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[ShadowSoldier89]

versus xiii concept had 4 playable characters, not 1. That was a much better start

everything about this trailer looked fun to play: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uQ7MwTXYLpg

That also looked REALLY far along. At this point we can assume it was most likely a rigged trailer, but conceptually it looks way more fun than everything I've played of Tabata's game

 

[Mendrox]

Are you implying that Witcher 3 is hard? Because it isn't. Off topic, but I dont really get the high praises for Witcher 3. The world building is excellent, story was well told, but gameplay was incredibly plain and repetitious to me.

Anyhow, the impression I'm getting from this thread is FFXV isn't that bad after all. Unless I've missed anything major, gameplay wise, FFXV looks to be pretty okay?

No I even edited my post so that people understand me better. I just said that people will complete this game AT ALL unlike Witcher 3 where was so much content that people didn't even finish it to this day. God damn.

 

[Ran rp]

so tabata spends all this time in atrs and events showing off the game and ends up showing everything?

 

[MoonsaultSlayer]

so tabata spends all this time in atrs and events showing off the game and ends up showing everything?

I wonder if he can be prosecuted.

 

[Betty]

You can't just pretend Versus never existed or ban it from discussion. In the reveal trailer for FFXV the logo literally morphed out of the Versus logo. If that bothers you I would blame Square Enix not the people who wish to discuss the games development in a thread about the game. If there 'was no design' then all Versus stuff is just pre-production FFXV stuff anyway making it an even more appropriate topic for discussion

Edit:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcUSXub_ypU

Edit2: That trailer is nothing like the game FFXV, I've made myself sad now.....

Even the tagline at the end is "A World of the Versus Epic!"

That trailer is still hype, wish the final game represented it.

 

[Holundrian]

Goddamn forgot that, that trailer still had Yakuza Regis. RIP.

 

[raven777]

It bothers me that every FFXV thread is shit up by this dumb NeoGAF circlejerk, yes.

Versus never existed, there is no game, they managed less with twice the length of development of FFXV. It's the exemplar of "the game existing in your head better than the one here and now." It's been ten years, shut the fuck up about it already!

I don't think it's much to ask to want to talk about FFXV in the FFXV thread, make your own thread if you want to Versusjerk.

Unfortunately the mods will never stop it because they're some of the biggest offenders.

wow

 

[Inuhanyou]

Stop saying this.

Listen to Kagari folks.

Making up your own headcanon to suit your argument never works in the end, i know from experience.

People have a right to talk about the Versus trailers and the concepts.

The whole reason Luna for example, being almost a non entity in the story really grinds some people's gears is because this is the character Tabata created and claimed was a very good, very strong character. Her premise already set off alarm bells, but it seems like she got fridged which sucks.

 

[SkylineRKR]

The water city trailer looked a lot like Uncharted scriptedness, I didn't really like it back then. Though the fight against Leviathan in the game proper looks fucking awful.

 

[gosoxtim]

Listen to Kagari folks.

Making up your own headcanon to suit your argument never works in the end, i know from experience.

People have a right to talk about the Versus trailers and the concepts.

The whole reason Luna for example, being almost a non entity in the story really grinds some people's gears is because this is the character Tabata created and claimed was a very good, very strong character. Her premise already set off alarm bells, but it seems like she got fridged which sucks.

exaclty i was really hoping luna be the aqua of final fantasy but nope not even close

 

[Pooya]

Even the tagline at the end is "A World of the Versus Epic!"

That trailer is still hype, wish the final game represented it.

when Nomura left, he took all the hype trailers with him. The game hasn't had a single good trailer since, the man knows his trailers. lol

 

[Solid Sora]

Why do people get offended when someone mentions the fact tgat versus was never a real game? I mean, the last we saw from it was fake trailer that was literally CG designed to look like gameplay with mock-up menus attached to it.

That's said, we saw many cutscenes of the versus project, which makes it fair to make comparasions imo. Most of the Versus cutscenes looked more interesting and were way better directed that any cutscene in XV that's not the ending or Luna's death.

 

[Crossing Eden]

The water city trailer looked a lot like Uncharted scriptedness, I didn't really like it back then. Though the fight against Leviathan in the game proper looks fucking awful.

It was even less like Uncharted set piece because none of what they showed in that trailer aside from the Insomnia courtyard battle was even playable back then.

 

[Kagari]

Why do people get offended when someone mentions the fact tgat versus was never a real game? I mean, the last we saw from it was fake trailer that was literally CG designed to look like gameplay with mock-up menus attached to it.

That's said, we saw many cutscenes of the versus project, which makes it fair to make comparasions imo. Most of the Versus cutscenes looked more interesting and were way better directed that any cutscene in XV that's not the ending or Luna's death.

No one's offended. Just pointing out the false narrative that Versus never existed.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Why do people get offended when someone mentions the fact tgat versus was never a real game? I mean, the last we saw from it was fake trailer that was literally CG designed to look like gameplay with mock-up menus attached to it.

That's said, we saw many cutscenes of the versus project, which makes it fair to make comparasions imo. Most of the Versus cutscenes looked more interesting and were way better directed that any cutscene in XV that's not the ending or Luna's death.

"There was no design, there was no game!"

Because that statement is factually incorrect. People try to pass it off as if there was only a single piece of CG that others got attached to when there's years worth of stuff out there.

 

[Socivol]

You can't just pretend Versus never existed or ban it from discussion. In the reveal trailer for FFXV the logo literally morphed out of the Versus logo. If that bothers you I would blame Square Enix not the people who wish to discuss the games development in a thread about the game. If there 'was no design' then all Versus stuff is just pre-production FFXV stuff anyway making it an even more appropriate topic for discussion

Edit:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcUSXub_ypU

Edit2: That trailer is nothing like the game FFXV, I've made myself sad now.....

I would really like to know what some of these character's original roles were supposed to be. I have a feeling Gentiana was supposed to have a significantly different role in the story.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Does Ignis ever stop look like Adam from the Bee Movie?

Source

 

[Samimista]

Does Ignis ever stop look like Adam from the Bee Movie?

Lol, I can't unsee this now.

 

[kayos90]

Watching the E3 2013 gameplay trailer and the previous Versus gameplay trailers, I really like how the animations and motions of the combat look way better than anything I've seen in the XV trailers. I think there's something fundamentally wrong with how movement and animations are handled in XV that just makes it feel really slow, janky even. Whereas the Versus stuff looked very smooth, floaty, much like how KH2 and BBS worked. Idk... maybe I just prefer that stylistic choice from Nomura.

 

[QuantumZebra]

Someday Gooch will get a big budget deserving of the Bad Boy King.

We can only hope Gooch will return for FFXVI to save us all

 

[Inuhanyou]

Why do people get offended when someone mentions the fact tgat versus was never a real game? I mean, the last we saw from it was fake trailer that was literally CG designed to look like gameplay with mock-up menus attached to it.

Because people aren't saying that just because its factually true. They are going way further and trying to insinuate that Nomura basically didn't even have a framework of a game period. It was just shallow fluff that was never anything according to them,just to push a narrative that they want to believe.

And that is implicitly wrong on all levels. We might never get to see what they did have, but they had a decent amount, outside of actual production of the game.

They spent 7 years in preproduction(Nomura only announced that the game had entered full production in 2012), they got quite a bit of pre production on the project finished, including the characters, world design, entire script and such.

 

[QuantumZebra]

Although the story seems to be pure butt (although that's really nothing new for this franchise), the gameplay and dungeons seem to be pretty good from what I'm seeing. I think that's how most reviews will go.

There is a wide gulf between XV's story and even XIII

 

[Falk]

You know, as much praise as Gooch gets, I'm not sure if wanting the 'old guard' to come back is anything more realistic than a pipe dream. As big as the PS2 games are, things have scaled way, wa-a-a-ay beyond that.

You can't, for example, take the guys that put Chrono Trigger together, put them in charge of a team 20x the size and expect the hierarchy and logistics to work out. Game design has changed and in that regard, while the ideas and drive may be there, execution is very much an unknown quantity.

Spoiler

Terra Battle console version where?

 

[Ludens]

So can you change the difficulty in the middle of the game?

 

[Inuhanyou]

So can you change the difficulty in the middle of the game?

there is only easy and normal so i don't think it makes much difference :V

Watching the E3 2013 gameplay trailer and the previous Versus gameplay trailers, I really like how the animations and motions of the combat look way better than anything I've seen in the XV trailers. I think there's something fundamentally wrong with how movement and animations are handled in XV that just makes it feel really slow, janky even. Whereas the Versus stuff looked very smooth, floaty, much like how KH2 and BBS worked. Idk... maybe I just prefer that stylistic choice from Nomura.

FF15's animations are like when you spent a huge amount of time on doing detailed animations but forget to make them actually functional in the game so they come out janky and overdone.

 

[kayos90]

Yall remember this gem of a trailer?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2en0gdL5T4

I do. Real sad nothing from XV comes even close. That Omen trailer is an absolute joke in comparison.

 

[ShadowSoldier89]

You know, as much praise as Gooch gets, I'm not sure if wanting the 'old guard' to come back is anything more realistic than a pipe dream. As big as the PS2 games are, things have scaled way, wa-a-a-ay beyond that.

You can't, for example, take the guys that put Chrono Trigger together, put them in charge of a team 20x the size and expect the hierarchy and logistics to work out. Game design has changed and in that regard, while the ideas and drive may be there, execution is very much an unknown quantity.

Spoiler

Terra Battle console version where?

he handled lost odyssey though. FF scope might be bigger than that, but that was still large, and that had a clear vision which is FFs biggest problem with workload atm.

(granted he didnt direct it)

 

[Falk]

Real sad nothing from XV comes even close.

i dunno man the music sounds similar

 

[Deleted member 20920]

Seems like much of the plot ideas from the E3 rerelease has been removed or diminished...

I'm more affected by that and not really when the game was still Versus.

 

[guybrushfreeman]

Yall remember this gem of a trailer?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2en0gdL5T4

I do. Real sad nothing from XV comes even close. That Omen trailer is an absolute joke in comparison.

At least the music never stopped being good

Edit: haha beaten

 

[kayos90]

Actually, serious question. Are there ANY Shakesperean influences or references at all? Cuz that had me really hyped.

 

[Byvar]

You know, as much praise as Gooch gets, I'm not sure if wanting the 'old guard' to come back is anything more realistic than a pipe dream. As big as the PS2 games are, things have scaled way, wa-a-a-ay beyond that.

You can't, for example, take the guys that put Chrono Trigger together, put them in charge of a team 20x the size and expect the hierarchy and logistics to work out. Game design has changed and in that regard, while the ideas and drive may be there, execution is very much an unknown quantity.

Spoiler

Terra Battle console version where?

The Gooch did fantastic with Lost Odyssey and The Last Story though, and since he is working on a 3D console title with Silicon Studio that he'll start talking about in the first half of 2017 (yes, they're working on something that isn't Terra Battle or Matsuno World, and my guess is that it's a Switch game), I'd say he has a lot more experience directing and producing modern games on that scale than Tabata did before taking over FFXV. Didn't he only direct mobile and PSP titles?

 

[Mifec]

there is only easy and normal so i don't think it makes much difference :V

There's a cheevo that you need to be on normal for.

 

[gosoxtim]

speaking of music i love shinomura work but noting i heard so far comes close to her kh music in xv but i cant wait for her kh3 music that is when we know when at her her best

 

[Inuhanyou]

Seems like much of the plot ideas from the E3 rerelease has been removed or diminished...

I'm more affected by that and not really when the game was still Versus.

Well Nomura and most of his staff did leave sometime in 2014 after all. Tabata and co had to come in and really change pretty much everything.

I still say it had to do with the scope of the game Nomura wanted to make. The higher ups didn't like spending that much investment on a numbered title so they canned his version, took him off the project and put his co director in charge of essentially making everything into a shippable single product as quick as possible irrespective of what that would compromise creatively.

But even after he left, a lot of the trailers they showed showed, even as late as last year do not resemble the final game, implying huge pressure and schizophrenic development pipeline where they ended up cutting out a large part of the things they had rewritten just so they would not have to deal with it.

Kingslgaive is probably the most publicly visible part of this, writing out the entire prologue of the game just so they could make a CGI movie about it concurrently, which was cheaper and faster than building far more assets for that in gaming terms.

Actually, serious question. Are there ANY Shakesperean influences or references at all? Cuz that had me really hyped.

Not anymore from what i hear.

There are certainly influences though, the post credits scene is titanic and the final battle is Matrix Revolutions Neo vs Smith

I still can't get over them blatantly copying titanic. Its one of my favorite movies of all time, but i never expected to see inspiration in FF15 of all places

 

[JerkShep]

Why do people get offended when someone mentions the fact tgat versus was never a real game? I mean, the last we saw from it was fake trailer that was literally CG designed to look like gameplay with mock-up menus attached to it.

That's said, we saw many cutscenes of the versus project, which makes it fair to make comparasions imo. Most of the Versus cutscenes looked more interesting and were way better directed that any cutscene in XV that's not the ending or Luna's death.

The gameplay is supposedly good even in this release so I'd wager it's the narrative aspect that people are focusing on. As you said, we saw a lot of cutscenes of Versus and even comparing the trailers Versus seems better written, better presented, with a more distinct style to it, just all around more interesting. Of course it might have crashed and burned on release, we'll never now, but since there seem to be some issues in the story of XV (presentation mostly: stiff dialogues, lots happening off screen, fewer full blown cutscenes) it's not strange that some are thinking "what ifs".

 

[Psychological Intellect]

This is the animation for "Adopt a reasonable tone." for asking with the leviathan for it's power...

there's a second option to demand it's power...yet THIS is the reasonable one.

wtf was the acting direction for the mocap actors in this game man?? I'm so genuinely curious as to what they were thinking.

omg im fuckin ded

 

[Ludens]

there is only easy and normal so i don't think it makes much difference :V

You're right, but as I wrote I need to finish this quickly to trade it back before it's worth nothing.
Easy and Normal should be both mindless, but fore sure on Easy you waste less time compared to Normal. So if I can go with Easy and switch to Normal for the final fight, it's a good thing. Can someone with the game check on this?

 

[Golnei]

Actually, serious question. Are there ANY Shakesperean influences or references at all? Cuz that had me really hyped.

The deaths of the majority of the cast could be argued as one. And having so many important events occur offscreen with only their aftermath or discussion of them relayed to the audience is another stylistic parallel to the structure of his plays when viewed in a certain light.

 

[Crossing Eden]

Watching the E3 2013 gameplay trailer and the previous Versus gameplay trailers, I really like how the animations and motions of the combat look way better than anything I've seen in the XV trailers. I think there's something fundamentally wrong with how movement and animations are handled in XV that just makes it feel really slow, janky even. Whereas the Versus stuff looked very smooth, floaty, much like how KH2 and BBS worked. Idk... maybe I just prefer that stylistic choice from Nomura.

They animations from the e3 gameplay trailers weren't actually real gameplay animations...the ACTUAL gameplay bits in that trailer look just as much if not more janky than what they did over the course of four years. Which imho actually looks quite good and is quite ambitious with the amount of props and characters interacting with each other.

What you're referring to is the team felt the need to very VERY briefly shake the camera and pause the action just a bit with each attack, which a design choice that Nomura games don't usually have, the animation quality itself isn't the issue

^
animation playback without any enemies to hit

So this:

this

this

all fake

this is what Versus looked like at that time:

Not exactly fluid if you ask me.

 

[Falk]

The Gooch did fantastic with Lost Odyssey and The Last Story though, and since he is working on a 3D console title with Silicon Studio that he'll start talking about in the first half of 2017 (yes, they're working on something that isn't Terra Battle or Matsuno World, and my guess is that it's a Switch game), I'd say he has a lot more experience directing and producing modern games on that scale than Tabata did before taking over FFXV. Didn't he only direct mobile and PSP titles?

Point taken - I guess CT was kind of a bad example to bring up. I'm personally feeling that The Last Story was still closer in scope to FFX than the PS360 output Square Enix had, but I do realize that's quite a bit of an undersell.

I guess in broader context, when we're talking about FFXV being a challenger to how western games that sell 8 digits are developed, it'd take any Japanese company quite a bit of mindset change to come anything close to being able to execute the logistics, and BD2 as a unit, regardless of how FFXV does, probably has learnt quite a bit on what to do, and maybe just as importantly quite a bit on what not to do.

What you're referring to is the team felt the need to very VERY briefly shake the camera and pause the action just a bit with each attack, which a design choice that Nomura games don't usually have

The hitstop?

KH games had hella hitstop

When you kill bosses

Spoiler

don't hurt me

 

[orthodoxy1095]

You know, as much praise as Gooch gets, I'm not sure if wanting the 'old guard' to come back is anything more realistic than a pipe dream. As big as the PS2 games are, things have scaled way, wa-a-a-ay beyond that.

You can't, for example, take the guys that put Chrono Trigger together, put them in charge of a team 20x the size and expect the hierarchy and logistics to work out. Game design has changed and in that regard, while the ideas and drive may be there, execution is very much an unknown quantity.

Spoiler

Terra Battle console version where?

Others have addressed this, but I don't really buy this either. Sakaguchi had a hand in Lost Odyssey and The Last Story and those games may not be to the exact specs we'd expect a JRPG to be this gen, but they're still home console JRPGs.

I don't think anyone would advocate Gooch coming back and getting thrown in the deep end with no support system. You'd want to surround him with competent people who have worked on a more modern scale already. I don't see how that could be any worse than giving some shmoe with PSP/mobile experience a home console to work on.

 

[Crossing Eden]

The hitstop?

KH games had hella hitstop

When you kill bosses

Spoiler

don't hurt me

Yes hitstop, could not think of the term when making that post, was driving me crazy.

 

[DiipuSurotu]

Anyone knows when are "Too Much Is Never Enough" and "I Will Be" played in the game?

 

[duckroll]

The Gooch did fantastic with Lost Odyssey and The Last Story though, and since he is working on a 3D console title with Silicon Studio that he'll start talking about in the first half of 2017 (yes, they're working on something that isn't Terra Battle or Matsuno World, and my guess is that it's a Switch game), I'd say he has a lot more experience directing and producing modern games on that scale than Tabata did before taking over FFXV. Didn't he only direct mobile and PSP titles?

You think Mistwalker and Silicon Studio are working together on a console game? Lol!

 

[Byvar]

You think Mistwalker and Silicon Studio are working together on a console game? Lol!

Yeah, I do. I'll just link to my earlier post for this. Basically, the announcement of their joint development talks about "great graphics" and "the excellent programming technology of Silicon Studio", which makes it seem like a console title more than anything.
Also, when Sakaguchi showed some concept art of it back in January, he mentioned that the art style would be 3D and he wouldn't be able to talk about it until 2017.

I dunno, all that points toward a console (Switch?) game in my eyes. I wouldn't mind if it's a portable title, though, since it'd still be a 3D game with a great story, and that's all I want from Mistwalker.

edit > I forgot to mention that he talked about wanting to replicate Fujisaka's art style especially with all the pencil lines (you can hear him say it here). I don't think that kind of detail is possible on 3DS or anything with graphical capabilities below that, especially since he wants it to be 3D models.

 

[kayos90]

They animations from the e3 gameplay trailers weren't actually real gameplay animations...the ACTUAL gameplay bits in that trailer look just as much if not more janky than what they did over the course of four years. Which imho actually looks quite good and is quite ambitious with the amount of props and characters interacting with each other.


What you're referring to is the team felt the need to very VERY briefly shake the camera and pause the action just a bit with each attack, which a design choice that Nomura games don't usually have, the animation quality itself isn't the issue

^
animation playback without any enemies to hit

So this:

all fake

this is what Versus looked like at that time:

Not exactly fluid if you ask me.

I was referring to the gameplay trailer from when it was still labeled as Versus.

 

[duckroll]

Yeah, I do. I'll just link to my earlier post for this. Basically, the announcement of their joint development talks about "great graphics" and "the excellent programming technology of Silicon Studio", which makes it seem like a console title more than anything.
Also, when Sakaguchi showed some concept art of it back in January, he mentioned that the art style would be 3D and he wouldn't be able to talk about it until 2017.

I dunno, all that points toward a console (Switch?) game in my eyes. I wouldn't mind if it's a portable title, though, since it'd still be a 3D game with a great story, and that's all I want from Mistwalker.

edit > I forgot to mention that he talked about wanting to replicate Fujisaka's art style especially with all the pencil lines (you can hear him say it here). I don't think that kind of detail is possible on 3DS or anything with graphical capabilities below that, especially since he wants it to be 3D models.

Lol it's going to be a high end mobile game because Sakaguchi doesn't want to lose to Kitase's Mobius.

 

[benzy]

This is the animation for "Adopt a reasonable tone." for asking with the leviathan for it's power...

This part killed me watching the stream. Noct's reaction when he hears about the fall of Insomnia is incredibly weird too. lmao.

 

[APZonerunner]

Someday Gooch will get a big budget deserving of the Bad Boy King.

He did, twice, they were Xbox 360 games and didn't have the FF name on them so people ignored them? LO is the continuation of PS1 FF that a lot of the fuckers who cry for one have never actually played, which is tragic.