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UK General Election 2017 |OT2| No Government is better than a bad Government
- Thread starter Jezbollah
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Yes, but counterpoint: their property developer mates at the country club will be right chuffed at freeing up 14 acres in W6
Miles Quaritch
Member
I don't believe that twitter thread for a second. They aren't scared of what he'll do so much as they know that if he ever gets into power and enacts those policies (which aren't exactly radical), they'll be out of power for what could potentially be decades.
Then again, voters are idiots. As soon as things are comfortable again, they'll vote the party of lower taxes back in, because why the fuck not...
How the hell does destroying one of the best hospitals in the country help other hospitals? Even more strain will be put on the others now, nothing but incompetence has come out of this government.
i'm fairly hopeful that the tories are on the way out but i dunno why you would think they will be out for decades. they'll be out for, maybe, 10 years. maybe a little less maybe a little more. the public are stupid, they'll just vote them in again when the 'who's strong' momentum shifts back to them. their policies and so on don't really matter.
Miles Quaritch
Member
It's a mistake to think this is incompetence. It's part of an almost decade long strategy to defund and cripple the NHS so they can claim it's not fit for purpose.
That's all it is, you don't attack a service in this way unless you want it to collapse and because it hasn't already done so, they've decided to ramp up their efforts to try and get it there as quickly as possible.
they will still probably win the next election tbh
Theonik
Member
You misinterpret the motives here. The point is the land the hospital is on is incredibly valuable. Developers want that land.
Yup. And that is why we need a labour government now
Miles Quaritch
Member
Wishful thinking on my part more than anything else. They ideally need to be out of power for at least two decades, that's how it'll take to fix everything they've done since they came in, but as you rightly said, voters in general are a bit stupid and tend to have short memories.
With the public mood, I expect them to do everything they can to avoid another general election. Propping up a lame duck PM, making deals that threaten national security, they don't care, they just want five years to get as many of their deals done as they can.
It's so stupid. University's for example own a lot of land and have done for hundreds of years but know long term you never sell the land.
I wouldn't be surprised the government has buddies who happen to be property developers who will make a fortune out of it. Absolute scum bags. There will be nothing left in public ownership. It's daylight robbery.
KimonoNoNo
Member
At least here in Wales heath is a devolved matter.
That seems to be the way things are heading although I still think it's possible that Britain won't leave the EU at all. I can still see a scenario of a bleeding economy, continued political instability and a second referendum being called and won when we're truly on the edge of leaving the EU.
I think Blair had it right in an interview I saw. He essentially said Brexit is a tragedy that we have to enact as the people have spoken, but that we should not irreversibly bind our hands to the referendum result. He said the door needs to be left open so the British public can change their mind at a later point as politics is fluid and attitudes can change.
That differs from the Lib Dem and the so-called remoaners views who very quickly downplayed the referendum result, called for another referendum and some of whom still refuse to even accept the result at all.
The second view is reactionary and misguided. At best it just reinforces the leavers position. A longer term view has to be taken in which all options remain on the table as the process unfolds. Bear in mind Blair's comments were made before the terror attacks, the election and Grenfell, when it looked like we were on the verge of a May dynasty for the next 10 years. Since nobody really knows what is going to happen we should at least try and keep all options open so that hopefully the country can be gradually nudged towards a soft Brexit or a second referendum.
killer_clank
Member
I Actually think this parliament will last as near as damnit to 5 years. The 1974 - 79 Labour govt and the 92 - 97 Tory govt shambled on for years with wafer thin or no majorities, and even if the DUP don't want to vote for something they can abstain and the tories should generally be able to pass things. Of course it'll be a govt that passes almost no legislation but the DUP and tories will rather stumble on forever than risk a Labour election victory.
This isn't limited to just one hospital, their plan is for all hospitals to sell their land and buildings to private companies. In order for the sale to be quick and cheap the government is going to match the selling price, and charge 5% of the value as penalty fees every year for those hospitals that refuse to cooperate, as well as blocking them from other funding.
This isn't even just some fantasy idea that they have. It's an actual plan that has been written up in detail. It's called the Naylor Review, and May had said she will implement it after the election.
SuperBowser
Member
The NHS has probably passed the point of no return already. People just don't realise it yet.
My team was moved from a nice clinic building to an old building that is shared with 2 random teams not associated with us (I assume the old building was sold). We now work in a building where the ceiling leaks in heavy rain and the electricity stops, meaning we can't work for the day. "Money saved".
My friend says his hospital sold the land in front of his ward. They are now building houses opposite his ward.
This guy gets it, the more rich people they create the more people can enjoy the benefits of the future privatized health care system, it is simple logic really.
The Tories are preparing for the future, while those left leaning bleeding heart liberals are living the past of universal health care for poor and rich alike, the fools.
Anyway who knew that having a secretary of state health that believes in privatization of health care could lead to a path where the privatization of health care seems actually viable.
EDIT:
Oh yeah and one really cannot understate how many nice new houses can be built by selling public property I mean http://www.economist.com/news/brita...-public-finances-much-help-them-great-british it has been working great.
frankie_baby
Member
Labour should announce now that any sell offs would become forfeit once they get in, it could at least trash the value of any sell offs and make it so there is no point selling them
Billy_Pilgrim
Member
It's silly to tie yourself to rules like that. There are cases where selling off a hospital and it's land makes sense, and is the exact type of thing that the Tories can point to as being dangerous economically. Look! Comrade Corbs is trashing property prices already!
We're now in the stage of the game where we need some nuance and strategy in order to put together a workable majority.
Even Scotland isn't immune and think it's a devolved power. Glasgow closed a few hospitals down and built that super hospital next to sewage works would you believe so you can't open your windows because of the smell and they forgot people need to park and hospital is plonked on one side of the City and pain in the arse to get to. Bought cheap land for a hospital, forgot the car park and the prime development land in the West End were there was a hospital is owned by the University, whoops.
My local hospital, Royal Berkshire Hospital (also Mays local hospital!) is so understaffed right now that some maternity shifts are running with only 25% of the nurses required. The place is underfunded and its showing, and this isn't even a deprived area.
Of course if the PM needs medical treatment I'm sure they'll snap-to, or she can go to Bupa...
Of course if the PM needs medical treatment I'm sure they'll snap-to, or she can go to Bupa...
They've already destroy our Forensic Science Services, with privatisation, which was the envy of the world. Its par for the course. It makes me sick that their allowed to get away with these things. Its not theirs to destroy or sell, they dont own it. And things like this shouldn't be run by the private sector, your not going to see much innovation or new discoveries from the private sector.
Can't post full article since i'm on mobile but:
May will face leadership challenge if she softens Brexit: Telegraph
May will face leadership challenge if she softens Brexit: Telegraph
http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN1980TJ
JonnyDBrit
Member
If she's with Spire Dunedin, they've got a place in my square. Perish the thought.
But yeah, the hospital's strained even as it tries to maintain the service. Had to triple temp doctors over the last winter? Yep. Needing charity support to refurbish family rooms? Check. Parking issues put the Reading council in a tough spot too, as the hospital nevertheless attracts so many patients it chokes up the area. But since they've not got the money to buy and build a new car park or the like (hell, they can't even keep Friar Street repaired on their current budget - cabling's been exposed and everything) their only option was to turn free parking in the area into pay and display... which then becomes a major problem for families wanting to visit the hospital on short notice without an ambulance. Oh, and the front entrance is off a one way road, so if you live west of the hospital, you have to take an additional detour no matter what.
...Sorry, that set me off.
Times running with May has 10 days to save leadership. Leave and remainers forming around candidates (Rudd for the remainers)
Let them fight.gif
RUDD? She barely held her seat!
That said, with these public performances, May herself would be hard-pressed to defend herself in a contest if she tried to fight a challenger off. She seemed more animated in private meetings with her MPs but she also looks like she's cracking up...
Sounds like civil war in the tory party is bound to happen no matter the outcome
Theonik
Member
Time to make this viral brah.
Remember this?
I bet the electorate doesn't.
It was always going to come to this. The pro EU Tories (AKA the common sense brigade) and the Eurosceptics (AKA dangerous lunatics) couldn't go on co-existing 'peacefully'. Something had to give eventually.
Personally I think the Brexiteers present a far greater and more likely threat to this country than ISIS, so no prizes for guessing how I hope this all shakes down.
Huw_Dawson
Member
That would be an entertaining marginal.
Imagine the Portillo moment being the Prime Minister.
The Greek Freak
Member
Tories wont rest until UK healthcare is trash like the U.S.
Dirtyshubb
Member
Did people already cover may canceling next year's Queens speech to stay in for 2 years?
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-cancel-next-years-queens-10640737#ICID=sharebar_twitter
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-cancel-next-years-queens-10640737#ICID=sharebar_twitter
Doing another referendum because you didn't like the result of the previous one defies the point of referendums. On the other hand, it is sensible to negotiate a deal with the EU and then put that deal to a vote. Now that would require the media and the government to accurately and effectively inform people what those options will mean for their lives and for Dave down the pub to give a shit about finding out. You could put that vote before Parliament, but if they vote against then I can imagine there being people taking to the streets. Either way, not going through with Brexit is political suicide.
Jesus, what poor intern worked overtime to photoshop that image of David Cameron and make him look porcelain.
JonnyDBrit
Member
...Wait, I'm confused, how does cancelling the Queen's speech secure May's position. Isn't she uh, Prime Minister? Or is it just in the ceremonial sense as it means the Queen will have accepted her appointment as Prime Minister until the next one, where she needs to continue affirming it (in case, say, the DUP decide to bugger off their confidence and supply deal in six months)?
Ah the joys of the UK Constitution. The Queen's Speech has been traditionally viewed as a confidence matter, so if they couldn't get one through they'd have to resign. So it makes sense to, you know, stop such a critical vote happening again.
Legally speaking though, only an explicit vote of no confidence will bring down the government. Those can happen at any time.
JonnyDBrit
Member
...So yeah, basically the continued affirmation she has the support of the majority of MPs. Shows how much confidence she has in the DUP deal lasting.
So the entirety of the UK will have to suffer a hard Brexit just because Theresa doesn't want a leadership challenge.
Great. Fucking great.
Meanwhile from the Sunday Times.
Theresa May has 10 days to save her premiership after she was put on notice to shape up and show she is fit to lead.
Confidence in the prime minister is in free fall in Tory ranks as constituency party bosses told ministers and MPs to force her from power. Up to a dozen MPs are ready to demand a vote of no confidence in May by submitting letters to the backbench 1922 committee.
Their ranks are expected to swell this weekend as MPs consult grassroots grandees about Mays faltering response to the Grenfell Tower inferno in west London.
Cabinet ministers have also let it be known they will oust the prime minister if it looks as if she is in danger of losing the vote on June 28 on Wednesdays Queens speech.
Had some middle eastern/ asian looking woman on the tommorow paper show. She had t be the most dumb upherself person I have seen. She said she campaigned for Brexit and doesn't see a hard or soft Brexit she just see's that you are in or out of the EU. She then went on to say she wants to be completely out of the EU, when asked what she meant bu it she said she meant we stop all links to the EU. Then told this would mean we wouldn't be able to fly planes across Europe etc if we went that harsh she said that wasn't right and started to shout and rant.
*Edit: I think she was a MP
*Edit: I think she was a MP
JonnyDBrit
Member
I must admit to being curious, but did her reasoning come off as related to the fascinating corner of the Brexit vote that's rooted in (though perhaps with this woman not being consciously aware of) its favouritism of Europeans over other ethnicities that have migrated to Britain?
Edit: Oh, possible Tory MP?
I think I have seen her before, but haven't a clue what her name is. When she had her view calmy debated she reacted with shouting and talking really fast. She actually wants us to stop everything with the EU, not just trade, but every law, including flights, fishing etc etc. She came across as being pretty damn insane.
JonnyDBrit
Member
...what in the actual fuck. Didn't she get the memo from Boris about how leaving the EU isn't leaving Europe?
Priti Patel?
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