That would defeat the point
No Man's Sky - Early Impressions/Reviews-in-progress Thread
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Bornstellar
Member
Sounds more like they needed to nail down fun gameplay loops before worrying about world generation.
AAA console exclusives start off at a much higher hype level, and it's harder to reign in, once the train gets moving.
People are also starved for good sci-fi games. This one promised a lot.
Clockwork5
Member
This game is super interesting and quite fun! I expect it to score well with the major outlets.
Lactose_Intolerant
Member
There are plenty of sci-fi games, there are hardly any space flight games anymore. People get excited for anything with a spaceship in it that you can drive. Look at the amount of money Star Citizen has raised.
Add in exploration and crafting, you start ticking more and more boxes for people to be interested in besides just space.
This should never have been a $60 game... if it was $30 or $40, it would be getting almost no heat for current events.
But it also means people would not be talking about it as much. And Sony didn't want that.
Yes, I'm saying Sony. I'm convinced that it was they who:
- went all in once they saw reception after reveal
- pushed for them to $60 price to make it more desirable and "not just another indy game"
- is likely even to blame for their indirect answer about multiplayer because it would cause day 1 sales damage
- they (not sony) will some day come clean about all of this 2-3 years from now
But it also means people would not be talking about it as much. And Sony didn't want that.
Yes, I'm saying Sony. I'm convinced that it was they who:
- went all in once they saw reception after reveal
- pushed for them to $60 price to make it more desirable and "not just another indy game"
- is likely even to blame for their indirect answer about multiplayer because it would cause day 1 sales damage
- they (not sony) will some day come clean about all of this 2-3 years from now
FreezerGeezer
Member
Impressions seem to be what I expected. Divided, with those that knew what they were getting into seemingly loving the game.
Mine is on order for PC. Looking forward to giving it a whirl. I think worst case scenario they have a fantastic canvas to build on here with future updates.
Mine is on order for PC. Looking forward to giving it a whirl. I think worst case scenario they have a fantastic canvas to build on here with future updates.
johnnydrama
Banned
So I managed to grab a hold of my cousin's copy of the game and played it for a little over an hour and a half. Explored a few planets. So far, I like nothing here.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I hate to point out that you might not like the game even if you do know what you are getting into. You wouldn't be the first.
OverdriveOtaku
Member
While I don't disagree with this, the game has been out almost two whole days and, if the Metacritic page is anything to go by, no major source has given an official review yet. It at least can give people a bit of pause to think about what they may be getting into since no sites are steering potential buyers one way or another. I'm waiting to see how the PC version fares for a few days before making a decision.
FreezerGeezer
Member
I get that this is a possibility, I am just saying from what I've read of user impressions, this seems to be the case.
Unfortunate for those that did understand what the game entailed and where still let down.
I hope I do not fall into the latter! Although I am jumping in just hoping to get 10-20 hours out of it.
loganclaws
Plane Escape Torment
I understand what you are trying to convey but I completely disagree in regards to your statement about NMS being close to what everyone wants. Everyone wants NMS to be close to what everyone wants but in reality it is soooo far off the radar and it's just bullshit hype. The game is strictly barebones without any meaningful interactions between any interesting systems. When compared to Space rangers 2, that game has a procedurally generated world that not only reacts to your actions in terms of economy, AI players, factions, protection or destruction of bases and story, but also all these aspects actually interact with each other, so AI players can affect the economy and vice versa, factions compete between each other and can attack and destroy bases and a myriad of other systems can interact with each other to produce a genuinely rewarding experience that remains fresh throughout countless playthroughs. The procedural generations is then augmented with that special ingredient of the human touch by having text adventures and hand crafted quests.
Based on the above, I hope you can see how much of a huge gap there is between games that are "part of the conversation" and NMS.
Edit: I don't know if you actually ever played Space Ranger 2, but you seriously should if you haven't.
I was thinking this today as well. I feel they put a lot into the game, but it just doesn't feel like $60 worth of game. Quality > Quantity
FullMetalx117
Member
So did this game basically turn out be "borderlands has millions of guns" but with planets instead?
Sony is not Publishing, not even on PS4, so basically your assessment makes no sense.
The price decision belongs to HG, and so far for me it has been more than worth it #shrug
If I sold you a copy for $30 would your enjoyment double?
Hydrogen Bluebird
Member
No Man's Sky business model idea: Free to play. Pay $1 for every planet you land on lol.
Clockwork5
Member
Not really. There is a good amount of variety between planets, from what I have found.
I've been to twenty or so planets. No two were very much alike.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
But I don't have 18 Quintillion dollars so I won't feel like I own the whole game.
March of the Crabs
Member
Yeah it's astounding how varied the planets actually are for something that's procedurally generated. Even the moons of planets have subtle similarities while being very different.
This is why I'm still very much interested in the PC version if they release mod tools. It seems like a very solid foundation, just not much else.
March of the Crabs
Member
Yeah for me it's just super fun to explore and mine and scan. For some people it'll just be a chore. Really depends on what you're into.
Vincent Grayson
Member
Yup. Even if you get similar biomes, the terrain generation in this game is fucking amazing, and I've found very different types of natural formations across all the planets I've visited so far.
J
JeremyEtcetera
Unconfirmed Member
I feel like we are on two different wavelengths here. Your argument is more about breaking NMS down and saying why Space Ranger is better, but I'm not approaching the conversation from that angle. To me, this isn't about comparison as it is more about combination. I want people to take the positive route here, look at what NMS has done right(even if that's very little in your opinion) and combine it with things other space-based games have done right and ask ourselves 'is this possible for one game?' Because to me you and others are right to point out that No Man's Sky is not the end-all be all of space games, but you have to also accept the fact that as a small dev team they cast a gigantic net and the scale of the game can be seen as impressive from the standpoint of 'amount'. Now, take that idea and think about if you had a team the size of an Assassin's Creed or GTA studio. What could be done with such resources? It could be immense. This is why I say NMS is a good, yet flawed, step in the right direction, and needs to be in the conversation even if its contribution is a tiny one.
Reverend Funk
Comfy Penetration
My biggest problem with the game right now is the lack of variety, like the surface of each planet looks different but you do the same things on every planet. If they manage to add enough new things to where the game doesn't feel so samey I'll be able to overlook most of the other faults brought up in this thread.
Hydrogen Bluebird
Member
People just overhyped the value of raw content, and the game's genre helped make it sound like all that raw content was a good idea.
"Spelunky -- it has over 1,000,000 levels!"
"Diablo -- it has over 1,000,000 dungeons!"
The idea of a platformer with a million levels or a dungeon crawler with 1 million dungeons just doesn't sound particularly compelling. But for whatever reason, the idea of a space exploration game with a billion planets is incredibly enticing to people. In part I assume because it's an accurate representation of the vastness of our galaxy, and in part because people assumed the planets and activities within would be worth infinitely repeating.
I think even the people that followed the game relatively closely didn't expect to be so stifled by the survival/crafting elements and the inventory management system.
The game probably would be better received if they had throttled back the survival stuff and just made it a cool "cruise the galaxy and discover stuff" game where I don't have to worry about fuel or broken/depleted equipment or building language proficiency to interact with NPCs. The mining should have been purely about crafting cool gear, and not a necessary resource just for basic mobility.
I can't agree. I love all that stuff about the game and if you removed it, I'd be agreeing with people that there is nothing to do in the game(and the planets would not be different enough that it would be fun for exploration alone). Especially the language thing, I love that! The exploring part is the reward for me properly getting myself set up and the going out and looking for stuff helps encourage me to explore. The having limits to what I can carry is the strategy to the game (what is most important) and I love having to strategize.
And honestly, the survival/crafting aspect is exactly what I expected of the game. Either early 2015 or late 2014 they listed what the game was going to have you do and if you read that you'd know what you were getting into. I think some people read what they wanted it to be and even some saw what it was and didn't want that kind of game (the what do you do people).
It's funny, if you went by the OT thread you'd see there are people enjoying the game but if you went by this thread you'd think everyone hated it (seen many people refuting that it could be a matter of taste why they hate it and flat out say it's a bad game).
Golden_Pigeon
Banned
Totally agree with this.
I really hope they will NOT raise the inventory capacity. It can become pretty big by buying space.
I think that most of us are more occupied playing the game than defending it. But really i feel satisfied. I don't understand in what way it could have been an other game than the game it is. They never pretend that it will be heavily story driven a la Mass effect or ultra realist like Elite.
XANDER CAGE
Member
Wow, an OT full of people who agree about loving a game and a review thread full of drama? That's never happened before. Incredible.
This is bang on the money.
Everything is just a rehash of where you've already been, you'll be on a red, brown, orange (etc) world, with the same day/night circle, with some small, medium and large animals, some small, medium and large plants some flying animals and if you have some water, some sea animals, you'll see the same buildings with the same layouts, containing the same containers in the same place which hold slightly different or identical stat boosting mods.
You can clearly see each and every template, and because of that everything feels the same, it feels like an illusion of a universe made up of a series of connected playfields, I'm not even convinced each planetscape is round.
Shrennin
Didn't get the memo regarding the 14th Amendment
I agree with this, to a point. I like the "knowledge stones" to understand language (as that reinforces exploration) but inventory management seems like such a bad mechanic for what this game is, or should be. There shouldn't be many barriers between constant exploring, and I think the inventory management, item management, and other things go a long way to hinder progress. It's one thing to need to build certain equipment to survive on a specific planet, but I don't think having the player be so concerned with resource materials for major systems to keep functioning was the best thing for this game.
no. borderlands has gameplay and narrative.
i'm only half joking. i had very low expectations with this game. i was enthusiastic and have played pretty much nonstop since launch. i completely agree with all the criticism this game is getting. and yet i cant stop playing. i think i've reached my limit though. that rat pellet skinner box shit is so transparent but ultimately unsatisfying. its quite threadbare in that respect. i hate it. yet i love it. there is so much potential with this game.
there needs to be more creativity. some sort of base building like theyve announced could help with this.
they really need to improve the inventory management. the ui is honestly quite difficult to use. and dont have parts of your suit or ship take up slots. its bullshit. and not fun. maybe bank slots at space stations that are universal or something. make it so you can move around machine parts within your ship and suit.
they need to remove the obfuscation of gameplay and actually explain shit more. i know they wanted to have a minecraft sense of discovery. but minecraft had 2 years of alpha/beta and a tonne more shit to do. and it just comes across and trying to cover up how barebones the game actually is.
essentially the gameplay loop at this point is travel to galaxy. land on space ship. check shop. go to planet. scan. collect red mineral to fuel ship. collect green mineral for money. fly back to space ship. sell. repeat over and over and over and over again.
they need to make the game harder. you will die within the first hour of minecraft if you dont know what you are doing. you will die often in minecraft. i have played probably close to 12 hours now and i have died once and it was from a miscalculated jump. there is no difficultly. no stakes. no tension.
they need to improve navigation. for a game about exploration there needs to be some sort of planet map. i have found stuff on a planet that i cant use at the point in time but would like to get back to and theres no clear way on how to leave a mark or find a way to navigate back to it. so often you find these places on a planet and their meaning has no importance to you because its one and done. you will never go back to them.
its not stuff that i feel would be too hard to implement so i remain hopeful that long term this turns into something beautiful. they've done quite a lot which is incredible. the planet generation, the tools system, the market, the lore, the travel. its really an amazing accomplishment technically. there just needs to be a bit more substance to it all. a bit more soul. as it is i would not recommend the game to anyone at this point mostly because of the price point.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Wouldn't it have been possible to scale back from the 18 quintillion? In retrospect it seems a bit ridiculous.
Huh, gee. An OT filled with people who love the game they bought.
I seem to remember this having a name in psych 101.
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
Yup normal day.
Do you disagree that the No Man's Sky might be more well-received if they got rid of the survival stuff? Or do you just disagree that the survival elements are un-fun? I think we can agree to disagree on the latter question, but removal of the survival stuff probably would have resulted in better critical reception since survival games are always really polarizing.
While there's a ton of interest in survival games at the $20 Early Access Steam level, this style of game has not seen a lot of success or interest at the $60 AAA console level. Tomb Raider 2013 was supposed to have a lot of survival elements, but I suspect they got nixed because it just wasn't testing well enough with a broad audience. There's a reason Resident Evil became a third person shooter rather than continuing to be a game where you're constantly stressed about healing/ammo resources.
Most AAA games with inventory/crafting systems tend to make all that stuff mostly optional. If someone playing Assassin's Creed wants to spend their time hunting animals to get the best pelts to construct the best armor then great. If someone playing Assassin's Creed wants to hunt down every waypoint and objective on the map then that's great too. If someone playing Assassin's Creed wants to be a stealth ninja that is never seen, that is great as well. But someone not interested in crafting, exploration, or stealth can still complete and enjoy the game. I can skip the hunting, skip the exploring, and murder 10,000 people in broad daylight. I will still have a good time with Assassin's Creed.
I think the perception of No Man's Sky was that it was going to be "Do What You Want" sort of game, where you can ignore whatever systems you don't find compelling and engage with whatever systems you do find compelling. In all those threads about "What do you do in No Man's Sky?" people always answered that you can be an explorer, or be a trader, or be a ruthless space pirate.....and people took those professions to be mutually exclusive. If I want to be a space pirate, I can just skip all that boring scanning/trading stuff and just blow starships out of the sky. But it turns out that all those professions are kinda interdependent and you can't just do whatever you want.
SturokBGD
Member
Sarcasm on NeoGAF well I never
Both. Seeing as how most reviews tended to mention that the planets start all feeling the same and that it just got boring, I think taking out the survival elements would not have saved it... it would just make it seem like there was even less to the game (cause with samey type planets the exploration itself isn't enough to keep you interested).
I always though it would be cool is on some planets you found remnants of where a space base was or a base that's been mostly destroyed and you could work to rebuild it and then claim it for your own like a mini project to do.I kind of wish they could do some elements of building or creating.
Sectorseven
Member
Maybe the survival part could be on a difficulty slider. The lower end could require less mats or status drops slower, or both.
Game does some things really well but also has serious issues. I find myself enjoying it overall but I can easily see why someone could hate it and others can find it incredible. Thankfully a lot of what Hello Games have said they're planning on updating are where many of my concerns lie but that won't matter in terms of reviews and early word of mouth.
It's about what I expected, with some key areas better and others worse, so overall I'm satisfied but it's going to be divisive for a long time to come.
That would require a designer. Or do you want "WoW Inn" on every planet?
Golden_Pigeon
Banned
I don't want to sound selfish but i don't really care if the game is well or badly received except for practical reason as if there will be a sequel and the developer feel rewarded for what they done.
I agree that the game would have received more positive impression but again i really didn't feel this survival limitation beyond the first hour of the game and then it's always lighter since you upgrade your multi tool and suit to less endure extreme condition and stack resource quicker.
If i could choose between the game with or without it, i would definitly stick with it. It give me the feeling of being out there, and not be like a camera out there. It resonate with what exploration is about: constant resource management.
VlaudTheImpaler
tl;dr
Has the lack of PC info this close to release been brought up at all by any reviewers?
Cause I'm trying to keep cool about it but it's really starting to upset me that we've had hardly any official info on it. Is this normal for PC? Seems ridiculous to me.
Cause I'm trying to keep cool about it but it's really starting to upset me that we've had hardly any official info on it. Is this normal for PC? Seems ridiculous to me.
Well, my revised position is not necessarily that the survival/crafting stuff needs to be removed, but just made more optional. You can't just be a miner, explorer, or pirate....you kinda have to be at least two of those things. Someone that just wants to explore new worlds and find new species still has to worry about collecting minerals and crafting new gear. Someone that just wants to raid freighters and dogfight in outer space also has to grind out materials for ship and weapons upgrades. People who want to be a jack-of-all-trades should be rewarded, but for the game to have broader appeal players shouldn't be forced into wildly varying styles of play.
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