Clinton: 'I was on the way to winning' until Comey, Russia intervened

Neoweee said:
People were never this harsh on Gore, Kerry, McCain, Romney, Dole, etc.

The degree to which people demand Hillary to crucify herself (and she better pay for her own fucking nails) seems rabid and insane. My God.

I really can't reconcile any of it other than viewing sexism as some kind of hatred multiplier.
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It's a little hasty to chalk it all up to sexism when you consider that she's been a far more divisive figure within her own party than any of the people you mentioned, and when you consider that her loss, regardless of why it happened, ended up throwing the world into a hell spiral. Stakes are a lot higher these days, and the situation is a little more complex than just one's gender.

Also, I'm not asking that she crucify herself, I'm just saying that if you're claiming to take responsibility for your loss, trying to save face in the same breath spoils that a bit. It's like Obama with the Wall Street speeches. It's not the worst thing in the world for someone to do, but don't expect people to stay silent about it.
 
jmdajr said:
Hilary needs to go away. Donate money if you want but stay out the spotlight.
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Agreed, at this point Hillary just appearing seems to make everyone going to a frenzy to both villify and defend her to comical lengths. Her presence now is hurting way more than helping.
 
conpfreak said:
"And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for you meddling kids"
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This is pretty much how it sounded. I just don't understand how someone who has been in politics as long as Hillary has could be so completely tone-deaf and not self-aware of anything she is saying. I mean I can name absolutely zero politicians who would have thrown out that "deplorables" line besides Hillary because every politician already knows from their first high-school student council election that you never insult the electorate.
 
Neoweee said:
"Blue Wall" based on prior elections is and always was a BS theory.

"Wisconsin looks safe" based on polls is actually making campaign decisions based on what's available and what's discernible from the current cycle's data, and that's what they did. Obviously they were wrong.

But it is moot, because that's not why she lost the election. She lost PA and FL despite campaigning there and spending there, but those states were lost in the same White Wave that crushed IA, OH, MI, and WI.
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It sorta looks like they didn't, actually.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...ie-hillary-fucking-ignored-us-in-swing-states

“They fucking ignored us on all these [three] battleground states [while] we were sounding the alarm for months,” Nomiki Konst, a progressive activist and former Sanders surrogate who served on the 2016 Democratic National Committee platform committee, told The Daily Beast. “We kept saying to each other like, ‘What the fuck, why are they just blowing us off? They need these voters more than anybody.’”
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“We were painting them a dire picture, and I couldn’t help but think they literally looked like they had no idea what was going on here,” she continued. “I remember their faces, it was like they had never fucking heard this stuff before. It’s what we had been screaming for the past 9 months… It’s like [they] forgot the basics of Politics 101.”
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“The math that they lost on, is the math we won on,” Konst said. “So we wrote out a plan, and sent it to them, telling them to stop thinking you’re going to get this ‘Obama coalition,’ it’s not going to happen.”
Assurances were then made with various Clinton senior staffers that they would follow through with subsequent meetings and phone calls to address these gaps and warnings. Instead, meetings were canceled and “rescheduled” into oblivion.
“We not only screamed about this, we wrote memos, we begged,” Jane Kleeb, Nebraska Democratic Party chair and another Sanders booster who was at the DNC meeting, said. “I spent a good chunk of time writing memos about how [Bernie’s surrogates] could be utilized on the campaign trail, about ‘issue voters,’ about the environment, Black Lives Matter, Dakota Access Pipeline, rogue cops, you name it… I was [also] talking specifically about rural communities, and how [Hillary] completely ignored and abandoned anything that we cared about.”
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http://www.politico.com/story/2016/12/michigan-hillary-clinton-trump-232547

Michigan organizers were shocked. It was the latest case of Brooklyn ignoring on-the-ground intel and pleas for help in a race that they felt slipping away at the end.

“They believed they were more experienced, which they were. They believed they were smarter, which they weren’t,” said Donnie Fowler, who was consulting for the Democratic National Committee during the final months of the campaign. “They believed they had better information, which they didn’t.”
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The anecdotes are different but the narrative is the same across battlegrounds, where Democratic operatives lament a one-size-fits-all approach drawn entirely from pre-selected data — operatives spit out “the model, the model,” as they complain about it — guiding Mook’s decisions on field, television, everything else. That’s the same data operation, of course, that predicted Clinton would win the Iowa caucuses by 6 percentage points (she scraped by with two-tenths of a point), and that predicted she’d beat Bernie Sanders in Michigan (he won by 1.5 points).
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The only metric that people involved in the operations say they ever heard headquarters interested in was how many volunteer shifts had been signed up — though the volunteers were never given the now-standard handheld devices to input the responses they got in the field, and Brooklyn mandated that they not worry about data entry. Operatives watched packets of real-time voter information piled up in bins at the coordinated campaign headquarters. The sheets were updated only when they got ripped, or soaked with coffee. Existing packets with notes from the volunteers, including highlighting how much Trump inclination there was among some of the white male union members the Clinton campaign was sure would be with her, were tossed in the garbage.
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People involved in the Michigan campaign still can’t understand why Brooklyn stayed so sure of the numbers in a state that it also had projected Clinton would win in the primary.

“Especially given what happened in the primary,” said Michigan Democratic Party chairman Brandon Dillon. “We knew that there was going to have to be more attention.”

With Clinton’s team ignoring or rejecting requests, Democratic operatives in Michigan and other battleground states might have turned to the DNC. But they couldn’t; they weren’t allowed to ask for help.
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On the morning of Election Day, internal Clinton campaign numbers had her winning Michigan by 5 points. By 1 p.m., an aide on the ground called headquarters; the voter turnout tracking system they’d built themselves in defiance of orders — Brooklyn had told operatives in the state they didn’t care about those numbers, and specifically told them not to use any resources to get them — showed urban precincts down 25 percent. Maybe they should get worried, the Michigan operatives said.
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TestOfTide said:
Thanks for showing you didn't read the article in the OP (where she explicitly said it was her own fault).

Hillary isn't literally the ONLY reason Trump won.
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Oh, please. No she didn't. You didn't read the article. I watched the tape. She half ass accepted responsibility; she basically said 'it was my fault but really Cuomo and Russia'. Stop pretending she didn't.

Still no real evidence of Russian hacking but you all latch onto that because it's so comforting and you believe everything USG says. Don't be such idiots.

So much fun reading through this thread and seeing the denial among the Clinton fandom. This whole election is a paradox for me personally because as much as Trump shouldn't even be anywhere near the Presidency, she sure as hell DID NOT deserve it. She and the DNC cheated, the emails showed that, and her loss is poetic justice.

Sorry not sorry. You got a problem with this position, that's on you.
 
FreedomFighter said:
Oh, please. No she didn't. You didn't read the article. I watched the tape. She half ass accepted responsibility; she basically said 'it was my fault but really Cuomo and Russia'. Stop pretending she didn't.

Still no real evidence of Russian hacking but you all latch onto that because it's so comforting and you believe everything USG says. Don't be such idiots.

So much fun reading through this thread and seeing the denial among the Clinton fandom. This whole election is a paradox for me personally because as much as Trump shouldn't even be anywhere near the Presidency, she sure as hell DID NOT deserve it. She and the DNC cheated, the emails showed that, and her loss is poetic justice.

Sorry not sorry. You got a problem with this position, that's on you.
Click to expand...
She let Trump win. That in itself should be enough to convince anyone on her political merits.
 
FreedomFighter said:
Oh, please. No she didn't. You didn't read the article. I watched the tape. She half ass accepted responsibility; she basically said 'it was my fault but really Cuomo and Russia'. Stop pretending she didn't.

Still no real evidence of Russian hacking but you all latch onto that because it's so comforting and you believe everything USG says. Don't be such idiots.

So much fun reading through this thread and seeing the denial among the Clinton fandom. This whole election is a paradox for me personally because as much as Trump shouldn't even be anywhere near the Presidency, she sure as hell DID NOT deserve it. She and the DNC cheated, the emails showed that, and her loss is poetic justice.

Sorry not sorry. You got a problem with this position, that's on you.
Click to expand...

What, specifically, did the DNC do?

The rules were essentially a copy-paste of 2008, with less BS.

They don't run the caucuses (state parties do).

They don't run the primaries (state election commissions do).

They certainly don't make all of the minorities that Sanders didn't even try to campaign at vote for Hillary.

He lost by four million votes. That's on the voters, not the DNC/Illuminati Lite.
 
FreedomFighter said:
Oh, please. No she didn't. You didn't read the article. I watched the tape. She half ass accepted responsibility; she basically said 'it was my fault but really Cuomo and Russia'. Stop pretending she didn't.
Click to expand...

"She didn't take responsibility even though she did". Suuuuure buddy.

Still no real evidence of Russian hacking but you all latch onto that because it's so comforting and you believe everything USG says. Don't be such idiots.
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No evidence of Russian hacking? Are you fucking kidding me? We have numerous intelligence agencies across the fucking world all saying that the Russians hacked the democrats. We even have numerous republicans who agree that the Russians hacked the democrats.

So much fun reading through this thread and seeing the denial among the Clinton fandom. This whole election is a paradox for me personally because as much as Trump shouldn't even be anywhere near the Presidency, she sure as hell DID NOT deserve it. She and the DNC cheated, the emails showed that, and her loss is poetic justice.

Sorry not sorry. You got a problem with this position, that's on you.
Click to expand...

So basically you are one of those guys who WANTED Trump to win.

Good to know that you are no better than the alt-right, nazi.

Neoweee said:
What, specifically, did the DNC do?

The rules were essentially a copy-paste of 2008, with less BS.

They don't run the caucuses (state parties do).

They don't run the primaries (state election commissions do).

They certainly don't make all of the minorities that Sanders didn't even try to campaign at.

He lost by four million votes. That's on the voters, not the DNC/Illuminati Lite.
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Don't forget the part where that poster STILL won't accept the fact that the Russians hacked the DNC.

Or the part where he LITERALLY admits that he wanted Trump to win.
 
Unknown Soldier said:
This is pretty much how it sounded. I just don't understand how someone who has been in politics as long as Hillary has could be so completely tone-deaf and not self-aware of anything she is saying. I mean I can name absolutely zero politicians who would have thrown out that "deplorables" line besides Hillary because every politician already knows from their first high-school student council election that you never insult the electorate.
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It's because Hillary never had to make her way up the ladder. It was a major issue- Bill was the one winning elections, not her, and that lack of experience/lessons was a massive issue. She didn't have the type of personality (and ability to lie) you need out of a candidate.

I still thought she was by far the better option over Sanders, but I voted Obama in '08 in large part because of these issues and was hoping she'd be able to draft off of him far more than she was able to. She should have stepped back after '08 and recognized the best way to use her was in anything but trying to win an election. But self-awareness was never her strong suit. (Compare her to Warren, who knows not to run nationally for Pres.)
 
The fact such a non scandal could have cost her the election against a guy who generated a new legitimate scandal each time he opened his mouth is beyond baffling

Can we just all agree a truly well run campaign should not have failed like that?
 
If I'm not mistaken Bill Clinton did want a conventional boots on the ground campaign as well as the newer data analytics driven techniques.

I almost envy that Trump happened. At least he'll be gone in a few years, while we're stuck in a never ending brexit nightmare. At least, you guys get to lick your chops ready with knowledge your are going to bite back.

There are many factors that have been discussed to death, but one that isn't is that Obama didn't ever lean towards social justice and economics justice, abandoning the working class, that turned to Trump. When people voted for Obama they didn't view him as the establishment, even though he really really was. And he didn't confront Russia, ever. It's too bad, I was looking forward to Hillary putting Putin in his corner.

Whoever comes around in 4 years, I hope, rightfully puts a stop to Russia trying to destroy the liberal west.
 
It could be argued that it was a contributing factor, but that would be like 2,3, or 4 on a Top 5 Reasons why the majority of states didn't vote for her.

Going to politely ask to not list out the five reasons for obvious reasons.
 
Shadowhelper said:
It's too bad, I was looking forward to Hillary putting Putin in his corner.
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You mean this Hillary?

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.co...-gift-to-russian-fm-gets-lost-in-translation/

When it comes to Russia, the Obama administration has been talking about “pressing the reset button.” It’s meant to symbolize a possible new start in U.S./Russian relations, which “crashed” after Russia invaded Georgia last August.

So when Secretary of State Hillary Clinton greeted Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov in Geneva Friday before sitting down to their working dinner, she was all smiles when she presented him a small green box with a ribbon.

Lavrov opened it and, inside, there was a red button with the Russian word “peregruzka” printed on it.

"I would like to present you with a little gift that represents what President Obama and Vice President Biden and I have been saying and that is: 'We want to reset our relationship, and so we will do it together.' ...
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art.clintonlavrov1.gi.jpg


Times sure have changed.
 
I'm no Trump fanboy, but Clinton in the epitome of a sore loser.
She didn't even hold a fucking concession speech the night of, she's a horrible example to kids out there and I'm glad she's not setting an example to our next generation.

With saying that, Trump does have a pass on that, because most, if not all, teachers hate him anyway and express that to their class.
 
partime said:
I'm no Trump fanboy, but Clinton in the epitome of a sore loser.
She didn't even hold a fucking concession speech the night of, she's a horrible example to kids out there and I'm glad she's not setting an example to our next generation.

With saying that, Trump does have a pass on that, because most, if not all, teachers hate him anyway and express that to their class.
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You mean the full concession speech she gave the morning of the 9th, when the results were confirmed?

Jesus, this is pathetic.
 
partime said:
I'm no Trump fanboy, but Clinton in the epitome of a sore loser.
She didn't even hold a fucking concession speech the night of, she's a horrible example to kids out there and I'm glad she's not setting an example to our next generation.

With saying that, Trump does have a pass on that, because most, if not all, teachers hate him anyway and express that to their class.
Click to expand...

You may not be a Trump fanboy, but you clearly have a irrational hatred for Hillary. I mean, you're just making shit up. Not a good role model? Yeah, how dare girls around the world have a strong, independent woman to look up to? Thank god we have a born-rich, entitled white-man who sexual assaults women as a role model.

Fuck me, this shit has just gotten ridiculous.
 
FreedomFighter said:
Oh, please. No she didn't. You didn't read the article. I watched the tape. She half ass accepted responsibility; she basically said 'it was my fault but really Cuomo and Russia'. Stop pretending she didn't.

Still no real evidence of Russian hacking but you all latch onto that because it's so comforting and you believe everything USG says. Don't be such idiots.

So much fun reading through this thread and seeing the denial among the Clinton fandom. This whole election is a paradox for me personally because as much as Trump shouldn't even be anywhere near the Presidency, she sure as hell DID NOT deserve it. She and the DNC cheated, the emails showed that, and her loss is poetic justice.

Sorry not sorry. You got a problem with this position, that's on you.
Click to expand...


Pure junk. But at least you're not dancing around it anymore.
 
partime said:
I'm no Trump fanboy, but Clinton in the epitome of a sore loser.
She didn't even hold a fucking concession speech the night of, she's a horrible example to kids out there and I'm glad she's not setting an example to our next generation.

With saying that, Trump does have a pass on that, because most, if not all, teachers hate him anyway and express that to their class.
Click to expand...

lol she didn't even speak to the people that were at her coronation ceremony I mean campaign headquarters when the results solidified, she sent her little gremlin minion Podesta out to shoo all of her distraught supporters away
 
Gestahl said:
lol she didn't even speak to the people that were at her coronation ceremony I mean campaign headquarters when the results solidified, she sent her little gremlin minion Podesta out to shoo all of her distraught supporters away
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You sound rational.
 
FreedomFighter said:
Oh, please. No she didn't. You didn't read the article. I watched the tape. She half ass accepted responsibility; she basically said 'it was my fault but really Cuomo and Russia'. Stop pretending she didn't.

Still no real evidence of Russian hacking but you all latch onto that because it's so comforting and you believe everything USG says. Don't be such idiots.

So much fun reading through this thread and seeing the denial among the Clinton fandom. This whole election is a paradox for me personally because as much as Trump shouldn't even be anywhere near the Presidency, she sure as hell DID NOT deserve it. She and the DNC cheated, the emails showed that, and her loss is poetic justice.

Sorry not sorry. You got a problem with this position, that's on you.
Click to expand...

lul
 
Did this thread get bumped because the other one was closed? Do people think they're about the same topic?
 
Peter Ian Staker said:
The fact such a non scandal could have cost her the election against a guy who generated a new legitimate scandal each time he opened his mouth is beyond baffling

Can we just all agree a truly well run campaign should not have failed like that?
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Yep.

It's important we learn the right lessons from this election. At least, if we don't want Trump re-elected, because don't put it pass this country for a second to vote him in again. They already did so once.
 
ElFly said:
there is this mentality that states cannot be flipped. before the election, the blue wall was unflippable. after the election, you are now saying that the rust belt could not have been flipped by Clinton's presence

so basically everything is predetermined forever, except that the fool, idiot guy who said it could happen, went, flipped the states and is now president

yes, as a reaction to the Comey letter, Clinton going there could not have preserved those states. Or maybe she could, the voter advantage for Trump was sometimes minimal. but the important part is that it should NOT have gotten there in the first place. the campaign was poorly planned, poorly ran, and to blame the last few days of it when it had ran for several months is crazy

the whole Blue Wall idea was dangerous, and Nate Silver warned of it loooong before Comey and the russians hackers came around
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The Blue Wall idea was false. It wasn't really a warning or maybe there was another person at 538 that wrote about it besides Nate. I distinctly remember them outlining why it was a trash alternative fact. In any event, you can see that people who claim to be pragmatic and operating off evidence at virtually all times are just as dumb and misinformed as the rest of us. Probably even dumber because of their confidence while talking down to us.
 
Did anyone catch Howard Sterns rants about this? I thought he summed it up quite perfectly. I'm on the can right now, but to summarize:

Hillary's team ran a bad campaign because they did not capitalize on Trumps frequent screw ups. She also did not communicate with the public effectively, especially during speculation about her health. He went on to argue that he could have clinched the white male / female vote if she came onto his show LOL I guess he invited her multiple times but she never committed.

He's not wrong.
 
TheLaughingStock said:
The Blue Wall idea was false. It wasn't really a warning or maybe there was another person at 538 that wrote about it besides Nate. I distinctly remember them outlining why it was a trash alternative fact. In any event, you can see that people who claim to be pragmatic and operating off evidence at virtually all times are just as dumb and misinformed as the rest of us. Probably even dumber because of their confidence while talking down to us.
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Hard to not talk down to you when you were in the other Clinton thread literally spewing conspiracy nonsense about how Hillary secret hates the momentum of the Resistance against Trump.
 
The bigger issue at play is she was also the subject of a full speed rage-induced media machine that attempted to railroad her for the last twenty years. People talked about Hilary Clinton on the right like she was a super villain. And they excused the same kind of behavior in Donald trump that they said they loathed in her and Obama. Comey was definitely part of it but discounting what the media has done, especially to enabling our divisive polarization (to the point where facts don't matter) is the much larger problem and it's going to make the next few elections very, very hard. People can't even agree on reality anymore.
 
Peter Ian Staker said:
The fact such a non scandal could have cost her the election against a guy who generated a new legitimate scandal each time he opened his mouth is beyond baffling

Can we just all agree a truly well run campaign should not have failed like that?
Click to expand...

She never even visited Wisconsin because it was assumed she had it in the bag. Then it turned out to be a key swing state that Trump flipped. Calling it a well-run campaign is a stretch.
 
RoninChaos said:
The bigger issue at play is she was also the subject of a full speed rage-induced media machine that attempted to railroad her for the last twenty years. People talked about Hilary Clinton on the right like she was a super villain. And they excused the same kind of behavior in Donald trump that they said they loathed in her and Obama. Comey was definitely part of it but discounting what the media has done, especially to enabling our divisive polarization (to the point where facts don't matter) is the much larger problem and it's going to make the next few elections very, very hard. People can't even agree on reality anymore.
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The past 20 years have the GOP practice on Hillary, but I would say that it was the past 4 years when right wing media was really honed in on targeting Hillary over everyone else. Like it got to the point these past 4 years where the GOP was attacking Hillary more than they were attacking Obama.
 
partime said:
I'm no Trump fanboy, but Clinton in the epitome of a sore loser.
She didn't even hold a fucking concession speech the night of, she's a horrible example to kids out there and I'm glad she's not setting an example to our next generation.

With saying that, Trump does have a pass on that, because most, if not all, teachers hate him anyway and express that to their class.
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... she's a horrible example for kids, but the illiterate, narcissistic, thin skinned, pussy grabbing racist is someone out kids can look up to!
 
Hard to defend her when she mentions campaign mistakes but ultimately blames her loss on Comey and Russia. Really reads like a "I made mistakes BUT it wasn't really my fault" argument.
 
Clinton is a major cog in the machine that is creating a gap between classes in America. Why am I seeing this turn back to the status quo from before Trump? Fuck Trump - but this is a pivot point. The citizens of America (the ones who can't rely on Saudi, Wall Street, dark money to get by) have an opportunity to change the course here.

No fucking way - not okay with min. wage of $12, money in politics and half baked healthcare.

Time to grow.
 
BstnRich said:
Clinton is a major cog in the machine that is creating a gap between classes in America. Why am I seeing this turn back to the status quo from before Trump? Fuck Trump - but this is a pivot point. The citizens of America (the ones who can't rely on Saudi, Wall Street, dark money to get by) have an opportunity to change the course here.

No fucking way - not okay with min. wage of $12, money in politics and half baked healthcare.

Time to grow.
Click to expand...

Good luck with that with the GOP as powerful as they ever were. Seeds for growth right there.
 
BstnRich said:
Clinton is a major cog in the machine that is creating a gap between classes in America. Why am I seeing this turn back to the status quo from before Trump? Fuck Trump - but this is a pivot point. The citizens of America (the ones who can't rely on Saudi, Wall Street, dark money to get by) have an opportunity to change the course here.

No fucking way - not okay with min. wage of $12, money in politics and half baked healthcare.

Time to grow.
Click to expand...

That's not going to happen until people start dragging GOP politicians out into the street and beating them.
 
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