Star Fox Zero |OT| The Fox Awakens

Z3M0G said:
(I was gonna start a new thread but figured that wasn't worth it... so I'll just leave this here.)

Parallels between Metroid: Other M and Star Fox Zero

Both Star Fox and Metroid are beloved franchises to Nintendo fans, yet have not been getting the love that many of us feel they deserve. But is that lack of love justified? Nintendo likely knows very well just how new games in this franchise are going to sell, but eventually give in to fan demand while the given console was in a drought of major (or any) game releases. I feel there are significant parallels between these two games:

Both games Nintendo probably didn't want to risk making, but gave in to demand from the fans. (As already suggested above, and this one is only a personal suspicion.)

Both Nintendo IPs that had 3rd party developers pulled in for development:
>> Metroid Other M - Team Ninja
>> Star Fox Zero - Platinum Games

Both games had controversial control schemes to serve as a final "justification" of their respective console's input methods:
>> Metroid Other M - switching between sideways hold and pointer hold in the heat of action (did anyone consider this choice as something that improved the gameplay?)
>> Star Fox Zero - using both screens in parallel in the heat of action, intentionally keeping either view from being viable on its own (from what I gather, yet to try it myself)

I'm not sure if the parallels end there or not... this is just something that came to mind suddenly.
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It's a stretch, especially since we know exactly why and how Star Fox Zero happened and we probably also know the story behind Other M and Metroid games in general but I don't remember the specifics right now. They're quite open about all of it. Not sure why there's need for fanfic speculation^^

Also, yes, the Wiimote flip in OM was awesome because you got classic controls AND motion aiming. And doing it just felt cool.
 
Anyone got any tips on beating Salvadora in 1:15:00 or less? I figure there has to be some trick where you just whip out the whole battle ship all at once.
 
I beat it last night

Dear God, I really tried to adjust to it, I really did but the controls just kill this game for me. Any difficulty didn't come from the game being challenging, but from me fighting with the controls. It's just clunky and having to constantly adjust the targeting reticle gets old quickly. The characters keep screaming about using the gamepad to aim, but even then it still seems off and shots seem to miss even when aimed dead on in the reticle. All I could keep thinking is "If this game had normal controls, it'd be fantastic". Reading impressions, It seems that the controls are something people either instantly love or absolutely hate, which is no surprise.

The graphics are great, the nostalgic touches are perfect and the actual difficulty of the game itself is pretty balanced. I'm going back through to conplete all the alternate paths and collect medals. Maybe something will click eventually control-wise but I just don't see it happening after this much time with it.
 
ryan13ts said:
I beat it last night

Dear God, I really tried to adjust to it, I really did but the controls just kill this game for me. Any difficulty didn't come from the game being challenging, but from me fighting with the controls. It's just clunky and having to constantly adjust the targeting reticle gets old quickly. The characters keep screaming about using the gamepad to aim, but even then it still seems off and shots seem to miss even when aimed dead on in the reticle. All I could keep thinking is "If this game had normal controls, it'd be fantastic". Reading impressions, It seems that the controls are something people either instantly love or absolutely hate, which is no surprise.

The graphics are great, the nostalgic touches are perfect and the actual difficulty of the game itself is pretty balanced. I'm going back through to conplete all the alternate paths and collect medals. Maybe something will click eventually control-wise but I just don't see it happening after this much time with it.
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It does get easier after subsequent playthroughs of levels.

One thing that I found useful was that the targeting reticles aren't really 1:1 with where the lasers go -- it shows the linear path the laser will get on in 3D space. This actually through me off in SF643D when I went back and played it.

I think in this game the Arwing takes up much less of the screen than in 64 on average, and it kind of exacerbates the aiming issue.
 
Just did a pure cockpit only arcade run (press minus at start of every level)... Everyone needs to do this at list once. Don't ever look at the wiipad till last part of andross (to dodge lame bites before mission accomplished). The game felt so fast and new even if I all ready cleared it all. I had no idea I can handle all range mode so well also the wolf dog fights are so intense. Ok then going to get splitter for sound and record a full run.

Oh ya one tip, use Walker with targeting to help out in all range mode if you can't follow target to well or to shoot gigarilla after flying around it... I love this game.
 
So I did a lot more coop yesterday In the pilot role and I'll be damned if it isn't good fun. There's also some competitiveness in seeing which person's going to get the most kills per section but it always boils down to how good you work with your partner when going for the overall score. The Zoness alternate mission is also pretty fun to speedrun in that mode. Since getting spotted isn't, or at least for us wasn't, an issue my friend in the gunner role had to always be watching out for the security systems while dealing with me speeding everywhere. There's also a lot of teamwork involved in having the gunner guide you doing the segments when the tv is showing a brief cutscene but you're still able to move around.
 
Formless said:
It does get easier after subsequent playthroughs of levels.

One thing that I found useful was that the targeting reticles aren't really 1:1 with where the lasers go -- it shows the linear path the laser will get on in 3D space. This actually through me off in SF643D when I went back and played it.

I think in this game the Arwing takes up much less of the screen than in 64 on average, and it kind of exacerbates the aiming issue.
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I'll have to try and keep that in mind on replay. The targeting really was a big issue for me, especially in the last fight with Andross when you have to hit those really small targets on his hand and they always seem to miss just above or below the spot.
 
Labrynian Rebel said:
Shame.
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would you take it without the fur texture?

this is the best I can do without spending an unreasonable amount of time on it^^

zerodapod.png


edit: just noticing the little specks of leftover stuff in the empty space, I'd clean that up ofc^^
 
Finally beat Andross, took a bit of patience near the end but I certainly had fun figuring it out over time.

Now to find all the secret exits 🙃 I'm certainly enjoying this game much more than I ever thought I would and for myself I'd have to say it's because of the dual screen/motion aspect, I like both the challenge of it and the immersion factor it brings to the game for me.
 
Gave up on this tonight about 8/9 levels in, I just can't deal with the camera going off the thing I'm controlling during cutscenes or big battles and then the clunky controls which are different for each of the vehicles.

It's a shame, because the game is a blast in the very small parts but then the reticle is always off and then needs readjusting. Aim dead center and your lasers are off my miles.

The biggest battles in this game are sadly the ones the player has with the controls and camera. Epic scenes.

Sorry, but I REALLY gave it my best.
 
I just beat the game. I had tons of fun...but that's because the game is working off a really great template (Starfox 64)

Is Nintendo too afraid to go past the Lylat wars? This is the third time they remade it. Every other non-Lylat iteration was never a true successor..we've never had a TRUE Starfox 2. Weird....

Motion controls were garbage but...eh...I learned to adjust.

One thing that REALLY grinded my gears -
The whole James McCloud thing was TOO on the nose. In the original, only Fox could see him, making it a powerful moment when he's scouring the skies looking for what he thinks is his father. Did he really see him? Who knows, it's up to you to decide.
In this game, not only could Andross see him but James actually stays inside the base. why would Fox be looking up for a guy who went down the tunnel?

Eeeh, I don't know. It's basically like the Lucas treatment of the Star Wars Special Edition. Everything needs spelling out...
 
Rymuth said:
I just beat the game. I had tons of fun...but that's because the game is working off a really great template (Starfox 64)

Is Nintendo too afraid to go past the Lylat wars? This is the third time they remade it. Every other non-Lylat iteration was never a true successor..we've never had a TRUE Starfox 2. Weird....

Motion controls were garbage but...eh...I learned to adjust.

One thing that REALLY grinded my gears -
The whole James McCloud thing was TOO on the nose. In the original, only Fox could see him, making it a powerful moment when he's scouring the skies looking for what he thinks is his father. Did he really see him? Who knows, it's up to you to decide.
In this game, not only could Andross see him but James actually stays inside the base. why would Fox be looking up for a guy who went down the tunnel?

Eeeh, I don't know. It's basically like the Lucas treatment of the Star Wars Special Edition. Everything needs spelling out...
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Re Spoiler:

Well, it appears James has some sort of power of teleportation or inter-dimensional travel. He was appearing out of nowhere already, so why couldn't he appear after Andross' defeat as well?
 
Etzer said:
Gave it a shot in Photoshop! Here ya go:

JYs1MC0.png
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Hope you don't mind but I tried fixing up the rotation of the fur effect on yours and tried to get the shading to bled a bit. I'm without a mouse atm so trying to blend and smudge everything together just right isn't too easy but I think it works:
ve96ST2.png
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ElectricBlanketFire said:
Okay, I just finished the training and first mission.

Hoooooooollllllllyyyyyyyyyyy shit stop telling me to use motion controls. Does it do this for the entire game?
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Brief tibits here and there for the walker, gyrowing, and landmaster aside yes. For all 3 of those vehicles it basically just gives you a + prompt to view the controls.
 
Nanashrew said:
Saw this the other day but don't see it in the thread.

https://twitter.com/NibrocRock/status/725521089984516096



I really like SF0's design over the Smash version. Proportionally, it looks more appeasing to the eye. Especially the head. The head look more normal than that giant head in Smash.
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Yeah, a step back from the awful Assault designs.

...

Finally went in and beat Andross and unlocked/beat the Wolf levels. The medals are going to take forever; sad that the SNES sounds are locked behind them but I really enjoyed the game.
 
I went and picked the game up today, gave the first couple levels a shot.

Controls are definitely tough to adjust to, like everyone always says. Seems like it nails the look and feel of a modern Star Fox game though. I think after a bit more play I can get used to the way it controls. From reading op I just found out that I can press - to switch views, and I think that's gonna make things a lot easier.
 
Playing the game for the first time today, I'm having a helluva time trying to get use to the controls. Any tips at all? I'm really liking the game but I got to get over this curve.
 
ElectricBlanketFire said:
Okay, I just finished the training and first mission.

Hoooooooollllllllyyyyyyyyyyy shit stop telling me to use motion controls. Does it do this for the entire game?
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No. The tutorial cues are only a fraction by sector alpha (stage 2), and iirc completely gone by zoness (except for small text reminders).

I want to say that the mentions die down in that level during alternate playthroughs, but that may just be because I've gotten faster.
Of course, there's always the "You've got an enemy on your tail" sort of jabber even late in the game.
ElectricBlanketFire said:
It literally told me to use them 10 times in one mission.
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It's the intro. It's stupid, but it's done 10 minutes in.
 
M-PG71C said:
Playing the game for the first time today, I'm having a helluva time trying to get use to the controls. Any tips at all? I'm really liking the game but I got to get over this curve.
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For me I turned off motion when not shooting. I use it to guide my charge shots when needed and for slight aim adjustment. Don't focus too much on motion aiming till you are accustomed to it and turning off motion helps with that. Recenters aim and lets you get ahold of the situation. With motion always on I tend to drift and have to recalibrate my aim more often then I want. Also FPV is real nice helps improve your aim and get used to how TPV interprets the redicule, so after you get your flying controls down try playing using minus to switch views around. Think of motion as moving your head in the pilot seat to get the extra edge in targeting.

Hopefully this helps.
 
Why is the Arwing version of Zoness not accessed by getting to the portal to Zoness in your Arwing? The side paths outside of Fortuna all feel so half-assed.
 
Alpha_eX said:
Gave up on this tonight about 8/9 levels in, I just can't deal with the camera going off the thing I'm controlling during cutscenes or big battles and then the clunky controls which are different for each of the vehicles.

It's a shame, because the game is a blast in the very small parts but then the reticle is always off and then needs readjusting. Aim dead center and your lasers are off my miles.

The biggest battles in this game are sadly the ones the player has with the controls and camera. Epic scenes.

Sorry, but I REALLY gave it my best.
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Well that's why they gave you a reset button for you to quickly on the fly, recenter yourself.
 
control wise, I'm actually in-between "this is pure SHIT what a trash justification for the Gamepad its broken miyamoto has lost it" Arthur Gies hate and "omg this is the greatest thing ever totally changed the game its like Im in Star Wars miyamoto have my baby you guys aren't playing it right have you tried sliding in cover" Neiteio style hyperbole. Honestly, they're just...fine? They take a bit to get used to, but once you get used to it...you dont really think about it.

All the dope Arwing/Landmaster stages are still dope, and the boring Escort Missions/Gyrocopter/Chicken Walker stages are still boring. And they probably would've been that way with a more normal control anyway. Maybe the game would be more visually impressive if they didnt have to run the game in 60fps x2 basically, but the original three games always had pretty simple geometry, which this game REALLY wants to remind you of, for better and for worse so...

The forced perspective stuff is real shit, tho.
 
Green Mamba said:
"We have to destroy Andross's bioweapons on Fortuna!"

"Never mind, Fox just up and left mid mission and flew all the way to Fichina to fight Wolf one on one for no reason."
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Ha! I like the part where Peppy crashlands and is in held captive on Titania...unless you find the portal and he magically frees himself
 
Green Mamba said:
"We have to destroy Andross's bioweapons on Fortuna!"

"Never mind, Fox just up and left mid mission and flew all the way to Fichina to fight Wolf one on one for no reason."
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Haha, pretty much all of the mission departures feel abrupt. See also:

PEPPER: "Come in, Star Fox! Enemies have appeared in Sector Alpha! We need your help!"
FOX: "You can count on — ohmygod is that Pigma?! COME BACK HERE YOU DADDY-KILLING SUNVABITCH!"
 
M-PG71C said:
Playing the game for the first time today, I'm having a helluva time trying to get use to the controls. Any tips at all? I'm really liking the game but I got to get over this curve.
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Ok, my best advice for stoping the sucking, sorry if a little condescending.

Concentrate on being inside the cockpit first--youre a freaking space fox inside of a virtual turret at the front of your ship and you can look around 180 degrees and shoot stuff like Han Solo. Now, have you ever played a two player split screen game like Mario Kart? Pretend that you glance over and see that the other player is positioned behind you so that you can see your own ship from behind. After glancing over a few times you realize you can see more of the obstacles from their screen and with a little practice still aim pretty well so you end up using their screen more, sometimes spending entire sections not looking at exactly what you're aming at like a hot shot. You just have to live in the game until you find your own balance based on each situation, which takes time unless maybe you cheat at a lot of split screen games. It's a trade-off between precision in aim and precision in flight.
 
My biggest issue with this game isn't the controls (which I also don't like), but I actually find the game way too long. Boss fights take way too long to beat and some missions are just filler. Give me a super tight 2 hour game that I can replay over and over.
 
I picked this up on release but Dark Souls III has been devouring all my free time until today. Only a couple stages in, and damn, I am terrible at this so far. The controls seem fine, but there's a learning curve I haven't ascended yet. Haven't even gotten a Mission Accomplished yet. As a SF SNES and 64 vet I feel kinda scrubby here.

Quick question for people who have played a lot of Zero.
Are there any super hidden zones like The Awesome Black Hole or Out of this Dimension from SNES or the Warp Zone from 64? Honestly, I'm guessing no, since really hidden secrets have for whatever reason fallen out of vogue in recent Nintendo titles, but here's hoping.
 
Finally acquired all the medals and unlocked the retro and black arwing. Decided to do basically do an arcade run in coop since my friend wanted to and we tested out the BA with his inexperienced self as the pilot and man was it a blast. I feel like I rave about the coop feature of this game a lot but if you haven't already try it with someone. It requires a good amount of cooperation, especially on the all range levels and if they're going into the game completely fresh it only heightens the experience in my opinion. Black arwing in and of itself is super cool though and makes scoring higher much easier.
The new title screen you get too is very nice as well.
 
Dolobill said:
My biggest issue with this game isn't the controls (which I also don't like), but I actually find the game way too long. Boss fights take way too long to beat and some missions are just filler. Give me a super tight 2 hour game that I can replay over and over.
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I just beat the entire game in one hour-long sitting last night, lol. Well, one path to the end, anyways.

There's a feature called Arcade Mode that opens up where you can play everything in one shot (although it gives you an option to take breaks)

Bosses that seem long at first go down much more quickly when you learn them. Like the secret boss Aquarosa can be defeated in under a minute using the regular Arwing, or in under 30 seconds using the Black Arwing. They give you five minutes for Aquarosa, but once you're skillful enough, it'll only take only a fraction of that time.

So yeah, keep at it! :-)
 
1upsuper said:
I picked this up on release but Dark Souls III has been devouring all my free time until today. Only a couple stages in, and damn, I am terrible at this so far. The controls seem fine, but there's a learning curve I haven't ascended yet. Haven't even gotten a Mission Accomplished yet. As a SF SNES and 64 vet I feel kinda scrubby here.

Quick question for people who have played a lot of Zero.
Are there any super hidden zones like The Awesome Black Hole or Out of this Dimension from SNES or the Warp Zone from 64? Honestly, I'm guessing no, since really hidden secrets have for whatever reason fallen out of vogue in recent Nintendo titles, but here's hoping.
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No super hidden zones unfortunately :(

I was sad too, as I really enjoyed the SF64 ones. One main level does have a part that is inspired by those, however.

Random tip: In the dogfights, when you're aiming with the gamepad, I suggest to shoot where the enemy is going rather than where they are. It might sound like common sense but it took a little while to get used to aiming with the gamepad and that really improved my performance. This is most useful in the Star Wolf fights.
 
Esque7 said:
No super hidden zones unfortunately :(

I was sad too, as I really enjoyed the SF64 ones. One main level does have a part that is inspired by those, however.

Random tip: In the dogfights, when you're aiming with the gamepad, I suggest to shoot where the enemy is going rather than where they are. It might sound like common sense but it took a little while to get used to aiming with the gamepad and that really improved my performance. This is most useful in the Star Wolf fights.
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That really sucks. That's one of my least favorite Nintendo trends these days. Their old games were full of awesome secrets. Really disappoints me.

Also, thanks for the tip. I'll try to get into that habit early.
 
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