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Rogue One: A Star Wars Story |OT| They rebel - SPOILERS

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Luckily it does make sense then.

Nah, since he is the expert on hyperspace travel who knows stuff we never heard of.

The whole cast essentially get killed, but oh heres CGI Leia saying "Hope". I did like the scene, but because it is on its own and there isn't any other celebratory scene, its almost like it sweeping the other characters under the rug.

The rebels have been living under the thumb of the empire, their lives are ruined, and the plans give them their their first real chance of turning things around, it would mean the world to them. So the rebels would have been ecstatic, crying with joy and relief etc. It would have given the characters deaths more value.

Why would anyone do this when the plans are not safe yet and the only ship who got them is chased by Darth Vader personally?

The battle has not even really ended yet, or do you think the Tie-Fighter suddenly stop shooting at the rebel ships because they have now the planes?
 
Luckily it does make sense then.

No it doesn't. Go hyperspeed. Deliver the plans to the rebels, which is the whole point of Rogue One: A Star Wars Movie.

Then go meet up with Obi Wan.

Instead of: Oh yea, we got this precious data a shitload of people died for, let's take a detour real quick find this random old guy we've never met.
 
What a terrible idea, every person on that mission knew it was a one-way trip and went with her willingly.

That would be terrible... Jyn and everyone else volunteering to go on that mission knew full-well that it could be a one-way trip. She achieved what her father set out to do - she has no reason to regret this. She's just thankful she had those people to back her up.

It was a scene where they see their death coming, literally. A moment of weakness like that would've been a relatable trait for a character that was portrayed a badass throughout.

Which was actually what the main problem with the characters in this, they are all badass from beginning to end.

Tell that to Zod's snapped neck.

???
 
The whole cast essentially get killed, but oh heres CGI Leia saying "Hope". I did like the scene, but because it is on its own and there isn't any other celebratory scene, its almost like it sweeping the other characters under the rug.

The rebels have been living under the thumb of the empire, their lives are ruined, and the plans give them their their first real chance of turning things around, it would mean the world to them. So the rebels would have been ecstatic, crying with joy and relief etc. It would have given the characters deaths more value.
The battle is still going on. When would be the time to cry with joy for the people there? "Hang on Darth Vader, let me grieve for my fallen mates on the ground there that I don't really know and celebrate getting these plans please before you slice me in two."

It leads directly into Episode IV. So any celebration of getting the plans are gone, because the plans are dropped in the middle of the desert and they just need to hope those two droids somehow find a dude they don't even know anything about.

No it doesn't. Go hyperspeed. Deliver the plans to the rebels, which is the whole point of Rogue One: A Star Wars Movie.

Then go meet up with Obi Wan.
The plan was to get Obi-Wan also to help with the fight.
 
Yeah I liked seeing Cantina guys, it was like huh wait were those, and then it's gone, just a frivolous reference. I liked it a lot better than C3PO and R2D2 talking to each other on Yavin. Sure it's quite possible they were there, but if you do cameos with main characters it's too much hey MEMBER THIS MEMBER.
 
I've thinking about that final scene with Jyn and Cassian because man...what a massive blunder. That scene was the perfect setup to make us care about their sacrifice.

Would've been better if they made Jyn saying her regrets like dooming everyone going on this mission, while Cassian calming her.

To me they all knew they were gonna die.... I actually loved the idea that they discussed taking the mission one beat at a time. Making sure to not think of the next move until one is completed.

I'm obviously going to watch it again but I really really enjoy the fact that they didn't ham up 'tender' scenes or exploit drama. This type of film isn't for everybody but I'm grateful they found a middle ground between Disney fan-fare and expanding on Star Wars lore.
 
Tell that to Zod's snapped neck.

lol

I think the ending was fine, except for the action being too long in some parts, or missing a breather, but this is some weird issue that has been plaguiing nearly every action movie in the last few years.

While I honestly left the movie with similar feelings, of the characters not really developing that much and being not as charismatic as those in TFA, it suits the tone of the movie, and in fact it offers quite a bit of charcter development, which isn't hamfisted or on the nose.

Jyn says herself to the statement that soon the Empire's banner/flag will be above the entire universe heads "doesn't matter as long as you don't look up." She doesn't care about the cause. She had her family on both sides. Her father working for the empire, Saw being a violent extremist rebel, both abandoning her "to protect her".

In the end she comes through for the rebellion, but the movie keeps her motivation subtly to herself. Yes she tries to get the Alliance / Rebels on Yavin 4 involved, but do we really know if this is her manipulating the support she needs to redeem her father, both her fathers if we count Saw too, or really her believing in the cause?

There is a depth to her and also Cassian, a man who does what is necessary, but certainly fights throught the movie with the weight of his guilty conscience.

It isn't much, it is subtle, but the much more interesting point to take away was that of a shaky Alliance, a rebel cause that is a far cry of what was depicted in 77, a fight between good and evil. They introduce the grimey, cynical 2016 real world realities of rebellions and the fight against a oppressive regime. This is what makes this movie a bold approach and a fresh take on Star Wars. Not it's characters or the overall story, which to be honest, is completely unnecessary.
 
Nah, since he is the expert on hyperspace travel who knows stuff we never heard of.



Why would anyone do this when the plans are not safe yet and the only ship who got them is chased by Darth Vader personally?

The battle has not even really ended yet, or do you think the Tie-Fighter suddenly stop shooting at the rebel ships because they have now the planes?

The battle is still going on. When would be the time to cry with joy for the people there? "Hang on Darth Vader, let me grieve for my fallen mates on the ground there that I don't really know and celebrate getting these plans please before you slice me in two."

It leads directly into Episode IV. So any celebration of getting the plans are gone, because the plans are dropped in the middle of the desert and they just need to hope those two droids somehow find a dude they don't even know anything about.

Im not saying it would need to be a huge long scene, but hell it is fiction anyway, they could have written anything they like to accommodate a small moment of celebration, hell they could have just had a small moment of "they've secured the plans" "yay" "now get out of there".
 
Im not saying it would need to be a huge long scene, but hell it is fiction anyway, they could have written anything they like to accommodate a small moment of celebration, hell they could have just had a small moment of "they've secured the plans" "yay" "now get out of there".

"May the force be with you, Rogue One", something like this?
 
It was a scene where they see their death coming, literally. A moment of weakness like that would've been a relatable trait for a character that was portrayed a badass throughout.

Which was actually what the main problem with the characters in this, they are all badass from beginning to end.

Jyn was badass when she was balling her eyes out after seeing her father for the first time in years? Or when Cassian's noticeably shaken when he realises K2's dead? Baze doesn't exactly shrug off Chirrut's death either.
 
No it doesn't. Go hyperspeed. Deliver the plans to the rebels, which is the whole point of Rogue One: A Star Wars Movie.

Then go meet up with Obi Wan.

Nah, since he is the expert on hyperspace travel who knows stuff we never heard of.

Yes, and it's clearly explained within the movie that the sheer strength of Vader and the Empire forces those plans to fall apart, which means they had to improvise. When I watched the movie, the clear message during the finale to me was how overwhelmingly powerful the Empire was compared to the rebels, and that the plans just barely made it out of there.

They couldn't go straight to the rebel base because Vader was on their tail. They couldn't broadcast the plans because it would reveal the secret design flaw to the Empire in case they intercepted it, which was the rebels' only ace in this game. Leia was already supposed to go to Tatooine to fetch Obi-Wan because they needed his help, as this was the first time they would go so strongly against the Empire and the first time they realized what exactly they could do with the Death Star. The entire idea is that the rebels were incredibly under equipped to really handle this problem on their own.

So Leia barely gets the plan at the end of the movie, flees from Vader to Tatooine as it's the only reasonable option as there is actually a man there who could help and who she was supposed to get anyway, and because Vader catches up with her above Tatooine the only option she has is to send R2 down in a last ditch effort and hope for the best.

We don't know exactly how much time expired between the end of R1 and the beginning of New Hope. We don't know if they spend some time being chased around the galaxy (keep in mind that the entire Empire would have been on the look out given the importance). We don't know if Vader has any way of tracking a ship through hyperspace or through the force, because honestly, it's all fake. It's all made up science, and Star Wars played fast and loose with that since the beginning. The people here claiming that it's clearly impossible and ruining the ending for them are cracking me up.

It's the same kind of logic used in movies like Indiana Jones, Back to the Future or older Star Wars movies. I can't imagine getting so hung up over it, as if fictional science (of which we really know nothing, there's not actually a lot that's revealed over the course of the movies) is more important than character motivation and story. If this is the kind of thing that can ruin a movie for you, I really don't understand how you could like any of the other Star Wars movies.They're all like this, frankly. Nothing about the way the spaceships moved and worked has made scientific sense since the very first movie, they work according to movie magic, storytelling logic and what looks cool. Some of you are acting like you're just figuring this out with the 8th movie in the series.
 
Can we also talk about how apathetic everyone seemed to be about the Empire? It really hit home with me...

Like being a rebel was not worth it in many peoples eyes... They seemed way too radical and ineffective.
 
Jyn was badass when she was balling her eyes out after seeing her father for the first time in years? Or when Cassian's noticeably shaken when he realises K2's dead?

Considering she crawl her way up there herself, yes. And Cassian reaction might as well been from seeing a grenade explode in his face, because it was more like a shock than shaken.
EDIT
Baze's death was good.
 
about indiana jones, yesterday i was watching raiders when they were digging right next to the nazis site and indiana takes out his costume and gets in his normal clothes, hat and all just to show that awesome sun shot, and nobody notices him. no one saw they were there.
sometimes this movies dont make sense and im fine with that.
 
Can we also talk about how apathetic everyone seemed to be about the Empire? It really hit home with me...

Like being a rebel was not worth it in many peoples eyes... They seemed way too radical and ineffective.

Yeah, they seemed to do a great job at making the Empire feel quite daunting and oppressive.
 
Considering she crawl her way up there herself, yes. And Cassian reaction might as well been from seeing a grenade explode in his face, because it was more like a shock than shaken.
EDIT
Baze's death was good.

I was talking about the hologram scene with Saw where she sees Galen for the first time. For all the stick Felicity Jones was getting in the build up to the film, she really sold that scene.
 
Except the whole movie and especially the last 10 minutes or so's purpose is to retcon/explain exactly that one thing...leading straight to the beginning of episode 4.

So it's supposed to make sense instead of not make sense. It's not "poking holes" when it's a big obvious question of "why did she do that".

Only if you think that the sole point of storytelling is plot.

Hint: it's not.

Agreed, and this is why the cantina jerks popping up here didn't bother me at all. Yes, it's a bit silly and clearly there for the fans, but is that a bad thing? The scene was a surprise to me because I really didn't expect it and it was funny.

Terry Pratchett had this universal force called 'Narativium' in his books - basically explaining that all the weird coincidences you get in stories like this just to give people an arc in their lives or to make people survive against incredible odds is just a law of nature. Basically, the laws of storytelling and the whims of the writer were a force similar to gravity. Just a normal part in his (mostly comedic, of course) world.

The same goes for movies like Indiana Jones, Back to the Future or Star Wars for me. It's not meant to be realistic, and these incredible coincidences are part of their style. The fact that it's a ludicrous coincidence that those cantina jerks would pop up there isn't a cheat on the part of the writers and they're not trying to trick anyone - that's the entire joke. It sometimes feels to me that people in general used to get that just fine when movies like Indiana Jones were still coming out, but the internet has made a lot more people more nitpicky, it seems. They're just goofy winks at the audience in a genre that's done it since the beginning.

Of course, you can overdo it. Revealing that Darth Vader made C3P0 or that Yoda and Chewbacca were old buddies is going to far - because then you're just connecting some of the biggest player in the series, and mostly because those scenes weren't clever, sweet or funny at all. It was just too much for those movies. The cantina jerks (I really don't know their names, forgive me) were fine - it's unexpected, funny, it makes you imagine the shitty week they are having and it's over within 10 seconds.

It's also surrounded by a better overall movie, of course. That helps.

But yeah, in the end you can nitpick any big action adventure movie like this to death, especially when it's sci-fantasy. If I'm happy and excited when I walk out of the theatre, that's all that matters. It sometimes feels to me like people watch these movies while mainly thinking about what points they can complain about when they get online afterwards. If you're not willing to suspend your disbelief for a little bit and accept it for what it is, any of these movies fall apart very easily. I dread to think what Gaf would think if Spielberg would have waited to make the first Indiana Jones movie until this year. People would tear it apart for its sillyness.

Thank you for this post. I have nothing to add except that I love the bit about Pratchett.
 
A post-episode 3 movie where Vader hunts down the remaining Jedi, including Obi-Wan, could be really cool, but with James Earl Jones up there in age, I'd assume we'd get a different voice actor unless they decide to do a film and JEJ is still kicking ass.
 
Also worth noting that - like Illuvatar in LOTR - the Force is an active, higher participator in the world that can guide the events of the stories. Call it cheap if you like, but it's an established part of the universe. Star Wars is a world where a god-like force is real.

The plans finding their way to the son of Vader who also happens to be the only one capable of acting on them and destroying the Death Star isn't just coincidence, the Force nudged it in the right direction. Had Leia delivered the plans straight to the Rebellion, the Death Star wouldn't have been destroyed.
 
A post-episode 3 movie where Vader hunts down the remaining Jedi, including Obi-Wan, could be really cool, but with James Earl Jones up there in age, I'd assume we'd get a different voice actor unless they decide to do a film and JEJ is still kicking ass.

I don't know if that's the kind of movie I would want (but hell I would watch it anyway of course), but I'll be blasphemous for a bit here and say that I would be fine with them recasting Vader. It's really cool that they managed to get JEJ in this one as it feels right, but I'm sure that after all this time there are plenty of very talented voice actors who can do a spot on Vader impression.

It'd be easier for me to swallow than recasting Han Solo. I like the choice they made for that one, but that part is still very much defined by the actor playing him for me. There's only one Harrison Ford, and I'm waiting to be convinced they can pull it off with another actor. Vader is, in the end, a guy in a full body costume who is hiding behind a mask. He'll still look the same no matter who is playing him.
 
I don't get you guys losing your mind over Vader's scene. It seemed like a perfectly serviceable action sequence.

For me, seeing ANH at 5, Vader has always been this mythical force of nature bad guy, where you imagine what he is capable of, you talk about it at length with friends, but you never, ever see it. To finally witness him let loose after years of fanboy imaginings is one of the best gifts I will get this Christmas.
 
A post-episode 3 movie where Vader hunts down the remaining Jedi, including Obi-Wan, could be really cool, but with James Earl Jones up there in age, I'd assume we'd get a different voice actor unless they decide to do a film and JEJ is still kicking ass.

Meet Chad Vader.

I dare say he does a better Vader than JEJ did in Rogue One.
 
I hate how every movie/tv series discussion eventually devolves into trying to poke holes into the plot like you didn't just watch a fucking movie about a moon sized weapon of mass destruction.
Yeah, a moon sized space station is unrealistic, but that doesn't mean that nothing has to make sense.
These universes have their own laws of physics and so on they need to follow.
 
Multiple people. One was Spencer Wilding - the guy who Star-Lord beats over the head for stealing his headphones in Guardians of the Galaxy.

Was this wrestler who was hired about the time TFA was annouced, involved, too?
I remember him wearing the costume on multiple occasions before and there was a lot of talking about that fact.
 
What a terrible idea, every person on that mission knew it was a one-way trip and went with her willingly.

Yeah - those who joined her, especially Cassian's fellows (whom i consider to be the 'black ops' soldiers of the rebel alliance, those who do the dirty work) were very much aware that there was a low chance of making it out alive.

While truly believing in the 'cause', this time it would be them sacrificing their own lives, and not just those of others.

And Chirrut and Baze simply lacked any kind of true 'purpose' in life. Their temple had been stripped mined, and finally, blown up by an imperial weapon of mass destruction. Contributing to the destruction of said weapon was a cause worth dying for.
 
Yeah - those who joined her, especially Cassian's fellows (whom i consider to be the 'black ops' soldiers of the rebel alliance, those who do the dirty work) were very much aware that there was a low chance of making it out alive.

While truly believing in the 'cause', this time it would be them sacrificing their own lives, and not just those of others.

And Chirrut and Baze simply lacked any kind of true 'purpose' in life. Their temple had been stripped mined, and finally, blown up by an imperial weapon of mass destruction. Contributing to the destruction of said weapon was a cause worth dying for.

I still have a feeling they were supposed to make it out alive.
There's shots in the trailers that contradict the "ending".

In the movie, Jyn and Cassian made it to the top of the tower and uploaded the plans only to die shorlty after once the Death Star arrived.

In the trailer, we have 2 instances of Jyn escaping with K2SO and Cassian. You can see Jyn running on the beach with the data-tape on her belt towards the AT-ACT's. The other is one were the team that infiltrates the Citadel Tower is running away through the tunnel ... It's the scene that focusses on another K2 unit that was shot in the London subway.

What if the entire "upload" thing was added during the reshoots? What if the "original" scene was ment to have Jyn hand over the tape to Leia herself?
 
No it doesn't. Go hyperspeed. Deliver the plans to the rebels, which is the whole point of Rogue One: A Star Wars Movie.

Then go meet up with Obi Wan.

Instead of: Oh yea, we got this precious data a shitload of people died for, let's take a detour real quick find this random old guy we've never met.

They were being chased. Heading to Tatooine was logical: they could at the very least send a message to Obi-Wan before attempting to escape from the Empire.

Jumping to Yavin-4 straight from Scarif would've led the Empire straight to their doorstep.
 
Crazy that they didn't think they could get away without having Star Wars in the title.
Well, the "A Star Wars Story" part never appeared on screen, either. Beyond that... I think it makes sense to in general have Star Wars somewhere in the name when advertising a Star Wars movie.
 
I still have a feeling they were supposed to make it out alive.
There's shots in the trailers that contradict the "ending".

In the movie, Jyn and Cassian made it to the top of the tower and uploaded the plans only to die shorlty after once the Death Star arrived.

In the trailer, we have 2 instances of Jyn escaping with K2SO and Cassian. You can see Jyn running on the beach with the data-tape on her belt towards the AT-ACT's. The other is one were the team that infiltrates the Citadel Tower is running away through the tunnel ... It's the scene that focusses on another K2 unit that was shot in the London subway.

What if the entire "upload" thing was added during the reshoots? What if the "original" scene was ment to have Jyn hand over the tape to Leia herself?

Or she and Cassian were killed by Vader in that hallway and they thought it was too dark.
 
I was actually surprised that everyone died. I figured some of them would die since they never showed up in the OT for obvious reasons, but I figured a couple would live and there would be a reason given as to why you never saw them later.

All of them paying the ultimate sacrifice for something bigger than they are works well with the story, though. I can't wait until this comes out on Blu-Ray so I can watch it back-to-back with 4.
 
I still have a feeling they were supposed to make it out alive.
There's shots in the trailers that contradict the "ending".

In the movie, Jyn and Cassian made it to the top of the tower and uploaded the plans only to die shorlty after once the Death Star arrived.

In the trailer, we have 2 instances of Jyn escaping with K2SO and Cassian. You can see Jyn running on the beach with the data-tape on her belt towards the AT-ACT's. The other is one were the team that infiltrates the Citadel Tower is running away through the tunnel ... It's the scene that focusses on another K2 unit that was shot in the London subway.

What if the entire "upload" thing was added during the reshoots? What if the "original" scene was ment to have Jyn hand over the tape to Leia herself?

Lucasfilm's Pablo Hidalgo said the ending didn't change. He said he'll talk about it a bit more once more people have had chance to see the film.
 
Just saw this today...biggest thing I took away from it is that Darth Vader finally lived up to his reputation after three (okay four) movies of relative disappointment. Holy shit.

Everything before that was pretty great too...I loved how well they captured the 70s look and feel but I don't see why they had to add a bunch of ship designs we never see again in the OT or VII.
 
I still have a feeling they were supposed to make it out alive.
There's shots in the trailers that contradict the "ending".

In the movie, Jyn and Cassian made it to the top of the tower and uploaded the plans only to die shorlty after once the Death Star arrived.

In the trailer, we have 2 instances of Jyn escaping with K2SO and Cassian. You can see Jyn running on the beach with the data-tape on her belt towards the AT-ACT's. The other is one were the team that infiltrates the Citadel Tower is running away through the tunnel ... It's the scene that focusses on another K2 unit that was shot in the London subway.

What if the entire "upload" thing was added during the reshoots? What if the "original" scene was ment to have Jyn hand over the tape to Leia herself?

The canon always said that Leia received the plans via transmission

Darth Vader said:
Several transmissions were beamed to this ship by Rebel spies. I want to know what happened to the plans they sent you.
 
The rebels have been living under the thumb of the empire, their lives are ruined, and the plans give them their their first real chance of turning things around, it would mean the world to them. So the rebels would have been ecstatic, crying with joy and relief etc. It would have given the characters deaths more value.

What is the reason for a celebration at this point? This is the intermission of a 4 hour movie. Were you also disappointed when they didn't throw a parade at the end of Empire?
 
So, for machete order, would Rogue One come before ANH? Would it be the FIRST Star Wars film a new viewer should watch? It is so totally different from most of the others it would be hard for kids to start with it, I think.
 
So, for machete order, would Rogue One come before ANH? Would it be the FIRST Star Wars film a new viewer should watch? It is so totally different from most of the others it would be hard for kids to start with it, I think.
The film is written expecting you to have seen a new hope, I don't think I'd ever watch it first
 
Lucasfilm's Pablo Hidalgo said the ending didn't change. He said he'll talk about it a bit more once more people have had chance to see the film.

Maybe the data tape was held in a separate facility than the transmission tower and they were required to make it on foot. I am really curious to know what the plan was.
 
I want to rewatch the movie again. I came out of it a lot more happy than with TFA but I was really high while watching this, so some of the bad plot points could have gone over my head. I felt like every character was serviceable and was distinct. I wish there were more aliens in the crew, but everyone was someone who would pop out in the prequels or originals in my opinion.


Also the CG for Tarkin and Leia was great. It's noticeable yes cause we all know Carrie Fisher isn't in her 20's anymore, let alone someone who isn't alive anymore. I would rather have them perfect this new technology that Disney is so eager to show off. I'd imagine there would be a bigger uproar if someone came to play Leia.
 
Or she and Cassian were killed by Vader in that hallway and they thought it was too dark.

The part that feels wrong is the ending. Don't get me wrong ... I enjoyed Rogue One a ton and think it's a great movie.

But, hear me out ... The Star Destroyer actually took out the Planetary Shield surrounding Scariff. Wouldn't that mean that Jyn and every other Rebel "stuck" on the planet had a chance of, you know, getting off the planet? Took a while before the Death-Star fired too. The shield was the ONLY thing keeping 'em there? ... would make sense that someone picked 'em up? That, and we all saw the trailers having K2SO, Krennic, Cassian and Jyn on the beach running out of some installation on Scariff towards the AT-ACT's? She even has the disk on her belt...

My guess? The Tie-Fighter we see in the trailer destroys the dish ... making sure Jyn can't upload. She and Cassian make it out alive (we seen them go down the elevator in the ending we got) ... only to be assaulted by the AT-ACT's on the beach ... they run towards a shuttle, upload the plans (at the time the SD crashed through the shield-gate) and get shot down and crash. The plans are succesfully uploaded ... Krennic wakes up ... goes down ... assesses the damage (shot we see of him walking in the sea on Scariff) ... he notices the Death-Star and it fires.
 
So, for machete order, would Rogue One come before ANH? Would it be the FIRST Star Wars film a new viewer should watch? It is so totally different from most of the others it would be hard for kids to start with it, I think.

I was never a fan of the Machete order. Later movies that take place before earlier movies all have callbacks/callforwards that only really work if you're familiar with what came before. I especially don't like the idea of messing up your OT watch by putting some prequels inbetween them.

The only real way to watch it for me is still by release order: 4 - 5 - 6 - 1 - 2 - 3 - 7 - R1 - 8 - Han Solo - 9 - Jar Jar's Big Adventure.

Although I'll be honest, I skip the prequels these days. I've seen them enough for one lifetime. The last big watch before 7 was enough for me.
 
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