US Vice-Presidential Debates 2016 |OT| Your Big Awkward Family Reunion
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Agreed. He knows how to actually talk and present himself unlike Trump, but when you really pay attention to what he's arguing for and know his stances it just makes him more of a snake.
VendettaRed07
Member
Kaine saying "he's asking us to vote for someone he won't defend" was a good one tbh
Pence undid that work by basically throwing Trump under the bus.
"Not a polished politician"
pottymouth
Member
I'm sure he's more worried about his property and investments in Florida rather than people.
Yeah that was really something.
Hey ya know, you're not actually defending your candidate right? Just sayin'.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Because it is.
We've seen Veep candidates fudge around with history to try to overlook their candidates mistakes while shining light on the mistakes of their competition, but to actually see a Veep outline a drastically different agenda than the head of their ticket, while lying pretty fucking consistently was different.
And if he'd said all that nobody would've listened or cared.
They would've heard "Yeah, it could be a conflict" and then stopped listening.
Debates for television need to offer short, punchy responses that are 100% true no matter how they're twisted, followed by a longer, also true answer.
Things that can be run by the other side as soundbites that are either negative or can be easily labeled a lie are dangerous.
Kaine was too aggressive, and didn't come off great, but Pence was a snake oil salesman all night and he's not nearly the gifted salesman that Trump is.
That's probably the best response he could give as it reinforces Trump's outsider credentials and the whole 'tell it like it is' garbage. That line absolutely resonanted with a good percentage of the audience.
Yep.
JHoNNy1OoO
Member
Undecided voters are the absolute worst. Every single presidential election choice is night and day. Yet you have people acting like it's a decision between painting your room white or off-white.
They should do the general populace a favor and just not vote.
With his supporters maybe. One of the things Independents and Undecideds like to claim is that they wait for all the information so they can get all the facts. I really don't see how "not a very good politician" is going to win over people that haven't long made up their minds to vote for Trump because he's an "outsider" (like an Oreo isn't Junk food).
That's not a negative for Trump, not with his base. Some of the folks who are voting for him adore this aspect about him because they are already pissed off at career politicians.
Ninja Scooter
Member
His base doesn't matter at this point. His base alone can't win him the election.
metalslimer
Member
Also I'll throw it out there that Christianity would be well served by more people like Tim Kaine, someone extremely passionate about their faith and doing good for people and yet knowing how not to force those beliefs down people's throats. It also reminded me that the death penalty really needs to make its way to the Supreme Court.
BlastProcessing
Member
We are a month away from Election Day. At this point, you need a lot more than your base to win.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Lol at Pence being likeable. Sure I guess until you see his awful stances on lgbt rights and a shitload of other nightmare policies.
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
but what does his base matter?
Anti-establishment sentiment seems to be running extremely high this year. Nobody is going to accuse Trump of being anything resembling a normal politician. It's a way of playing to his strengths while also just admitting the truth of the matter.
Already Torn
Banned
I truly don't understand it. Like I get why Donald Trump is likable to some people, I remember being entertained a year ago at GOP primaries before everything seemed real. But I'm seething just watching Pence say a single sentence.
Like even if you don't know his policies. Just the way he says every single word. It's just the most evil looking thing.
The thing is, that's just one example of Pence doing that. He was completely unable to actually defend Donald Trump.
"He's calling Mexicans rapists and criminals"
"You whipped out that Mexican thing again"
Lys Skygge
Member
I thought Family Guy had some pretty funny commentary on undecided voters.
Undecided voters are the biggest idiots on the planet
karasu
Member
Yeah I don't get that at all. Pence is awful and just as scary as Trump.
He did somewhat defend that comment didn't he? There's only so much you can do when your running mate is Donald Fucking Trump.
FrenchMovieTheme
Member
it might be true but there comes a point where anti-establishment sentiments aren't going to overcome flat out racism/sexism/etc.
Hmm that could be.
I'll just say that I don't think the line will likely help or hurt Trump really. Unless it becomes a popular soundbite that hits the social media where people that don't watch debates may linger. Probably won't though.
Wait, are there actually people who think Trump needs to shore up his base?
Trump can't lose his base, they are rock solid. The problem is everyone else. So a whole night focusing on his flaws, his VP failing to defend him and instead focusing on making himself look reasonable, is not good for Trump. Everyone already knows anybody not Trump is better than Trump.
So at the end of the night, its a night solely about Trumps flaws.
How are we talking about how Kaine looked? VP matters to... nobody.
The point in this was to damage Hillary or Trump. And Trump got melted in the spotlight.
This whole campaign, between the two most disliked candidates ever is about who is in the spotlight looking like a piece of shit.
Tonight that was Trump.
Winners? Maybe none, huge loser in this debate? Trump.
That's the point.
I feel like I'm on another planet here.
Trump can't lose his base, they are rock solid. The problem is everyone else. So a whole night focusing on his flaws, his VP failing to defend him and instead focusing on making himself look reasonable, is not good for Trump. Everyone already knows anybody not Trump is better than Trump.
So at the end of the night, its a night solely about Trumps flaws.
How are we talking about how Kaine looked? VP matters to... nobody.
The point in this was to damage Hillary or Trump. And Trump got melted in the spotlight.
This whole campaign, between the two most disliked candidates ever is about who is in the spotlight looking like a piece of shit.
Tonight that was Trump.
Winners? Maybe none, huge loser in this debate? Trump.
That's the point.
I feel like I'm on another planet here.
I'm with you. Same planet. You are right.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
It's pretty funny that just circling the question and not answering is actually probably less damaging than trying to defend his stupid shit.
The whole anti-establishment thing is weird to me. I'm pretty set in some anti-establishment thoughts, but I feel like Trump is still a total embodiment of the establishment. Not the DC establishment, but still the white, privileged 1% establishment. It's pretty wild how he's managed to capture that block.
beacon 0f light
Member
Thought Kaine's best moment was his response to Pence re implicit bias in the police force. "People shouldn't be afraid to bring up issues of bias in law enforcement. And if your're afraid to have the discussion, you'll never solve it"
Yes, he failed. Pence tried to save his own reputation rather than defend much of what Kaine was slinging regarding Trump, which is what he was supposed to be doing the whole time.
exmachina64
Banned
wat
I think I'm going to write a screenplay titled The Projectionist.
Yes on both counts.
People be sleepin on Kaine, thinking he's all "Golly, gee whiz" and shit because he's a nice guy, but dude will shank a muhfucka smoove when they let their guard down.
I think they have two up. This one is showing foll for me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVXqNcW_-HA&t=69s
KO Traveling Hobo
Member
A lot of young people who feel alienated by society are lining up to support Trump. The deplorables line played right into that. Any time that an "us vs them" situation arises, most people are probably going to value "us" over "them".
fallengorn
Bitches love smiley faces
Agreed. Framing it as them being afraid to talk about it was great and really pushed Pence deeper in defense.
About all you could say is Pence was calm and level headed. He could provide no substantial answers to any of the points brought up by Kaine. All he could do was try to change the subject or ramble.
Kaine acted a bit too jumpy and constantly interrupted him. He did land some good blows but he definitely could've done better.
It doesn't matter in the end though.
Yeah! At least there's two of us!
At this point, they are both so toxic, that there is nothing anybody can do to make either of them look better. Nobody is gonna be swayed to vote FOR Hillary or FOR Trump.
Its a game of making your opponent look much, much worse so people who are undecided (who are these people? How are you so out of it that you don't know about Clinton and Trump? How is that possible?) will vote AGAINST the shittiest one.
Trump is already massively disadvantaged electorally, so any time he is the focus of the negative sway that hurts him big.
How can you even win a debate purely on style when you say almost nothing valid and fail to capably defend your candidate? Pundit class so far up its own ass on this.
People complain and become cynical about politics, then they fucking devolve into this reality show-esque grading on presidential debates, it's fucking maddening.
WORDS STILL MATTER, IDIOTS.
People complain and become cynical about politics, then they fucking devolve into this reality show-esque grading on presidential debates, it's fucking maddening.
WORDS STILL MATTER, IDIOTS.
Rats Off To Ya
Banned
This was Kaine's plan all along.
Joking, but honestly, I can't imagine all the ways the Clinton campaign has planned to put Trump on tilt during the debate process. Sowing dissent within the ranks has to be one of them.
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