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Rogue One: A Star Wars Story |OT| They rebel - SPOILERS

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I agree with pretty much everything Half in the Bag said. Just give us a completely new adventure for the next one please.
 
firehawk12 said:
So in the book universe, there's the Empire AND the First Order? They're completely different organizations?
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There is no separate book universe (except for those under the Legends label). The current books are in the same canon as everything else right now (films, shows, comics, etc.). The First Order is what the remnants of the Empire became after its defeat.
 
Killer Queen said:
So do you think that with more films like Rogue One and films that are closer to the prequel timeline that Disney can undo people's distaste for that timeline.
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Not necessarily the "timeline" but Rogue One attempted to contribute a part in fixing two things that the prequels damaged:

1. Reinstating the mysteriousness of the Force. TFA already did a bit and Rogue One had Chirrut. Midichlorians were a stupid idea.

2. Rehabilitating Darth Vader. The prequels did quite a number on him with Anakin being a shit character played by a shit actor. The scene with Krennic and the hallway scene made him appear like the overwhelming menace I felt he was when I was a kid.
 
Ragnorok64 said:
Looking at your negatives, the kind of movie you want doesn't sound all that fun. This is a movie wherein the whole cast dies, their (almost) entire squad and support fleet get destroyed, and you're saying you wanted it to be darker?
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I don't necessarily want the film to be darker, I just find the way they do some of the comedy to be at odds with the amount of death there is.

In TFA when the five planets blew up, it just seemed like it went way off the spectrum of dark for how much silly comedy there was. Either don't blow up the 5 planets, or be more careful about when and how the light-moments and comedy come in.

R1 handled it a lot better, but as you said, it's a suicide mission. They are in a dire situation. The companion robot AI seemed way out of place. And I don't think there is a problem with cutting some of the popcorn nostalgia fluff and take the story and characters seriously. They are at war after all.

Maybe I can't put my finger on it, but I'm still really bothered by how so many blockbusters do this. When there's mass killings, mass explosions and destruction, everyone is in a dire and violent situation.....I just feel really uncomfortable by straight comic relief.

A good example is in Saving Private Ryan with some of the lighter moments with Matt Damon. It worked because it felt real, felt human, came at a time in the movie when the characters were on down-time, and it didn't feel like it was included for the sheer sake of comic relief.
 
Killer Queen said:
So do you think that with more films like Rogue One and films that are closer to the prequel timeline that Disney can undo people's distaste for that timeline.
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I think Rogue One succeeds because it is closer to the OT than the PT. It's odd seeing complaints against Rogue One not feeling like Star Wars when I've always felt like the PT was in a completely different universe than the OT. Yeah, it's got light sabers and droids, but even with all that it still never felt like Star Wars to me. I mean, it would make sense for it to feel different because it takes place decades before the OT. But Fantastic Beasts still manages to feel like it fits in the Harry Potter universe despite that. I think a big part of the Prequel Trilogy's failings is its constant beating you over the head that Anakin is gonna become Vader. As a result, the entire PT is dominated by this dour and negative tone where you're following a protagonist you don't really like or even sympathize with. Both the Prequel Trilogy and Rogue One have a dark cloud over them. We know Anakin becomes Vader. We know most/all of the Rogue One squad dies. However, Rogue One, despite being a darker movie that explores the gray areas of the rebellion and knowing everyone is gonna die, still feels positive and feels like Star Wars by echoing that message of hope. The prequels never felt like Star Wars until the end of RotS where you start seeing familiar Star Wars technology and imagery.

To answer your question, yes I think there could be interesting Star Wars stories to be told in the prequel era. But there needs to be a clear villain and better protagonists. Not just "separatists?" and "trade federation?" and the boring ass robed Jedi Order.
 
sphagnum said:
The Empire fractures after Endor due to warlordism among the Moffs and military commanders, with some like Adelhard carving out their own Space North Koreas proclaiming that Palpatine never died and it's all a Rebel trick. The bulk of the Imperial fleet that survived/stayed loyal to the core was under Sloane's command since Piett died at Endor. Mas Amedda, since he was the Grand Vizier, became the official leader but nobody paid attention to him. The Empire surrendered one year after Endor when it agreed to the Galactic Concordance, which smacked it with huge reparations and prevented it from recruiting more Stormtroopers or building more weapons. As the economic situation got worse, over time the Empire faded away and its remaining member systems joined the New Republic.

The First Order was established in the Unknown Regions by hardliners who refused to give up and made their exodus to a place the Republic didn't control. How Snoke came into power, we don't know yet. The FO existed in secret for decades, funding itself through control over pirate and terrorist groups like the Amaxine Warriors. What we do know is that there was a sizeable faction of Centrist senators (the political faction that wanted a stronger central government) who were in on the conspiracy and eventually seceded when the FO made itself public.
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Honestly I would have rather watched a film about this than what we got in Rogue One. lol

West Wing: Empire edition.

I'd also still like to see how these guys can justify being part of the Space Nazis after the entire galaxy found out they built a second Death Star.

Gravidee said:
There is no separate book universe (except for those under the Legends label). The current books are in the same canon as everything else right now (films, shows, comics, etc.). The First Order is what the remnants of the Empire became after its defeat.
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I know, but normal people aren't going to read the books. So all of this stuff may be explained, but I'm never going to see it unless they cast like CCH Pounder as this tough Imperial Admiral and make a movie about her.
 
I'm still waiting for that transitional film between the smoothy scifi CG prequel worlds to the 'retro' practical look of recent.


I chuckled when the deathstar viewfinder had some oldschool tv fuzziness when it booted on.
 
firehawk12 said:
I'd also still like to see how these guys can justify being part of the Space Nazis after the entire galaxy found out they build a second Death Star.
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Easy, they viewed the Rebels as terrorists. Destroying Alderaan was justifiable because it was a terrorist planet plotting to overthrow the government, and while it was distasteful it was necessary to show that there was no legitimate power but the Emperor, who had been Easley votes into office by the Senate. The Rebels were the REAL villains for continuing to fight and forced the Empire to get involved in a terrible civil war. If they had just worked within the proper channels...!

Lost Stars and Servants of the he Empire explain the Imperial mindset pretty well.
 
Why did the pilot need to get a communication to the fleet in the main action sequence? To tell them they need to get the shield down? They already know that. They've got squads trapped on the planet below. The only thing worth attacking in the entire orbit of the planet was the shield station they dropped on top of.
 
Jackpot said:
So was the "I rebel" and the TIE fighter hovering over the tower walkway scenes cut or did I miss them?
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Oh wow, I just remembered I was totally waiting for that to happen while she was up there, then just kind of forgot about it because of how great everything else that was happening was.
 
Jackpot said:
Why did the pilot need to get a communication to the fleet in the main action sequence? To tell them they need to get the shield down? They already know that. They've got squads trapped on the planet below. The only thing worth attacking in the entire orbit of the planet was the shield station they dropped on top of.
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They were busy dealing with the Star Destroyers. The message was to let them know that they need to drop it asap otherwise they could have/would have waited until they won the space battle to focus the gate down.
 
sparky2112 said:
Why was it necessary for Jimmy Smits to be there at all?
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I really wanted that Jar Jar rumored cameo. I wanted Jar Jar to be Organa's inside man from the Senate who went with Organa back to Alderaan. So every time I watch Episode IV going forward, I can take solace that Jar Jar is being blown to bits.

Meesa gonna die indeed.
 
sphagnum said:
Easy, they viewed the Rebels as terrorists. Destroying Alderaan was justifiable because it was a terrorist planet plotting to overthrow the government, and while it was distasteful it was necessary to show that there was no legitimate power but the Emperor, who had been Easley votes into office by the Senate. The Rebels were the REAL villains for continuing to fight and forced the Empire to get involved in a terrible civil war. If they had just worked within the proper channels...!

Lost Stars and Servants of the he Empire explain the Imperial mindset pretty well.
Click to expand...
Sure, I had that explained to me earlier when I brought it up a couple of days ago, but I look at it this way - you are a human white male in an organization that, at least on screen, only hires other human white males. Your main job is to terrorize and slaughter civilians, strip mine resources, create super weapons that can annihilate planets, and do the generally evil things we associate with tyranny today.

I can understand if you decided to stay in the Imperial army for like a few years because you don't know better, but after 20-30 years of Imperial rule? All of the old white guys in the movies are career officers, so they have chosen to be evil and kill minorities/aliens. I'm not sure if Star Wars had its own version of the Nuremberg trials, but you'd think everyone shown on screen would be found guilty.
 
Why did the lead Rebel Alliance guy shoot Forrest Whitaker's man who was holding a grenade and kill all those anti-Empire guys during the Jedha street battle?
 
sparky2112 said:
Why was it necessary for Jimmy Smits to be there at all?
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Bail Organa is one of the founding members of the rebel alliance. In that scene they are debating what action they should take, their first big opportunity as an alliance so it makes sense that he's there. His experience, leadership, and resources are pretty key to the rebels I imagine.
 
firehawk12 said:
Sure, I had that explained to me earlier when I brought it up a couple of days ago, but I look at it this way - you are a human white male in an organization that, at least on screen, only hires other human white males. Your main job is to terrorize and slaughter civilians, strip mine resources, create super weapons that can annihilate planets, and do the generally evil things we associate with tyranny today.

I can understand if you decided to stay in the Imperial army for like a few years because you don't know better, but after 20-30 years of Imperial rule? All of the old white guys in the movies are career officers, so they have chosen to be evil and kill minorities/aliens. I'm not sure if Star Wars had its own version of the Nuremberg trials, but you'd think everyone shown on screen would be found guilty.
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Besides the superweapons, doesn't sound that different from Belgian colonial rule of the Congo.
 
Well, I watched this on a whim, and as someone who has not seen any Star Wars movies except A New Hope when I had to watch it for a class in school ~10 years ago, I enjoyed it. Also did not realize Tarkin or Leia were CGI until I read this thread.
 
watershed said:
Bail Organa is one of the founding members of the rebel alliance. In that scene they are debating what action they should take, their first big opportunity as an alliance so it makes sense that he's there. His experience, leadership, and resources are pretty key to the rebels I imagine.
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Also, he should be there for canon reasons.

Leia's message to Kenobi:
General Kenobi, years ago you served
my father in the Clone Wars. Now he
begs you to help him in his struggle
against the Empire. I regret that I
am unable to present my father's
request to you in person, but my
ship has fallen under attack and I'm
afraid my mission to bring you to
Alderaan has failed. I have placed
information vital to the survival of
the Rebellion into the memory systems
of this R2 unit. My father will know
how to retrieve it. You must see
this droid safely delivered to him
on Alderaan. This is our most
desperate hour. Help me, Obi-Wan
Kenobi, you're my only hope.
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It was only natural to have Bail be there, when he's the one to have Leia go 'recruit' Kenobi.
 
Jeffrey said:
I just found it odd that all the engineers were old white dudes... thats not how that works!
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I thought I was the only one. This shit irked the hell out of me too. An entire galaxy of races to choose from and the STEM people are all old white guys? Really?
 
The worst part about the reshoots being so highly publicized is the misinformed hot takes trying to guess what cool parts were saved by a different director or what bad parts were due to Disney interfering.
 
hoos30 said:
I thought I was the only one. This shit irked the hell out of me too. An entire galaxy of races to choose from and the STEM people are all old white guys? Really?
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i mean, i got the fact that they're old - they clearly looked like people who barely ever saw the sunlight. They were certainly forced to continue their work on the battle-station over the last 15(?) years at least. (they might have started working on the project ever since the Empire was formed). Seeing as it is a top secret weapons project, i don't think they would have had much vacation time or contact to the outside world, and there wouldn't be huge fluctuations of staff.
Somehow Galen managed to act like a man so broken that he lost his will to fight, which kinda made Krennic 'trust' him.
 
hoos30 said:
I thought I was the only one. This shit irked the hell out of me too. An entire galaxy of races to choose from and the STEM people are all old white guys? Really?
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The Empire is a human-first organization. Canonically, they look down on alien/non-human species.
 
WadiumArcadium said:
Vader fighting rebels was some of the earliest concept art Making Star Wars reported on for the film. I think they always planned to end the film with one.
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I always thought that rumor read like it happened in the middle of the film, almost in the spot I thought the Krennic seen would be. I hope we get a tell all about what was original and new in the final film. It'll always bug me.
 
WadiumArcadium said:
I expect it was Edwards. Gilroy came into help with additional dialogue, not action scenes.
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The ending was a good chunk of what was redone. Considering it's focused on action I dont' think it's as clear cut as just punched up dialogue.

Plus Gilroy's salary was bumped up to 5 million for helping with postproduction. I would be shocked if Edwards got more than than that considering the much more established Abrams netted $10 million for TFA.

RyanW said:
Isn't that a Legends thing? I don't think the new canon has really touched on that
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I don't think it needs to be officially decreed. The OT went out of their way to populate the Rebellion with aliens when provided with the budget to do so (RotJ) but still stuck with human only Imperials to the end.
 
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