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[Boke1879]

And if the value proposition here comes down to raw power (which has never been the appeal of consoles imo), than MS can have an opportunity here by offering a more powerful iteration, even if it comes at a higher price.

Why buy a second PS4 with a bump in power when you could buy a new, even more powerful Xbox to compliment the PS4 you already have?

Because price will continue to be a factor imo. Assuming Neo launches for $400. I doubt MS can afford to launch another $500 console just for power. They tried it and we clearly see what happened. That's even to say MS is doing something similar, but I believe they are.

Also this move is to keep you locked into an ecosystem. I've had a PS4 since launch. invested well over a few grand into it buying games. I'm also interested in Neo. My digital library carries over and my physical. I'm all in. I'm locked in. and you're able to drop the base PS4 model to about $250-$300. Most people will buy that, but then over time they'll upgrade.

We're entering and interesting time and with change comes doubt, fear, and uncertainty. but a change is needed. Like many stated. This waiting 5,6 or 7 years then starting a new gen from scratch just isn't smart of sustainable. That's a big shock to rising dev costs, and having the potential of losing your market. Look at what happened to MS this gen.

I mean games as a service is a thing. It pretty much start last gen. When DLC became a thing. Games as a service became a thing. When season passes became a thing etc.. This industry is evolving. Will it work out? IDK. But i don't think if Neo fails the console market fails. The PS4 will still be there and your games will still work. I'm just very interested and curious.

I understand the concerns, but everything leaked so far to me curbs that concern. I just want Sony to official announce this thing so we can hear what devs are saying straight up. Something tells me it'll be different from what "sources" are saying.

 

[scoobs]

I expect a lot of "In NEO-mode the game hits it target and stays there, while the core version struggles ..."

Whether that comes to pass or not is how I'll know whether this NEO has been a negative or positive influence.

I read this in the DF guy's voice. I have officially watched too many of their videos on youtube.

 

[Flopfan]

So begins the in-house console wars.

They called it a civil war on the giantbombcast lmao

 

[Pokemaniac]

The hardware is only marginally more powerful in this case, it's not a full gen jump, it's not even a quarter gen jump.

forward BC on pc doesn't break every 3 years either it makes no sense.
You could buy a lynfield i5 and hd5870 in 2009 and still play every game on it today, and continue to play every multiplatform game on it until the end of the ps4-ps4k generation

idk why you want forward compatibility to be broken it's terrible for the user/gamer/consumer.



Not after 3+ years they don't.
I used to have a hd6870 (xbox one level performance) and the upgrade I bought 3 years later got >300 percent the performance of my old one.
noone spends hundreds of dollars to get 20 percent more performance after 3years

130 percent more gpu performance is a small iterative boost, it's not meaningless, but it's not nearly enough to do anything radically different.

A full generation jump is normally an ~1000 percent jump (and something similar for the cpu, and 16x jump for the ram), so when comparing it to a normal generational jump this spec bump is very small.

Which again is why some people are wondering what the point is.


Look at last gen, whether you had a 7800gtx or an 8800gt, by the end of the gen the difference between them and a modern gpu dwarfed the difference between the two, so they were both outdated all the same.
By the time the ps4 is at the end of its life and ps5 is about to release if it's supposed to be another 8 year gen (that is the argument , right? that ps4k is somehow supposed to extend this generation) the ps4k will be badly outdated just the same as the ps4.

If the goal was the extend the generation then a ps4k isn't going to help
if it's just a random intermediary spec bump before a normal length (5-6 year) generation switch then it's fine.


You can't really compare tflop numbers between very different architectures

the hd5870 was a 2.7TF gpu on paper yet the 1.8TF hd7850 (GCN, brand new architecture compared to the 5870) in ps4 is obviously performs a good 50-60 percent faster in games.

Not that the xbox one was a full generation jump, it clearly wasn't, and it suffers for it in current gen ports.

If a ps5 is only a 5x jump from ps4 it would be incredibly dissapointing.

All of the iterative handheld released by Nintendo, which all have comparable bumps, have exclusive games. The exclusives are usually what really justifies the existence of these types of revisions. The PS4k really should be no different.

 

[Boke1879]

I expect a lot of "In NEO-mode the game hits it target and stays there, while the core version struggles ..."

Whether that comes to pass or not is how I'll know whether this NEO has been a negative or positive influence.

This is what i feel far too many people will focus on honestly. Any little framedrop or hitch will be attributed to devs not paying attention to the regular old PS4. when in reality a lot of games don't hit the mark when it comes to frames etc. Just look at last gen. TLOU. ND who probably had the most experience and prestige regarding the hardware couldn't stop some of the technical things from happening. It happens. Didn't stop anyone from enjoying the experience, didn't stop it from being a great game and it didn't stop it from selling a shit ton. They also did a remastered version which is kinda what would happen with Neo right?

 

[NullPointer]

Because price will continue to be a factor imo. Assuming Neo launches for $400. I doubt MS can afford to launch another $500 console just for power. They tried it and we clearly see what happened. That's even to say MS is doing something similar, but I believe they are.

Also this move is to keep you locked into an ecosystem. [...]

But isn't something like the NEO aimed at the hardcore of the hardcore? Those with more expendable income willing to shell out extra cash for extra power? If so, make the upgrade sizable, and charge a premium for it. That Elite controller for the Xbox sure as hell wasn't cheap, but that audience ate it up.

And in this era of multiplatform game dominance, what need is there for platform or brand loyalty, and how well can you really lock somebody in without a wealth of exclusives? Why not go where the power is and buy your *new* multiplatforms on the more powerful console while enjoying the exclusives you missed from sticking with the other platform?

 

[Alebrije]

I will! Wait for PS5......"if"

 

[Boke1879]

All of the iterative handheld released by Nintendo, which all have comparable bumps, have exclusive games. The exclusives are usually what really justifies the existence of these types of revisions. The PS4k really should be no different.

Content will always be key. That said this is what I see happening. Base PS4 is like $250-$300.

Neo PS4. $400 but bundled with a game. COD, Star Wars, Horizon, GOW4.


That's how they'll drive adoption among new customers imo.

 

[hesido]

I expect a lot of "In NEO-mode the game hits it target and stays there, while the core version struggles ..."

Whether that comes to pass or not is how I'll know whether this NEO has been a negative or positive influence.

I too expect a lot of this and softening remarks such as "but the frame rate dips and slightly lower resolution in no way takes away the enjoyment of the games."

I'd also like to know how many games will be delayed because of NEO. But we'll never be able to know, as if anyone is going to admit that.

 

[potatohead]

Not after 3+ years they don't.
I used to have a hd6870 (xbox one level performance) and the upgrade I bought 3 years later got >300 percent the performance of my old one.

Let's say double or triple performance on PC GPUs within 3 years upgrading, which is similar to what happens. That's the same as what PS4K is offering.

What I was trying to point out though is that people on the PC side upgrade on their own terms. Sometimes that's as little as one year, and they are willing to spend an extra $100 (assuming reselling the older GPU) for a 20% or 30% boost in perf.

I personally wait several years, I upgraded from a 9800 GTX to a 760 GTX and got probably 5 times perf.

 

[RadioJoNES64]

One thing that intrigues me is how Sony is going to handle software being cut off from a model. Say in theory that the PS4 may be able to handle PS5 games on very low settings but not PS5.5 games. Wouldn't hardware generations still exist between every 4 - 8 years?

 

[Boke1879]

But isn't something like the NEO aimed at the hardcore of the hardcore? Those with more expendable income willing to shell out extra cash for extra power? If so, make the upgrade sizable, and charge a premium for it. That Elite controller for the Xbox sure as hell wasn't cheap, but that audience ate it up.

And in this era of multiplatform game dominance, what need is there for platform or brand loyalty, and how well can you really lock somebody in without a wealth of exclusives? Why not go where the power is and buy your *new* multiplatforms on the more powerful console while enjoying the exclusives you missed from sticking with the other platform?

But the hardcore didn't even eat up a $500 Xbox One. I just think for a console no one wants to touch that price in this arena right now.

 

[NullPointer]

But the hardcore didn't even eat up a $500 Xbox One.

It was $500 because of Kinect, not because it blew the PS4 away in terms of performance. That wasn't an appeal to the hardcore, it was an appeal to a wider audience.

The PS4 is both the most powerful and the cheaper option between the two.

 

[Gren]

I'm just waiting on the official statement regarding how all of this is going to work. Forward-compatibility should be a given, but then stranger things have happened.

One thing I'm curious about is how long future support would be handled, i.e. can I be assured that my PS4 will be able to not only play all games across it & the PS4K's library, but also the inevitable PS5's, or will I need to upgrade to a new console every other iteration? And what of smaller, less graphically intensive games; is there any reason I couldn't expect a more simplistic PS5 title to work on my PS4, and if so, how will they be identified as such (special icons on packaging/storefront pages)?

Right now this whole thing is much like the original Xbox One roadmap; a lot of speculation but not enough concrete info (though in this case we're at least still waiting on the official word).

 

[Boke1879]

One thing that intrigues me is how Sony is going to handle software being cut off from a model. Say in theory that the PS4 may be able to handle PS5 games on very low settings but not PS5.5 games. Wouldn't hardware generations still exist between every 4 - 8 years?

At some point the base PS4 will be phased out of retail, and while yes in theory those games released for PS5.5 could work. This is when people will start to upgrade past the base PS4 model if everything works as it should.

 

[Orniletter]

You're all entitled to be excited by this development but it really is a turn off for me. I loved the stability of being a console gamer. I don't want my console to be like my cell phone, where in 2 years im ages behind if I don't upgrade. Will be interesting to see how this turns out but I can honestly say my ps4 might be my last Playstation console. Those are just my honest personal feelings as a consumer.

I really do feel the same.

PlayStations used to be the only place where you'd get these awesome, tasty japanese thirdparty games. Close to everything is on PC now too and the PS4 is more like the amalgamation of console bullshit (online fee requirement, higher game prices) now combined with PC drawbacks (upgrade or suffer, zero plug and play everything has to be installed and updated with gigantic patches etc.).

Might as well go PC and reap the benefits.

And yeah, it's great that the OP made a case for the billion dollar company and why this shift is in their best interest, but I'm still not convinced this is any good for consumers.

 

[hesido]

But the hardcore didn't even eat up a $500 Xbox One. I just think for a console no one wants to touch that price in this arena right now.

But I that was the only Xbox one MS could offer to set a base number of customers. PS Neo could be priced 1000 USD and Sony could still be on selling a buttload of PS4 the original. 10 percent of user base that wants a premium product at 399 - 449 would still make Sony money and PS neo could be the cheap entry level product when PS Trinity is introduced.. (Not to be mixed with PS three)

 

[Boke1879]

I really do feel the same.

PlayStations used to be the only place where you'd get these awesome, tasty japanese thirdparty games. Close to everything is on PC now too and the PS4 is more like the amalgamation of console bullshit (online fee requirement, higher game prices) now combined with PC drawbacks (upgrade or suffer, zero plug and play everything has to be installed and updated with gigantic patches etc.).

Might as well go PC and reap the benefits.

And yeah, it's great that the OP made a case for the billion dollar company and why this shift is in their best interest, but I'm still not convinced this is any good for consumers.

The shifts benefit the industry at large and people like me who wish for a bit more power. If you have a base PS4 you don't have to upgrade. You're not forced or required to.

And why are we will on this "upgrade or suffer". Do you know for a fact base PS4 games will run at 15 fps and be shit? Or can you be content with something that looks liked Uncharted 4?

 

[Arnie7]

The key here is the x86 architecture. All these consoles will be backwards compatible. Consoles have finally caught up with the market. Like PC gaming those that can afford the latest product can play game on ultra settings. Those that' don't care about graphics can still play the same game at lower setting with normal ps4. Games will always be there but the only difference is will you want to keep up with the latest.

 

[NahaNago]

But isn't something like the NEO aimed at the hardcore of the hardcore? Those with more expendable income willing to shell out extra cash for extra power? If so, make the upgrade sizable, and charge a premium for it. That Elite controller for the Xbox sure as hell wasn't cheap, but that audience ate it up.

And in this era of multiplatform game dominance, what need is there for platform or brand loyalty, and how well can you really lock somebody in without a wealth of exclusives? Why not go where the power is and buy your *new* multiplatforms on the more powerful console while enjoying the exclusives you missed from sticking with the other platform?

Isn't the point of these future upgrades brand loyalty instead of generational loyalty. All the games you already own on the newest and greatest upgrade model in order to keep you from jumping from brand to brand.

 

[soul creator]

"Now games might not run well on the regular PS4!" seems like an odd worry to have, considering that already happens with PS4 games. Unless the argument is that the Neo will somehow make this more pervasive due to developers focusing their efforts on the new system and ignoring the old one. But considering the install base on the old system is gonna far outweigh the new system, there's no incentive for developers to instantly make the neo version some amazing required thing and make the base version completely unplayable all of a sudden. Sure, it could happen, but again, unplayable games have existed for all of console history, so if that's the worry, there are far more relevant factors to focus on.

It does seem like every potential drawback/worry that people have is something that already exists (like with PC vs. PS4/XB1 versions), and there's no incentive in place or evidence that indicates it will be appreciably worse with the Neo, beyond what seems to be a vague feeling. Even the Hyrule Warriors example that people point to is a single game (and of course, poorly running games have existed on the 3DS since launch, way before the New 3DS existed). If there was any indication that Sony was breaking game compatibility and making Neo-exclusive games in the near future, I could see worry, but that's obviously not happening. By the time Neo-exclusive games hypothetically become a thing, it would be around the time of the typical new console launch anyway.

I guess some might think of cross-gen PS3/PS4 games, but that's hardly the same thing due to the drastically different OS/online/development environments for each. Game design itself is not gonna drastically change based on the new system's existence. Though maybe now, Rockstar's games will finally fill in any missing grass!

The Neo is a bit faster PS4. If you're looking to buy a new PS4, and the price isn't drastically more, it might make sense to wait for the Neo. If you have a PS4 already, continue to buy games you're interested in. If the Neo enhancements look awesome enough to be worth the money, then pretend like it's a new Slim model and upgrade.

My guess as to what most developers will do? Still develop PS4/XB1/PC games like they've always been doing, and then see if there's any time/budget to make tweaks for any Neo enhancements.

 

[NullPointer]

Isn't the point of these future upgrades brand loyalty instead of generational loyalty. All the games you already own on the newest and greatest upgrade model in order to keep you from jumping from brand to brand.

I'm just thinking, if you have a PS4 and a library of PS4 games, you'll still have that after the NEO releases.

But if the NEO's core value proposition is more power, and MS makes an Xbox 1.5 with even more power, than the upgrade options take on a new color.

You could buy a NEO, and have a PS4 with some extra power and that can play some, (mostly newer) games better, or you could buy an Xbox 1.5 with even more power, buy your new multiplatforms on that machine, and buy into the exclusives you've missed, some of which will play much better than they would on a regular Xbox, presuming the Xbox iterative model is similar to the NEO. At that point the Xbox looks pretty good.

 

[Moonstone]

Smh, so much for giving benefit of the doubt

Well it is just a twitter quote. I can see why some devs might not like this. Because Sony prohibits later Neo patches after October. And right now devs are probably on crunchtime to get the Q4 titles out.

While creating different profiles might no be a big thing in general, not everybody has probably a new devkit right now and the API might not be finalized. Indie devs that want to release in Q3-Q4 might be under stress (and probably lack necessary information right now).

You do realize that if in 2 to 3 years you multiply performance by 3 times, that means in 4 to 6 years you multiply performance by 9 times right if the same function is used?

Well, I think what chubigans wanted to point out - that we don't see those huge performance boosts as in the past. Moore's law doesn't work anymore.

Right now there is a big step, because of 14nm process for GPUs, HBM2 and AMD has a new CPU architecture (ZEN) coming. But after that? The shrink to 10nm will take some time. And there is probably an end at 7nm. The PS3 debuted at 90nm!

So we will reach a point (we actually have reached it already), where performance won't double every year.

In the meanwhile we get other new technologies like M.2 SSDs, DDR4 RAM Disks, USB 3.1, 4k Bluray and so on. An iterative model is better able to adapt to new tech.
With realy long circles there is a point where you have to release - no matter what tech is out. Because of competition or declining sales of current gen hardware.

And what people also seem to forget is that XboxOne and PS4 are SoC designs.
So two chips have to be merged into one. There is always a tradeoff between CPU and GPU. It is not comparable to PC where you just install a better CPU or GPU. Ps4/Ps4k might look too weak. But it is possible that this is the best they could do. Without designing a complete new chip that would cost a lot more.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

I think I'm just going to wait for Sony to explain their plans. There are so many angles you can go at this both commending and condemning it.

I really don't like the idea of waiting another two months at least though....

 

[KAL2006]

I'd like to see 3 year console cycle, with system getting 6 years support. So when PS4.6 releases, Sony drop support for PS4, and all games use PS4.5 as a base.

 

[NahaNago]

I'm just thinking, if you have a PS4 and a library of PS4 games, you'll still have that after the NEO releases.

But if the NEO's core value proposition is more power, and MS makes an Xbox 1.5 with even more power, than the upgrade options take on a new color.

You could buy a NEO, and have a PS4 with some extra power and that can play some, (mostly newer) games better, or you could buy an Xbox 1.5 with even more power, buy your new multiplatforms on that machine, and buy into the exclusives you've missed, some of which will play much better than they would on a regular Xbox, presuming the Xbox iterative model is similar to the NEO. At that point the Xbox looks pretty good.

That is no different from how someone buys multiple consoles in a generation especially in comparison to the start of the one we just had except in reverse with xb being the weaker console .

 

[NullPointer]

That is no different from how someone buys multiple consoles in a generation especially in comparison to the start of the one we just had except in reverse with xb being the weaker console .

Just pointing out that the NEO doesn't lock people into the platform if MS decides to make a more powerful iteration of their own. In fact, it could provide MS an opportunity to win some of those customers into the Xbox and Xbox/PC fold.

 

[YuShtink]

Meh, this whole thing has been the final nail in the coffin with me and consoles. I won't be buying any more. My 2 year old consoles are already going to be second fiddle? When my PC already takes a dump all over both to begin with (and all over the PS4K to boot)? I was still in it for the exclusives this gen but this is the end for me. All PC from now on. Consoles are literally becoming low mid-range PCs. All of the benefits of owning a console instead will now be gone.

 

[metareferential]

Meh, this whole thing has been the final nail in the coffin with me and consoles. I won't be buying any more. My 2 year old consoles are already going to be second fiddle? When my PC already takes a dump all over both to begin with (and all over the PS4K to boot)? I was still in it for the exclusives this gen but this is the end for me. All PC from now on. Consoles are literally becoming low mid-range PCs. All of the benefits of owning a console instead will now be gone.

I doesn't change a thing for pc players who also happen to like console exclusives; it doesn't make your console irrelevant, it's effectively the other way around. More skus will likely mean more options and also cheaper ones (since gaming on pc first and foremost means buying very few games).

With the added benefit of forward compatibility (you can wait before upgrading) . It's a win-win situation.

 

[XxRampage07xX]

I'd like to see 3 year console cycle, with system getting 6 years support. So when PS4.6 releases, Sony drop support for PS4, and all games use PS4.5 as a base.

But how do you explain it to PS4 users? Or will you just say "Attention to current PS4 users. The software support for PS4 has been terminated and thus, you won't be able to play any of upcoming games. So for now, you have two options: Upgrade your system and enjoy new games or just stick to your PS4 and play old ass games. The choice is yours. Peace!" in every commercial?

 

[Alienous]

The way I see it, one of two things will result.

The NEO gets PS4 up-ports with resolution/frame-rate upgrades. This is relatively benign, and more likely considering the limitations of the Xbox One and potentially of the NX.

Or the PS4 gets down-ports of games that are designed using the capability of the NEO. Because games must be playable on both it could mean more poorly performing PS4 titles, as one of the primary benefits of console gaming is further watered down ('This version of the game is designed around the capabilities of your hardware'). I can see "But it runs fine on NEO" being a benchmark.

For me it's a case of the benefits not outweighing the problems, especially the potential precedent of iterative hardware that dilutes the idea of a console as a static, 'Let's get all we can out of the hardware' platform

 

[soul creator]

Meh, this whole thing has been the final nail in the coffin with me and consoles. I won't be buying any more. My 2 year old consoles are already going to be second fiddle? When my PC already takes a dump all over both to begin with (and all over the PS4K to boot)? I was still in it for the exclusives this gen but this is the end for me. All PC from now on. Consoles are literally becoming low mid-range PCs. All of the benefits of owning a console instead will now be gone.

Before Neo: Your gaming PC dumps all over your 2 year old console for most 3rd party games, but the consoles may have had exclusive games you wanted.

After Neo: Your gaming PC will dump all over consoles for most 3rd party games, but the consoles may have exclusive games you want.

What's changed?

 

[-Horizon-]

They called it a civil war on the giantbombcast lmao

#TeamOG

 

[Lord Phol]

I will have to see exactly what this console is and what it will mean for future games and the original PS4 first before I pass judgment. If it ends up being just a better PS4 though than that's it for me, no more consoles from Sony and most likely Microsoft. I all ready have a PC, I don't need another one, and I can't afford it either. There's two reasons for me to own a console and that is exclusives and comfort. This would remove the comfort factor, and it will take more than just a few exclusives (which are becoming less and less as more developers are porting to PC) to make me fork up money for console upgrades.

 

[potatohead]

Well, I think what chubigans wanted to point out - that we don't see those huge performance boosts as in the past. Moore's law doesn't work anymore.

The guy I was responding to was expecting a 5x increase in GPU performance within 3 years as PS4K will be.

Was just pointing out how it doesn't even make sense, and not just because Moore's Law is getting tighter.

He was claiming that if you get 10x perf. between generations, halfway in you should have 5x perf. as if it was linear increases.

Which doesn't make any sense (the latter half of that timeline would only see a 2x increase in perf. then).

I'm not expecting doubling of performance every year, that simply doesn't happen these days, and hasn't happened for years if not decades. That's exactly what I was saying.

 

[Refreshment.01]

Can you elaborate? Thanks.

There's a PS3.75 developers have been design games for since 2013. It's even a bit harder to design for than it will be for the Neo XD

 

[NahaNago]

Just pointing out that the NEO doesn't lock people into the platform if MS decides to make a more powerful iteration of their own. In fact, it could provide MS an opportunity to win some of those customers into the Xbox and Xbox/PC fold.

I understand why the console makers would like multiple versions of their consoles and even why publishers would like them as well i just don't see as much of a benefit for the gamer outside of getting a more powerful version of the console . On to the second point if Microsoft doesn't release their xbox 1.5 this year then they have to compete with 2 consoles more powerful than it for 4 years straight that will leave them with 2 years left for this gen that is if we are still getting a ps5 in the ps4's 6th year.

need sleep.

 

[Mass_Pincup]

I expect a lot of "In NEO-mode the game hits it target and stays there, while the core version struggles ..."

Whether that comes to pass or not is how I'll know whether this NEO has been a negative or positive influence.

That's what I also expect and fear.

 

[BleedOrange]

I mean if you're okay with Sony making the Playstation more like a PC with literally none of the benefits of PC gaming then sure you'd be okay with this.

Before Neo: Your gaming PC dumps all over your 2 year old console for most 3rd party games, but the consoles may have had exclusive games you wanted.

After Neo: Your gaming PC will dump all over consoles for most 3rd party games, but the consoles may have exclusive games you want.

What's changed?

The weight of your wallet.

 

[Hawk269]

But isn't something like the NEO aimed at the hardcore of the hardcore? Those with more expendable income willing to shell out extra cash for extra power? If so, make the upgrade sizable, and charge a premium for it. That Elite controller for the Xbox sure as hell wasn't cheap, but that audience ate it up.

And in this era of multiplatform game dominance, what need is there for platform or brand loyalty, and how well can you really lock somebody in without a wealth of exclusives? Why not go where the power is and buy your *new* multiplatforms on the more powerful console while enjoying the exclusives you missed from sticking with the other platform?

Not necessarily. I think to a certain degree it is aimed at the hardcore, but it is also aimed as a Trojan Horse for Sony and 4k Blu Ray. Sony is one of the biggest supporters and makers of UHD Sets, but isn't it odd that they are one of the only players without an announced UHD Blu Ray Player? I have a few friends that work at Best Buy and they are reporting that the Samsung UHD player is selling like crazy due to them having the only player out. From what I have read Panasonic is going to release a player soon as well and they don't even have any of their 2016 UHD TV sets available in the U.S.

The NEO is aimed at the consumer that wants a higher end product and that also has a UHD Blu Ray player. If the $399.99 price sticks and it does come with the UHD player, that is the same price of the Samsung, plus you get a console in it as well. The NEO is going to be the box that makes people think twice before choosing. Do I go with (at the time most likely) $299.99 PS4 or spend and extra $100 and go for the Neo that also has a UHD player?

So while I believe to a certain degree that the NEO is aimed at hardcore, it is also aimed at the everyday consumer that wants the higher end gear and with the adoption of 4k TV's, Sony will have a sure fire hit with this unit. The thing also won't be a hard sell to a consumer. A $100.00 difference for better gaming performance and a UHD player is nothing to sneeze at and imho many would choose to go with the higher priced unit because of what you get with it..that is if all this is true anyways!

 

[potatohead]

I mean if you're okay with Sony making the Playstation more like a PC with literally none of the benefits of PC gaming then sure you'd be okay with this.

Except it's still nothing like a PC, just a more beefy console?

Just sitting here reading that from my gaming PC, and sorry, there's really nowhere it makes sense.

Slightly more like a PC doesn't make PS4K anything even remotely like a PC still.

 

[Mechanized]

Lol don't over inflate this as some monumental sea change. Sony wants to sell 4k tvs and new hardware. The end.

 

[Hawk269]

Lol don't over inflate this as some monumental sea change. Sony wants to sell 4k tvs and new hardware. The end.

Yup that is basically in a very short way what I posted above...Neo is a Trojan Horse for Sony's UHD player and boosting gaming performance just sweetens the deal even more.

 

[Alienous]

Except it's still nothing like a PC, just a more beefy console?

Just sitting here reading that from my gaming PC, and sorry, there's really nowhere it makes sense.

Slightly more like a PC doesn't make PS4K anything even remotely like a PC still.

He didn't say that the PS4K was more like a PC but that the 'PlayStation' is, and I sort of agree. Different hardware playing the same software (discs/downloads) is a step in the direction of the PC.

 

[Sonson21]

This was a pretty good post. I've been riding the hate bandwagon full throttle, but this made me take a step back to look at the bigger picture. And well maybe it's not all doom and gloom as I thought before.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I personally feel the upgrade doesn't go far enough.

Its not supposed to be a representation of how they want to do console jumps in the future to me. But what they could get away with today for a more powerful branch of the base PS4's internals for that price.

 

[jroc74]

Nice write up. With that negative opinion/tweet getting so much attention its nice to see a positive one.

Or you're allowing people with the disposable income to buy a slightly better experience and allow 4K tv owners to get actual 4K video output upscaled for the tvs they use?

Like Chub says, the market will decide.

But like airline seats, tickets to the football match or movie seats, if you're willing to pay more, you can have a slightly better experience. But everyone gets to the same destination, everyone sees the same match, everyone sees the same film.

Honestly GAF is looking too deep into this. All this is is a 4K PS4 and that'll be it's main selling point. It's being sold right alongside the regular PS4 and Sony isn't splitting the userbase. When this thing is announced, nothing much will change, the sky won't fall, and all this speculation will be for nothing. It's a premium product for people who want it. Nothing more, nothing less.

Yup.

I look at the phone market with low end, mid range and high end. If this is really gonna be a bad thing...there would only be one type of phone sold. iPhones wouldnt be cheaper now, pre paid carriers wouldnt even exist. If other markets can survive with low - high end why cant consoles?

Well there used to be a platform where in multiplayer games everyone was getting the same resolution and performance. And now there's none.

This is my answer to that:

This does happen on PC, even if we don't realize it all the time.

If I play at 40 fps and someone else at 144 fps, I'm not going to know.

And really, I don't care that much either.

Yup. And to those worried about unfair advantages in MP games....please, please, please post your concerns in cross network play threads. Because if cross network play becomes a regular thing....Just imagine PC, PS4, XBO and Wii U players all in a game of Rocket League together...even if you leave PC out....PS4, XBO, Wii U.

Cant have it both ways. PC users have multiple, multiple cpu/gpu configs and they survive in MP games.

I think many of Nintendo's statements about their next hardware, even before the codename of NX was mentioned, indicate that it could very well be iterative. The whole concept that Iwata laid out, i.e. more than two form factors, regardless of the performance of each system, combined with the Supplemental Computing Device patents, would indicate that NX may very well encompass multiple game systems, be iterative, allow optional SCDs for better game performance and span generations of hardware (if not outright replaced by iterations). All NX platforms running the same OS, the same ecosystem for users, having the same development environment for devs, etc.

While these things aren't confirmed, everything said so far, and Nintendo patents, indicate this is direction Nintendo is going.

Yea Nintendo is going in this direction too. "like brothers in a family" or something like that from his quote.

Well-written but I'm skeptical the games as a service ecosystem works for the console audience. Manufacturers are losing a powerful marketing tool - the brand new generational launch and the big price drop. How excited can you get about a mildly iterative console that plays the same games?

This kinda sounds like what led to the U.S. game industry crash - too many undifferentiated boxes on the market that play the same games.

This doesnt hurt the smartphone market with low-high end phones. Auto market with luxury cars, etc.

If revisions last gen didnt cause the industry to crash I doubt this will. And at the most we will have the same 4 platforms: Sony, MS, Nintendo and PC. PS4 and PS4K is supposed to play the exact same disc. Thats nothing like when we had at one time consoles on the market from 6-10 different companies.

 

[Jacksinthe]

But how do you explain it to PS4 users? Or will you just say "Attention to current PS4 users. The software support for PS4 has been terminated and thus, you won't be able to play any of upcoming games. So for now, you have two options: Upgrade your system and enjoy new games or just stick to your PS4 and play old ass games. The choice is yours. Peace!" in every commercial?

The same way it's done with generations now - how would it change?

The exception: perhaps now we will get consistency and predictability with what will release which gen and how long support will last. Now we can normalize the rate at which a new box releases with iterative updates. We technically could have before, but technology moves either too much or too little to pull the trigger at one point or another. With this, there's not much of a wait between iterations so you can always take advantage of current tech in a cost effective manner and still stay relevant.

 

[Uncle Moe]

I get the advantages. This is the N64 expansion pak to the next level. But let's not pretend this is great for gamers as consumers or the console industry. This is solely about a giant corporation who wants to use declining hardware sales and leverage its brand into higher profit margins with new consoles. Apple and phone manufacturers are highly successful with convincing consumers that they need the next years phone because of the 2 megapixel camera increase and slight change to gpu etc..

Excellent riposte. I'm firmly in the Madness (et al.) camp.

 

[BleedOrange]

Except it's still nothing like a PC, just a more beefy console?

Just sitting here reading that from my gaming PC, and sorry, there's really nowhere it makes sense.

Slightly more like a PC doesn't make PS4K anything even remotely like a PC still.

If you own a gaming PC there's usually 1 of 2 incentives to do so:

1. To play PC exclusive games
2. To play multiplatform games at the highest possible quality

Sony's solution to #2 is to sell you a box with all of the console downsides (pay to use your own internet connection, closed platform, no third party stores), but none of the goodness that the PC solution gives you (free multiplayer, open platform, a gazillion competing stores).

TBH I think the only reason that Sony wants to put this out is so that their VR headset doesn't get left in the dust by the big boys. That, and they would love to sell you another $400-500 box.