That's my fault on calling them "QTEs" but what I was refferring to were those "warp kills" I guess I just have different expectation from a Numbered Final Fantasy game. Which is why I said that they should've just named this something aside from Final Fantasy as I really don't see the rpg element anymore.
FINAL FANTASY XV - Niflheim Base Battle Footage
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That's my fault on calling them "QTEs" but what I was refferring to were those "warp kills" I guess I just have different expectation from a Numbered Final Fantasy game. Which is why I said that they should've just named this something aside from Final Fantasy as I really don't see the rpg element anymore.
And what's that gif suppose to imply? I'm expressing my opinion and you mock me with a gif? Very nice.
Makoto Yuki
Banned
I don't think those are QTEs, they are just context sensitive button presses.
Also, when it comes to "expectations from a Numbered Final Fantasy" it's best you don't have any because the mainline games are subject to change. The only Final Fantasy that was remotely different was XII because it was already deeply rooted in Ivalice's world and lore. Even then, it still manages to hit Final Fantasy trademarks, much like this game is doing.
Yeah,
It's totally a Metal Gear game, didn't you know?
You've never had to sneak around an enemy base in a Final Fantasy before!
I guess that's true and I can clearly see that Nomura took a lot of inspiration from Kingdom Hearts when it came to gameplay. I'm just being pessimistic and hoping that it's not all style over substance.
KCroxtonJr
Member
Sorry, I just didn't have words at the time, You totally blew my mind going from mentioning Metal Gear, to The Bouncer, To Nier...all games I love dearly.
Now I know this is going to be my favorite game ever since it captures the essence of those games.
Yeah,
It's totally a Metal Gear game, didn't you know?
You've never had to sneak around an enemy base in a Final Fantasy before!
So which of those have the 3rd person sneak/cover takedown mechanics?
artsi
Member
Believe me, they would have had something like that if the tech was at that point then.
It's just progression.
That's what kinda worries me as the developmental problems the game has along with the revisions are making me wary that the game may be all over the place. I'm hoping it is good as we are due for an excellent Final Fantasy game. I hope I'm wrong that the game is very superficial.
Wow, the YouTube video is closing in on a million views without having the benefit of being a main trailer or a major event to drive attention, and with mostly positive feedback..
If the march event is more stuff like this I think SE can expect to go in into sale season guns blazing.
If the march event is more stuff like this I think SE can expect to go in into sale season guns blazing.
That's a pretty terrible argument there. Saying the game doesn't "fit with Final Fantasy" and then arguing using a standard game mechanic that was not present back when these examples were made is not really very compelling. Based on your argument Metal Gear = Uncharted = Mass Effect since they all have third person cover mechanics?
DirgeExtinction
Member
With that way of thinking, neither FFVII nor FFVIII could've been seen as a "Final Fantasy" game since they were different than previous FF games.
Also, what does "the rpg element" entail for you?
In what numbered Final Fantasy game have you seen that mechanic? Those games you mentioned have used those as the definition of their game. Like I mentioned above, FFXV's gameplay mechanic is more in line with Kingdom Hearts (obvious Nomura influence) as oppose to a Final Fantasy game. Even the Final Fantasy 7 Remake follows the formula albeit it's been stylized. Which is my point that the game could've been called anything and it would've been great, but it's not within my realm of expectation that follows the numbered final fantasy games.
My Final Fantasy JRPG element entails what it has had from the very beginning of the series and what I'm seeing here is Kingdom Hearts mechanics, I'll go even as far as it mimicking Final Fantasy XII but even that is a stretch. I know the series needs to evolve somewhat, but again this is just me, they could've just named this something outside Final Fantasy and it would've been fine as well. Then again the last real Final Fantasy for me was 9.
Bartholomuse
Member
Nothing wrong with a good military base in a jrpg, it's a good excuse to throw challenging, cool looking enemies at you in an enclosed space. Fuck it, half of Type-0 consisted of army bases, and it was pretty cool for the most part, you fought a lot of visually interesting mechanized stuff and some crazy, large bosses.
I just hope that the bases don't just turn into the settlements in games like Far Cry / AC where most of the enemies in the game are just holed up in one, waiting for you, the player, to "liberate" it. I'd like maybe half a dozen, large and varied areeas with a sense of history, kind of like the ones in MGSV
I just hope that the bases don't just turn into the settlements in games like Far Cry / AC where most of the enemies in the game are just holed up in one, waiting for you, the player, to "liberate" it. I'd like maybe half a dozen, large and varied areeas with a sense of history, kind of like the ones in MGSV
With every new Final Fantasy since VII (save for IX) they've done things that haven't really stayed true to the formula. The modern setting of VII. The draw system in VIII. The linearity in FFX. The MMO's XI and XIV. The offline MMO/Gambit system in XII. The removal of towns in FFXIII.
I'm not saying any or all of those were changes for the better mind you (that's entirely subjective), but it's not like numbered Final Fantasies have stuck to a singular formula in a long time. Even FFVI was noticably different than it's predecessors despite still being more of a classic RPG because it had nothing to do with crystals or warriors of light/darkness/dawn/palmolive/whatever.
I'm not even saying that people have to be excited for or like the game. I'm optimistic about it, but I've been optimistic about the last couple and haven't enjoyed them, so I'm not 100% certain on it either. It just irks me to see it have things like chocobos, airships, summons, magic, moogles, classic monsters, recurring music, magitek armor, crystals, Cid and various other things from the franchise and people say "this doesn't even resemble Final Fantasy!"
That just seems to be a way of them burying their head in the sand and ignoring all the things that clearly make this the next Final Fantasy just because they don't agree with certain directions that the game is going in.
Agree to disagree. I respect your opinion and how you want Final Fantasy to progress, but to me it really has more in common with Kingdom Hearts/Nier than what a numbered Final Fantasy (up to 9) should be. If anything, this really is a Gaiden.
I don't necessarily want the series to progress further this way. I look at each game individually and enjoy it for what it is if it's good. If they were to announce that FFXVI was a classic, big budget, medieval, turn based RPG that is returning the series to its roots a la FFIX I'd be over the moon for that as FFIX was my second favorite in the whole series and a top 5 all time game. I'm open to whatever way they want to take the series, as long as the games deliver.
KCroxtonJr
Member
edit:nvm i need to sleep lol
Unfortunately not all FF fans have this mentality.
I think sometimes people are afraid to say it but a lot of people really think Final Fantasy isn't Final Fantasy unless the combat has you selecting actions from a menu, one character at a time. If XV had that, people would be like, "now THIS is FINAL FANTASY!"
XV is such an FF game from everything we've seen. Maybe it has some elements that are inspired by other games of other genres but this game is doing things that only an FF game would do and I think it has a world that only an FF game would have.
XV is such an FF game from everything we've seen. Maybe it has some elements that are inspired by other games of other genres but this game is doing things that only an FF game would do and I think it has a world that only an FF game would have.
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
O so we are back to the it's not final fantasy aye? Good lord
YankeeDonB
Member
Agreed. Of course "this isn't a Final Fantasy game" often really just means: "I've liked some previous FF games, and don't know if I'll like this."
Identity is a philosophically difficult concept (cf., Ship of Theseus). But there's more than enough continuity between each new Final Fantasy and the last to clear any reasonable set of criteria for group identity (same creators, lots of series tropes, ambition, etc.).
It's fine to be skeptical of change, but "this isn't FF" is usually just a lazy shorthand argument.
well said.
Youtube audio and video quality only seems to get worse over time.
rayman1900
Member
Maybe he's saying that because we see most of the time during the footage buttons prompts appearing at the center of the screen... but those are just hud indications of what the user can do in certains situations...
I'm not against this idea or anything, (although I've come to enjoy action rpg combat more now) but how are you imagining the battle system? Like for a game with graphics as good as or better than XV, would you just have it turn based/ATB, switching from one character to the next while the other characters just stand there and wait until they're allowed to swing their sword, throw a punch or cast a spell? I'm sure there's probably some way to do it without it looking silly but I can't picture it so I'm wondering what others are imagining.
MultiJhonny
Banned
I will just blindly accept what Ito comes up with
I think what I would imagine for a modern-day turn-based battle system would be a two-step phase for battles that combines elements for the systems from Final Fantasy X, Final Fantasy XII, and Resonance of Fate.
Random chance and attack speed would determine the player or enemy who attacks first. The first phase would determine position, but not in a grid like a tactical RPG. It would be more three dimensional and fluid. This is to prevent the stationary aspect of turn-based battles so that the characters and enemies aren't just standing around and bouncing.
The second phase is the attack. Perhaps there would be some way to implement a contextual phase that has to do with countering.
Also, players would be able to switch out characters at will. There would be three or four characters fighting at a time. Weapon switching would be fluid as well and linked to a single button press.
I'm not sure I understand how the graphics and game system can be so strictly tied together. How one is advanced, the other absolutely has to be as well, I don't get it.
There was some suspension of disbelief that had to be done back then due to what we were technologically capable of, and I think it is great that that isn't needed for some games anymore, but I don't necessarily see it as a big negative that other games can still use it as well.
I honestly felt that XII was the perfect solution to this whole turn-based system on a game with modern graphics. You're still able to issue commands to any character at any time and you have to set up gambits which feels very strategic and allows so much customization. I know a lot of people didn't like feeling like everything was AI controlled but I really think it was more fun and require more strategy than most of the older turn-based or ATB FF games.
AuthenticM
Member
Just have Ito make XVI using an overhauled X-2 combat system, complete with jobs and abilities.
Boom, ship it. I'd buy it.
Boom, ship it. I'd buy it.
I know what you mean. It's kind of like how games were better in some ways before voice acting because the characters would always sound how we felt they should in our own heads. Older games always required more imagination in a lot of different ways. As technology keeps progressing, games are requiring less and less imagination. But you can't see how it would look very strange if Noctis stood in place in a fighting stance, waiting for his turn to slash his sword and then got out of the way to allow the next person to take their turn? In a world that looks as realistic as that with characters that look like that, I can't see how that would work and not appear very strange.
Nomura basically said the exact same thing when talking about the battle system for the FFVII remake.
I'd take a new Grandia.
Vincent Grayson
Member
Yeah, I'd have loved to see at least one more FF game using a system like XII's. Hell, I wish I could just have a party of 3 AI buddies with gambits in XIV.
I just can't see Square releasing an FF game that has lower quality graphics than the Duscae demo. They're gonna make sure this thing looks amazing.
Really doubt they ever make a traditional turn based, mainline FF ever again when even FF VII remake is now an action RPG. Some sort of hybrid like FF XII with seamless battles is the best I see them doing at this point. I'm not even sure they'll be going back to FF XIII's field encounters now that they have the proper memory for seamless battles and a large world that can still be balanced with great graphics. They're definitely not going to make a cutting edge game with a large budget that's turn based.
It's really silly to see people lamenting that they're not making the same type of mainline FF game that they were 15 or more years ago. I mean of course they're not...what do you expect? Especially with increasing budgets?
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
Than they'll probably add more budget to that franchise. Otherwise i expect ff to keep experimenting .
Edit:mainline ff that is thet have world of ff too
I wouldn't even call FFVII remake an action rpg from what we saw. Looks like you have basically the exact same battle menu but you can move your character and switch characters at any time. I just don't consider a game a real ARPG if you have to select Attack from a menu, ya know? Seems more like FFXII than anything.
MultiJhonny
Banned
Yeah I see that happening or continuing on with the Bravely series
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
Yea definitely. As far as big budget turn based? Eh closer we will ever get to those again is the persona franchise
Probably Dragon Quest too, that is, if the next installments after XI release on consoles.
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
Ahh forgot dq, thats a pretty big one actually. If square gives it push in the west
I really doubt Setsuna explodes, but even if it does that's not how it works. Dragon Quest is turn based and has been selling millions for years, but FF has been doing its own thing for a long time now.
You're not selecting Attack from a menu. Not in the traditional sense. Think Kingdom Hearts.
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