Batman v Superman Spoiler Thread: Don't believe everything you read, Son

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I'm really conflicted about Doomsday. I liked his look and his evolution. I thought he posed a real threat and I felt like they were screwed.

Problem is the fight is too short and WW and Batman do nothing. WW should've had more to do, instead she gets a few spots that shows how badass she can be. Batman is essentially on the sidelines the whole fight and has no business being there.

Then they get Lois involved which is just pointless. She's only there for Superman to say goodbye and to give Batman some action with Doomsday. Let Batman get the spear
 
Aquaman hits the camera for no reason? Don't you see the way humans treat the oceans, why there's a reason they haven't interacted with us in the universe? You expected him to pose for the surveillance drone?

Not sure if joking but,


Lol he did pose. For a race thats trying to remain hidden I expected him not to stare at the camera for 2 minutes and for some reason decides to hit the damn thing (not even completely destroying it).
 
I saw someone mention on Twitter that there's a decent 90 minute superhero movie hiding in this wreak, and I think there might be. Someone will probably to a decent fan edit once it hits video. The problems here won't be solved with a longer cut - it needs clarity, not more bloat.

Drop the dream sequences. All of them. Drop the momentum halting Justice League preview trailers. Re-structure the plot threads, particularly in the first act, so they flow better. None of that will salvage the directorial problems, but it would help make the film more coherent and focused.
 
The movies are not the same as the TV universe. They've said that repeatedly.

I watched the TV show and I watched the movie but I don't follow what producers or execs have to say about them. Sure, they've made the decision but it's a poor one especially in light of what the MCU is doing with its own properties. It would be a lot better if the TV shows and movies were in the same canon.
 
Do people really have that big of a problem with Batman killing cause I sure as hell didn't. This maybe my favorite version of Batman to date. I can't wait for the rater R Blu-ray. I hope he straight up decapitates someone in it.

Oddly no beef with him killing, had a beef with him pulling the trigger on the gun... like at no point did he use Batarangs in this movie

Would have been the perfect time for them to debut.

Also Synder needs to stop making everything explode!

Like when he is shooting up the cars, it looks like he is aiming for the tires (both in the Batmobile and plane) but I guess he hits the gas tanks?
 
I really wish that BFF nonsense would stop. That's not even remotely what happened. All he did was make a promise that Martha wouldn't die and then said "I'm a friend of your son's" to her. What should he have said? "Hi, I'm Batman and 10 minutes ago I was about to murder your son."
 
I saw someone mention on Twitter that there's a decent 90 minute superhero movie hiding in this wreak, and I think there might be. Someone will probably to a decent fan edit once it hits video. The problems here won't be solved with a longer cut - it needs clarity, not more bloat.

Drop the dream sequences. All of them. Drop the momentum halting Justice League preview trailers. Re-structure the plot threads, particularly in the first act, so they flow better. None of that will salvage the directorial problems, but it would help make the film more coherent and focused.

Disagree wholly. This is a movie that needs more material, not less. The problems it has are related to overcutting, not undercutting. Scenes begin and end abruptly. Conversations are choppy, reduced down to the principle elements with very little natural flow.
 
I saw someone mention on Twitter that there's a decent 90 minute superhero movie hiding in this wreak, and I think there might be. Someone will probably to a decent fan edit once it hits video. The problems here won't be solved with a longer cut - it needs clarity, not more bloat.

Drop the dream sequences. All of them. Drop the momentum halting Justice League preview trailers. Re-structure the plot threads, particularly in the first act, so they flow better. None of that will salvage the directorial problems, but it would help make the film more coherent and focused.

Can we also cut out the mostly random horses?

I'm still trying to figure out the senator plotline. Lex blows her up, world uses it as an excuse to turn against Superman though. Why?
 
Yo so what was the end game for Lex? Really I mean if doomsday defeated superman what next lol? Didn't seem like Lex would have had a feasible way to stop Doomsday from reeking havoc
Do people really have that big of a problem with Batman killing cause I sure as hell didn't. This maybe my favorite version of Batman to date. I can't wait for the rater R Blu-ray. I hope he straight up decapitates someone in it.
Yeah I loved this batman. It was a darker Batman then we're used too. This one wasn't afraid to use guns, and frequently did. The nightmares/hallucinations he had were cool.
 
You don't get it like Zack Snyder does. That isn't "their tone".

Their tone is bleak, dark, and uncompromisingly violent. You can't expect the Flash to subdue a guy by easily tying him up. He has to HURT him. If he's lucky, maybe kill him through some "manslaughter" loophole. That's what real heroes do. Violence is the one and only answer.

I'm sure Zack Snyder totally gets it. That's why the movie is such a critical success, amirite?

Jesus christ, I know the TV Flash does not fit in BvS universe; that's not hard to figure out at all. My point is, they should have either made TV Flash fit BvS or BvS fit TV Flash. That's how you get people emotionally invested in your properties.
 
Can we also cut out the mostly random horses?

I'm still trying to figure out the senator plotline. Lex blows her up, world uses it as an excuse to turn against Superman though. Why?

Even that didn't happen though. It's immediately reported that it was a suicide bomb by Wally.
 
Disagree wholly. This is a movie that needs more material, not less. The problems it has are related to overcutting, not undercutting. Scenes begin and end abruptly. Conversations are choppy, reduced down to the principle elements with very little natural flow.
The Justice League material / the Knightmare / Flash from the future had no business being in this movie other than to push material for the later movies. All of that could have been cut and not affect the core story at all. Cut all of that out and edit back in character and plot beats Snyder had to sacrifice for those and the movie would probably work better as a self-contained picture.
 
Can we also cut out the mostly random horses?

I'm still trying to figure out the senator plotline. Lex blows her up, world uses it as an excuse to turn against Superman though. Why?

Lex blows up the whole place to hurt Superman. Not physically, obviously, he's trying to break his spirit. He fires up Batman while dragging down Superman.

The Justice League material / the Knightmare / Flash from the future had no business being in this movie other than to push material for the later movies. All of that could have been cut and not affect the core story at all. Cut all of that out and edit back in character and plot beats Snyder had to sacrifice for those and the movie would probably work better as a self-contained picture.

That stuff takes up maybe 10 minutes. They could have cut it out, sure, but it's not the principle issue here.
 
Hi everyone, I'm Disgraced and these are my thoughts.

+ Visuals
+ Fights
+ Score—they better bring this back for WW! Don't pull an Iron Man and ditch the cool, recognizable theme!
+ Wonder Woman—her demeanor was badass and cinematic magic made Gadot imposing.
+ Batfleck—my favorite scene was his "introduction" where he rescues the sex slaves(?) who refer to him as a devil—that was very Year One. But... while the killing didn't bother me in its context—externally, it was really jarring to see Bats brutalizing thugs into fucking pulp and stabbing them right in fucking windpipe. Jesus Christ. That's not typical Bats. I felt the nerds' tears all over me like rain. No, but seriously, I don't begrudge anyone upset about it. It was surprisingly excessive and a compelling argument can be made (and has been, like everywhere) for it being unfaithful.
- DCCU crap / far too aggressive
- Story—I didn't understand anything—whatever, it was all a big excuse for explosions and violence.
I SMELL FUCKING GOYERISMS
- Dialogue—everyone had a poem—Lex wasn't wearing a bandage because of his cut—his poem that he wrote for Lois and Supes was written on there.
FUCKING DAVID GOYER
- Weird editing? I'm interested to see the DC.
- Clark and Lois in the tub was hot, but otherwise, unfortunately I wasn't invested in their relationship, or anything emotional really. None of that hit me. People shit on Snyder for lots of things, but I'd say that's his particular weakness. The only character he's directed I've felt for is Rorschach and I'd attribute that more to Haley's exceptional performance and the fact that the character's material is just really hard to botch.

I was feeling it 100% until Flash came through time.
 
I'm sure Zack Snyder totally gets it. That's why the movie is such a critical success, amirite?

Jesus christ, I know the TV Flash does not fit in BvS universe; that's not hard to figure out at all. But they should have either made TV Flash fit BvS or the BvS fit TV Flash. That's how you get people emotionally invested in your properties.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

Actually making sure you have a shared universe when you're making a shared universe of films? Insanity.

But seriously, it's just that WB don't know what they're doing.
 
Can we also cut out the mostly random horses?

I'm still trying to figure out the senator plotline. Lex blows her up, world uses it as an excuse to turn against Superman though. Why?

Because he could have prevented it. Even Superman admits this to Lois.

As far as the Senator plotline that was all mostly just to push Lex as being manipulative. When she sees the jar of "Granny's Peach Tea" and sees that Luthor was not in his seat she knew she was about to die. And about 3 seconds later she did.
 
You have no idea what you're talking about.

Actually making sure you have a shared universe when you're making a shared universe of films? Insanity.

But seriously, it's just that WB don't know what they're doing.

Why bother integrating the TV shows when that's just limiting the stories both mediums can tell?

Look at AoS. Nothing they do can ever matter because only the movies can effect the setting.
 
That stuff takes up maybe 10 minutes. They could have cut it out, sure, but it's not the principle issue here.

It doesn't take up a lot of screentime but it's all incredibly distracting and grinds the film to a halt for no good reason. Removing WW and the other JL stuff might knock the film down 15mins but would go a long way in making the story more focused.
 
That stuff takes up maybe 10 minutes. They could have cut it out, sure, but it's not the principle issue here.
It absolutely is. All of that adds up to the movie as it exists being unfocused. Every unessential moment to the core plot on-screen is less time for what the movie should've been focusing on. In movies, every minute, every second of on-screen information is integral to telling the intended story.
 
It doesn't take up a lot of screentime but it's all incredibly distracting and grinds the film to a halt for no good reason. Removing WW and the other JL stuff might knock the film down 15mins but would go a long way in making the story more focused.
It absolutely is. All of that adds up to the movie as it exists being unfocused. Every unessential moment to the core plot on-screen is less time for what the movie should've been focusing on. In movies, every minute, every second of on-screen information is integral to telling the intended story.


Eh. It's a little intrusive, and you're right that it certainly doesn't help the film's pacing issues any, but it's so far and away from a primary issue. I don't see why people are so focused on it.
 

Nitpick the article.

Some of them are answered in the movie like 14 and 16 (I stopped after the first page.)

14. Why has Batman been trying to find out what The White Portuguese is for so long?

Bruce says that a sizable chunk of kryptonite was found three months ago in the Indian Ocean and has been trying to track it since then.

16. What does a lowly sex trafficker have to do with Lex Luthor?

He worked for the head of Luthor's bad guys. Bruce says the head of his security or whatever is involved in human trafficking along with a bunch of other stuff when he's got his information up on the computer in the Batcave.

Shit like this makes me wonder if people actually watch the film or play on their damn phones the whole time during movies.
 
Disagree wholly. This is a movie that needs more material, not less. The problems it has are related to overcutting, not undercutting. Scenes begin and end abruptly. Conversations are choppy, reduced down to the principle elements with very little natural flow.

I actually largely agree with you, in particular with the bolded. This was my comment on it from the other thread:

About a half hour into the film I started playing a game: count the number of times characters have a conversation that has a beginning, middle and end. And I don't mean end as in the scene cuts away, or gets interrupted. But actually concludes in a way that two humans talking to each other might. There's plenty of dialogue - this isn't Mad Max - there's just no flow to it. People emote, spout, shout and quip. They don't really converse much. When they do the scenes cut away at odd times, making them feel incomplete.

I think I got up to one, but I've since forgotten which one it was.

I was referring to what fans can do after release, not what the director / writers might to do to try and patch it up. I'm also skeptical an extended cut will provide the breathing room the conversations need, since it's being talked up as an R-rated cut. I'm assuming that means they go harder on the action rather than let the character scenes resolve more naturally. If there are longer cuts of the more character focused scenes, that would help. But there's a lot of extraneous material around them that could go, and some plot threads that could be streamlined.
 
Can we also cut out the mostly random horses?

I'm still trying to figure out the senator plotline. Lex blows her up, world uses it as an excuse to turn against Superman though. Why?

No no, he put bail on the wheelchair dude. He's convinces him to go to the senator and have Superman face him in court. Superman being a nice dude does it so he can help show he's doing the right thing (similar to him going the press route with Batman). Lex has it rigged and it explode painting him in a bad light. Thus the piss jar, showing the senator that Lex is going to get his way regardless of what she thinks and she already helped him without her knowing, her looking at the jar was the moment she realized she was played.

At the exact same time he's been sending his paycheques (wheelchair dude) back to Bruce Wayne saying it's all his fault he let him down... giving him an alibi to suicide bomb the place. Placing further guilt on Bruce and at the same time pitting Bruce against Superman. It had nothing to do with the world turning on him, he wanted the entire time for Batman to turn on him. He played Batman like a fiddle.

The entire time he's pitting the two together, he's even sending Clark those photos of the bat branding.
 
What was the point of the desert sequence, anyway? I mean, the movie makes it a point that it was to frame Superman, to make the world think Superman killed everyone.

...but surely no one would be so fucking daft to think Superman suddenly used assault rifles to mow down a bunch of thugs, right? Was the point to have a thread for Lois to be of any significance in this movie? Because ultimately the only point is that she uncovers that the bullets came from LexCorp, thus Luthor is responsible. And that proves, eh, uhm.. that Luthor is trying to set up Superman?


This movie makes some remarkable leaps in logic at times. I'm really looking forward to seeing it again next week, I have so many questions that require a second viewing.
 
What was the point of the desert sequence, anyway? I mean, the movie makes it a point that it was to frame Superman, to make the world think Superman killed everyone.

...but surely no one would be so fucking daft to think Superman suddenly used assault rifles to mow down a bunch of thugs, right? Was the point to have a thread for Lois to be of any significance in this movie? Because ultimately the only point is that she uncovers that the bullets came from LexCorp, thus Luthor is responsible. And that proves, eh, uhm.. that Luthor is trying to set up Superman?


This movie makes some remarkable leaps in logic at times. I'm really looking forward to seeing it again next week, I have so many questions that require a second viewing.

Based on interviews, a bunch of the desert stuff was cut from the film if Zack is to be believed. It's part of what's being added back into the film with the extra 30 minute cut.
 
Going through this, and question 8 isn't really valid since that character's a girl in this universe.

Still reading it...

EDIT: And immediately they answered it. Like...why bother?
Those kinds of articles are always shit, with most questions that can be answered with an even vague awareness of what is happening on screen.

Just click bait bullshit
 
This movie needs to cut:

Knightmare scene
Pa Kent
Doomdsday
Wonder Woman
and Cameo scene at end.

and needs to add:

More Bruce Wayne Batman, show us his past and where he stands now. If I didn't follow this movie, I wouldn't even know that he's an older Batman who retired.
Bigger training montage, show us him making mistakes as he gets back into the game and brings the legend back.

And a way longer fight. The fight fell short in the movie.
 
I saw someone mention on Twitter that there's a decent 90 minute superhero movie hiding in this wreak, and I think there might be. Someone will probably to a decent fan edit once it hits video. The problems here won't be solved with a longer cut - it needs clarity, not more bloat.

Drop the dream sequences. All of them. Drop the momentum halting Justice League preview trailers. Re-structure the plot threads, particularly in the first act, so they flow better. None of that will salvage the directorial problems, but it would help make the film more coherent and focused.

This movie needs to be a different movie.

It has fundamental thematic, structural and writing issues. There is no fixing this.
 
This movie needs to cut:

Knightmare scene
Pa Kent
Doomdsday
Wonder Woman
and Cameo scene at end.

and needs to add:

More Bruce Wayne Batman, show us his past and where he stands now. If I didn't follow this movie, I wouldn't even know that he's an older Batman who retired.
Bigger training montage, show us him making mistakes as he gets back into the game and brings the legend back.

And a way longer fight. The fight fell short in the movie.
You and I are nearly identical with our cuts. Totally agree.
 

Some of these are horrible.

7. Why are the World Engine remains sitting around for scavengers and villains to pilfer them from “somewhere in the Indian Ocean”?

Like we recover EVERYTHING from every wreckage? And it's not like an engine, just a piece of rock that fell off.

8. Did they just immediately kill off Jimmy Olsen?

Technically not unanswered since I don't think the film referred to him as Jimmy... not sure if the credits did?

11. Why does anyone care what happened in Africa anyway?

Don't think they care about WHAT happened in Africa, more they care about where his jurisdiction ends and begins.


12. Do people really think Superman is responsible for shooting deaths of villagers during a skirmish with a warlord?

From the testimony, it sounded like they were accusing him of his intervention increasing hostility, not that he was directly related for their shooting.

And this can go on and on.
 
This movie needs to cut:

Knightmare scene
Pa Kent
Doomdsday
Wonder Woman
and Cameo scene at end.

and needs to add:

More Bruce Wayne Batman, show us his past and where he stands now. If I didn't follow this movie, I wouldn't even know that he's an older Batman who retired.
Bigger training montage, show us him making mistakes as he gets back into the game and brings the legend back.

And a way longer fight. The fight fell short in the movie.

I don't think that's the case. Maybe it was at one point in production, maybe it even is in the director's cut, but this film has nothing that leads you to believe he was retired at some point.
 
What was the point of the desert sequence, anyway? I mean, the movie makes it a point that it was to frame Superman, to make the world think Superman killed everyone.

...but surely no one would be so fucking daft to think Superman suddenly used assault rifles to mow down a bunch of thugs, right? Was the point to have a thread for Lois to be of any significance in this movie? Because ultimately the only point is that she uncovers that the bullets came from LexCorp, thus Luthor is responsible. And that proves, eh, uhm.. that Luthor is trying to set up Superman?


This movie makes some remarkable leaps in logic at times. I'm really looking forward to seeing it again next week, I have so many questions that require a second viewing.

The point of the desert sequence was to get Superman in the senate hearing so Lex could blow it up around him as part of his "break Superman" campaign.

As to why they blame him, idk. My best guess was that they blame him for starting the firefight, not that he personally killed those guys. Tweak the timing a little; Superman shows up, then shots are fired, as opposed to how it actually happened.
 
What was the point of the desert sequence, anyway? I mean, the movie makes it a point that it was to frame Superman, to make the world think Superman killed everyone.

...but surely no one would be so fucking daft to think Superman suddenly used assault rifles to mow down a bunch of thugs, right? Was the point to have a thread for Lois to be of any significance in this movie? Because ultimately the only point is that she uncovers that the bullets came from LexCorp, thus Luthor is responsible. And that proves, eh, uhm.. that Luthor is trying to set up Superman?


This movie makes some remarkable leaps in logic at times. I'm really looking forward to seeing it again next week, I have so many questions that require a second viewing.
It wasn't implying Supes mowed these people down, but that all the deaths happened due to Superman's unsanctioned intervention, that his actions caused things to spiral out when in reality Luthor set up the firing squad to kill everyone.

The stuff involving Africa was cut too according to Snyder, so the Director's Cut might make this plotline a lot clearer.
 
This movie makes some remarkable leaps in logic at times.

The entire Lex/Senator plotline was baffling to me: If you found a rock you want to keep on the ocean floor, would you 1) have it put it on a boat and bring it home, or 2) have meetings with the junior senator from Kentucky to see if she can okay bringing it into the US?

Then she blocks the import license (which I'm pretty sure a senator can't do as it's a federal agency that regulates them), and Lex just...puts it on a boat and brings it home anyway.
 
Some of these are horrible.

7. Why are the World Engine remains sitting around for scavengers and villains to pilfer them from “somewhere in the Indian Ocean”?

Like we recover EVERYTHING from every wreckage? And it's not like an engine, just a piece of rock that fell off.

8. Did they just immediately kill off Jimmy Olsen?

Technically not unanswered since I don't think the film referred to him as Jimmy... not sure if the credits did?

First off, the size of the wreckage is ENORMOUS. Hell, they can't even get the ship out of Metropolis. Also, would our tools and machinery even be able to salvage what is there? I would assume it has the same level of invulnerability as the actual Kryptonians?

As for Jimmy Olsen, he's actually listed in the credits of the film.
 
Below is just my opinion. It is merely me attempting to capture my personal preferences, observations, and my overall experience. You will probably feel different, and that is okay.

I hated the trailers, except for one maybe, but most of them left me disappointed. Explosions, explosions, loud music and some more cgi thrown in. I didn't care for the marketing campaign, and I was afraid this movie would be like any other superhero movie I had seen in the past couple of years, that I'd get a typical opening scene, a typical middle, typical scene transition, typical-- you get where I'm going with this. I didn't get any of this. I got a strange fucking movie. Like REALLY strange. The kind where even I went 'uh, I can't believe they did that'.

I loved this movie.
I've always wanted the bigger superhero movies to get the watchmen treatment, and that's exactly what I got for the first half of this movie. The first half is fucking incredible. I can't believe Snyder got to work on that. Larry Fong cinematography is masterful. The whole Batman introduction is INSANE. There is nothing that could top that for me when it comes to Batman. That was a thing to behold.
The amount of story told SIMPLY through imagery in that first 30-40 minutes is absolutely genius. The editing, I'll get back to this, but in this part of the movie the editing is a work of art. The music, the editing, the cinematography, I felt things. This was Batman being introduced like he should have been.
I felt like I was watching a comic come back to life. That was incredible. I haven't seen anything of the sort in a superhero movie since Watchmen.

As I said before, this was a strange movie. Really strangely put together. It didn't follow any real formula. It was the first superhero movie I've seen in a while where I had no idea whether we were halfway through the movie or whether the ending was nearer. And I fucking loved it. It was such a major deviation. It felt as though someone just wanted to make their own kind of superhero movie. Chris Terrio dug real deep into the DC verse and came up with his own stuff, and Snyder attempted to capture his madness in visual representation. This is the kind of movie you get when you have someone who is an otherwise an incredible writer working with a director with an eye for imagery. And together they come up with some strange fucking shit.

There were some moments where I felt the editing was moving away from some scenes too early. Most notably for me was when Lex is talking with the Senator, and I was just starting to get a feel for who he was and their relationship before it cut away. It's a double-edged sword. The editing is what made the first part of the movie work, but at some points it would switch too early. Still a strange way to put together a film. I didn't hate or anything, it was just something I noticed, and don't know how to feel about it.

Some laughably bad things:
1. Everything to do with WW + Bruce Wayne's internet correspondence. That shit is hilarious. But I expect something stupid out of every big budget movie, and that's this movie's big dumb dumb moment.
2. Lex Luthor, although he was terrifying in some parts, I think the way he was portrayed was too much like the joker and had no place in the movie. He was all over the place. But I legitimately didn't know what he was going to do next, which is great, but also bad. The joker is that kind of character, not Lex.
3. 'Expendable' characters that deserved much more. Notably, Mercer and the Holly Hunter. Holly was superb in her scenes. I wanted to know more about both and it is a major problem for me.
4.That scene with Superman and his dad on the mountain. It felt as though 10 minutes was cut between him leaving metropolis and suddenly being a hobo again on a mountain.
5. This movie is NOT kid friendly, which will definitely hurt its box office take. It's essentially an adult graphic novel. Kids will get bored with the first half of the movie because it is too adult, and in some cases, straight up horror.
6. Bruce Wayne basically saying he wants to put together the justice league and work with other meta humans, out of no fucking where. It didn't feel as though he meant it at all.
7.No post credit sequence. That's going to hurt this movie, they could have used that to spam information instead of putting it right smack in the middle of the movie. Audiences WANT to be spammed with info in post credits, so why not fucking use that instead? Absurd.

This movie would have worked better if they had done the following:

1.Removed Lex Luthor entirely.
2. Remove Doomsday.
3. Superman's road to redemption in the eyes of the citizens should have been after the senate hearing, and he should have then pledged himself to the American government, which should have lead to him and Batman having some sort of confrontation both of them fully understanding where the other is coming from, but one in which neither can back out from.
4. With that time freed up, I'd have spent another 10 minutes trying to get Batman/Clark/Loise/Martha Kent together at the Kent farm having a lunch and getting to know each other.
5. Some more scenes with Holly Hunter's character. She should have been the one to convince Superman to not subordinate himself to the government any more after she witnesses how human corruption is worse than letting Superman do his own thing.
6. NO justice league stuff. Just a postcredit sequence would have been enough.

There basically shouldn't have been a bad guy in this movie aside from an ideology clash. And guess what, the death count would have been a lot lower too. And you'd have a lot more time to do more things.

This movie feels as though a bunch of comicbook nerds got together and decided to make their own elseworld story. Someone high up took a serious fucking risk. Did you ever expect yourself to see desert Batman being attacked by an army of Superman henchman, whilst fucking PARADEMONS are flying all across and around? But that's exactly what you got. That's fucking incredible,and you got that.

This movie has its flaws, but it is no way a terrible movie the likes of which some people would have you believe. It is mediocre in some aspects, nothing more offensive than what other superhero movies have done to us in the past few years. It is in some major aspects, superior to some of the latest superhero movies we have seen. The director's cut will win more people over, I am sure, it really felt as though there were some things they couldn't fit in there for the sake of timing.

It looks like it is rewatchable. Which for me is the metric of an enjoyable film for me personally. But like all other superhero movies, the big climax at the end the biggest hurdle stopping me from being able to that after a few times. They all have these boring endings, where CGI is just THROWN in your face whether you like it or not. It's a horrible thing they all do nowadays.
 
The entire Lex/Senator plotline was baffling to me: If you found a rock you want to keep on the ocean floor, would you 1) have it put it on a boat and bring it home, or 2) have meetings with the junior senator from Kentucky to see if she can okay bringing it into the US?

Then she blocks the import license (which I'm pretty sure a senator can't do as it's a federal agency that regulates them), and Lex just...puts it on a boat and brings it home.

Maybe Lex kills her before she has the opportunity exercise whatever authority she has to block the license. Clearly she's got pull in that department, which is why he talked to her in the first place.
 
The entire Lex/Senator plotline was baffling to me: If you found a rock you want to keep on the ocean floor, would you 1) have it put it on a boat and bring it home, or 2) have meetings with the junior senator from Kentucky to see if she can okay bringing it into the US?

Then she blocks the import license (which I'm pretty sure a senator can't do as it's a federal agency that regulates them), and Lex just...puts it on a boat and brings it home anyway.

So he kills her out of spite? Along with Mercy? He was doing illegal shit from the get go. Why ask permission for that?
 
It's weird how this movie simultaneously treats the audience like idiots and leaves things completely unexplained. Like the courtroom scene where the jar is labeled and Lex's empty seat is labeled. The surveillance videos of the metahumans with convenient character logos on the folders. Bruce's lovely email to Diana "It IS you!"

And then you have man-bat, parademons, the bizarre Flash time traveling, Knightmare, Darkseid logo, etc.

Ok, you're trying way too hard dislike this movie.

1. The Senator specifically says "Piss in a jar and call it grandma's sweet tea.", the labelling is the actual punchline.

2. Lex's seat would be labelled. It's a reserved seat specifically for him.

3. If you were Batman what would you put in the email? That line is in the email for their interactions sake, not to inform the audience.
 
This is entirely wrong and wholly misses the point of the actual movie.

I don't think so.

*Superman zooms man into wall, turning him into paste*

What "lessons" did Superman learn from Man of Steel? I was promised by the director that Superman would learn the value of life after being put in a position where he ended one.

In THIS film, a lot of people lose their lives to the HEROES, and they don't have the "no choice" excuse anymore. They could easily have subdued many of them without killing but they don't.

And that goes to even that brief scene with the Flash. Did he HAVE to physically harm the guy, when we know his powers lets him restrain him without ease and lack of injury? Of course not. Like everyone else in this film, they could do it without harming or killing... but they don't want to.
 
Eh. It's a little intrusive, and you're right that it certainly doesn't help the film's pacing issues any, but it's so far and away from a primary issue. I don't see why people are so focused on it.

Because it's a primary issue. Come on dude. It's not just a little intrusive. The whole plot stops for several minutes for an unexplained and impromptu vision/dream sequence of really bizarre out-of-context shit that is followed by another unexplained and impromptu dream (maybe?) of Bruce being visited by a character who is again completely removed from context. And then none of this is mentioned again.

It's a pointless interjection (and not the only one) that further drags down the pacing in an already overstuffed movie.
 
Maybe Lex kills her before she has the opportunity exercise whatever authority she has to block the license. Clearly she's got pull in that department, which is why he talked to her in the first place.

But there's no need to even tell anyone. It's a ~12 inch rock. He could just bring it home and keep it all secret and do his thing. He needed the government to get him access to Zod and the ship, not to bring a rock home. For that matter, why not toss in, "oh and I want to bring this rock home" when he was buying favors from the corrupt senator? Why even talk to Holly Hunter's character about it?

I think she's incidental to this part of the story. The real point of the explosion in the Senate was to further heighten the Batman v Superman story, with Lex being the puppermaster working to get them to fight. The "can I bring this rock home" angle was extraneous and ultimately didn't go anywhere since he just did it anyways. (This is one of the plot threads I'd cut down hard in order to make for a more trim cut of the film.)
 
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