Wonder Woman in her office
Boys fighting
Meh that's a 3
Giant CG monster... That's a 10. Ready to rock and roll
Wonder Woman |OT| The World is Ready for You, Gal Gad [SPOILERS]
- Thread starter 3N16MA
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Boys fighting
Meh that's a 3
Giant CG monster... That's a 10. Ready to rock and roll
crisdecuba
Member
Logan was a better film than WW, but GotG2 was on the same level as WW. And for what it's worth, the characters in WW were more appealing and the humor worked more consistently for me.
I don't quite understand not being able to connect with or be emotionally invested in the character because you're a boy. The themes and character arc weren't all that gender specific.
Although, at the same time of this is true, this could give insight into the extra effort people have to make in consuming movies and television when the characters don't represent them.
Subpar Spatula
Banned
Fantastic.
Great humor, great villain, great hero, and great side characters. I don't think I've enjoyed watching PG-13 super hero movie since TDK and damn this was mighty good.
Great humor, great villain, great hero, and great side characters. I don't think I've enjoyed watching PG-13 super hero movie since TDK and damn this was mighty good.
The Man of Steel fight is kind is a continuity flub. I would have been willing to suggest that maybe Wonder Woman was just elsewhere at the time and couldn't get to metropolis, but Zod sent out a world wide threat, so there's no way she didn't hear it. It was a world ending threat, no way she'd pass on that.
And really, the movie ends with Wonder Woman, in full suit, flying out of her tower upon hearing that there was trouble brewing, so the implication here is that she has been active in the world since then. It is antithetical to her character resolution for her to sit back and let the world go it's own way.
Idk, it just doesn't jive for me for WW to exist in the same continuity as DCEU. For all that posturing about how "Superman is a god" and people panicking and shit, Wonder Woman is an actual god and she's been around for a hundred years at this point.
And really, the movie ends with Wonder Woman, in full suit, flying out of her tower upon hearing that there was trouble brewing, so the implication here is that she has been active in the world since then. It is antithetical to her character resolution for her to sit back and let the world go it's own way.
Idk, it just doesn't jive for me for WW to exist in the same continuity as DCEU. For all that posturing about how "Superman is a god" and people panicking and shit, Wonder Woman is an actual god and she's been around for a hundred years at this point.
Inferno313
Banned
The opening and closing sequences of this take place post-BvS. I don't think the ending means she's always been active, just that she's stayed active post-BvS.
BronsonLee
Member
It's a pretty bad flub but I would just try to move past it like when the issue pops up in other hero films. It just stands out more because as we know character wise, she would never stand by on that one bit. She couldn't stand aside when she saw a fairly typical war-torn town and trenches, there's no way she wouldn't go crush Zod with zero sympathy
Was there ever a reason for her showing up in BvS Pre-Doomsday? It would've made more narrative sense for her to pop in to stop the Batman/Supes fight, then go ham on Doomsday herself like she did
Was there ever a reason for her showing up in BvS Pre-Doomsday? It would've made more narrative sense for her to pop in to stop the Batman/Supes fight, then go ham on Doomsday herself like she did
Plus, Man of Steel had severe issues with pacing, characterization, dialogue, and plot structure.
Even if you believe the two are similar - I don't - fact is that Wonder Woman is pound for pound a better made movie. And that's from someone who has wasted a lot of digital ink defending MoS around these parts.
But the whole point of the final fight with Ares is her realizing that humanity is worth fighting for.
Roland_Gunner
Member
Logan I can agree with but Guardians? What did GotG2 do better than WW? Outside of the Gamora / Nebula arc it was a non-stop series of lame dick and fart jokes.
broncobuster
Banned
Would've been funny/stupid if BVS revealed some Kryptonians tried starting shit in Paris or London and Diana shut that down with quickness.
Biggest-Geek-Ever
Member
Man, based off this movie, she should have fucking murdered Doomsday. Telekinetic shield and lightning attacks that can kill gods, and instead she's goofing around attacks his legs with a sword.
BronsonLee
Member
I liked Guardians a lot, but that franchise is extremely cynical and goes for different emotional beats IMO
Show their ship landing and getting fuckin' bodied ASAP by the one true god
Maybe she's out of practice
Maybe she didn't want to let loose considering they were still fighting in a city
Maybe it's Maybelline!
It was funny as fuck to see her fucking tank everything Doomsday had and still beat his ass. Supes is OP but doesn't know how to fight. Batman knows how to fight but is a normie. Wondy is the true hero of the land
Show their ship landing and getting fuckin' bodied ASAP by the one true god
Maybe she's out of practice
Maybe she didn't want to let loose considering they were still fighting in a city
Maybe it's Maybelline!
It was funny as fuck to see her fucking tank everything Doomsday had and still beat his ass. Supes is OP but doesn't know how to fight. Batman knows how to fight but is a normie. Wondy is the true hero of the land
This comment is inaccurate and a disservice to the writer.
No, it isnt. I found it to be a very predictable movie because it just leans on common storybeats the whole way through. That can be fine as long as the action, dialogue, pacing, ect are on point... but I didn't think the movie did any of those well either. I don't know how involved he was but I felt that "Snyder stink" all over it with overuse of slo-mo/cg, bad pacing, and hamfisted dialogue.
On the positive side: I would agree that its a better movie than MoS or BvS. Gal is a great Wonder Woman, she and Steve delivered solid performances.
broncobuster
Banned
Superman's main move is flying really fast at opponents. Faora exposed his inexperience in MoS when she smacked him silly at the IHOP.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
I do think WW needed it. The problem is that it just wasn't as interesting as the other fights in the movie. It was also much too similar to the other DC movie final showdowns. Dark sky, firey explosions and two characters jumping and punching and flying around throwing giant things at each other repeatedly until it's over. There needs to be some visual diversity in these climaxes.
BattleMonkey
Member
Thought it was great, really only thing that was a bit of a miss if really Gal's acting. It sometimes just was... awful
BronsonLee
Member
Diana is so OP that if Ares wasn't there for the main throw down, it would've made absolutely no sense for Trevor to do the sacrifice fly
Should've pancaked his ass
Should've pancaked his ass
I can imagine Diana getting super annoyed watching all the news heads talk about Superman as if he's the hottest shit to ever grace their planet.
Newsperson: He's like nothing we've ever seen before. He has super strength and can fly.
Diana: Anyone see me lift that tank over my head at the end of WWI?
Newsperson: He saves countless lives.
Diana: I literally ended The Great War, lady.
Newsperson: He's like a god.
Diana: Bitch, I am literally part of the Greek pantheon. Goddammit.
Newsperson: He's like nothing we've ever seen before. He has super strength and can fly.
Diana: Anyone see me lift that tank over my head at the end of WWI?
Newsperson: He saves countless lives.
Diana: I literally ended The Great War, lady.
Newsperson: He's like a god.
Diana: Bitch, I am literally part of the Greek pantheon. Goddammit.
Lights and Waves
Member
yukianderson
Member
I really loved it. Walked out wanting more. Gave me hope for Justice League.
Think you are in a big minority there if i am honest.
mugurumakensei
Member
It is necessary in WW. It shows off just how powerful she is. It ties her up so Trevor's sacrifice is necessary. It also ties up her character arc and Ares's motivation. He wasn't this great evil, but he wanted to destroy humanity for their sins. Diana despite seeing the same things chose to give humanity a chance. There's no way to end the plot line without Ares or Diana gone. They are gods so the fight was going to be flashy.
Shadow-Link
Banned
I don't want to see more emo Superman and punished Batman after this. Give us more Wondy please, she is the true hero that shines light upon us.
BossDarkseid
Member
Just got out of the film.
Pretty damn good. Worked in the right ways and my only disappointment is that Ares turned into a big cgi fight rather than some sword vs swords thing.
Certain parts worked sooo well though. Diana crossing No Man's Land to liberating Veld has hype and wonderful.
Pretty damn good. Worked in the right ways and my only disappointment is that Ares turned into a big cgi fight rather than some sword vs swords thing.
Certain parts worked sooo well though. Diana crossing No Man's Land to liberating Veld has hype and wonderful.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Yeah she was great. Movie had some spotty writing but she pulled it off and most of the supporting cast was solid.
Another thing I noticed: Despite the fact that everything after Themyscira has that Snyder-esque blue overlay on everything that drowns out a lot of the color, I barely noticed it because it actually fit the atmosphere of the war setting. I think specific places of peace, like the cafe, are the things that are mainly marked by a warm, colorful glow to visually signify their lack of conflict. A lot of the movie was dark and blue, but it never felt oppressive like MoS and BvS did.
BossDarkseid
Member
Well Diana did mention that they were capable of so much more. I mean for sake of argument I think Ares gave them a nudge but his point was that the capability of evil was always there.
Also some of the German soldiers looked like kids.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Many soldiers in war, even on the "bad" side, aren't inherently evil people. You could see how young those Germans were. They were practically kids, conscripted to fight in a war they were told was just, and yes even if they were committing war crimes they were doing so under orders of a madman who would kill them on the spot if they refused.
Yes there was the whole thing about Ares influencing them but it was tonally spot on to see that I think. It's the duality in humans that Diana saw. And they were just relived the fighting was over.
broncobuster
Banned
While I'm in the minority of folks who really liked BvS, Superman and Wonder Woman having no reaction to seeing one another was bizarre. From Supes perspective, only Kryptonians are superpowered individuals. His reaction should be, she's a Kryptonian? She has a little more to go off of, but it's reasonable to think Superman is a reincarnation of the gods. And when you get into emails, Aquaman looks like Poseidon.
Hoping it's explored somewhat in JL. Diana talking about the age of heroes gives me hope.
Movie was pretty good but entirely forgettable. Seemed like pretty much a retreat of Captain America: First Avenger with way better action sequences and a lot less humor that actually managed to be charming/funny.
But what I hated and I find is hardly defensible is their approach to presenting the conflict of WW1. They literally go "The british are the good guys, Germans are the bad guys" and even go as far as saying that the Germans, as a whole, are influenced by the God of War, turning them evil, implying that...they alone are the source of the conflict, I guess?
Just go for WW2 if you want an easy to present, evil force like that. I'm not patriotic in the slightest but I thought that was kinda offensive and really took me out of the movie. They took a complex, brutal, real conflict and turned it into this parody while also trying to make these big, important statements about the nature and cruelty of humanity. Nu-uh. That does not work at all. If you want to go that route why not just go with the Nazis or simply invent a conflict?
But what I hated and I find is hardly defensible is their approach to presenting the conflict of WW1. They literally go "The british are the good guys, Germans are the bad guys" and even go as far as saying that the Germans, as a whole, are influenced by the God of War, turning them evil, implying that...they alone are the source of the conflict, I guess?
Just go for WW2 if you want an easy to present, evil force like that. I'm not patriotic in the slightest but I thought that was kinda offensive and really took me out of the movie. They took a complex, brutal, real conflict and turned it into this parody while also trying to make these big, important statements about the nature and cruelty of humanity. Nu-uh. That does not work at all. If you want to go that route why not just go with the Nazis or simply invent a conflict?
Roland_Gunner
Member
I can see what you mean about the final scene but they do repeatedly say that the armistice is only a day away and the German general is the only one trying to stop it.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
The war was already going to be over the next day, as long as they stopped Luddendorf, which they did. Ares put the armistice in motion and refused to let it be stopped thinking it would fail. He was wrong.
None of this has anything to do with the soldiers fighting on the airfield stopping the fight and hugging each other the second Ares has been killed. Luddendorf was killed way earlier and still they tried to start the plane with the chemical weapons. Only after Ares died did they stop fighting, completely going against Steve's big speech moments before, showing that, yup, actually, they have been turned evil by Ares.
They've been influenced by Ares, which isn't anything anybody denied. His death, along with being a big showstopper that drew everyone attention, was more like the core thread tugging everybody along, but it couldn't have actually resulted in the war unless humanity gave in and chased that thread along with him. His fight was a big, giant spectacle, so when he was defeated, I imagine a lot of soldiers just had a bunch of doubts enter their minds that were held at bay by the war god's presence.
Ares being an influence doesn't absolve people of their responsibility for their actions is the point.
I thought the rational for them hugging at the end was them witnessing two literal gods do battle in front of them and destroying half the airfield. They looked kinda shell-shocked and relieved it was over.
Regarding Ares, I thought the film showed Ares influencing key people to create war or lengthen it rather than that he's corrupting all men and once he's dead everything is fine.
Z
ZombieFred
Unconfirmed Member
Now I am back in I thought I would write up about one of the themes I heavily enjoyed about the film; Love and the power of being something more than just a man or women. Steve Rogers and his friends helped swayed the outcome, saving the "Day" while Wonder Women was "Saving the world". Call it corny but love and the motivation behind it was shown strongly with the characters and their sacrifices.
Steve, his team and WW saving the village was the best use of heroism I have ever watched. It reminded me of the soldiers in Man of Steel with the main soldier on the plane sacrificing his life to help save the city getting totally annihilated, fighting Mera against all logic that would point it being a suicidal task. These people did it out of love for their fellow man and the world with it. All the little heart-warming moments in the town with Trevor and his team, especially when the sniper was singing playing the piano was probably one of the best executed scenes I've got out of any comic book film.
DC portrays these moments completely different with Marvel on how with DC these heroes are viewed or revered as Gods/mythical legends, while with most Marvel films they go for the every day man view. With what I said above and how when it comes to a normal soldier going up against a deity of unstoppable force it really adds a shit load of tension and weight when these moments occur.
Steve, his team and WW saving the village was the best use of heroism I have ever watched. It reminded me of the soldiers in Man of Steel with the main soldier on the plane sacrificing his life to help save the city getting totally annihilated, fighting Mera against all logic that would point it being a suicidal task. These people did it out of love for their fellow man and the world with it. All the little heart-warming moments in the town with Trevor and his team, especially when the sniper was singing playing the piano was probably one of the best executed scenes I've got out of any comic book film.
DC portrays these moments completely different with Marvel on how with DC these heroes are viewed or revered as Gods/mythical legends, while with most Marvel films they go for the every day man view. With what I said above and how when it comes to a normal soldier going up against a deity of unstoppable force it really adds a shit load of tension and weight when these moments occur.
Pai Pai Master
Banned
Everything from No Man's Land up through the night in the town was probably one of my favorite bits in any superhero movie. I wasn't hot on the entire film especially the climax but I absolutely loved those moments and the film is worth watching for that middle act alone.
Poodlestrike
Banned
If this was your takeaway, you can't have been watching it that closely. The British high command is presented significantly less favorably than their German counteparts (sans Ludendorff who, much like his real life equivalent, was pretty fucked up), there's a whole moment where Diana realizes that neither side is really morally superior, the actual God of zlWar was playing a Brit...
mugurumakensei
Member
Mostly correct. He gave people information then let them do with it how they saw fit. Lutendorf used it to give himself more power. Dr Poison used it to create more powerful gas bombs. Humans prolonged wars and sought wars on their own.
Z
ZombieFred
Unconfirmed Member
Also i loved Doctor Poison and her screwed up mentality in the film. She had strong moments such as her sadistic humour and then seeing her fragile mental state at the fireplace.
A simple villain and a cool design.
A simple villain and a cool design.
Just caught it in IMAX. Was great. Very good to see a female superhero (which is based on an original franchise, I should add) movie turn out so well.
The climatic fight was great too and it was nice to see that she fought at full power and did not get intentionally gimped due to some contrived plot device.
The climatic fight was great too and it was nice to see that she fought at full power and did not get intentionally gimped due to some contrived plot device.
BossDarkseid
Member
I think even if people are iffy on the final boss fight, we can be happy that at least it didn't devolve into some faceless drone army/swarm fight.
I didn't mind the love stuff either. First time someone said it was like 30 or so minutes into the film and its part of Wonder Woman's core ideals + message and as Patty Jenkins said, if the idea that we have to love and be compassionate and want to help those in need is "cheesy", so be it. It avoided being saccharine.
I didn't mind the love stuff either. First time someone said it was like 30 or so minutes into the film and its part of Wonder Woman's core ideals + message and as Patty Jenkins said, if the idea that we have to love and be compassionate and want to help those in need is "cheesy", so be it. It avoided being saccharine.
MisterHero
Super Member
Wondy can't fight a giant robot in the Indian Ocean then fight a 2 spaceships in Metropolis in a matter of seconds. Supes can take her.
David Incorporated Esq.
Member
I felt like I just watched a remake of The 5th Element set in World War I Europe. Does anyone else get that vibe?
Freezasaurus
Member
The climax was certainly the weakest part of the film, but it was nowhere near as bad as the drivel we got from Batman vs. Superman.
I was skeptical of Gal Gadot playing the part when casting was initially announced, but she played it brilliantly. Especially the parts where she had to convey sadness, like after the gas attack on the village. She was almost hysterical and it was totally believable.