GinoFelino
Member
Sure. I believe most of this stuff happens with the best of intentions too.
I do wonder what caused it to be released in this state.
Firewatch's PS4 performance is terrible
- Thread starter Diprosalic
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Sure. I believe most of this stuff happens with the best of intentions too.
I do wonder what caused it to be released in this state.
Clinton514
Member
$2 discount for PS Plus. I'm thinking of just letting it sit on my HDD until it's patched.
Nameless
Member
Compounded by the fact I was actively looking for/noticing hitches & stutters going in, the performance issues definitely stood out having played nothing but Gravity Rush for a week straight. Still, I didn't personally encounter anything game or experiencing ruining during my 2 hours with game.
With said, those 2 hours left such an impression that I'm going to put Firewatch aside until patched because frankly it's so good that it deserves to played in a way that maximizes the immersion instead of being slogged through and tolerated.
With said, those 2 hours left such an impression that I'm going to put Firewatch aside until patched because frankly it's so good that it deserves to played in a way that maximizes the immersion instead of being slogged through and tolerated.
thats what i did. i've got other games in my backlog to keep me busy until a patch.
gutterboy44
Member
Double dipped and picked up the PC version. Fired it up during lunch just to look around in the intro parts...night and day. The game immediately felt better and I felt more immersed as the character being able to freely look around at all of the pretty details and not have my screen tearing and jittering to all hell. You should definitely play this game, just don't play it on PS4 right now. You can get it to rock solid 60fps very easy on PC.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
Thanks for info. Makes sense.
GinoFelino
Member
Well, at least some outlets have started reporting on it.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-02-10-firewatch-dev-assures-a-ps4-framerate-fix-is-on-the-way
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-02-10-firewatch-dev-assures-a-ps4-framerate-fix-is-on-the-way
Devs: "Hey Unity guys, your PS4 performance sucks."
Unity: "Yea we know. We don't really know how to fix it, won't be anytime soon"
Devs: "Well then, release the kraken!"
Yes, and I don't buy their excuse. Blaming test kits?
I've expressed concerned every single time the game was shown on PlayStation 4. It was obvious that the frame-rate was unlocked and the experience was juddery.
I had a feeling it was going to turn out exactly like it did (though some of the bugs are more surprising) and I'm disappointed that I was right.
Honestly, if they built the game in Unity 4, there really isn't going to be a lot they can do here. The main thing would be 1) cap the frame-rate at 30fps and 2) hunt down and fix some of the other bugs. The game does drop under 30fps but if it were capped at 30 it would at least feel a lot less unstable.
Although, I understand that this isn't even always possible with Unity, unfortunately.
finalflame
Banned
Wonder what's taking so long for the Digital Foundry assessment of the game, because it's going to tear it apart.
Hey, I wish I were the one doing it but I'm working on Dying Light (which has some rather unforeseen problems of its own especially on one platform).
finalflame
Banned
Totally appreciate your guys' work, wasn't saying you're slacking off or anything, just that I'm "excited" to see the cold, hard numbers and paper proof of just how broken and subpar the performance is. Poke whoever is working on it to get it out the door so there is an objective refute to the people saying "I didn't really notice it" or "it's infrequent"
People keep saying "I'm going to wait for a patch"
To what extent can a patch really fix any of these problems? The way seemingly knowledgeable people here are talking, it sounds like this is some kind of core issue that's inherent to Unity......not a matter of "Whoops, we made the physics simulation a little too intensive, we'll knock it down a notch."
The fact that it's a 10-11 person team and they have already started offloading responsibility for fixing the game onto Sony/Unity makes me worried that the patch everyone is waiting for might never come (or be a long time coming).
I get the sense that like Skyrim/Fallout on PS3, this will be more of a "Take it or leave it" situation and less of a "wait for patch" situation.
To what extent can a patch really fix any of these problems? The way seemingly knowledgeable people here are talking, it sounds like this is some kind of core issue that's inherent to Unity......not a matter of "Whoops, we made the physics simulation a little too intensive, we'll knock it down a notch."
The fact that it's a 10-11 person team and they have already started offloading responsibility for fixing the game onto Sony/Unity makes me worried that the patch everyone is waiting for might never come (or be a long time coming).
I get the sense that like Skyrim/Fallout on PS3, this will be more of a "Take it or leave it" situation and less of a "wait for patch" situation.
OrbitalBeard
Member
Pretty much. Based on what I've read, I have no faith this is going to receive any meaningful fixes. At this point, I'm just trying to decide if I should wait until the game is $5 during a PSN flash sale or just forget about it altogether.
This kind of entitlement is a lot worse for the industry than a game that needs optimization getting released for $18-20.
"For now, M3Freak is on my (blocked) list."
I am going to guess you are in your late teens/early 20s.
boredJonathan
Member
Add me to the list of people who read the developer's comments about Unity/Sony needing to work together basically meaning no real fix, at least not for several months. Only thing that seems to possibly be in our favor is that it sounds like these issues aren't just related to Firewatch, but Unity in general which hopefully gives both companies motivation to actually get things ironed out.
At this point, having already pulled the trigger on the PS4 version - I'm going to wait to upgrade my PC and then grab it when it's inevitably on sale on Steam to play it. Shame... it was literally one of my most anticipated games for this year.
I think they can probably fix the hard crashes and the visual glitching. But the actual performance stuff? I don't know. It sounds like they just made Unity do a bunch of things that it's not very good at doing.
How much better would the game fare if they just hard-capped the framerate at 30? That certainly seems possible.
Played on PS4 for about 3 hours last night. Only noticed some slight slow down when turning but it happened rarely for me. Didn't want to wait and decided to just go for it and hope it wasn't glaringly unplayable. No crashes. Seems issues were a bit overblown. Maybe unless you're really anal about frame rate you'll be fine playing it. Glorious game so far.
GinoFelino
Member
It doesn't sound good. But at least they seem to be genuinely determined to try.
Oh, totally.
I mean, there's absolutely no way your single experience might not reflect all our experiences.
We're just being anal, obviously.
I think capping it WOULD make a big difference.
Pyramid head
Banned
Like I said earlier in the thread, certification used to do just that. Not mandate a minimum framerate, but if a tester felt the framerate was having a serious impact on a game, you bet that they would put that in as a bug, not an 'A class' bug, but rack up enough bugs and the game would fail cert.
Do you think developers used to just give up after one failed sub? It wouldn't mean "less games releasing on PS4", but it might mean more delays and less games broken on release.
WordsintheWater
Member
Do you remember what part of the map that is at? I want to go test it myself because I seem to remember walking by that area and not having that same issue. I'm not gonna act like people are lying on here because I know there are issues, but these issues, crashes, freezes, and constant stuttering haven't been occurring to me. And to answer the question of course I don't find that type of pop-in acceptable.
EDIT: Just found the exact spot and it can be replicated on my system. All the trees pop in at exactly that spot every time.
OrbitalBeard
Member
Uh, no.
Tons of people in this thread, many of whom are incredibly forgiving of performance problems, are having issues with this game.
It's cool that you're able to overlook them and enjoy the game, but these problems are not "overblown".
JetSetRadio
Banned
^ Shiiiit this guy is vocal without having played the game.
OrbitalBeard
Member
^ Shit this guy is vocal without having played the game.
True, I haven't played it (watched quite a few videos on the game's performance though), which is why I'm not telling people their feelings and opinions are wrong. I absolutely believe there are people who can enjoy this game.
I have an issue with people accusing others of hyperbole, which is precisely what I was responding to.
By the way, the only reason I haven't played this yet is due to the opinions of people in this community I respect. I bought a $20 PSN card for this game alone. So yeah, I'm a little upset.
SEGAvangelist
Member
What about The Witness? I'm surprised you guys did nothing for that release especially with all the resolution stuff.
Good question. It's a game that just happened to land right in the middle of a busy time when not everyone was available.
I've been playing it myself on PS4, though, and am quite impressed with it.
I'm surprise that they would even mention it given...well what may or may not be in the NDA, but I will say that there can be something to it...(I normally don't even want to touch the subject, but I have seen some of it even end in public places so it's safe to comment that they are not the first to comment on the subject).
EIDT: You mentioned Unity 4 earlier, was there a confirmation that it's running on that version (or in case it's an old quote, it's still using it)? Been way to busy to really keep an eye out on the game even if it looked really promising from the first previews.
SEGAvangelist
Member
You should do an analysis. Has the resolution for that game ever even been confirmed?
The problem is that this line applies for a lot of games nowadays.
JetBlackPanda
Member
Are there any videos that show what kind of performance issues we are talking about?
I couldn't get a higher resolution than 1080p on my 4K monitor, unfortunately, but my 3680 w/ a 7950 could do max 1080p with only minor stuttering at load zones on a Mac, which disappeared when dropping to High settings. I assume it's even smoother on Windows.
Definitely recommend the PC version at this point, but hopefully they fix the PS4 version.
Firewatch's performance, while sub-par, isn't game-breaking. The notion that developers should continue to work on their games until they fulfil some arbitrary performance standard is all well and good, but there are budgets to consider and in some cases it's just not going to be feasible to spend several weeks or even months reaching that goal. MS didn't ditch its 720p minimum for HD X360 games out of whimsical impulse but because "problems" with both first and third-party games made the fact it was unrealistic abundantly clear.
If you're very interested in the game, I don't think the performance is game breaking due to the type of experience it is. Those on the fence will likely want to wait.
It's definitely noticeable but it didn't hinder my experience as much as it would in most games.
Note: I am using an SSHD and comments from other people on SSHDs have also not had as much of a poor experience as some are describing.
Sure it did (and afaik still does), but it's never been anything like minimum average 25fps or anything (let's not forget that plenty of PS2/3 titles did run at similar or worse framerates) nor would it ever be "the" dealbreaker. In any case, a proper technical performance requirement is quite unrealistic to implement from multiple technical and somewhat legal standpoints, but since it's not going to happen, I'd rather not use the time to really go into detail why that is.
I would imagine that most of their demonstrations over the years (on PS4) were performed on test kits...right? I can't imagine they were using retail PS4 units at that point. The performance issues were visible from very early on and were never really fixed, it seems.
I also don't have a confirmation that it's actually Unity 4 but, considering when it started development, I cannot imagine it's using Unity 5. I can't really say with any certainty, though, that's pure guesswork.
Naturally, you can't really (well realistically) showcase the game on retail units. It's true that if the problems were still visible on testkits before the release, then they would be seen on the retail units, but test kits might not completely represent the retail unit.
Ah gotcha, though I would guess that they would have taken the step from Unity 4 to 5 when targeting consoles, even if the process is not exactly painless. Which, I think anyone who has worked on Unity 4 and consoles can probably agree with
I hope some of them start reporting the game crashing or getting stuck on a certain chapter. I've yet to see any comments from the developers on this. I would have been able to overlook the other performance problems, but the fact I have to start a new game after getting 3/4 of the way through is unacceptable to me.
MassiveNights
Banned
One last comment from me on this.
I think it's important this 'genre' or style of game or even a game of this size/scope doesn't sell itself short by allowing itself to be more forgiving of technical problems.
I really hate twitchy MP shooters and stuff of that ilk, which are probably the most scrutinised when it comes to performance.
These single player experiences are totally my jam and why I invested in a PS4.
It's not an excuse that because this game doesn't need silky smooth performance to let its mechanics breathe that it doesn't have silky smooth performance.
Lots of us find enjoyment out of games in different ways. For me I was so excited to really drink in the environment and feel 'lost' in a Wyoming forest playing at a snail's pace.
I feel like these issues detract from the game's goals and it's irrelevant that you don't need to needle in on a headshot.
It's not hyperbole to expect more.
I think it's important this 'genre' or style of game or even a game of this size/scope doesn't sell itself short by allowing itself to be more forgiving of technical problems.
I really hate twitchy MP shooters and stuff of that ilk, which are probably the most scrutinised when it comes to performance.
These single player experiences are totally my jam and why I invested in a PS4.
It's not an excuse that because this game doesn't need silky smooth performance to let its mechanics breathe that it doesn't have silky smooth performance.
Lots of us find enjoyment out of games in different ways. For me I was so excited to really drink in the environment and feel 'lost' in a Wyoming forest playing at a snail's pace.
I feel like these issues detract from the game's goals and it's irrelevant that you don't need to needle in on a headshot.
It's not hyperbole to expect more.
M3Freak
Banned
The devs' explanation doesn't wash. I'm supposed to believe they play on their dev systems and never try the game on the retail unit? WTF? There's no way they missed it.
Also, how can only some people experience the problem and not others when the PS4 is a CLOSED system? Illogical!
At any rate...it's their loss. I'm sure they lost some sales that will never come back. The only way to make devs change their ways is to not buy their partially completed games.
M3Freak
Banned
Well there are impediments to testing on retail systems on consoles...
Player and environmental variables? Not everyone has the same hard drive let alone take the exact same paths, dialogue choices, or world interactions in game.