Destiny |OT42| Embrace the Not-Knowing

gdt said:
I've been on a mini vacation all weekend....so what is the buzz on the raid?

Is it good? Mechanically complex?
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It's great.
There are some fairly mechanic heavy fights but there's some wiggle room like VoG rather than KF. I think the atmosphere/environments in this raid are the best we've had in a raid so far. It feels like Mad Mad mixed with Blade Runner.
 
Zoba said:
I spoke with Dan Miller from Bungie earlier today (before i kicked him out of my party lol) and he mentioned that this was going to be a muuuuuuch slower grind than before, so ya'll mofos already hitting your head against the soft caps barely a week nto it are making me roll my eyes more than the gunsmith used to reroll perks

I for one look forward to spending the next year casually grinding Vanguard packages for an LDR.
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Honestly they shouldve gone all the way and held off on opening the raid by a few weeks.

The problem I feel that alot of people are having, is a rush to get raid ready as soon as it opens. Patrick Klepek wrote about it some time ago, but its about missing the feeling of being "there" right when something happens. And I imagine alot of people get anxious when they cant get geared up to be raid ready in a few days.

Bungie of course isnt helping by opening the raid a few days after the expansion. Yes, theres no rush to get raid ready, but in reality Bungie is rushing it by going against their idea of "slow grind," by immediately opening the raid.
 
Glendemonium said:
Started a Hunter yesterday, used the 40 boost that came with RoI and carried over some saved hunter stuff to boost light level to 335.

Still have yet to see the quest for the void subclass. Not sure what the trigger is for it.

Speaking of, is there a fast way to grind subclasses? I kind of want my Hunter to be a PVP character but still do PVE. Almost bought that 20 dollar pack with the exotic item until I found out you can't infuse it.
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Its an early Taken King mission, I think Cayde gives it.

Grinding subclasses idk, Bounties and Crucible still I figure.
 
Zakalwe said:
I'm 362. I've not been grinding at all. I've been playing with a friend. We've done:

320 Strikes
Heroic Stirkes
Nightfall
CoO
AF
Patrol missions to rank up vanguard and faction.
Dalies
And in between we've run story missions and strikes for his new Hunter.

Unless you were absolutely rushing to higher light levels from the start, there was no need to grind. You can just play a cariety of content as you usually would.

Anyone who rushed to be 370+ and complains about grind forced the grind on themselves.
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If you wanted to be Raid ready at 1pm EST Friday, that is not true. I consider 365 Raid ready, and even then 370 is debateable for the final boss.

The progression in RoI is bad. In TTK, I was able to just run every quest and play all the new stuff. All of it increased my light. In RoI, you hit a wall pretty fast unless you run strikes. The two blues you get from a boss are the ONLY efficient ways of leveling. Faction packages help, but again require grind. Exotics need to be saved post-365.
 
Subtervotion said:
If you wanted to be Raid ready at 1pm EST Friday, that is not true. I consider 365 Raid ready, and even then 370 is debateable for the final boss.

The progression in RoI is bad. In TTK, I was able to just run every quest and play all the new stuff. All of it increased my light. In RoI, you hit a wall pretty fast unless you run strikes. The two blues you get from a boss are the ONLY efficient ways of leveling. Faction packages help, but again require grind. Exotics need to be saved post-365.
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I came up with the same conclusion otherwise you'll need lots of shards if you keep grinding them. I'm saving a couple of mine until I get 365, so I'll be farming strikes/factions until I get close enough.
 
Oh shit, I got the Thorn exotic quest. And this time I have it on a class that actually has offensive Void skills (Nightstalker)!
In year 1 I got it on a Titan, which was a massive pain in the ass to earn with a Defender in Crucible. But yeah, color me surprised. Also, nice nod to the old school exotic quests, Bungie. :)
 
Subtervotion said:
If you wanted to be Raid ready at 1pm EST Friday, that is not true.
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I can appreciate those people who want to burn through the content asap, "world first" and people who like to keep at the head of the wave. For those people I understand that limiting progress will be frustrating.

And I also understand that releasing the raid a a week after release of the DLC seems contradictory to the limited progress as it makes it seems as if the delay was intended to allow people to get ready, but to get ready in a week you need to either game the system or grind like hell.

So the design of the game is contradictory which will inevitably lead to frustration, I get that.

I agree that Bungie should have catered to both types of players. If they left in a way to grind out hard to reach raid level in a week then they obviously intended for it to be possible (Omnigal farm aside), so they absolutely could have included a variety of ways that were as efficient as the others to reduce the feeling of grind.

However, there is no need to rush for the raid. And if you don't rush, you can play a large variety of content and achieve steady enough progression that it always feels like what you're doing is worthwhile.

So yeh, if you rush for the raid you are forcing the grind on yourself. At this point when we understand the system especially.

I'm glad I didn't rush for the raid day one. I have friends who are taking it slower and looking forward to a blind raid sometime over the next few weeks. It really isn't difficult to avoid spoilers (this forum and the discord are the only places I frequent that talk about it, and even then it's easy to spot posts and just skip them) and I'm feeling no burnout.

I do get your frustration though, don't get me wrong.
 
Arramos said:
From what I understand, SIVA is a separate entity from Rasputin. SIVA (from what I understand) was intended to be used to build huge structures, but its AI went out of control, and began trying to take over everything. Rasputin was able to somehow contain SIVA in one of his bunkers, and Rasputin understood how powerful SIVA could become. So when he saw the Iron Lords coming to unleash SIVA, he had to try to stop them at all costs. Saladin acknowledges this in the last mission, Rasputin was trying to warn them that SIVA was not what they expected, and trying to keep them from potentially dooming themselves, Rasputin, and the entire system.
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I did say they were two different entities. But here is the thing, I don't think the bolded ever happened. If it did then Iron Lords would have known about it (they have existed since the time of collapse and lived for centuries) and not try to harness SIVA since it was uncontrollable.Which is why I don't understand why Rasputin was containing it if it didn't do anything in the golden age..and why the Iron Lords decide to contain it after Rasputin gets angry.

Perhaps what happened was that SIVA did become risky but the humans were able to dismantle and get rid of their buildings and cities built using SIVA and then have it locked away with Rasputin. But still doesn't explain why Iron Lords didn't know this.
 
The 7th King said:
Ok, I'm almost at 365 light thanks to Sepiks. Now what? Just factions, raid and exotic engrams? Nothing faster?
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If you really want to rush, then farming Omnigul is the fastest.

Otherwise:

320 strikes, Heroic strikes, Nightfall, daily quests/events (for marks, motes, coins engrams), CoO, DF, even patrol missions to rank up vanguard factions, pvp, etc...

There are plenty of ways to relax and play and progress.
 
Revolutionary said:
Oh shit, I got the Thorn exotic quest. And this time I have it on a class that actually has offensive Void skills (Nightstalker)!
In year 1 I got it on a Titan, which was a massive pain in the ass to earn with a Defender in Crucible. But yeah, color me surprised. Also, nice nod to the old school exotic quests, Bungie. :)
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What bounty did you turn in to get it?
 
Just a bit confused on something on the grind to LL365. So I understand that you run strikes to get blues so you can increase your LL to that point. However, what I don't understand are the two items that I've never really seen drops for. The Artifact and Class items. Do I just have to rely on Vanguard and Crucible and Faction packages for those?
 
Zakalwe said:
If you really want to rush, then farming Omnigul is the fastest.

Otherwise:

320 strikes, Heroic strikes, Nightfall, daily quests/events (for marks, motes, coins engrams), CoO, DF, even patrol missions to rank up vanguard factions, pvp, etc...

There are plenty of ways to relax and play and progress.
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But isn't Omnigul up to 365? Both heroic and normal, and 320 strikes too.
Jinjo said:
That and skeleton chests.
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Thanks.
 
stay gold said:
No one?

GG Bungie. Seriously, well done.
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Problem is most people either:

1) Have played it already so it won't be blind
2) Are still leveling up (you can see so many posts here where people are asking how to even get past 350s)

Which is why the best time to do blind run is immediately around launch with people who grinded early or a couple of days/week later after launch the with people who get up there later.


There is also the factor that this is the wrong time to ask since most people are based in US and it's early Sunday morning. And that you expected someone here within 30mins.
 
The 7th King said:
But isn't Omnigul up to 365? Both heroic and normal, and 320 strikes too.
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People are hitting over 380 with these farms I thought?

nOoblet16 said:
Problem is most people either:

1) Have played it already so it won't be blind
2) Are still leveling up (you can see so many posts here where people are asking how to even get past 350s)

Which is why the best time to do blind run is immediately around launch with people who grinded early or a couple of days/week later after launch the with people who get up there later.
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This too.

There are plenty of us who are waiting to run it blind over the next few weeks. Don't worry about spoilers, it's not like a story where a single sentence can ruin it for you.
 
If the goal was to slow progression they clearly came up short. The dedicated have had no problem blasting to 380 and beyond within days of the DLC's release. That's not really an issue for me. Respect to those that crossed that threshold. However what good is it for Bungie to let the big streamers outlevel content before it's released? You don't need to be 380 or even 370 to beat the raid, but if you are it becomes that much easier. Your raid is completed in a few hours. Your raid is 3-guardianed and nearly even 2-guardianed within days.

Also it's pretty apparent that 370 is quickly becoming the new Gjallarhorn.
nOoblet16 said:
Perhaps what happened was that SIVA did become risky but the humans were able to dismantle and get rid of their buildings and cities built using SIVA and then have it locked away with Rasputin. But still doesn't explain why Iron Lords didn't know this.
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I remember reading that SIVA was deadly to humans. In my vision of events the Iron Lords were just looking to recapture Golden Age tech, but didn't know the full story of SIVA. Rasputin did. Rasputin sees these immune weapons of the Traveler threatening to release a grave threat to the city and responds in kind. The Iron Lords realize how dangerous SIVA is too late and sacrifice themselves to correct their mistake.

Really curious how the Fallen got a hold of SIVA. Will read the fragments soon.
Zakalwe said:
People are hitting over 380 with these farms I thought?
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You hit 365 with farm. Then you use your resources to go beyond that. A few strikes offer high end loot.
I didn't want to farm like that, but I also didn't want to go into the raid as dead weight.
 
kayos90 said:
Just a bit confused on something on the grind to LL365. So I understand that you run strikes to get blues so you can increase your LL to that point. However, what I don't understand are the two items that I've never really seen drops for. The Artifact and Class items. Do I just have to rely on Vanguard and Crucible and Faction packages for those?
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They do drop, but they're extremely rare.
But you're right, you're going to have to rely on rank up packages.
A pretty good way to get an artifact is by ranking up Eris Morn by grinding court of Oryx and doing those bounties. It's not a guaranteed drop, but it's more likely than any other way.
 
Mindlog said:
You hit 365 with farm. Then you use your resources to go beyond that. A few strikes offer high end loot.
I didn't want to farm like that, but I also didn't want to go into the raid as dead weight.
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EL CUCO said:
Only way to hit 385 is with rank up packages, exotic engrams, or skeleton chest (if you need an artifact)
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Roger.

So unless you're rushing progress still doesn't need to be traditional "grind", ie you can spread it out over multiple game types/events and earn packages, exotics, chest keys etc...

This is fine for me as I'm not in a rush, it definitely sucks for those wanting to hit higher faster and the most efficient way will always be the way to go (and constant repetition of that will be traditional grind).
 
Strangelove77 said:
They do drop, but they're extremely rare.
But you're right, you're going to have to rely on rank up packages.
A pretty good way to get an artifact is by ranking up Eris Morn by grinding court of Oryx and doing those bounties. It's not a guaranteed drop, but it's more likely than any other way.
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I thought I was supposed to save Eris Morn packages for post LL365.
 
Vanguard package dropped a 350 Ex Astrid fusion rifle. First perk set isn't great (knee pads or underdog) but the second is counterbalance. Maybe combined with underdog I'll have a nice oh shit weapon. Has accelerated coils as well and the charge is already pretty fast.
 
Since 370 seems to be the sweet spot to feel decent for the final encounter. Then I think it's garbage that the only way to get there right now is to do 15-20 faction rank ups starting at 365 and then to have a big exotic engram collection in your vault.

Being 370 in the final boss is like being a lvl 29 in HM Atheon. Being below 370 is like being a lvl 28.
 
SeanR1221 said:
Vanguard package dropped a 350 Ex Astrid fusion rifle. First perk set isn't great (knee pads or underdog) but the second is counterbalance. Maybe combined with underdog I'll have a nice oh shit weapon. Has accelerated coils as well and the charge is already pretty fast.
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I think I might have found a godroll FR.

Long Far Gone type (fast charge, high impact)
6 in the mag.
Hip Fire
Rangefinder
Single point sling

The thing is brutal for both pve and pvp. Its arc too, so it's been tearing through the current weeklies.
 
EL CUCO said:
FWIW, I just got two 370LL class items from Archon's Forge.
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Yeah it's good for class items but not ghosts and artefacts. For some reason the drops in the Forge seem to be based on your overall light level though rather than the light level of your class item, so if you're 366 with a 368 item they still come out at 366/7. Maybe that's just my experience though.
 
Zakalwe said:
I can appreciate those people who want to burn through the content asap, "world first" and people who like to keep at the head of the wave. For those people I understand that limiting progress will be frustrating.

And I also understand that releasing the raid a a week after release of the DLC seems contradictory to the limited progress as it makes it seems as if the delay was intended to allow people to get ready, but to get ready in a week you need to either game the system or grind like hell.

So the design of the game is contradictory which will inevitably lead to frustration, I get that.

I agree that Bungie should have catered to both types of players. If they left in a way to grind out hard to reach raid level in a week then they obviously intended for it to be possible (Omnigal farm aside), so they absolutely could have included a variety of ways that were as efficient as the others to reduce the feeling of grind.

However, there is no need to rush for the raid. And if you don't rush, you can play a large variety of content and achieve steady enough progression that it always feels like what you're doing is worthwhile.

So yeh, if you rush for the raid you are forcing the grind on yourself. At this point when we understand the system especially.

I'm glad I didn't rush for the raid day one. I have friends who are taking it slower and looking forward to a blind raid sometime over the next few weeks. It really isn't difficult to avoid spoilers (this forum and the discord are the only places I frequent that talk about it, and even then it's easy to spot posts and just skip them) and I'm feeling no burnout.

I do get your frustration though, don't get me wrong.
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The issue I think myself and others have is like you mentioned, the contradictory nature of it. Bungie could have held off on the raid for a week or two. Gave people breathing room.

At the same time though, the game doesnt have enough content to do that. What, 5 missions with a couple of updated strikes and Archon forge? Adding a skeleton key system?

Bungie has no choice to bum rush out the raid. Only time players had breathing room was in Vanilla. But because of that necessity to release the raid fast, it does cultivate a culture of anxiety to gear up to it fast. That if you dont, you feel like youre missing out.

Bungie can do with having a schedule. Maybe dungeons first week. Unlock archon forge the next. Then raid the 3rd week of release. And go back to having a flat LL for gear. So that it can work with this schedule, each week you have a goal you can reach if you do the activities, none of this "boy I hope the next drop has 1 extra light level".
 
Wait, Memory of Jolder is a 380 artifact?! If so, 350 today! I also like the radar one and the Crucible damage reduction over time one.

And I know people are complaining about Forge, but I really enjoy it. I have gotten some great stuff from it (not as good as the Omnigul farm). The damn offering could drop more frequently, though.


Oh, and thanks for adding me to the clan, deaf. You guys a riot to play with.
 
While the grind this go around harken back to year 1 (not vanilla, come on now...that resource farming was bananas), it is a little irritating they opened the raid so quickly.

I know it's a dammed if you do, dammed if you don't kind of deal, but really, Bungie is inviting players to burn through content as fast as possible to be "raid ready" in just a few days.

Further, the raids are always the best endgame content for pve players. The opening weeks are the absolute most fun of when a raid drops. To bar this to a majority of players unless you have the time to play destiny like a job, is really a bummer.

That said, I did the expansion.
 
Raven117 said:
While the grind this go around harken back to year 1 (not vanilla, come on now...that resource farming was bananas), it is a little irritating they opened the raid so quickly.

I know it's a dammed if you do, dammed if you don't kind of deal, but really, Bungie is inviting players to burn through content as fast as possible to be "raid ready" in just a few days.

Further, the raids are always the best endgame content for pve players. The opening weeks are the absolute most fun of when a raid drops. To bar this to a majority of players unless you have the time to play destiny like a job, is really a bummer.

That said, I did the expansion.
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Pretty much my thoughts. The comparisons to vanilla grind though make me laugh. I spent at least 20 hours farming planetary materials, and then that many more groveling for ascendant shards.
 
CrudeDiatribe said:
Cooldown isn't a "can't work", it is a greatly reduced chance during the cooldown. Suspect the ToC is two fields on the character: cumulative chance and last success. During the cooldown period odds are reduced by some amount (e.g. 10x). Every unsuccessful ToC increases cumulative chance by some amount and each success resets it.
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Is there a cooldown if you didn't get an exotic? Or does the cooldown only kick in when you get one.

In other words: if I farm draksis back to back until I get an exotic engram does that reduce my odds?
 
CrudeDiatribe said:
Survey/tests with hundreds of participants.
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This is really interesting, thanks for sharing.

BreezyLimbo said:
The issue I think myself and others have is like you mentioned, the contradictory nature of it. Bungie could have held off on the raid for a week or two. Gave people breathing room.

At the same time though, the game doesnt have enough content to do that. What, 5 missions with a couple of updated strikes and Archon forge? Adding a skeleton key system?

Bungie has no choice to bum rush out the raid. Only time players had breathing room was in Vanilla. But because of that necessity to release the raid fast, it does cultivate a culture of anxiety to gear up to it fast. That if you dont, you feel like youre missing out.

Bungie can do with having a schedule. Maybe dungeons first week. Unlock archon forge the next. Then raid the 3rd week of release. And go back to having a flat LL for gear. So that it can work with this schedule, each week you have a goal you can reach if you do the activities, none of this "boy I hope the next drop has 1 extra light level".
Click to expand...

I agree, they could easily have designed the release of events to make it feel like we constantly had something meaningful to work toward if we wanted to rush as fast as possible.

The fact that they intentionally allowed people to rush via an extremely grindy method (strike rewards and resource splurging) along with the release of the raid only a week after the DLC drop tells us they intended for it to be done quickly (hell, they even promote "world's first" type things via their blogs) and simply couldn't be bothered to design a varied and intelligent/fun system for it.

Deku Tree said:
Is there a cooldown if you didn't get an exotic? Or does the cooldown only kick in when you get one.

In other words: if I farm draksis back to back until I get an exotic engram does that reduce my odds?
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Read this link.

Scroll through the comments for some detailed explanations.
 
Zakalwe said:
This is really interesting, thanks for sharing.



I agree, they could easily have designed the release of events to make it feel like we constantly had something meaningful to work toward if we wanted to rush as fast as possible.

The fact that they intentionally allowed people to rush via an extremely grindy method (strike rewards and resource splurging) along with the release of the raid only a week after the DLC drop tells us they intended for it to be done quickly (hell, they even promote "world's first" type things via their blogs) and simply couldn't be bothered to design a varied and intelligent/fun system for it.



Read this link.

Scroll through the comments for some detailed explanations.
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If you know the answer can you just tell me yes or no?
 
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