.Misplaced priorities or not. That's the reality of the situation. You need a huge amount of public support to bring about change and this is gaining very little, while annoying the rest.

So in the end, it's about how white people feel about it that's the true indicator of its worth?

1. How do you know any of the people so far that have complained about this protest in this thread were white? You jumped to the assumption they were wight because they complained. What exactly are you implying? All people who disagree are white? Are all white people racist?

2. It is about how people feel. You can say one thing and do another, but the point about the message spread though protests is that you change how a person feels about a subject. A successful protest should make people thing about the issue reevaluate their stance on it, hopefully in support.

 

[Siegcram]

That's the audience the protesters are aiming at though.Misplaced priorities or not. That's the reality of the situation. You need a huge amount of public support to bring about change and this is gaining very little, while annoying the rest.

People valuing their commute time over a righteous cause aren't the audience. This isn't intended to sway them.

Your argument has been trotted out countless times already in this and other similar threads and has been adressed to death. So I suggest you actually read those and come back when you have some insight to offer that goes beyond concern trolling on behalf of EMTs and people in cars.

 

[Sushi Nao]

That's the audience the protesters are aiming at though.Misplaced priorities or not. That's the reality of the situation. You need a huge amount of public support to bring about change and this is gaining very little, while annoying the rest.



1. How do you know any of the people so far that have complained about this protest in this thread were white? You jumped to the assumption they were wight because they complained. What exactly are you implying? All people who disagree are white? Are all white people racist?

2. It is about how people feel. You can say one thing and do another, but the point about the message spread though protests is that you change how a person feels about a subject. A successful protest should make people thing about the issue reevaluate their stance on it, hopefully in support.

Because "I support what they're doing but" is as white as the driven snow. Some assumptions in life are pretty safe. If someone says they support a societally disruptive cause, but not the disruption required, I do not think they actually know what it is they're supporting.

As well, one of the most significant indicators of systemic racism is that the perpetrators have no idea that they're being racist. They just love that calm cool status quo.

 

[uncelestial]

I am very proud to live in the Bay Area and see this great turnout.

I am ashamed to belong to a forum where people are saying everything from "bad tactic/think of the traffic," to "good luck with that, BLM; the media doesn't give a shit," to "MLK would hate this" (even though this is exactly what he did). The traffic is going to be fine. You've had it pretty fucking convenient for your entire life while other people had to use the word "community" aspirationally.

If you are not black, you do not understand what it's like to live in a community where your interactions with the police are frequently so tense and dangerous. You're used to a life where the police protect you and both you and the cops give each other the benefit of the doubt. This is a serious situation. If you think hashtags and social media thinkpieces are going to get regulations enacted that change this, it's time to grow up. I have long been annoyed at 99% of the "activism" I've seen from my so-called liberal friends consisting of irritating polemics and virtue signalling on Facebook.

This, and more, is what is needed. Please think about being on the right side of history. Listen, and don't talk except to ask how to help. This isn't about you.

 

[Auctopus]

So, I imagine all the Gaffers saying this is an incredible and brave (and not stupid) way to protest would stand on the roof of their cars in this traffic and applaud the protestors, forgetting the possible emergency they could have been travelling towards beforehand.

Listen, and don't talk except to ask how to help. This isn't about you.

I'm beginning to wonder why these threads are even posted in Off-Topic and not just exclusive to the Black Culture Thread. If you're a white person in these threads, your opinion doesn't matter and you're immediately isolated or belittled (inb4: this is what black people suffer) for having an opinion so what's the point? Just put a sign on the thread saying "Don't bother coming in, you're already wrong."

 

[ElTorro]

If you think hashtags and social media thinkpieces are going to get regulations enacted that change this, it's time to grow up. I have long been annoyed at 99% of the "activism" I've seen from my so-called liberal friends consisting of annoying polemics and virtue signalling on Facebook.

Yeah. Many people are satisfied enough with social media activism. While that also helps, it's unrealistic and self-deluding to think that that's enough to solve problems in the real world. This is true for most issues of social injustice.