Yeah there's a big difference between weirdly barren and artificial like MGSV and big, open and expansive like RDR that provides a sense of scale to the world while still having interesting content dotted all around the map.
The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild **SPOILER FREE** Impression Thread
- Thread starter fluffydelusions
- Start date
Yeah there's a big difference between weirdly barren and artificial like MGSV and big, open and expansive like RDR that provides a sense of scale to the world while still having interesting content dotted all around the map.
Punished_Snake
Member
Yes and games like the Witcher 3 has visually cool looking world, but has lots of empty areas that has nothing to do in them.
Going by this thread it seems like they do.
OrbitalBeard
Member
For sure. Don't get me wrong, I expect the voice acting to be kind of bad, but you also have to remember that Zelda fans are ridiculously hyperbolic about this series and the most hardcore among them are the ones downloading the leaked game now and watching streams of it. So, it's actually really, really hard to gauge a lot of opinions right now.
brandonh83
Banned
Yeah the world sounds like it's way too big tbh, but I'll reserve judgment until I've played it.
Also the soundtrack... I really like everything except the battle music. It's hard to describe but it's like Wind Waker's battle music, where it's just kind of random hits on what sounds like baby instruments. I never liked that in Wind Waker at all, then Skyward Sword came along with (IMO) the best battle tracks in the series, but now we're back to the Wind Waker style of it.
But like with the overworld I still want to reserve judgment and hope that it works in context. I just really miss Skyward's more traditional battle/boss music and I haven't yet heard everything, so there's that. I've mostly just heard smaller battle tracks and miniboss stuff-- both were extremely meh to me, but I haven't heard any legit boss tracks yet I don't think. As long as the actual dungeon boss and final boss track(s) are great then I'm good to go.
Just a few things that have me on edge. Everything else sounds amazing. And the rest of the soundtrack I've heard is amazing, the village music is sooooooooo good I can't stress it enough.
Also the soundtrack... I really like everything except the battle music. It's hard to describe but it's like Wind Waker's battle music, where it's just kind of random hits on what sounds like baby instruments. I never liked that in Wind Waker at all, then Skyward Sword came along with (IMO) the best battle tracks in the series, but now we're back to the Wind Waker style of it.
But like with the overworld I still want to reserve judgment and hope that it works in context. I just really miss Skyward's more traditional battle/boss music and I haven't yet heard everything, so there's that. I've mostly just heard smaller battle tracks and miniboss stuff-- both were extremely meh to me, but I haven't heard any legit boss tracks yet I don't think. As long as the actual dungeon boss and final boss track(s) are great then I'm good to go.
Just a few things that have me on edge. Everything else sounds amazing. And the rest of the soundtrack I've heard is amazing, the village music is sooooooooo good I can't stress it enough.
That's true. It's best to stick with impressions from reviewers who got the Switch version and are 20+ hours into the game, tbh.
SinCityAssassin
Member
Clear case for the Switch, they did say.
There's a thing they should patch in both versions for sure, don't know how they missed it in design phase.
Since you have a quick menu for change weapons I don't know why you must go to the full pause menu to drop the useless stuff.
This won't be a problem if durability wasn't a thing.
Since you have a quick menu for change weapons I don't know why you must go to the full pause menu to drop the useless stuff.
This won't be a problem if durability wasn't a thing.
Can't you throw any weapon? It seems a fast way to do what you want
OrbitalBeard
Member
If you have a weak weapon that you no longer want....throw it at the nearest enemy.
That's a box quote
With all the poor VA talk, I'm wondering if the ongoing voice acting strike had anything to do with it. Horizon was sited as having less than stellar VA for the supporting cast, could explain Brom, and Sony usually knocks that out of the park. The writers guild strike gave us gems like Transformers 2, so it's not out of the question.
MiamiWesker
Member
See I'm not one of these people that think TP overworld was too enpty. It had big fields, so what, it served a purpose. They put a giant chase sequence in it. There were horse back battles. And it still has a bunch of secrets scattered around.
An open world doesn't need a million things to do every few steps. What it needs is when you reach a specific location that location is designed in a way to provide a unique excellent experience. That's the zelda way. Explore the world by traveling through fields to reach a spot where you solve puzzles, fight enemies and do all sorts of cool stuff.
I assume BOTW does all this.
An open world doesn't need a million things to do every few steps. What it needs is when you reach a specific location that location is designed in a way to provide a unique excellent experience. That's the zelda way. Explore the world by traveling through fields to reach a spot where you solve puzzles, fight enemies and do all sorts of cool stuff.
I assume BOTW does all this.
papercan55
Member
I'm sure someone will make one in the review thread..
On a sidenote all of these wii u impressions are really bad, i know they want to push their new console but it doesn't look good at all.
Fingers crossed for a day one patch for wii u owners.
No. The voice work for Japanese to English rarely ends up well. Seems like there is just a disconnect there.
That said, voices are opinionated as well. As in people literally complain about the sound of someone's vpice as opposed to someone's acting ability
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
Now flipside, sorry for not replying to things but the game also does a lot right, and I want to highlight things I've picked up on too which are worth noting.
-The dynamicness of the game's systems is awe-strucking. There is multiple ways to almost any situation and the fact the game just gives you tools and lets you do things is amazing. This goes into all elements, from combat, to puzzles, to exploration, and I'll go more in-depth on those in a second. But Nintendo introduced a LOT of new mechanics for the player, for enemies, for the environment, and I think it pays off because it creates some really unique, interesting, fun, surprising, and enjoyable time-by-time moments. I think the game is infinitely helped by its playground, go out there and form your own journey element that is elevated simply because of how much the player can actually do and how much can actually happen dynamically in the game world. The combat I'll tackle here as I can't go too in-depth from lack of much hands-on time myself, but there's a lot of weapons with very different traits and uses to play around with, and it's amazing how several people can probably face the same enemy lookout location for example and have completely different things happen simply through the game's own dynamic mechanics.
-The world is interesting and varied, while there are some big open spaces there's also a lot of detail in other parts of the world and the game does have an engaging fantasy world full of things to discover. I want to say more but afraid I'd be tiptoing spoilers, but there is some scenically beautiful spots, this game nails the 'look out around you and see much beauty' moments, and there is a lot to stumble upon. It's a very large world and the game does seem to open up even more the deeper you go in... I want to talk more about what I mean but just know the world they crafted is engaging. The barren issue does exist, but it's not the biggest issue due to how other elements of the world are tackled masterfully.
-The puzzles are very different from the rest of the series. A lot of them rely on figuring out solutions with the tools and abilities you have and things in the area. But I think this works wonderfully. Not a single puzzle I've seen so far has a single solution, you often have to learn what you can do and use creativity to get by the puzzles. This also makes Shrines quite fun because it's not specifically a set solution you're looking for, you're problem solving with what you can do to how to bypass obstacles, and the game does a great job at allowing different ways of thinking to figure out stuff. I could see some from word taking this as a negative, but for the style of game BotW is I think the openess in puzzle design is clever, well-implemented, and simply fun.
-The bosses are great from what I've observed so far, there's some more staple bosses, some spectacle, and some dynamic. The mix is impressive, but so is the fact most of the boss fights end up being quite memorable. There's also maybe some of the toughest enemies in the series in this title, I think many will die more in this game than just about any other recent Zelda game. I think there's a high chance this game may be the hardest Zelda game since Zelda 2. Not consistently so, but if you want a challenge it definitely can be seeked.
-The sound design of the game is amazing. Ambiance and music are top notch, there was a lot of attention put into the sound design and it shows. It makes the world that much more lush and alive, and makes the silent moments more engaging as the sound design is incredibly immersive. The music has some amazing tracks, some very interesting takes on old tracks, and just... I want to go more specifically, but know the music is very, very good and the sound design is excellent.
-Just on a note I want to throw out there, the game does have a lot of highs, both in slower exploration and more bombastic moments. The game strikes a great balance between downtime and more intense time, which I think adds so much. There's a lot here for those to enjoy who want to explore and take their time, or those who want to be challenged and have heavy action. I think the fact the game can adhere to so many different playstyles and taste while not really conflicting with the other, and the player can go at their own pace and do what they want to do rather than being forced to do this or that strictly adds so much to the experience.
---
A better way for me to express what I perceive as positives, this is based on three things, stream watching, my brother (who does have the game, and yes, legally), and I'm not a person who was particularly one way or the other on this game I will mention. I wasn't really excited or down on it, I just barely followed it and knew I would pick it up, thought it'd probably be good but there's other releases this year that I'm much, much more excited for. While I'm not completely neutral, I wasn't on this game's hype train and I'm just viewing stuff from a perspective that isn't excited, but also will pick up the game. Some of what I'm relaying is from my brother, some from my own observations. I think a lot of what I say, both positively and negatively, will ring true though.
-The dynamicness of the game's systems is awe-strucking. There is multiple ways to almost any situation and the fact the game just gives you tools and lets you do things is amazing. This goes into all elements, from combat, to puzzles, to exploration, and I'll go more in-depth on those in a second. But Nintendo introduced a LOT of new mechanics for the player, for enemies, for the environment, and I think it pays off because it creates some really unique, interesting, fun, surprising, and enjoyable time-by-time moments. I think the game is infinitely helped by its playground, go out there and form your own journey element that is elevated simply because of how much the player can actually do and how much can actually happen dynamically in the game world. The combat I'll tackle here as I can't go too in-depth from lack of much hands-on time myself, but there's a lot of weapons with very different traits and uses to play around with, and it's amazing how several people can probably face the same enemy lookout location for example and have completely different things happen simply through the game's own dynamic mechanics.
-The world is interesting and varied, while there are some big open spaces there's also a lot of detail in other parts of the world and the game does have an engaging fantasy world full of things to discover. I want to say more but afraid I'd be tiptoing spoilers, but there is some scenically beautiful spots, this game nails the 'look out around you and see much beauty' moments, and there is a lot to stumble upon. It's a very large world and the game does seem to open up even more the deeper you go in... I want to talk more about what I mean but just know the world they crafted is engaging. The barren issue does exist, but it's not the biggest issue due to how other elements of the world are tackled masterfully.
-The puzzles are very different from the rest of the series. A lot of them rely on figuring out solutions with the tools and abilities you have and things in the area. But I think this works wonderfully. Not a single puzzle I've seen so far has a single solution, you often have to learn what you can do and use creativity to get by the puzzles. This also makes Shrines quite fun because it's not specifically a set solution you're looking for, you're problem solving with what you can do to how to bypass obstacles, and the game does a great job at allowing different ways of thinking to figure out stuff. I could see some from word taking this as a negative, but for the style of game BotW is I think the openess in puzzle design is clever, well-implemented, and simply fun.
-The bosses are great from what I've observed so far, there's some more staple bosses, some spectacle, and some dynamic. The mix is impressive, but so is the fact most of the boss fights end up being quite memorable. There's also maybe some of the toughest enemies in the series in this title, I think many will die more in this game than just about any other recent Zelda game. I think there's a high chance this game may be the hardest Zelda game since Zelda 2. Not consistently so, but if you want a challenge it definitely can be seeked.
-The sound design of the game is amazing. Ambiance and music are top notch, there was a lot of attention put into the sound design and it shows. It makes the world that much more lush and alive, and makes the silent moments more engaging as the sound design is incredibly immersive. The music has some amazing tracks, some very interesting takes on old tracks, and just... I want to go more specifically, but know the music is very, very good and the sound design is excellent.
-Just on a note I want to throw out there, the game does have a lot of highs, both in slower exploration and more bombastic moments. The game strikes a great balance between downtime and more intense time, which I think adds so much. There's a lot here for those to enjoy who want to explore and take their time, or those who want to be challenged and have heavy action. I think the fact the game can adhere to so many different playstyles and taste while not really conflicting with the other, and the player can go at their own pace and do what they want to do rather than being forced to do this or that strictly adds so much to the experience.
---
A better way for me to express what I perceive as positives, this is based on three things, stream watching, my brother (who does have the game, and yes, legally), and I'm not a person who was particularly one way or the other on this game I will mention. I wasn't really excited or down on it, I just barely followed it and knew I would pick it up, thought it'd probably be good but there's other releases this year that I'm much, much more excited for. While I'm not completely neutral, I wasn't on this game's hype train and I'm just viewing stuff from a perspective that isn't excited, but also will pick up the game. Some of what I'm relaying is from my brother, some from my own observations. I think a lot of what I say, both positively and negatively, will ring true though.
That's what it looks like.
But then again, the same people who want 3000 things to do every 5 meters hate Assassin's Creed with a passion.
mickagau33
Member
Ahah, everytime I want to go in the spoiler threard, I end up here because there is the SPOILER word in capital letter in the title too. I should be really careful before posting ;-)
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
I hate to say this, but I'm on the same page. I didn't view Twilight Princess as having big empty spaces and actually liked it's overworld personally.
Trust me, while the more detailed areas of BotW is more detailed than any location from Twilight Princess, the most barren areas of BotW is much larger and much more barren than any place from Twilight Princess as well.
Skittzo0413
Member
Dusk Golem, you are just watching a stream right, not actually playing the game?
Most of the impressions so far have sorta been the opposite of what you've been saying about the openness and bareness of the world, which could have to do with the fact that you're watching someone else play it.
One of the things in an open world that a lot of people don't think about is that large open spaces go hand in hand with traversal speed (and whether traversal itself is fun). A big empty field can be very engaging if you're simply riding through it on horseback, looking at landmarks in the distance, or gliding over it to reach a peak on the other side.
If you had to run on foot through every open landscape in the game then I can definitely understand it getting boring and tedious, but so far this doesn't seem to be the case according to most previewers.
Most of the impressions so far have sorta been the opposite of what you've been saying about the openness and bareness of the world, which could have to do with the fact that you're watching someone else play it.
One of the things in an open world that a lot of people don't think about is that large open spaces go hand in hand with traversal speed (and whether traversal itself is fun). A big empty field can be very engaging if you're simply riding through it on horseback, looking at landmarks in the distance, or gliding over it to reach a peak on the other side.
If you had to run on foot through every open landscape in the game then I can definitely understand it getting boring and tedious, but so far this doesn't seem to be the case according to most previewers.
I think I know what the complaint about the non-realistic or not too realistic environment at least at the plateau means. I've also noticed this. There are these mountain ranges, that have this walkable area at a specific height, then another at a different height and so on. It reminded me of the Pokemon anime. On the other hand I saw also beautiful and natural looking areas, such as the beach area at the beginning of the latest trailer. The "heightmappy" look is probably still around at many places but from what I've seen from videos and trailers, I'm not bothered at this point.
Neoleo2143
Member
For god knows what reason the streamers haven't been bothering with horses for the most part. It's actually infuriating to see them hoof it so much.
Skittzo0413
Member
Interesting, I wonder if horse riding wasn't tutorialized enough. That would be fairly ironic.
Wow really? Of course the world's going to look empty if you opt not to use the widely-available main transport method. That's like playing Red Dead Redemption without a horse or GTA without a car.
Neoleo2143
Member
I mean it'd be completely their fault for ignoring every stable in the world.
OrbitalBeard
Member
Open worlds (and games in general) are also about getting personally immersed in the experience. If I watched someone play Shadow of the Colossus on Twitch, I would find that game's barren overworld to be incredibly dull. But playing the game for myself, it doesn't feel that way at all, because I'm fully invested. But we'll see. It may end up being something that bothers me when I play the game, but I doubt it.
Ah, the old "I don't like what I'm hearing and haven't seen it for myself but I'm going to attack it anyway". Good stuff!
akidnamededdy
Banned
I'm curious about how the people reporting massive frame drops (to the 5-15 range) and horrible pop-in are playing the game. Not to accuse anyone here of piracy, but there's a way to play games from the SD card and a way to play games from a USB drive, and one is considerably better performing in general than the other.
And that's how we get the CD-I timeline.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
Mostly from streams, but I got to play a couple hours of the game. My brother and I often exchange off things, I have a WiiU but he doesn't and he has a Switch pre-ordered while I don't. He managed to get an early copy on WiiU so I lent him my WiiU to play the game on on the agreement I get to play for a couple hours before letting him go wild. But since then I've mostly been watching streams. The game has a lot going on mechanically, and I have a pretty apt eye for picking up on little things. I normally put that towards horror games, but on occasion other types of games too. If you followed Resident Evil 7 for example you probably saw a lot of my analysis, and if you look back at what I noticed way before launch almost everything I noted hit the nail on the head, And it's not just been RE7, I've done this with a number of games. I design my own games in my spare time and think a lot about game design, I have a particular interest in it. It's not that unusual for me since watching gameplay I sort of breakdown what's happening in game design and not just off superficial things like how the player is playing. It's much easier to do of course if you've played the game some and know from hands-on what's going on, but I digress.
So this is a mixture of my brother getting the game early and stream watching. I also know my brother's breakdowns he's been sharing with me and parroting some of that, but others are forged from my own time and observation.
The thing about the barren comment is harder to pinpoint. I want to show gif examples of what I mean but I don't know which areas have been shown off and which have not. It's basically the world is selective in where it's lush and detailed. Barren stuff isn't the end of the world, but it is definitely noticeable. And this impression of it isn't just from me or my observations, this is also a complaint others playing are noting, and my brother who's decently further in is also talking to me about. and I definitely noticed while playing and from watching streams as well.
It's not a deal breaker, there is a lot to do in the game, but I think there is more barren landscapes than people are expecting. It's definitely not rare to come to a place that's mostly lifeless, lacking NPCs or enemies or maybe there's just one enemy camp or NPC within the visible spectrum of where you are.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
There's a lot more positive to see than negative, but more people sort of gravitate towards negative for fears or wanting to justify their own feelings (which isn't a bad thing, it's part of human nature), but I think there's not much reason to fear. The game has flaws, but it's still a fantastic game as far as I can tell. But it's good to be informed on what to expect I also think, nothing is flawless and it's good not to sweep such flaws under a rug either for hype purposes, just as it's not bad to praise something a game does particularly well that is hype-worthy, and this game does some things amazingly for certain.
Raven77
Member
Seeing some comments about the open world being maybe too big, not enough to "do" in some spaces.
Has anyone given any consideration to this being intentional? If you were to travel to undeveloped "wild" parts of the world, you would find many areas of "nothing". The game's title implies that this is a game about nature, etc. The outdoors don't always have to be beautiful and littered with things to see and climb, and observe. Sometimes nature can provide a sense of loneliness, a sense of longing to be back with people, etc. Maybe the game is purposely providing us with these large areas to just let us get lost in them, to feel Link's sense of being alone in a giant world. Perhaps these areas are there to make the more densely populated areas and villages feel even more vibrant and beautiful so that when we arrive at them we feel we have finally "made it" back from the wilderness and that loneliness.
Or maybe I've just thought too much about this...
Has anyone given any consideration to this being intentional? If you were to travel to undeveloped "wild" parts of the world, you would find many areas of "nothing". The game's title implies that this is a game about nature, etc. The outdoors don't always have to be beautiful and littered with things to see and climb, and observe. Sometimes nature can provide a sense of loneliness, a sense of longing to be back with people, etc. Maybe the game is purposely providing us with these large areas to just let us get lost in them, to feel Link's sense of being alone in a giant world. Perhaps these areas are there to make the more densely populated areas and villages feel even more vibrant and beautiful so that when we arrive at them we feel we have finally "made it" back from the wilderness and that loneliness.
Or maybe I've just thought too much about this...
No it's the old "every fucking open world game works this way because it needs to, but let's complain anyway". Fantastic stuff!
brandonh83
Banned
I mean, if I'm asking a developer for a realistic open world, I think it should feel organic. Asking for a big open world but filled with activities every square foot is like asking a director shooting a film adaptation of a book to shoot every single page. It's just not realistic in the least bit. There's always going to be stretches of openness that aren't necessarily filled with things to do. I don't mind traversing or riding through some "blank spaces" as long as the flora and fauna is pleasing, and it sounds like something to do in this game is never too far off.
I think it adds to the beauty and organics of the world. It's fine to not prefer that over a compact design like say in the top down 2D Zelda's, but I don't think it's realistic to expect a true open-world design that works organically to be filled a point of interest at every space. That being said, it's possible that they made this game too big, and depending, some of the empty space could get tiresome if not handled appropriately, so the verdict is still out. As long as it's not another Wind Waker situation, I'm down.
I feel like being out in a wide open field and just taking in the surroundings adds to a sense of vastness and exploration. I don't necessarily have to be partaking in some kind of activity to be enjoying myself.
I think it adds to the beauty and organics of the world. It's fine to not prefer that over a compact design like say in the top down 2D Zelda's, but I don't think it's realistic to expect a true open-world design that works organically to be filled a point of interest at every space. That being said, it's possible that they made this game too big, and depending, some of the empty space could get tiresome if not handled appropriately, so the verdict is still out. As long as it's not another Wind Waker situation, I'm down.
I feel like being out in a wide open field and just taking in the surroundings adds to a sense of vastness and exploration. I don't necessarily have to be partaking in some kind of activity to be enjoying myself.
What score do you expect it to have, even if all reviewers share your complaints?
If you don't care about scores dismiss my post.
I think it's mostly that people have heard journalists going nuts over this game, so they want to hear the negatives from people to see where it falls short. Every game has its flaws. Plus, most of the impressions so far have been from the Great Plateau, while a lot of journalists have been saying the good stuff is off the Plateau
akidnamededdy
Banned
Seeing some comments about the open world being maybe too big, not enough to "do" in some spaces.
Has anyone given any consideration to this being intentional? If you were to travel to undeveloped "wild" parts of the world, you would find many areas of "nothing". The game's title implies that this is a game about nature, etc. The outdoors don't always have to be beautiful and littered with things to see and climb, and observe. Sometimes nature can provide a sense of loneliness, a sense of longing to be back with people, etc. Maybe the game is purposely providing us with these large areas to just let us get lost in them, to feel Link's sense of being alone in a giant world. Perhaps these areas are there to make the more densely populated areas and villages feel even more vibrant and beautiful so that when we arrive at them we feel we have finally "made it" back from the wilderness and that loneliness.
Or maybe I've just thought too much about this...
Was just gonna post "the game's called Breath of the Wild, not Breath of the Million NPCs Trying To Talk To You All The Time." Dunno what people were expecting.
That said I've checked out some videos and it seemed like there was always something going on. If anything those (sidequest collectible spoiler)
Korok seeds
I'm not too concerned.
SinCityAssassin
Member
The review embargo is forcing them to talk to actual walls about more zelda because they can't do it anywhere else.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Wait so you guys are leaving impressions based on streams? -_- dont actually have the game? Never heard of this before.
Lights and Waves
Member
Any impressions on the story? No spoilers, of course.
Is it satisfying? Full of twists? Rewarding?
Is it satisfying? Full of twists? Rewarding?
Skittzo0413
Member
The other thing is a lot of us (from the preview thread anyway) have been hearing nothing but positives on this area of the game- i.e. the structure of the world, and I've actually watched quite a bit of preview footage to back up a lot of those positive impressions, but obviously nothing like a full stream. The previewers have been really praising the balance of density and openness, which is why seeing some opinions to the contrary are kind of big talking points.
Also we haven't been hearing many negatives about the game at all, so naturally we're more interested in seeing that than the positives we've seen all over the place.
PancakeBurglar
Member
I love how they've handled the world, seems like there are plenty of towns and npcs but also just open fields to ride your horse and take in the atmosphere, I don't want things stopping me every 5 seconds when exploring. Plus critics seem to all agree there is plenty of content and things to do in the game overall so I'm not worried.
family_guy
Member
Like what? Only thing that comes to mind is Xenoblade Chronicles and NoA had nothing to do with that.
Got the game early because french story in my town broke the street rate. I'm playing Wii U version
I am only in tutorial area and this is the first time I can say: I'm not bored because I'm not restrained of my movements 99% of the time. They're just some walls (the ones in the shrines) you can't climb but that's it.
I do feel busy all the time at the moment but not forced to be. There are no subquests (on the Great Plateau) that tell you go farm X stuffs so I farm because I want to.
Climbing a wall to escape furious guardian, it's cool, lol
Edit: graphically speaking. You need to play the game, the screenshots don't flatter the game. Yes, it's style washed out but less because everything blend together. I'm less bothered by the graphics now like I was in the beginning before playing. But yes, if your tv can make the game more saturated, do it, lol.
Neoleo2143
Member
It's not really twisty per say but it is thematically interesting, has a lot of great character interaction, and uses classic adventure game trappings as well to intertwine gameplay and narrative nicely.
It's no Grim Fandango but it doesn't need to be. It's solid so far.
MiamiWesker
Member
Gotcha.
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