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[Crash Station]

Have you listened to those who have played the game? The Japanese audience sniffed this out for what it was already. And everything I have seen (which is quite a bit) only further confirms their thoughts. You even started to partially admit to that here before trying to deny it. I have even repeated it numerous times now. And you're still defending her literally being drugged into loving someone she consistently expresses no attraction for. It's the same/as close to gay conversion as the game could possibly get.

Thanks for using us whenever you deem fit, I suppose?

How is expressing my interpretation "using" you? I haven't played the game, but I've watched a lot of the translated stuff involving Soleil and came to my own conclusions divorced from any kind of controversy.

Please don't try to twist this so I'm the homophobic one. I made a thread about how happy I was at how progressive Tales of Zestiria was for having a gay protagonist. I was a massive supporter of Tyeforce's #miiquality campaign. I went off on my future brother-in-law when he said homosexuality is a choice. I'd rather not be lumped in with that last one.

 

[Onimusha78]

The art style in Shadow Dragons was complete lifeless garbage thought. There's no way this:

is better than this

You can clearly tell which one is going to attract the larger amount of people.

Awakening was my first FE game and I probably would never have touched it if it had looked like Shadow Dragon tbh

 

[L95]

The way he looks like the SD portrait kinda looks like his forehead is actually rather large and the hair is covering up the bulge of it, like he's Unfrozen Caveman Swordsman.

His neck is also really long.

 

[yanipheonu]

Well, I'm against censorship for the most part, I gotta say, there's that part of me that just love that this feature is not in the game. It really did degrade the whole game, and im kind of glad it's gone.

Still, it'd be cool to, I dunno, release a rated-M DLC for their game for people who wanted the option? That's actually not a bad compromise.

 

[Crash Station]

Well, I'm against censorship for the most part, I gotta say, there's that part of me that just love that this feature is not in the game. It really did degrade the whole game, and im kind of glad it's gone.

Still, it'd be cool to, I dunno, release a rated-M DLC for their game for people who wanted the option? That's actually not a bad compromise.

I doubt this removal has anything to do with the ESRB.

 

[Eidan]

Lol omg. That "creepy garbage" saved the franchise from complete irrelevance.

Petting saved Fire Emblem? Or whatever creepiness could be found in Awakening?

 

[RMI]

Any facts to back up people bought Awakening for the creepy shit?

...

I rather see something die than to be tarnished.

Must just be a coincidence it sold so well and received so much critical acclaim.

Great attitude, btw.

 

[Mik317]

can we stop using word like creepy garbage when trying to have an actual fucking discussion for once?

Its sets things off on the wrong foot and shows you aren't interested in actual discussing anything but rather trashing those who do like it. Like are we children around here? It sets me off to see this type of crap keep happening in these threads. I tend to stick around because despite my dissagreing I like to get the POV of those who oppose it. My POV isn't the only one nor it is the correct one so it is good to get this wide lens of sort. I wish to one day create a story and I wouldn't want to be ignorant of others views and alienate people to the point where they think I am an asshole. But too often we don't get anywhere because of the loaded bullshit.

Newsflash, if you are trying to discuss something ,it helps if you don't enter said discussion by shitting all over the other people before even starting. Calling something you dont like garbage sets you off on a the wrong foot and no actual discussion is made because now the other side thinks you are a jerkwad and then we get to this shitfest with the back and forth.

I think there are fascinating discussions to be had on these topics (which is why I gravitate towards them lol) but I swear too much time is wasted on petty shit and lot of it could be avoided if people approached it like adults and actually respected the other side (even if you disagree with them. many a times I have had posts written up only to delete them because they would have added nothing....or got me banned).

Lets do better

 

[nintendoman58]

Any facts to back up people bought Awakening for the creepy shit? Most people didn't even know the tone of the game until they played it. Plus, if the franchise died with New Mystery of the Emblem, then so be it. I rather see something die than to be tarnished. Plus, when do franchises ever stay dead? It might take 20 years, but games come back.

I bought Awakening because it was a fun SRPG with interesting mechanics regarding marrying characters causing the children to have different abilities depending on who married who, which allowed for different strategies.

Nothing about Awakening "tarnished" the franchise like so many people in this thread desperately try to believe.

 

[Palculator]

As I stated above, everything is greenlit by producers for a reason. Minigames like this can help or hurt the bottom line depending on the market. And which corporate middlemen are responsible? For all we know, NoA and treehouse could have talked with some from the original team and mutually determined to adjust/cut certain content from there. There is conjecture on both sides here.

So where's the statement from a Nintendo rep saying they added it to make it more suitable for the "Japanese audience"?

Petting saved Fire Emblem? Or whatever creepiness could be found in Awakening?

Read their exchange.

 

[Nanashrew]

The art style in Shadow Dragons was complete lifeless garbage thought. There's no way this:

is better than this

You can clearly tell which one is going to attract the larger amount of people.

One day I hope to see a slightly more muscular Marth.

I dunno who the artist of this card is unfortunately but I really dig it.

 

[Triple Dash]

Seriously? I hate the Kozaki art too, but anything is better than Shadow Dragon.

Personally I'd take the Shadow Dragon artwork myself, heck I've hung the SD Pre-Order Art Cell on my wall like a poster.

The mild color palette, increased fanservice, and lack of moving mouths while characters are speaking killed a lot of the charm that previous games had IMO (though I do like the black/white manga-style pics from Kozaki).

 

[Crash Station]

Any facts to back up people bought Awakening for the creepy shit? Most people didn't even know the tone of the game until they played it. Plus, if the franchise died with New Mystery of the Emblem, then so be it. I rather see something die than to be tarnished. Plus, when do franchises ever stay dead? It might take 20 years, but games come back.

The relationship factors absolutely played a part in reviving the series. You think it's just a coincidence there's such a huge amount of fanbase crossover with FE and Persona?

 

[RM8]

You think it's just coincidence there's such a huge amount of fanbase crossover with FE and Persona?

Wat, really? I mean, I'm not saying shipping didn't increase FE's popularity - I've seen in firsthand with people who weren't into the series before. I just don't think I know (IRL) one single FE fan who is also a Persona fan :0

 

[Risette]

Petting saved Fire Emblem? Or whatever creepiness could be found in Awakening?

maybe character designs that were not total hideosity like all of the past FE games saved FE? Awakening didn't have petting btw.

Awakening was meant to be the last FE game. It was on the chopping block. So whatever Awakening added to the series clearly worked.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

When they came for Tharja's ass, we all knew this would happen. It's a slippery slope. Taking away things from the game I mean. Not Tharja's ass. Tharja's ass is not slippery. I mean

thank god i live in PAL land

 

[Mik317]

I don't like it therefore it should die is such a shitty way to be.

Mario could become an FPS. I'd be butthurt as hell and wish for the good ole days but if people liked it enough then so be it. I'mma have to hold that L forever.

 

[RM8]

I don't like it therefore it should die is such a shitty way to be.

Mario could become an FPS. I'd be butthurt as hell and wish for the good ole days but if people liked it enough then so be it. I'mma have to hold that L forever.

And, even if the new Mario FPS fans would hate it, you'd love it if Mario went back to not being a FPS

maybe character designs that were not total hideosity like all of the past FE games saved FE? Awakening didn't have petting btw.

Awakening was meant to be the last FE game. It was on the chopping block. So whatever Awakening added to the series clearly worked.

Misleading - it was going to be the last FE game if it sold less than 250k, which even the DS games achieved IIRC.

 

[EmiPrime]

I buy everything Nintendo first party day one but I was put off by the rubbing crap and Soleil's drugging.

Now I will put in my pre-order. Good job Treehouse.

 

[Vena]

Polygon's (identical) article but worded slightly differently: http://www.polygon.com/2016/1/26/10837900/fire-emblem-fates-petting-minigame-localization-changes

Anyway, there's enough to suggest that the minigame is indeed cut, but I suspect (as has been evidenced enough for me to believe) that they have either replaced it with something else or just removed the minigame and "My Room" now leapfrogs straight into brief character interactions.

 

[Joyful]

I buy everything Nintendo first party day one but I was put off by the rubbing crap and Soleil's drugging.

Now I will put in my pre-order. Good job Treehouse.

conversely, I wont be buying.

 

[Nanashrew]

Oh yeah, relationships played a rather large factor, on top of that they made the game more accessible and went for an art style that would appeal to more people. They put everything they had into the game because it could have been the final in the series. The marriage system, and despite how many like to talk waifus, it's not really about waifus or even as bad as people often talk about and it's a perfectly acceptable system of support. It's an extended version of support I'd say, and without going over some lines that would turn a lot of people off.

EDIT: Talking about the Awakening discussion going on.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

maybe character designs that were not total hideosity like all of the past FE games saved FE? Awakening didn't have petting btw.

Wow. Talk about a nonsense opinion, here it is. The past games had great character designs.

 

[DICKS AHOY]

I don't like it therefore it should die is such a shitty way to be.

Mario could become an FPS. I'd be butthurt as hell and wish for the good ole days but if people liked it enough then so be it. I'mma have to hold that L forever.

I agree with your overall point but incidentally weren't the origins of Splatoon that the team had the 3rd person shooting/ink mechanics laid out, were brainstorming a new IP to fashion around it and at one point Miyamoto said they should just slap the Mario IP onto it, to which the team refused?

conversely, I wont be buying.

conversely to both of you i'll just shoplift it now

 

[Crash Station]

maybe character designs that were not total hideosity like all of the past FE games saved FE? Awakening didn't have petting btw.

Awakening was meant to be the last FE game. It was on the chopping block. So whatever Awakening added to the series clearly worked.

Hey now, only the ones before 6 were ugly.

 

[Kinsei]

maybe character designs that were not total hideosity like all of the past FE games saved FE? Awakening didn't have petting btw.

Awakening was meant to be the last FE game. It was on the chopping block. So whatever Awakening added to the series clearly worked.

You're seriously calling these hideous?

 

[Mik317]

I agree with your overall point but incidentally weren't the origins of Splatoon that the team had the 3rd person shooting/ink mechanics laid out, were brainstorming a new IP to fashion around it and at one point Miyamoto said they should just slap the Mario IP onto it, to which the team refused?

Yeah..the crazy part is that Nintendo probably would pull off a Mario FPS and my salty ass would play it.

so maybe not the best example lol.

 

[Kiro]

First no drugs to trick lesbians into marrying men, now no petting my waifus? I think I'm gonna cancel my Special Edition, this isn't the game I signed up for.

 

[Nanashrew]

Yeah..the crazy part is that Nintendo probably would pull off a Mario FPS and my salty ass would play it.

so maybe not the best example lol.

There is Yoshi's Safari though! I found it pretty fun, but you need the scope.

 

[Bumbletron]

So where's the statement from a Nintendo rep saying they added it to make it more suitable for the "Japanese audience"?

If you think a statement is the crux of my point, you are mistaken. The post you quoted for "truth", says that corporations are run by people who are after money, not artistic vision. Everything in a game is greenlit by producers and changes are made by them behind the scenes all the time. This minigame doesn't read as something someone thought was crucial to the artistic integrity of the game. Instead it seems like a marketing tool, added in to win over some of a niche group sitting on the fence. Ironically, with the controversy surrounding it, it is now a marketing tool in the US as well.

 

[Road of Ease]

How is expressing my interpretation "using" you? I haven't played the game, but I've watched a lot of the translated stuff involving Soleil and came to my own conclusions divorced from any kind of controversy.

Because you are trying to speak on behalf of LGBT people when you say Soleil and an anime petting minigame are "two losses for the LGBT audience".

You ignore LGBT grievances when it makes the game you like seem ignorant (if not homophobic) but then you use the one gay person who thinks petting straight man in an optional minigame is a good replacement for not being able to marry them in the actual game to present yourself as a defender of LGBT content.

You may not be homophobic. I truly don't think you are. But when it comes to gay issues, if you're not gay, you should listen more and speak less.

 

[GamerJM]

I actually like both the pre-Awakening and post-Awakening character designs (except for like, Nowi and whatever). But I never minded the lack of proper feet. The Radiant games probably have my favorite overall art styles.

 

[RM8]

I don't mind the new art direction that much, I just hate specific character designs. I just hope the series isn't stuck with this style forever.

You're seriously calling these hideous?

Ew, those warriors are wearing too much protection!

 

[Jintor]

Still, it'd be cool to, I dunno, release a rated-M DLC for their game for people who wanted the option? That's actually not a bad compromise.

Oh man.

I don't know if locking it behind dlc would generate a better or worse reaction.

maybe if it was free dlc or something... but jesus.

 

[Ekai]

How is expressing my interpretation "using" you? I haven't played the game, but I've watched a lot of the translated stuff involving Soleil and came to my own conclusions divorced from any kind of controversy.

Please don't try to twist this so I'm the homophobic one. I made a thread about how happy I was at how progressive Tales of Zestiria was for having a gay protagonist. I was a massive supporter of Tyeforce's #miiquality campaign. I went off on my future brother-in-law when he said homosexuality is a choice. I'd rather not be lumped in with that last one.

You are in one breathe defending something that is very obviously gay conversion (I really fail to see how you could interpret it as anything but that-the game is so in your face about her orientation-the way she is handled is an absolute mess and I have no clue how they will localize it) and in another breathe arguing that removal of this feature is insulting to LGBT. That's using us as you'd like. One shoves us to the side, the other is all: "but you guys have to be offended for us here because reasons". I don't like being used like that.

I also formed my view without any "controversy". I took what was there and determined that, yes, the controversy was 110% true. It's pretty damn blatant in the game.

I'm not saying you're homophobic. I don't think you are. I'm saying I don't appreciate being used. If you're a supporter of LGBT causes, wonderful. I'm not judging you on that front and am happy that you are an ally. I am however in stark disagreeance with you on everything regarding Soleli. That combined with the "that's not gay conversion but this is what should truly be offensive to LGBT" atmosphere that's being generated right now (not necessarily specifically generated by you, just this is the general atmosphere I'm feeling) just does not sit well with me.

 

[Palculator]

If you think a statement is the crux of my point, you are mistaken.

Well, I guess I was, since I was asking for a fact to back up those features were in the game because middlemen wanted them to be.

 

[Draxal]

One day I hope to see a slightly more muscular Marth.

I dunno who the artist of this card is unfortunately but I really dig it.

Kozaki.

You're seriously calling these hideous?

Kita's younger characters are really bad with the gigantic anime eyes (hi Marcia/Micaiah). Her newer art is so much better.

As for FE6/7's artist Eiji Kaneda, he was responsible for Sword Arm Ike.

 

[Draxal]

edit. DP.

 

[SenorArdilla]

Wow. Talk about a nonsense opinion, here it is. The past games had great character designs.

Fire Emblem characters are really anime and their designs relate to what was popular at the time.

 

[boiled goose]

Shouldn't have existed in Japan either.

 

[Bumbletron]

Well, I guess I was, since I was asking for a fact to back up those features were in the game because middlemen wanted them to be.

Are you not going to address any of the rest of my argument? Because at this point it seems like you want to be right more than have a discussion on the merits of my statement.

 

[snikky]

Well, I guess I was, since I was asking for a fact to back up those features were in the game because middlemen wanted them to be.

Do we have a fact that states the idea for including the petting mini game originated from the creative team?

 

[Risette]

You're seriously calling these hideous?



stuff

I mean, yeah. These are C-grade fantasy anime designs at best (that coloring, eugh), whereas the Kozaki designs are masterful.

I know people are caught up on the practical armor meme but come on

 

[Palculator]

Ew, those warriors are wearing too much protection!

Well, they don't need to wear protection since the damage they take depends on their defence stat. It's a video game, remember?

 

[Joyful]

First no drugs to trick lesbians into marrying men, now no petting my waifus? I think I'm gonna cancel my Special Edition, this isn't the game I signed up for.

you make it sound worse than it actually is but yeah p much

 

[KirbYuuYuu]

Shouldn't have existed in Japan either.

I guess this is how I feel.

I don't think it should've been removed. It just shouldn't have made it in period.

 

[RM8]

Well, they don't need to wear protection since the damage they take depends on their defence stat. It's a video game, remember?

Let's never design cool armors, then. Everyone should wear underwear, since it's a video game.

 

[Miroku129]

nah bro i'mma keep putting sick-nasty sneer quotes around """"""""""""""""""""""censorship"""""""""""""""""""""" whenever i talk about corporate middlemen exerting their power and influence upon the creative process because in this specific instance it removes something from the game i'm okay with losing

the intersection of art and commerce makes fucking fools of us all (except the commerce people, they keep making money) but the willingness to have corporate middlemen decide what is and isn't too offensive or appropriate for audiences instead of letting their own basic cognitive abilities do the same is kind of unsettling.

you can't have your cake and eat it too, people. you can't simultaneously advocate for games being an art form and then laud and champion the Money People for interfering with the creative process for money's sake. the few times that their infringements do things you like-- like taking weird face rubbing minigames out of games that don't really need them-- do not make up for how ready willing and able marketing departments are to totally fuck up a creator's work for the sake of marketability.

in order for video games to be as beautiful as they can possibly be, sometimes we need to let them be ugly. and if we need to see that ugliness by anime's messy light, so be it.

THIS.

 

[Ekai]

Are you not going to address any of the rest of my argument? Because at this point it seems like you want to be right more than have a discussion.

Palculator often ignores arguments that don't fit his ends. It's really not worth it.

 

[Palculator]

Are you not going to address any of the rest of my argument?

No, it has nothing to do with our exchange which was me asking for actual facts to back up these features were added due to middlemen requesting them after you asserted them to do so in response to Zebetite's post.