I mean, why not post the RT and IMDB ratings too?
Alien: Resurrection
RT - 54%
Fresh: 38
Rotten: 33
Compared to Prometheus.
RT - 72%
Fresh: 201
Rotten: 77
That's a heck of a lot more reviews and a better indication of the quality of the movie.
Alien Covenant Trailer Released
- Thread starter MRORANGE
- Start date
- Status
I mean, why not post the RT and IMDB ratings too?
Alien: Resurrection
RT - 54%
Fresh: 38
Rotten: 33
Compared to Prometheus.
RT - 72%
Fresh: 201
Rotten: 77
That's a heck of a lot more reviews and a better indication of the quality of the movie.
Psychoward
Banned
Uh, no? Alien Resurrection has a 63, Prometheus has a 65.
There should be a term like Godwin's Law for when someone brings Rotten Tomatoes scores into movie discussions.
"I didn't like movie, it was poorly written. Characters acted only in service to moving the sloppy plot forward."
"Ok whatever stop trying to look cool here's numbers about it"
"I didn't like movie, it was poorly written. Characters acted only in service to moving the sloppy plot forward."
"Ok whatever stop trying to look cool here's numbers about it"
Killer Queen
Banned
Ah, it was user score I was looking at, apologies.
Psychoward
Banned
I'm not saying they're equivalent in being bad, I even posted my rankings earlier in the thread. I am saying using metacritic is silly when the point differential is only 2. In addition if you guys want to focus solely on the ratings and not the argument and the context be my guest.
There's so, so many reasons why Prometheus' script fails at a fundamental level and even the people who like the movie can't defend it nor even try in most cases. So I don't see how it's a stretch to understand why people don't like the movie.
A Serious Man
Member
Resurrection is the worst movie ever made, Prometheus is just sort of decent.
Killer Queen
Banned
What point are you trying to argue? I'm saying that despite GAF's insistence on the contrary, most people don't hate this movie, the closest you can get to proving that is by bringing up review scores. I chose 3 sites so it wasn't one sided, all of which have a favorable majority towards the movie.
You're arguing that no most people hate this movie because, people on the internet said so?
Never once said the movie isn't flawed and that everyone should love it.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Of course it does. C'mon man. If you didn't care, you wouldn't be in here. It's Christmas Eve and you're bullshitting about how people on GAF don't like Prometheus as much as you do. You care a li'l.
That's still not "militant," though. And if the thrust of your explanation for why you liked it centered on accusing people who don't of being "militant," and suggesting they're saying bad things about the movie you like because they're lying to themselves, or lying to others so as to look cool in front of the rest of the board, then pushback isn't just understandable, it's expected.
Hell, the thread right now is a misspelled mess of old info playing host to a game of slapjack with aggregate scores.
Nobody's even really talking about the movie. Or reading any of the words that go into how those Prometheus scores got arrived at. No quotes from those critiques, no insights from those reviews. You're just trying to hit each other in the head with numbers as if that's gonna shut someone up.
Talk about the movie if you wanna, yunno? Talk about why you liked it.
Simo
Member
I still enjoyed Prometheus as it's a really gorgeous movie, stellar production design and some cool characters with great performances. I truly think the Engineer was a really interesting character, and the Dark Horse comics have certainly made some cool stories with it. So it's not all wasted.
Unfortunately, Prometheus betrays much of what made the earlier films so great. Alien, Aliens, and Alien 3 had elements of lovecraftian and cosmic horror, which is essentially about mankind coming into contact with something that's beyond their comprehension and control, and paying dearly for it. Prometheus totally went against that. Making the engineers the creators of humanity ended up weakening the other movies. I'm still surprised that Ridley Scott had such a misread on what made the originals so good. The scene were they enter the derelict ship for the first time in Alien is soured now that they've established that the thing in the chair helped created mankind. We don't need all the answers, just enough to know that the characters are in too deep. That's really it.
I'm hoping they won't focus too much on that in this new movie. I really want them to nail it, as it'd be nice to have another solid Alien movie that people can get behind, but the rumors got me really worried that they're gonna try to tie a bow it all once again. We really don't need that.
Yep. Unfortunately we don't have Dan O'Bannon and I wonder what his thoughts on Prometheus would of been had be been alive to see it.
Psychoward
Banned
I'm arguing two things
1) there's plenty of reasons to dislike the movie outside of being "edgy"
2) most people do hold a dislike towards the movie yes
If you wanna go off ratings and SOLELY base it on the majority or whatever, attack of the clones has a 6 user score on metacritic. Technically a 6 means it skews more towards people liking it. But there's more to appeal and backlash than just a user score and yes, there isn't going to be a definitive reason to figure out whether or not a movie is panned or not. One way to do it is to look at its reception after the wave of initial hype, and we both know the reception to Prometheus hasn't been kind at all.
Killer Queen
Banned
I think you're a tad bit confused on the point I'm trying to make.
I know the movie is flawed
I know why people don't like it
I know why I like it and I don't really need to prove to anyone why I like it because I'm not trying to convince anyone.
I'm just saying that the general public reception of this movie isn't as negative as people would have you believe.
But that's not the point I'm trying to make.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
I'm not confused by your point at all, man.
Although the two sentences you just posted are kinda contradictory, if I'm reading 'em right.
Psychoward
Banned
Killer Queen
Banned
But you haven't proven this and you have nothing to back it up outside of what would either amount to anecdotal evidence (whether it be on GAF or otherwise) and without some kind of numbers as movie reviews provide then it's not really a point you can prove.
You can argue it with Suicide Squad because you have the numbers to back it up, but this isn't the situation.
And whether or not you liked or disliked attack of the Clones those scores are the closest you can get to a general consensus meaning that yes, the general consensus skews to that movie being more favorable. Sure there's hype to factor into it, but that's not really quantifiable
When people take the time to shit on the same thing in every situation its presented, it starts to come off that way.
I made a typo, but I'm sure you get it.
Regarding your second point. it's not critically panned and the majority of people probably watched it once and thought it was just okay. There isn't anything special about the movie and of course dissecting it shows that it fails on many levels.
Simo
Member
Collider's interview with Waterson and also talks about the trailer and footage they saw.
http://collider.com/alien-covenant-...utm_campaign=collidersocial&utm_medium=social
The description of Paradise and the neomorphs matches the spoilers coming out of those test screenings too.
http://collider.com/alien-covenant-...utm_campaign=collidersocial&utm_medium=social
The description of Paradise and the neomorphs matches the spoilers coming out of those test screenings too.
Prometheus is one of the few films that has made me genuinely roll my eyes repeatedly while I was sitting in the cinema.
- the reveal that Weyland is Vickers' father
- the Space Jockey being retconned to 2/3 of the original size
- the reveal that the Engineer has a 100% DNA match with humans
- David somehow being able to understand Engineer speech
- Vickers not being able to run sideways
- a scientist removing his helmet in an alien atmosphere
- another scientist petting an alien snake despite being scared to death of aliens a few minutes earlier
- the guy with the map (and robots to scan the area) is the guy who gets lost
- opening the door to Fifield (who they know is dead)
The script is just complete drivel, the characters don't seem to have any critical thinking skills (despite being scientists) and many plot details are nonsensical. The only character who behaves in a comprehensible way is David, he is a psychopath who despises humanity and yet he ends up being the only likeable one, I probably would have unleashed the black goo on those morons if I were him.
- the reveal that Weyland is Vickers' father
- the Space Jockey being retconned to 2/3 of the original size
- the reveal that the Engineer has a 100% DNA match with humans
- David somehow being able to understand Engineer speech
- Vickers not being able to run sideways
- a scientist removing his helmet in an alien atmosphere
- another scientist petting an alien snake despite being scared to death of aliens a few minutes earlier
- the guy with the map (and robots to scan the area) is the guy who gets lost
- opening the door to Fifield (who they know is dead)
The script is just complete drivel, the characters don't seem to have any critical thinking skills (despite being scientists) and many plot details are nonsensical. The only character who behaves in a comprehensible way is David, he is a psychopath who despises humanity and yet he ends up being the only likeable one, I probably would have unleashed the black goo on those morons if I were him.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
So now it's just a matter of whether or not the initial rumor about Waterston's character really was a bad rumor, or if it's a thing that's being hidden, Khan-style, from the marketing.
Let us pray that 20th Century Fox were just trolling when they forced those leaks to be taken down.
Haha basically nailed all my complaints.
The thing is the film looks so damm good production wise especially the 3D. So to see it crash and burn with the above mentioned silly decisions galls me.
Lets hope this sequel vastly improves.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
I mean, there's a couple quotes in that interview that could point towards that rumor being intact...
Simo
Member
Lol yeah it seemed like she was going off to bring up the connection more there before she stopped herself and moved on.
Chained Prometheus
Member
Well, according to Corporal Hicks from AVP Galaxy (dude who revealed James Franco's involvement and backed the recent 4chan spoilers), that particular rumor on Daniels isn't true.
But yeah, no way of knowing for sure yet.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Can nobody in this fandom fuckin' spell? Jesus.
Seriously though, I hope it's untrue, but if it is true, they need to not hide it, or treat it like some sort of twist or giant shock. They need to come out with that shit up front. Don't pull the Into Darkness okey-doke.
Chained Prometheus
Member
My bad, man. Wasn't paying attention there.
And yeah, I completely agree. I can already see the massive backlash if Ridley really does try to go in that direction with Daniels' character and how much worse that wrath will be if they try to hide it and pull a Khan on us.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
I was just building on the goof of this thread's title, it's alright.
Or rather, tThis tThread's Ttietl
Dash_Riprock
Member
Dear God at those supposed leaks. Its sad that Alien is one of only two franchises that I actually WANT to have a full reboot.
True Savior
Member
What this franchise needs is the Blomkamp crazy fan-fiction come to life.
Chained Prometheus
Member
Personally speaking, I have no expectations of Alien: Covenant being amazing. Ironically enough, Blade Runner 2049 is in a better position for pulling off that sort of miracle thanks to Denis Villeneuve and his cast and crew being involved.
However from the sound of things, we might get a pretty solid Alien film for a change. At best, it'd probably be The Force Awakens-tier, rather than Mad Max: Fury Road-tier. It depends if Hicks from AVPGalaxy Forums is right about his reports on the film (and so far it seems like he is).
"You mean it comes out of her situation, which is sort of the same with Ripley in the first film.
WATERSTON: Exactly! Shes just a regular lady, who turns out theres definitely a parallel there, for sure."
Please no...
Even if you included the deleted and extended scenes, there are still enough flaws to drag the rest of the film down. The scenes' exclusion from the final cut isn't something you can blame on Fox either. That was wholly Ridley and Pietro Scalia (the editor) choosing to cut what they did.
This ranking is spot on.
Now that I think about it, AvP and Prometheus are kind of the same movie. An old and dying Mr. Weyland sends a expedition to make a discovery that will further his legacy. After a mysterious briefing that involves some Chariots of the Gods nonsense, the expedition wanders around and unwittingly unleash a dormant alien threat. The security guys prove ineffectual against said threat, Mr. Weyland is eventually killed by the non-xeno alien, and everyone dies except the Ripley stand in (and the non-xeno alien). Soon after, the xeno alien kills the non-xeno alien, Ripley-lite escapes, and a new xeno hybrid bursts from inside the seemingly dead non-xeno alien (sequel tease!). Roll credits as viewers walk out with a look of disappointment on their face. Seems pretty similar to me.
In some way, AvP could be considered the better movie. Though Prometheus has better acting and production values, AvP at least doesn't seem to be high on itself. It never really aspired to be more than a dumb action/horror movie, so I can't really fault it for failing to be more. This talk of movie rankings is begining to remind me of the thread a few weeks back where people were shitting on Aliens. That turned out to be an interesting discussion.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
Yeah, the parallels are definitely notable.
Well she looks hot anyway, I'm on board for that. Too "Hollywood" hot though? And too much apeing Ripley's look? I fear it's overly slick which just completely detracts from the Alien aesthetic that existed from the first 3 movies (though I hated 3)... the films got silly after that.
Samurai G0SU
Member
Lesss go hype
Mammoth Jones
Member
I'm excited. Huge Alien fan.
Plasticine
Member
I think AvP is better than Prometheus simply because it's aware of how stupid it is. Prometheus strives to be something more and fails badly. AvP is aware it's a big dumb Wrestlemania match between two really cool looking monsters. Anderson cranks everything up to 10, and stages some really cool action sequences -- especially the throw down between Celtic Predator and Grid Alien. It's reach does not exceed its grasp. But then, I also have an unreasonable love for Paul WS Anderson movies, so it could just be that.
shira
Member
Idk maybe I'm going crazy but it feels like one mod is correcting typos and another mod is adding typos.
wesleyshark
Banned
Hype hype hype
Bobby Roberts
Banned
The man knows his cheese.
I was trying to think of what his top three would be, and it's like, 99c rental paradise
AvP
Event Horizon
Resident Evil Afterlife?
Does that last one just barely nudge out Mortal Kombat? I think it might. But jesus, look at the pinnacle of this man's mountain of turds. Behold it. The filmography in which Alien vs. Predator is the shining star. The dingle on the berry.
behold
Chaotic-Strike
Banned
My favorite memory from seeing AVP in the theatre was right when it ended a man yelled "That movie fucking sucked".
- Status