Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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zaitsu said:
I think many of us here was Cerny worshippers day one.
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I'm definitely one of those, all hail the great and powerful Cerny!

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I'm excited for the next gen Xbox showcase, but I'm also tempering my expectations in terms of first party. I would think that a lot of the exciting new projects will be too early to show anything substantial since the studio acquisitions happened recently.

I know that there's going to be the usual Halo and maybe Forza, but I want something different from Xbox already.
 
dan_of_orion said:
if we are being honest, so many of us didn't even know how an ultra fast SSD would impact next-generation gaming, I remember a lot of people including PS fans shitting on Mark Cerny after the Road to PS5 talk because they thought the SSD could only impact things such as load times etc, it was a number of developers who came out in the months that followed that really vindicated and substantiated what Cerny was saying, Tim Sweeney and Unreal Engine 5 being really good examples.
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In truth we still don't know.

We have seen the Unreal engine 5 demo but because of NDA we don't know what kind of data speed was needed for it .
We have seen the R&C game but again how much data was needed to do the level jumping is unknown .

The SSD alone may not be as impactful as the I/O and bottleneck changes sony has made but we really won't know anything for certain until we can get some realworld numbers.
 
Bo_Hazem said:
I think Sony will push for PS5 Pro at least to sell 8K TV's, they're pretty connected to each. I would get an 8K by then, although wished that Sony's 8K were more reasonably priced to have them a try. Pretty superior pieces of mastery with eye-melting brightness!
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I've switched 3 TVs since 2016, so I think my C9 will be it for the next couple of years. It will be interesting to see if the Pro will use 8K as one of it's key selling points. The base model supposedly will be an "8K ready machine."
 
Gamelab continues today. Not to expect much at all, but I think these two segments today will be cool to listen in on. This will be the first time we see Mark since the "Road to PS5" video.

Game Lab Live

gamelablive.com gamelablive.com

24 June - 17:00 - 18:00 (CEST) / Q&A - The ever-changing role of a Creative Director
Speakers: Ken Levine & Mark Cerny

24 June - 18:00 - 19:00 (CEST) / Q&A - Gamelab 2020 Keynote: On the verge of a new generation
Speakers: Phil Spencer (Head of Xbox) fireside discussion with Seth Schiesel (contributor,The New York Times)
 
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I finished TLOU2 yesterday but I'm not going to discuss the game itself, story, etc. because it's offtopic here. However, I'd like to share some findings on the technical side that I noticed while playing:

- ND engine (does it even have a name? I think I've missed it) already uses streaming a lot and, I think, loads only those objects and their textures that are needed in the frustum. For example: I was in a small room (let's say it was a room, to omit spoilers), focusing on objects in front of me (textures were okay) then I turned towards the exit and back, then I noticed a texture pop-up. While I tried to replicate that error, I couldn't repeat it. That'd mean the game shuffles assets all the time, not only when you enter/exit a certain area.

- I haven't noticed any frame drops in game. I tried to turn the camera around, especially in places where you could expect performance drops (like in front of mirrors), couldn't get it. To my eye, the game is rock solid 30 FPS.

- Sound design is phenomenal. There are thousands of different samples that play around you and you can actually listen to enemies not only through the visual "listening mode" but also by yourself. Footsteps on various surfaces differ, rain drops on different materials give different sounds, guns sound incredibly. It was a pleasure to play and great immersion. However, I didn't get the up/down awareness of sound, just the 360 panorama on a plane. I think my setup was wrong (settings in game and headphones with VSS). My headset is a bit malfunctioning right now but I hope it lasts till November so I can get a new one. If anyone can comment on that, please do. Speaking of sound, I noticed something interesting in the game menu. If you scroll down the sound section, there's that last entry which is inactive. Is it waiting for Tempest?

e61c7mN.jpg


- Graphically speaking, this game is a league of its own. Simply the best animations I've ever seen and the best material implementation (hair looks like hair, fabric looks real, wet concrete walls shine exactly as they should). You can notice a lot of reflections, not only mirrors but various metal surfaces. I think those will be patched into RT for the PS5 version. I also think that this phenomenal texture quality is due to the fact that they're prepared for higher resolution in PS5 and downscaled to be squeezed through the antique HDD.

I'm definitely going to play it again on PS5, with higher difficulty setting (let's hope new CPU will allow enemies to be smarter) and in quality mode. I didn't feel any need for a higher frame rate in this particular game. I think we've seen the last of PS4's capabilities. Time for a change.
 
FeiRR said:

'TLOU2'

- ND engine (does it even have a name? I think I've missed it) already uses streaming a lot and, I think, loads only those objects and their textures that are needed in the frustum. For example: I was in a small room (let's say it was a room, to omit spoilers), focusing on objects in front of me (textures were okay) then I turned towards the exit and back, then I noticed a texture pop-up. While I tried to replicate that error, I couldn't repeat it. That'd mean the game shuffles assets all the time, not only when you enter/exit a certain area.

- I haven't noticed any frame drops in game. I tried to turn the camera around, especially in places where you could expect performance drops (like in front of mirrors), couldn't get it. To my eye, the game is rock solid 30 FPS.

- Sound design is phenomenal. There are thousands of different samples that play around you and you can actually listen to enemies not only through the visual "listening mode" but also by yourself. Footsteps on various surfaces differ, rain drops on different materials give different sounds, guns sound incredibly. It was a pleasure to play and great immersion. However, I didn't get the up/down awareness of sound, just the 360 panorama on a plane. I think my setup was wrong (settings in game and headphones with VSS). My headset is a bit malfunctioning right now but I hope it lasts till November so I can get a new one. If anyone can comment on that, please do. Speaking of sound, I noticed something interesting in the game menu. If you scroll down the sound section, there's that last entry which is inactive. Is it waiting for Tempest?

e61c7mN.jpg


- Graphically speaking, this game is a league of its own. Simply the best animations I've ever seen and the best material implementation (hair looks like hair, fabric looks real, wet concrete walls shine exactly as they should). You can notice a lot of reflections, not only mirrors but various metal surfaces. I think those will be patched into RT for the PS5 version. I also think that this phenomenal texture quality is due to the fact that they're prepared for higher resolution in PS5 and downscaled to be squeezed through the antique HDD.

I'm definitely going to play it again on PS5, with higher difficulty setting (let's hope new CPU will allow enemies to be smarter) and in quality mode. I didn't feel any need for a higher frame rate in this particular game. I think we've seen the last of PS4's capabilities. Time for a change.
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I'm still going through my first run, but it's seriously impressive and pushes my PS4 Pro to the limit. I don't think I've ever heard the fan run as loud as it has the entire way through a game before.

Just looking at the rainwater trickle down from highway pavements and such looks realistic af. This game is a technical powerhouse.

The only dip I saw was a bit minor, but it happened during an outside fight as I was running and jumping through grass.

I too used headphones for this. On my second run I'll use my Home Theater. The gun shots sound amazing. The audio is impressive, but I'm not using headphones with 3D audio capabilities or VSS. As is, it's enough to keep you immersive.

I think it's safe to say we'll see a PS5 upgrade of this at some point and as you see in your images, 3D audio support (maybe from the new 3D pulse headset for the PS5?)
 
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Zoro7 said:
It's so strange to see how the SSD was seen as insignificant when the PS5 specs were fist released. Now it's all anyone is talking about including Devs. How times change!
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To think people said 'nah' back to that first Wired article when Cerny mentioned PS5's SSD would be something currently unavailable on PCs...
 
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Bo_Hazem said:
I think Sony will push for PS5 Pro at least to sell 8K TV's, they're pretty connected to each. I would get an 8K by then, although wished that Sony's 8K were more reasonably priced to have them a try. Pretty superior pieces of mastery with eye-melting brightness!
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Wow ... do we really need 8K ??? IMO if PS5Pro do exist in future the goal should be 4K 60 with decent quality of RT.
 
Phil Spenser says he is still confident about Xbox Series X launch after watching Sony's recent show. Reading between the lines, it seems like he wants XSX to be about 60fps where as the PS5 is more 30fps.
 
CurtBizzy said:
AC Valhalla is 30 fps on the Series X
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Is that absolutely set in stone though? I know some Ubi dev has said it but things could change before launch. There could even be a performance/resolution mode selection.

But as for Phil, he probably means his first party studios will be targeting 60fps, with PlayStation going for 30fps as shown in their recent event.
 
T-Cake said:
Phil Spenser says he is still confident about Xbox Series X launch after watching Sony's recent show. Reading between the lines, it seems like he wants XSX to be about 60fps where as the PS5 is more 30fps.
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Seems you only read on your own between line to hear what you want to hear.
 
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T-Cake said:
Phil Spenser says he is still confident about Xbox Series X launch after watching Sony's recent show. Reading between the lines, it seems like he wants XSX to be about 60fps where as the PS5 is more 30fps.
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its nice to want things but its about getting it done.
 
T-Cake said:
Is that absolutely set in stone though? I know some Ubi dev has said it but things could change before launch. There could even be a performance/resolution mode selection.

But as for Phil, he probably means his first party studios will be targeting 60fps, with PlayStation going for 30fps as shown in their recent event.
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There is no way that the XBSX can double the FPS of the PS5 in any game... If there is a mode for 60FPS, a mode for PS5 will be made too...
 
jose4gg said:
There is no way that the XBSX can double the FPS of the PS5 in any game... If there is a mode for 60FPS, a mode for PS5 will be made too...
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That would only be possible if it was a massive difference between the two.

The way I see it the PS5 and the XSX will run the game at 60FPS but the XSX will have a higher resolution and maybe more effects. The PS5 version will benefit from Sonys I/O and will load/stream faster than the XSX version.
 
T-Cake said:
Maybe so but I ain't counting them out yet!
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Nobody is counting them out, any sane person, from a consumer perspective doesn't want them out of this race. But better frame rates never sold consoles, better frame rates usually get graphic cards to sell better.

Consoles sell games. If they have them, they're good. If they don't, they should.
 
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Every time I get to choose between a 60fps or a 30fps better graphics mode I usually start with 30 and then switch to 60 because when Im playing a game I dont notice the difference in graphics but do notice the smoothness.

That said I hope every single game gives us the option between modes.

But also 30fps doesnt suck. Driveclub was smooth AF with it.
 
T-Cake said:
Phil Spenser says he is still confident about Xbox Series X launch after watching Sony's recent show. Reading between the lines, it seems like he wants XSX to be about 60fps where as the PS5 is more 30fps.
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And he would say he is not ????

It's absoluty Impossible, the difference between XSX and PS5 will be minimal, and to be clear will have things that XSX's GPU will have more difficult than PS5 (like triangle processing). The 52 CUs cannot be used or filled all the time or will not be at all 100%, PS5 can fill all of those 36CUs with work (this was said by Cerny). The CU occupancy is a problem that happens in PC and XSX too. That's why even overclocked Threadripper's CPU cannot beat other Ryzen CPU with less cores and thread (you cannot fill all the cores and threads with data).

But I think it's plausible to XSX go on 60fps in First Party, because it will be XONE games running in a XSX.
 
Tiago07 said:
And he would say he is not ????

It's absoluty Impossible, the difference between XSX and PS5 will be minimal, and to be clear will have things that XSX's GPU will have more difficult than PS5 (like triangle processing). The 52 CUs cannot be used or filled all the time or will not be at all 100%, PS5 can fill all of those 36CUs with work (this was said by Cerny). The CU occupancy is a problem that happens in PC and XSX too. That's why even overclocked Threadripper's CPU cannot beat other Ryzen CPU with less cores and thread (you cannot fill all the cores and threads with data).

But I think it's plausible to XSX go on 60fps in First Party, because it will be XONE games running in a XSX.
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Lol, can you stop pretending that games on XSX will be of lower quality... You're just spreading FUD.
 
Tiago07 said:
But I think it's plausible to XSX go on 60fps in First Party, because it will be XONE games running in a XSX.
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This is more what I meant. It's easy to know what I'm thinking but I didn't get that across in my hastily-typed post. He seems confident in the XSX power differential after having watched Sony's presentation 10 days ago. I just read that as a difference between 30fps (Sony 1st party) and 60fps (Microsoft 1st party) otherwise how can they really show a power differential? No-one is going to be fighting over small resolution differences anymore.

If MS can get games looking as good as Sony's but have them at 60fps instead of 30fps, that's a demonstrable power difference. But this is only my opinion!
 
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Bo_Hazem said:
The GPU and CPU improvements on PS5 are exciting, but even more exciting is the introduction of an ultra-high speed SSD with lightning fast load speeds. This is a transformative improvement in consoles that will reduce load times down to one or two seconds and enable real-time streaming of massive worlds at ridiculously fast speeds. Without any optimization work, the loading and streaming of Marvel's Avengers improved by an order of magnitude on PS5. When optimization is complete, loading content will be nearly instant, allowing players to seamlessly jump into missions anywhere in the game world. And as Iron Man flies through content-rich levels, higher resolution textures and mesh will stream in instantly, maintaining the highest possible quality all the way to the horizon.
blog.playstation.com

Marvel’s Avengers confirmed as free upgrade to PS5

See how the PS5 version of Marvel's Avengers will shine when it lands this Holiday.
blog.playstation.com blog.playstation.com
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I wanted to highlight this post from earlier today. Everybody was crying and saying "Guerrila didn't say the SSD helps improve graphical quality / fidelity / gameplay, so it must be there only for faster load times.

Yeah, then this happened.
 
LordOfChaos said:
Hope this isn't like Hunt the Truth where the marketing campaign is intriguing but the final game has sweet fuck all to do with it
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But then wouldn't you hope the marketing campaign is as good, and then the game delivers?
 
Tiago07 said:
But I think it's plausible to XSX go on 60fps in First Party, because it will be XONE games running in a XSX.
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What makes people think that First Party XSX games can't or won't scale to graphical settings that push the performance below 60FPS?

They'll almost certainly going to be adding things like Ray Tracing for instance.

Look at Control on PC or any game with current RT support. Or imagine if Rockstar added some RT to RDR2. RDR2 is a game based on an engine that scales to the PS3/360 generation but even without RT can bring a high end PC to below 60FPS.
 
X-Fighter said:
Lol, can you stop pretending that games on XSX will be of lower quality... You're just spreading FUD.
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Im not saying that XSX will be at lower quality. Im just saying the difference is not what some people say it will be and Im not saying too PS5 GPU is stronger or something else.

About the triangles it's not me its Mark Cerny saying "when triangles are so small its difficult to fill all those CU's with it" "and that's why we go with 36 CUs at higher clocks" (comparasion between 48CUs and 36CUs).

So explain to me why this is FUD

I have doubts with CU Occupancy too. I think its possible to XSX run with more resolution even with this problem.
 
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