Polygon: Xbox Scorpio will be a ~6 TFLOP system (v PS4K's 4.14), unveil soon, Fall 17

LukasTaves said:
That rumor sounds kind bullocks for me. If it was cheaper going for the newer archictecture why not change the cpu as well?
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Only the GPU presented these issues? I mean I don't believe it too, but it sure has nothing to do with CPU.

etta said:
Challange how?
I'd rather see you bet with someone that Scorpio isn't 2016 because I really want it to release this year ;-)
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Challenge as in the other way: Perma ban if Scorpio is not coming in 2016.

How about you bet against me: Scorpio is not coming this year. 2 Weeks avatar bet.
 
Chobel said:
Only the GPU presented these issues? I mean I don't believe it too, but it sure has nothing to do with CPU.
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The rumor said paying AMD to shrink down the design was more expensive than buying a brand new design already in 14nm, so that's why they went for it.

But if that was the case, why buy a brand new design for the gpu and keep the same cpu (which would make the design more expensive), instead of upgrading both?
 
Collingwood said:
Zen CPU is 2016 isn't it? Pretty sure it is.
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Zen Desktop is coming this year with non-desktop (e.g. APUs) coming next year in order of priority, so if Scorpio is to use Zen it won't release this year.

wccftech said:
Still, we’ve learned that AMD’s planning to debut Zen based desktop FX CPUs by Q4 2016, just in time for next year’s holiday season. While Zen based APUs are expected to debut at a later date in 2017.

Read more: http://wccftech.com/amd-zen-launch-q4-2016/#ixzz4ATYrJvqw
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kingwingin said:
but rumours point towards neo being the result of sony trying to make a slim ps4 and being forced to upgrade the chips in order to keep cost down. They werent going towards making a powerful new system. I cant see it being expensive

Im sure MS was forced down the same path while wanting to slimline their console but chose to dial it up to 11.
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Ummm.

I can see the first part being true if R&D for 14nm die shrink is not worth the cost of just straight up using Polaris 10.

2nd part i don't think so because AMD has no products at 14nm that offers esram and uses DDR4. XB1 slim version is probably in the works for a long time. Might not even be 14nm Finfet.
 
LukasTaves said:
The rumor said paying AMD to shrink down the design was more expensive than buying a brand new design already in 14nm, so that's why they went for it.

But if that was the case, why buy a brand new design for the gpu and keep the same cpu (which would make the design more expensive), instead of upgrading both?
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Because possibly the new Zen CPU architecture is actually more expensive, while Polaris is not?

So a new design for the APU which only alters the GPU part will be cheaper.
 
You know what, taking it to the extreme like that by considering what would happen if it was 10TF and released one year later is a good day way to think about it.

If in some bizarro world that happened, I wouldn't care if it was 10TF, because it's one year later, if MS wanna get back in the game they gotta do something drastic and unexpected, and that is to release the scorpio this year. It does make sense.
 
Dark_AnNiaLatOr said:
You know what, taking it to the extreme like that by considering what would happen if it was 10TF and released one year later is a good day way to think about it.

If in some bizarro world that happened, I wouldn't care if it was 10TF, because it's one year later, if MS wanna get back in the game they gotta do something drastic and unexpected, and that is to release the scorpio this year. It does make sense.
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What if slim model actually Scorpio with 6TF at $299 and all Xbox one owner can trade in with 80% discount, available after MS E3 conference.
 
Still think MS is aiming to release Scorpio in 2017. I also believe that MS will be subsidizing the console by $50-60 to help ensure/guarantee cpu/gpu superiority as this gen, media/internet has made this a big issue IMO.

So I think the actual cost of Scorpio will be $450-$460, factor in subsidy results in that sweet spot price of $400 that the consumers desire.

I also think that HBM tech inside the console would help to balance cost and console design/size/form factor..if MS does choose to go with Vega, I hope that they provide adequate coolimg like with the Xb1.

Also, in order to compete being 6months - 1yr late with their update/release, I also believe that MS will offer some sort of trade in program during it's first year of sales to help retain its current X1 owners...
($150 trade in promo anyone??)

=D
 
I have a feeling it'll come out next year, although I wouldn't hate for the system to be out by Christmas and go head to head with Sony. I mean, they could go crazy and take a huge loss on the system just to counter Sony's Neo and get some traction,

My guts though tell me that they just don't care about releasing this year, they'll allude to a new system, say that everything is in place and that all of your games will work in the future and stuff, and they'll just release the slim system with UHD and 4K support and think it's enough to keep them going until fall 2017 where they will release their new system.

I'd like to be wrong though!

Also, no way they are releasing for more than 400$. Wouldn't even be surprised if they'd try to go lower.
 
KinofChaos said:
Not sure , maybe I am missing something, doesn't a system consists more then the GPU, the NEO is also supposed to use the same GPU, so where is the scorpios extra TFLOPs come from? ZEN, as currently it's not possible with the jaguar CPU. In order for Scorpio to launch at 6 tflops same time as neo it will need a new CPU, how would BC work? What CPU currently? It would most like;y be Zen which means launching much later then NEO, am I missing something?



See above, a system is more then the GPU.
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The CPU and GPU regardless of what they are will be on the same 14nm process. Cost comes down to the size of the chip and yields at the time of manufacture. All signs point to the Neo APU being smaller than the PS4 APU due to sticking with the same CPU cores on a smaller process. The difference in cost between the two is going to be less about MS taking a huge hit or the box costing more, and more about the Neo being more profitable for Sony than the PS4 already is. If the Scorpio APU is the same size as the XBO APU then it will be substantially more powerful than the Neo APU while costing only marginally more than the APU that MS is currently using. In other words, MS doesn't need to take a massive hit on hardware to be more powerful than the Neo, they just have to not make as much of a profit, or only lose marginally more than they did on XBO.

Also, I don't buy into the two boxes using the same GPU setup. The GPU cores on the Scorpio APU are not going to run at the clock speeds of a dedicated PC GPU. The Scorpio GPU is much more likely to be comparable to a lower clocked 480x, while the PS4 GPU cores will be comparable to a lower clocked 480. Don't kid yourself into thinking they are the same exact die that one company just decided to clock 45% higher. The thermals of an APU with those kinds of clocks would be insane in a console.
 
I personally dont see the point in MS releasing the Scorpio this year to go head-to-head with Neo. I mean, Power difference will help yes...but at this point and time I don't think its wise to go head on.

Best for them to fully develop their strategy and start to trickle it out with X1 then move on to a powerful new console next year. To some people MS is basically damned if they do and damned if they don't.

E3 is around the corner, so time will tell soon...I just suspect a slim...*shrugs*
 
etta said:
No... because I don't believe it's coming in 2016 either. I just really want it in 2016.
Bet with Compsiox and Collingwood ;P
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Agree. I want it in 2016, but don't think it will be here till 2017.

However, as someone else posted, *IF* MS does announce it at E3, it is coming this November. It would be foolish to talk about it and it not come out this year. If they do talk about it and announce it at E3, then the story will be that the SLIM Xbox One will be the starter system and for those enthusiasts or those that want a more advanced system, we have the Scorpio coming this November. Again, that is if they talk about Scorpio.

I personally think Scorpio will not be talked about at all. Perhaps in interviews Phil will mention things about better hardware in the future, but the focus for 2016 will be the Slim model.
 
So what's the best case scenario?

*Microsoft announces Scorpio this E3
*Scorpio has 6 TFLOPS
*Scorpio comes out this November alongside PS4K Neo.
*Scorpio costs $400 USD (which means Microsoft needs to take a loss on every sale right?)
*Scorpio is compatible with Oculus Rift for VR

*MS also announces an XB1 Slim at a reduced price compared to the current model
*Moving forward, all XB1 games are forward compatible with Scorpio
*Scorpio is 100% backward compatible with XB1 and the current 360 BC solution

That would make for a pretty awesome E3. But I still want huge surprise game announcements. I want an Xbox year of dreams. So Alan Wake 2, Banjo Kazooie 3, Half Life 3.

I know I'm setting myself up for disappointment.
 
So people are taking 6TF to the bank, but when the sources said late 2017, they really meant 2016 or early 2017. Sometimes I just don't understand.
 
I see a lot of predictions with only 8gb of RAM. Anyone else think that they need to go to 12-16gb of RAM this time? If this is really going to push things, I think that 8gb of RAM is not going to be enough, especially if you consider that about 2-3gb is for the OS.
 
Montresor said:
So what's the best case scenario?

*Microsoft announces Scorpio this E3
*Scorpio has 6 TFLOPS
*Scorpio comes out this November alongside PS4K Neo.
*Scorpio costs $400 USD (which means Microsoft needs to take a loss on every sale right?)
*Scorpio is compatible with Oculus Rift for VR

*MS also announces an XB1 Slim at a reduced price compared to the current model
*Moving forward, all XB1 games are forward compatible with Scorpio
*Scorpio is 100% backward compatible with XB1 and the current 360 BC solution

That would make for a pretty awesome E3. But I still want huge surprise game announcements. I want an Xbox year of dreams. So Alan Wake 2, Banjo Kazooie 3, Half Life 3.

I know I'm setting myself up for disappointment.
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Best best case scenario is that AMD already has a Zen APU brewing for MS and decided to produce that in tandem with the desktop CPU to really market the new Zen lineup.

Or that Zen is as cost effective as the 480 and surprises us with performance/cost and MS goes semi off the shelf like OG XBOX.

This is just my wish list. Super unlikely.
 
...Scatter... said:
Best best case scenario is that AMD already has a Zen APU brewing for MS and decided to produce that in tandem with the desktop CPU to really market the new Zen lineup.

Or that Zen is as cost effective as the 480 and surprises us with performance/cost and MS goes semi off the shelf like OG XBOX.

This is just my wish list. Super unlikely.
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I wouldn't say highly unlikely, it's possible they could of gone that route. We will find out soon I suppose.

by soon I mean next year lol
 
BeforeU said:
Makes sense.
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image.php

lol i kid
 
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