Reddit Compiles Definitive List of All NMS Missing Features/False Marketing +Sources

elco

Member
Thought I'd check in as someone who is happy with my purchase of the game, on PC no less.

The marketing for the game seems pretty typical to me, in that its trying to sell you a product, not be a dispassionate and exquisitely subdued description of the game.

Taking a glance through that reddit post I already see things that I disagree with. For example "Faction Affiliations w/ Significance" is supposed to be a problem? There are different factions. I can ally with one faction and war with another if I choose. Exactly as described in the video. I see multiple other items are already crossed out, perhaps this will be yet another?

In the end I have no doubt it doesn't have every feature it was ever hyped up to have or that they hoped it would have at launch. The point is that hardly any games would stand up much better if you pour over bit of pre-release material looking for supposed discrepancies.

Its a video game on offer like ANY other. You can buy it blind, rely on marketing, wait for reviews, you can even sit down and just watch others play the game endlessly. There is nothing uniquely sinister or outrageous going on here.

Get out of here with your logic.

I dont think I've ever seen anything quite like this in all these years of gaming. I quit reading the list after the first paragraph was completely false based on my 30ish hours in game. If I didn't know better first hand, I'd assume by the amount of hateful responses in this thread that this list was accurate. "Definitive list" - hell, even this threads title is wrong/misleading... just like the original title for he "paid" dlc thread just earlier today. Perhaps it's just the progression of social media, but I don't like where this is headed.
 
Just going through a few of these...

Landing on asteroids

Shaun said you 'can at the moment' in his one line reply about a build over a year old. Presumably it was removed. If you could land on an asteroid however, what would you do? The only asteroids in the game are entirely barren.

Destroying space stations and fleets

"So if you try and destroy a whole space station or destroy a whole fleet"

He doesn't exactly speak of it as if it's actually in the game, just something you could potentially do. You can destroy 'entire fleets' (groups of space ships flying together).

Larger Freighters actually moving

This is very briefly shown in an older build of the game, not sure why it doesn't happen in-game, but I'm also not sure that it would alter the gameplay experience significantly at all. Frighters appear in-game, but they only seem to warp around.

I think Shauns lack of transparency regarding the multiplayer was wrong, but I think people are just splitting hairs attempting to isolate these relatively minute aspects of the game that do not feature. If we subjected every independent game developer to this with against what they have said in their development video logs then there would certainly be a large number of developers whose games failed to meet their pre-release expectations.

Big budget games tend to do far worse, completely miss representing their titles with inachievable levels of anti-aliasing and texturing, representing the release of a game across all platforms. When was the last time a driving game actually looked like its trailers? When was the last time an open world game truly featured the freedom represented in its developer videos?

I was actually talking to a friend last night, about how I can't remember the last time I've felt a trailer from EA truly represented the gameplay experience. This Battlefield 4's trailer for instance, if you were to look at the gameplay exhibited there, you would think almost the entire game were destructible. The entire thing is shot like some crazy Micheal Bay movie, and it's at complete odds with the moment to moment gameplay any player is liable to experience.

We live in an industry where it's become perfectly common to show target renders and cinematic, stylised gameplay sequences (e.g. Watch Dogs E3 trailer) that do not represent actual gameplay, yet are used to with very clear intent to convey the actual gameplay experience. While No Man's Sky may not have lived up to everything Shaun had planned, do people truly believe that if the lifeless frighters were moving, it would be a better game? Landing on barren asteroids with nothing to do on them, would that make it a better game?

Consumers are disappointed because they looked on this experience with incredibly high anticipation, and for them, it hasn't delivered however very few of these 'missing features' were likely to change that experience. For the most part however, complaints regard the density of the game, the repetition of its gameplay, the fact that what you actually do in the game, isn't very interesting for people to do (not everyone, some enjoy it). Would the ability to name your ship make it any more enjoyable to fly? There are certainly some game changing features, like multiplayer (probably the best example) but we're talking about an interview from almost 2 years ago. Everyone was able to see before purchase that the game did not have MP registered on the box, Shaun certainly should have been more transparent, but if you ended up spending £50 on something that wasn't there, then that's on you.

If it hits launch day and you're still unsure if a feature your counting on is or isn't in the game, then why not just hold off? Why not wait a day or two and find out? I think a lot of NMS was sold on the mystery of space, and Shaun took that too far eluding to the details of some of the games mechanics, but ultimately it's not unrecognisable like some suggest.
 

Uthred

Member
Does that make it ok to lie, because we should have been smart enough to see thru the lies?

Were they lies at the time? Did he make intentionally false statements or did he make statements that at the time were true but during development became unachievable? Not clarifying the situation before launch arguably makes him dishonest but it doesnt magically make the things he said lies. The oddly binary TRUTH/LIES rhetoric surrounding this all feels very simplistic, and at times childish.
 
I'm sorry people feel misled - I'm not being snide, I really mean that - but jeez... I mean almost all of these are things said in interviews years ago as "possibles" that presumably didn't pan out for one reason or another. I don't think anyone LIED. I guess people wanted Sony or whoever to release a statement a month ago saying "hey we went through every bit of press from the past few years and here're things that changed as development went on"?

The easy answer to this is don't buy a game at launch.
 
So the only river in the No Man's Sky universe is the one that flooded their studio?

41923-brutal-savage-rekt.gif
 

Dubz

Member
Were they lies at the time? Did he make intentionally false statements or did he make statements that at the time were true but during development became unachievable? Not clarifying the situation before launch arguably makes him dishonest but it doesnt magically make the things he said lies. The oddly binary TRUTH/LIES rhetoric surrounding this all feels very simplistic, and at times childish.
Omitting facts is akin to lying IMO.
 

flkraven

Member
I'm sorry people feel misled - I'm not being snide, I really mean that - but jeez... I mean almost all of these are things said in interviews years ago as "possibles" that presumably didn't pan out for one reason or another. I don't think anyone LIED. I guess people wanted Sony or whoever to release a statement a month ago saying "hey we went through every bit of press from the past few years and here're things that changed as development went on"?

The easy answer to this is don't buy a game at launch.

Many of these things (online play, no dlc) were said within 2 weeks of launch. Nice try, but this is too big a hole for HG to be saved by a white Knight.
 
Not entirely.

Every team I've been on has had a Sean Murray or Peter Molyneux at the lead level. They would just spout off things they wanted in the game, rather than things that actually were - not because of any anti-consumer nefarious purpose, but because they actually wanted to do those things and thought they (read: the team) could get it done. We knew that every single time that person got in front of a camera or microphone they needed a PR person there to shut them the fuck up before they over-promised the world. Sometimes it worked and we'd keep them in check and other times another fucking feature just got added to the product or we all look like assholes.

Everyone on the team largely hated that motherfucker, but he was always in a boss-level position so no one could really do anything about it. We literally had office pools and running jokes about what new thing this person would say at E3 or Gamescom that the rest of us would have to struggle to implement at the last damn minute. I actually won that pool once. I really, really wish I hadn't.

This does not excuse or defend anything; it's merely an explanation that Sean Murray isn't a unique snowflake in the games industry. There's hundreds of people who run their mouth about the game they want to make rather than the one they are actually making. The difference is that most of them work for studios that know enough to keep them on a very short leash. Hello Games doesn't have the experience to do this (or the manpower to compensate for it) and Sony clearly wasn't hands-on enough to prevent it.


Man, working with Todd must be hard.
 
Sean will never be seen the same anymore. Now every game he gets behind will always be super scrutinized

Good. Actions, not words...

I'm surprised at the constant use of a "small indie team" being seen as a legitimate defense for the shipping product missing if not contradicting so many promised elements. They're the ones asking for $60 from you, not the other way around. Though game software development is a fluid thing when it comes to what is desired and planned to be in and what makes it at the end of the process, it's hardly unreasonable to expect a game maker to deliver on what they say to sell it. Maybe they'll hire someone else to speak for their next product instead of Molyneux Jr.
 
I'd argue that you're vastly overstating the difficulty of marketing this game.

Regardless, a lot of the backlash stems from this reality:

Before the game came out, Sean wouldn't be quiet. He had interviews, presentations and was super active on social media.

Game comes out, Sean is no longer communicative. Fans have questions, things appear to have changed from what they were marketed, and there are no answers. That makes his former transparency and openness seem like a farce and suspicious.

This isn't entirely true either. The entire team went 6 months without a word between the first E3 showing and showing it off again. In fact, there were many months of press darkness from the team. People were asking about it it then. Again, damned if he doesn't. Then when he does talk about it people kept asking "But what do you even DO" in such droves that it became it's own meme and spawned nearly every news outlet under the suns version of a "Here's what you do in No Man's Sky" video series. Again, damned if he does.

As far as not saying anything since the game came it, it's been one goddamn week and as everyone can attest to, there are lots to fix and work on. The PC has already had 3 patches (2 of them experimental and available in a single damn day) and Sean Murray has hired an entire QA team that is larger than the current team. They're not sitting on their asses avoiding anything and in all honesty, I would avoid this community too given what has already been going on.

Give them some time. Real time. Not internet time.
 

John Dunbar

correct about everything
those tweets that murray posted about the two players "meeting" were so fucking strange that i don't think he deserves any benefit of the doubt. "wow, didn't expect this to happen so soon!" what happened? if one of them had not been streaming on twitch they would never have known they could visit the same planet and "meet".
 

Orca

Member
This Battlefield 4's trailer for instance, if you were to look at the gameplay exhibited there, you would think almost the entire game were destructible

One difference is Sean actually said the entire planet was destructible and they're clearly not. The 'levelolution' events were never claimed to be more than they are.
 

Ranger X

Member
Fishy from the start I say. I knew this would happen since day one. Believers laughing at us in hype thread why we were asking "but what is there to do in this game". Now they slowly getting their head out the smoke cloud it seems.

I am pretty sure the game had some unfortunate production issues and Sony probably didn't let them extend. They had to wrap and do whatever it takes to wrap. This is actually a sad reality of this industry happening all the time.
 

wildfire

Banned
well people need to smarten up

it was obvious from the start that they weren't going to deliver on all of these promises

Does that make it ok to lie, because we should have been smart enough to see thru the lies?

Telling a good lie isn't about only saying the right things. They presented videos of gameplay that is too rare to experience or doesn't exist anymore. They got the backing of Sony which made more people comfortable with shelling out money for it. THey had additional support of the gaming press even thogh behind the scenes some of the press slowly realized even among themselves they don't have a good handle of what was being previewed.


A good lie works when other people you trust get suckered in. A good lie (like any magic trick) works when you rely on things you can see. A good lie also depends on the temperament of the liar themselves. Any conman can tell you that no single conman can bamboozle anyone because everyone is too diverse in their subconscious biases. But that also means noone is immune to being tricked. Our internal beliefs influence how we trust who is talking to us.
 
I think the lesson to learn is to not promise the world when you can only deliver the artic, and don't be upset when people keep asking where Santa Claus is.
 
One difference is Sean actually said the entire planet was destructible and they're clearly not. The 'levelolution' events were never claimed to be more than they are.

Except you can destroy any portion of a planet (that I have tried) though using the grenade launcher attachment to the multi-tool. As long as you have the resources to keep reloading it, you could theoretically blast through the world. So...that's not really wrong either.
 
That Atlantic article is horrible. And the Steam representation of the game is absolutely inexcusable, using an old build to sell to unsuspecting buyers. Also the E3 event with him stating that he was visiting a random planet and then it comes out that it was scripted when we also have a quote from him criticizing scripted demos. One would be enough but I don't see how anyone can actually defend the culmination of all these different things. I'm glad I didn't buy the game and was planning on seeing where it was a year down the road but now I'm questioning whether to give them the money.

I think this whole thing can be boiled down to no one keeping a leash on this guy, he spouts off about so many different features with all this embellishment and no one is there after the fact to reign him in. I do feel bad for the rest of the dev team, I think they deserve a lot of credit for making this game. Here's hoping the piles of cash they are getting make for a soft landing and they truly do their best to implement these features even if it's not as great as having them day 1. In the end this game has so much potential and still has my interest if they can implement more of these features at a lower price.
 

MisterR

Member
Get out of here with your logic.

I dont think I've ever seen anything quite like this in all these years of gaming. I quit reading the list after the first paragraph was completely false based on my 30ish hours in game. If I didn't know better first hand, I'd assume by the amount of hateful responses in this thread that this list was accurate. "Definitive list" - hell, even this threads title is wrong/misleading... just like the original title for he "paid" dlc thread just earlier today. Perhaps it's just the progression of social media, but I don't like where this is headed.

This has been the most embarrassing shit I've ever seen on Gaf. The most amazing thing is most of the biggest detractors don't even have the game. They are basing everything on some streams they have watched and Reddit stuff like this they take as gospel.
 

theWB27

Member
I know people are trying to rationalize that stuff in development happens, but as much as I like what's there, Sean's main thing during all this was to only mention what was already in the game and not possibilities.

Why would do many things need to be cut if, going by his word, they were already in game.
 
Even with all the unfulfilled claims, I still want to buy this game for the promise alone. The art style gets me. I still believe that some of this stuff is going to be patched in as well, I just can't let the dream die.

I think it's fun to play... ...and to me that makes it a good game...
 
Flipped through the reddit thread. Found a lot of "i was wrong corrections". Definitely missing the lack of different factions, but given what I know of what it would have taken to get that working properly programming wise I can live with it not being there.

I made a second pass through the reddit thread, and that seems to be only major missing feature? I'm not sure I'd consider planetary physics a major to me in this game, but it seems like it might be major to others?

I think a lot of the reactions here have been overblown. Moreover, these types of reactions are what keep developers from talking about how the sausage is made while it's in develop. I'd rather we foster an open environment. And if something falls short, so be it.

Also, skimming through the thread, I'm seeing a lot of "nobody seems to know what a lie is" comments. Add me into that group.

Fwiw, the game isn't perfect but I've really enjoyed my time with it.
 
Many of these things (online play, no dlc) were said within 2 weeks of launch. Nice try, but this is too big a hole for HG to be saved by a white Knight.


Drop the DLC thing because it just convolutes the argument.

The fact that they won't release free content that they can't afford to release for free is logical.

Hello Games need to fix the ability to see each other and the ability for planets to rotate for starters. You can see on the ship radar that distress signals and anomalies move around the space, so I don't know? Maybe it is as they added more active gameplay elements they had to cut more passive ones.
 

Dubz

Member
This has been the most embarrassing shit I've ever seen on Gaf. The most amazing thing is most of the biggest detractors don't even have the game. They are basing everything on some streams they have watched and Reddit stuff like this they take as gospel.
The author sourced everything and edited portions of the list when proven wrong.

If Sean Murray were to admit when he was wrong, I think he, and HG, would get a lot more slack from the gaming public.
 

Megasoum

Banned
I actually just jumped into the middle of a big space battle in a new system... Dunno if it's because I'm on the experimental system.


While it looks cool it's actually really annoying cause it prevents you to pulse jump around the system.
 

Clear

CliffyB's Cock Holster
Get out of here with your logic.

I dont think I've ever seen anything quite like this in all these years of gaming. I quit reading the list after the first paragraph was completely false based on my 30ish hours in game. If I didn't know better first hand, I'd assume by the amount of hateful responses in this thread that this list was accurate. "Definitive list" - hell, even this threads title is wrong/misleading... just like the original title for he "paid" dlc thread just earlier today. Perhaps it's just the progression of social media, but I don't like where this is headed.

Imagine spending years of your life working on something, and this is what you get for your efforts... Honestly I wonder sometimes about getting back into game-dev, and then stuff like this comes along and any enthusiasm I have flies out the window.

Rationally I know I should just file it away under "typical internet sillyness", but the truth is it leaves a nasty taste in my mouth. I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels the same way.
 

Demoskinos

Member
This witch hunt that's going on is kind of fucking gross. People compiling lists of "oh well this is every single thing he said that isn't in the game" The realities of game development can rapidly shift the course of a product.

I don't think Shaun ever knowingly mis-represented NMS. It was all of the crazed fucking fans who blew everything about this game out of proportion. I knew this was coming from the second this game was announced. Who would have thought that the internet would have overhyped this game for themselves. I'm not even a huge fan of NMS myself but jesus people learn to have realistic expectations about things like this.

Frankly, everyone who is angry about this did it to themselves. Like seriously what did you think a studio like Hello Games was going to be able to turn out with the small team that they have?
 

MisterR

Member
Many of these things (online play, no dlc) were said within 2 weeks of launch. Nice try, but this is too big a hole for HG to be saved by a white Knight.

The DLC thing is complete bullshit. They simply said that yes, there could possibly be something in the future they might have to charge for. They are still doing free DLC. They were just covering their bases if there was ever a big expansion that was very costly to develop. It may be too late for white knights, but it's never to late to develop some reading comprehension.
 

Jimrpg

Member
Now this is a conversation I think is worth having.

I was talking with a fellow gaffer earlier about the planetary rotation and I provided this video because I thought it would be interesting to them because their theory was that planetary rotation was never in the game and I thought this helped prove that.

I believe this video would interest you. https://archives.nucl.ai/recording/b...n-no-mans-sky/

Fast forward to 41:14...

You can tell she felt really embarrassed while she was dodging the real question. I wonder who it was who told her to do that?

Even before watching that vid though I always felt really bad for the rest of the team. I think it was our own Thomasmahller who was also a dev on Ori who stated that he hated the way that Sean always made everything about him. He was upset that Sean also had his name as the official twitter handle instead of Hello Games which would better represent the entire studio.

Does Sean Murray own hello games? If he owned it, then the others would just be employees and he would get most of the day. Disrespectful regardless...

Still that's how most of the Japanese run their marketing with a central director figure.
 
This witch hunt that's going on is kind of fucking gross. People compiling lists of "oh well this is every single thing he said that isn't in the game" The realities of game development can rapidly shift the course of a product.

I don't think Shaun ever knowingly mis-represented NMS. It was all of the crazed fucking fans who blew everything about this game out of proportion. I knew this was coming from the second this game was announced. Who would have thought that the internet would have overhyped this game for themselves. I'm not even a huge fan of NMS myself but jesus people learn to have realistic expectations about things like this.

Frankly, everyone who is angry about this did it to themselves. Like seriously what did you think a studio like Hello Games was going to be able to turn out with the small team that they have?

This. Very much this.
 
This witch hunt that's going on is kind of fucking gross. People compiling lists of "oh well this is every single thing he said that isn't in the game" The realities of game development can rapidly shift the course of a product.

I don't think Shaun ever knowingly mis-represented NMS. It was all of the crazed fucking fans who blew everything about this game out of proportion. I knew this was coming from the second this game was announced. Who would have thought that the internet would have overhyped this game for themselves. I'm not even a huge fan of NMS myself but jesus people learn to have realistic expectations about things like this.

Frankly, everyone who is angry about this did it to themselves. Like seriously what did you think a studio like Hello Games was going to be able to turn out with the small team that they have?

Yeah, it was totally just the fans...

EDIT: posting this for the third time...

As I mentioned earlier, the majority of consumers simply don't know or even care about the interworking's of the gaming industry. They shouldn't have to in order to shape their expectations before they buy a game. All most of them know is what they are shown through advertising. People have every right to be upset that the product promised wasn't the product delivered.
 
I don't think Shaun ever knowingly mis-represented NMS. It was all of the crazed fucking fans who blew everything about this game out of proportion. I knew this was coming from the second this game was announced. Who would have thought that the internet would have overhyped this game for themselves. I'm not even a huge fan of NMS myself but jesus people learn to have realistic expectations about things like this.

Frankly, everyone who is angry about this did it to themselves. Like seriously what did you think a studio like Hello Games was going to be able to turn out with the small team that they have?
I felt the same way until I saw the collection of some of the statements that Sean had made. People definitely overhyped it. For the most part, we got what was shown off. I don't blame people for believing what he said, though. Having said that, I'm not sure if you're being genuine given some of your questionable posts in threads involving the game, though. I don't know what it is about this game that causes people to throw tempered rationality out the window.
 

flkraven

Member
The DLC thing is complete bullshit. They simply said that yes, there could possibly be something in the future they might have to charge for. They are still doing free DLC. They were just covering their bases if there was ever a big expansion that was very costly to develop. It may be too late for white knights, but it's never to late to develop some reading comprehension.
Wtf are you talking about reading comprehension. He literally said "no DLC, just patches" verbatim, last week. How am I supposed to comprehend that.
 

Dubz

Member
For the record, I have the game and quite enjoy it.

Thatt being said I would have loved to have a game that had:

Faction mechanics
Rotating Planets
Different Classes of ships with different attributes.
Ability to name ships
Environment affecting the resource types
Multiplayer
Proper Trading System
 
Imagine spending years of your life working on something, and this is what you get for your efforts... Honestly I wonder sometimes about getting back into game-dev, and then stuff like this comes along and any enthusiasm I have flies out the window.
Or....Imagine spending $60 of your hard earned money on a game that is missing many of the features you were led to believe would be implemented. Honestly I wonder sometimes about preordering games, and then stuff like this comes along and my enthusiasm I have flies out the window.
 

Sakura

Member
Wait so reading that list, you can't destroy freighters/frigates? That was one thing I was looking forward to and why I wanted to upgrade my ship.
 
Or....Imagine spending $60 of your hard earned money on a game that is missing many of the features you were led to believe would be implemented. Honestly I wonder sometimes about preordering games, and then stuff like this comes along and my enthusiasm I have flies out the window.

The thing here is that on one hand we have a small group being effected on the other we have an enormous group being effected. That enormous group happens to be consumers and that small group happens to be the ones consumers are giving their money to.
 
Frankly, everyone who is angry about this did it to themselves. Like seriously what did you think a studio like Hello Games was going to be able to turn out with the small team that they have?

It's really, really hard to put the blame for No Man's Sky's astronomical (no pun intended) expectations on the audience when the developers were on record talking about the game in ludicrous terms not even six months ago.
 
Top Bottom