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[Bo_Hazem]

L M F A O
Damn, you're a sneeky bastard...and i mean that in the best way possible.

Well, CatLady offered me a low job for a starter, to sweep the floors after their meetings. It's not a bad job elsewhere, but you know that they'll be shitting their pants in a daily basis with all the good news from the blue side while bad news don't seem to be stopping lately for them.

 

[Mahavastu]

Now, assuming the 40 CU card is similar to the PS5 GPU, but without cache scrubbers, no Tempest Engine and no disabled CUs. IIRC it was said that for yields the arrangement in CUs on RDNA meant that for every defective CU, you need to disable a pair - hence why the PS5 has 36CUs, but the Tempest Engine - which oddly must also be running at a variable clock - was explained to be a reworked CU for accelerating Fourier Transforms, if I'm remembering the Road to PS5 talk correctly.

So if it was assumed 4 CUs would be defective to give 36 working CUs , then which of the 40 CUs is being reworked for the Tempest engine?

According to "road to ps5", the tempest engine is based on CUs, but different. So I assume the tempest engine is NOT part of the 40 CUs and is in addition to them.

 

[ethomaz]

Damage control for who and why? You make no sense.

Because the console doesn't have games at launch he tried to give excuse saying what he said.

That is the definition of damage control.

It is not my issue you couldn't understand what he said.

 

[Sinthor]

According to "road to ps5", the tempest engine is based on CUs, but different. So I assume the tempest engine is NOT part of the 40 CUs and is in addition to them.

You simply cannot "rework" a CU on the fly. They have to be DESIGNED that way. The Tempest has been shown as a separate and different entity from the GPU. In fact, it's been stated that the Tempest engine is more related to the Cell processor and SPU's than it is a simple CU.

This is basically just another attempt to try and claim the PS5 has less power than stated and that it's "really" closer to that 9TF mark that so many loved to talk about early on.

So bottom line, GPU has 40 CU's with 4 disabled. Tempest engine is a separate part of the system. So is the SSD controller for Pete's sake before someone tries to claim that "really 4 of the 36 CU's are completely taken up controlling the SSD so the PS5 REALLY only has 32 CU's available for games!" or some crap like that.

 

[ethomaz]

OPM December/2020.

Yakuza 7 4k 60fps on PS5. No Ray Tracing.

This game on SeriesX has 3 modes: 4k 30fps, 1440p target 60fps and 1080p 60fps. No Ray Tracing too.

I expected to multiplatform runs better on PS5 due all the focus on efficiency... at least on first years.

But that difference is atrocious if true.

Bigger than CoD 720p to 1080p.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Since Bo came back from his ban he's been running up warz posts and combined with SirCaw and Ethomaz the entire forum has been polluted with shit like this for a week.

 

[Defrop]

Source: @OPM_UK

Spoiler

 

[ethomaz]

Didn't you even see Scorn latest video stuttering and dropping frames? Something to do with the API or HW configuration.

I believe Scorn devs choose to use DX11 instead the new Xbox Series X API.

 

[Zones]

Original music? Not a fan of the orchestral Japanese soundtracks, reminds me of cheesy RPG's. Licensed quality music like in Death Stranding. Now that was a perfect selection.

Did you just call orchestral Japanese soundtracks "cheesy RPG" music?

Well, you should undoubtedly be ashamed of your words and deeds!

 

[carloseduardocd]

I expected to multiplatform runs better on PS5 due all the focus on efficiency... at least on first years.

But that difference is atrocious if true.

Bigger than CoD 720p to 1080p.

I suspect it's something like dynamic 4k.

Very strange PS4 Pro running this game at 4k 30. The Japanese version of this game runs in PS4 900p 30fps and PS4 pro 1080p 30fps.

But the SeriesX version sounds strange too. They have two 60fps modes: at 1440p with some drops and 1080p.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Little off topic but anyone else get the update to the x900h tv yet and try it out? I updated and now whenever I play hdr content on my base ps4 in hdr I lose signal. Never happened before the update.

Maybe you chose Dolby Vision and PS4 doesn't support it?

 

[Bo_Hazem]

 

[Bo_Hazem]

They are probably unlocking resolution and framerate while adding 3D audio.

They can't simply support HRTF-based 3D audio. It must be done from the ground up. It's near impossible to support BC or enhance older game if they didn't already have them ready from the very beginning for PS5.

 

[Empire Strikes Back]

OPM December/2020.

Yakuza 7 4k 60fps on PS5. No Ray Tracing.

This game on SeriesX has 3 modes: 4k 30fps, 1440p target 60fps and 1080p 60fps. No Ray Tracing too.

But the PS5 isn't running the BC version?

 

[bitbydeath]

Assuming its all true why would there be a 30FPS difference between the two platforms?

I can understand the GDK might be causing some issues but a 30FPS drop on the XSX?

Something doesn't seem right to me.

It's just math.

 

[Empire Strikes Back]

How do you turn an RDNA2 GPU into a GCN one?

I don't really understand what they are saying about the BC.

I really don't get it too. What is MS doing for BC? I'd guess even if they are not supporting the full featureset of RDNA2 like VRS and RT when playing BC, they would at least get the benefits of cache that AMD touted or something like that. I thought there were no way to not take benefit of that...

Unless they dedicated a serious amount of transistors for logic from GCN to make BC more viable? I just don't see this happening, but it could explain the size of the APU/the CU count not checking with the PS5.

Could someone more knowledgeable come with a better idea of why?

 

[Sinthor]

I really don't get it too. What is MS doing for BC? I'd guess even if they are not supporting the full featureset of RDNA2 like VRS and RT when playing BC, they would at least get the benefits of cache that AMD touted or something like that. I thought there were no way to not take benefit of that...

Unless they dedicated a serious amount of transistors for logic from GCN to make BC more viable? I just don't see this happening, but it could explain the size of the APU/the CU count not checking with the PS5.

Could someone more knowledgeable come with a better idea of why?

Ok, I'm not a hardware designer but I think I have a clear picture of this. It's obvious that the RDNA 2 designs still support the GCN instruction set. Almost HAVE to in order to do hardware BC without additional silicon- the only other way would be some sort of built in emulator. But what is meant about BC games not having access to RDNA 2 features is simply that RDNA 2 has additional instructions and features that the GCN based hardware didn't. So when you're running BC, you cannot have access to those additional features or instructions. No access to Ray tracing for example. That's all.

So they're just saying in the end that BC is limited in what functionality it can provide. Which should be fine as it IS "backwards compatibility" after all, NOT 'next gen.'

 

[Empire Strikes Back]

Ok, I'm not a hardware designer but I think I have a clear picture of this. It's obvious that the RDNA 2 designs still support the GCN instruction set. Almost HAVE to in order to do hardware BC without additional silicon- the only other way would be some sort of built in emulator. But what is meant about BC games not having access to RDNA 2 features is simply that RDNA 2 has additional instructions and features that the GCN based hardware didn't. So when you're running BC, you cannot have access to those additional features or instructions. No access to Ray tracing for example. That's all.

So they're just saying in the end that BC is limited in what functionality it can provide. Which should be fine as it IS "backwards compatibility" after all, NOT 'next gen.'

I thought that was the case... but "architectural boosts" (as put by DF) are much broader term than "new features/instructions". I really don't know what to make of it, but I'm guessing you are right at the end of the day.

 

[Empire Strikes Back]

I expected to multiplatform runs better on PS5 due all the focus on efficiency... at least on first years.

But that difference is atrocious if true.

Bigger than CoD 720p to 1080p.

Could it be the fact that working on the PS5 is almost identical to working on the PS4, so they can optimize the engine right away while on the Xbox they have that Game Core thing to scale across the SX and SS? I'd guess that would reduce their capability of optimizing the engine.

They were always a PS first developer, anyway.

 

[gamechanger87]

I expected to multiplatform runs better on PS5 due all the focus on efficiency... at least on first years.

But that difference is atrocious if true.

Bigger than CoD 720p to 1080p.

That's because it's not true...

This game won't run at 4K 60fps on either console. Not native at least. The game engine is too taxing. Both consoles will let you choose performance modes.

I wouldn't trust OPM with anything.

Yakuza: Like a Dragon on Xbox Series X - how next-gen hardware delivers a cross-gen experience

Yakuza: Like a Dragon has Sega's much-loved series taking to the new generation in style, an Xbox Series X launch title…

www.eurogamer.net

 

[Zadom]

That's because it's not true...

This game won't run at 4K 60fps on either console. Not native at least. The game engine is too taxing. Both consoles will let you choose performance modes.

I wouldn't trust OPM with anything.

Yakuza: Like a Dragon on Xbox Series X - how next-gen hardware delivers a cross-gen experience

Yakuza: Like a Dragon has Sega's much-loved series taking to the new generation in style, an Xbox Series X launch title…

www.eurogamer.net

Keep calm, and take my opinion as fact.

 

[Empire Strikes Back]

That's because it's not true...

This game won't run at 4K 60fps on either console. Not native at least. The game engine is too taxing. Both consoles will let you choose performance modes.

I wouldn't trust OPM with anything.

Yakuza: Like a Dragon on Xbox Series X - how next-gen hardware delivers a cross-gen experience

Yakuza: Like a Dragon has Sega's much-loved series taking to the new generation in style, an Xbox Series X launch title…

www.eurogamer.net

Your link doesn't say anything about the PS5 performance... In fact, it says the engine was built for the PS4!

 

[Hawking Radiation]

Source: @OPM_UK

Spoiler

 

[SlimySnake]

Source: @OPM_UK

that cant be right.

AC and watch dogs run at native 4k 60 fps and native 4k 30 fps on both consoles. why the disparity with yakuza? is yakuza the RE8 of xsx?

 

[SlimySnake]

this is great, but i really dont understand why they have to go all the way down to 1080p to get double the framerate.

4k is 8.2 million pixels.
1440p is 3.6 million pixels.
1080p is 2.1 million pixels.

they should easily be able to get 1440p 60 fps by reducing the resolution by half to double the fps. i really dont like this because it means the ray tracing is causing a huge bottleneck on the gpu. but then again, if that was the case they shouldnt have been able to get to 4k 30 fps. maybe its 4kcb?

 

[Empire Strikes Back]

Maybe the answer is in the fact the engine was made for the PS4? Maybe going from 800MHz to 2230MHz helped? Or going from 1.6GHz Jaguars to 3.5GHz Zen 2? Maybe the Zen 2 cores with Jaguar timing?

This is rather exciting.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

this is great, but i really dont understand why they have to go all the way down to 1080p to get double the framerate.

4k is 8.2 million pixels.
1440p is 3.6 million pixels.
1080p is 2.1 million pixels.

they should easily be able to get 1440p 60 fps by reducing the resolution by half to double the fps. i really dont like this because it means the ray tracing is causing a huge bottleneck on the gpu. but then again, if that was the case they shouldnt have been able to get to 4k 30 fps. maybe its 4kcb?

Let's wait to see both running with raytracing to understand why those choices are made.

 

[oldergamer]

Source: @OPM_UK

Spoiler

Pretty sure OPM has that info incorrect. 4K mode is not 60fps and is "dynamic" on both consoles.

Three modes are on offer: normal, high resolution and high frame-rate. Tackling normal mode first, Series X renders this at native 1440p, with no dynamic resolution scaling. The trade-off for not going for a true native 4K is that everything targets 60fps with full v-sync. Meanwhile, resolution mode aims for a native 3840x2160 but does so with a half-rate refresh, busting down the action to 30fps (with rare frame-pacing issues). Lastly, we have the frame-rate mode; this returns us to a fluid 60fps - though the resolution drops to a native 1080p in this case. The idea is it takes the resolution down even further than the normal mode, in a bid to smooth over some of its performance drops.

 

[gamechanger87]

Your link doesn't say anything about the PS5 performance... In fact, it says the engine was built for the PS4!

That has nothing to do with the step up from 30fps to 60 FPS. The game will come with three modes on PS5 like it is on series x. The game will not be native 4K 60fps on either console at the same time. It's one or the other.

Y'all can believe what you want but this game will not be native 4K 60 on either console. OPM forgot a comma.

I'm just trying to provide the logical facts on what they are offering to do. You don't jump from 1080p sub 30 to 4K 60 with this game.

 

[bitbydeath]

This posted yet?

 

[jamwest24]

This posted yet?

What is this from?

 

[B_Boss]

Kojima Productions is currently composing music for an 'undisclosed project'

That's Disney Concert Hall in Downtown LA as well ...

 

[carloseduardocd]

That has nothing to do with the step up from 30fps to 60 FPS. The game will come with three modes on PS5 like it is on series x. The game will not be native 4K 60fps on either console at the same time. It's one or the other.

Y'all can believe what you want but this game will not be native 4K 60 on either console. OPM forgot a comma.

I'm just trying to provide the logical facts on what they are offering to do. You don't jump from 1080p sub 30 to 4K 60 with this game.

Ok, it's a reasonable point of view.

Maybe could be 4k dynamic or forgot some comma like you wrote.

But for me it's still strange the XSX FPS drop in 2 modes (4k 30 and 1440p 60) like Digital Foundry report. In 4k 30 drop to 24FPS, and 1440p 60 drop to 42FPS. Only 1080p 60fps had a constant frame-rate.

It could reasonable think 4k 30fps constant or 1440p (4k dynamic) 60fps constant.

 

[LordOfChaos]

You simply cannot "rework" a CU on the fly. They have to be DESIGNED that way. The Tempest has been shown as a separate and different entity from the GPU. In fact, it's been stated that the Tempest engine is more related to the Cell processor and SPU's than it is a simple CU.

This is basically just another attempt to try and claim the PS5 has less power than stated and that it's "really" closer to that 9TF mark that so many loved to talk about early on.

So bottom line, GPU has 40 CU's with 4 disabled. Tempest engine is a separate part of the system. So is the SSD controller for Pete's sake before someone tries to claim that "really 4 of the 36 CU's are completely taken up controlling the SSD so the PS5 REALLY only has 32 CU's available for games!" or some crap like that.

From the DF Cerny interview
"The Tempest Engine is effectively a re-engineered AMD GPU compute unit, stripped of its caches and relying solely on DMA transfers - just like a PS3 SPU. In turn, this opens the door to full utilisation of the CU's vector units."

Inside PlayStation 5: the specs and the tech that deliver Sony's next-gen vision

www.eurogamer.net

I don't see why using what would be a disabled CU anyways has any bearing on a person saying it's more or less powerful? It would just mean less dead silicon.

 

[Sinthor]

From the DF Cerny interview
"The Tempest Engine is effectively a re-engineered AMD GPU compute unit, stripped of its caches and relying solely on DMA transfers - just like a PS3 SPU. In turn, this opens the door to full utilisation of the CU's vector units."

Inside PlayStation 5: the specs and the tech that deliver Sony's next-gen vision

www.eurogamer.net

I don't see why using what would be a disabled CU anyways has any bearing on a person saying it's more or less powerful? It would just mean less dead silicon.

Right but my point was you can't just take some random disabled CU on the GPU and "make" it into the Tempest. It may be based on a CU like design, but it was DESIGNED to be what it is. I should have been clearer.

 

[yewles1]

I believe Scorn devs choose to use DX11 instead the new Xbox Series X API.

Is DX12U even out to devs yet? I know DirectStorage isn't atm.

 

[RookX22]

Maybe you chose Dolby Vision and PS4 doesn't support it?

I saw some people on reddit talk about that, it was defaulting to the dolby option for some reason but even if I manually nswitch it to the enhanced 4k 120 option it doesn't work flawless. I set it to standard and it works fine now hopefully there won't be any funky stuff with the ps5 with the enhanced option.

 

[ethomaz]

Is DX12U even out to devs yet? I know DirectStorage isn't atm.

Well if you want to use RT in Xbox games you need to use DX12U... so games like Watch Dogs is probably using it.

 

[Captain Hero]

This posted yet?

GT is going to be great again with PS5

 

[bitbydeath]

What is this from?

The Gran Turismo FaceBook page.

https://m.facebook.com/GranTurismo/

 

[Games Dean]

its most likely a cross gen game which could explain a 3 year turnaround time. naughty dog shipped tlou2 in just under 3 years after shipping the lost legacy.

I'm several days late on this but feel like at this point I have to make the disclaimer every time he repeats this nonsense:

This is fud, he has been shown evidence that it is, and he continues to spread fud about it. Carry on.

 

[schaft0620]

OPM December/2020.

Yakuza 7 4k 60fps on PS5. No Ray Tracing.

This game on SeriesX has 3 modes: 4k 30fps, 1440p target 60fps and 1080p 60fps. No Ray Tracing too.

I think its pretty obvious that they are throwing money at them to get the XOX version optimized in time for launch of XSX. The sad part is everyone in the Xbox communities ripped RGG for having a "bad engine." The game runs at 1080/30 locked on the PS4 Pro but 900/60 on the XSS like wat the heck.

 

[aclar00]

this is great, but i really dont understand why they have to go all the way down to 1080p to get double the framerate.

4k is 8.2 million pixels.
1440p is 3.6 million pixels.
1080p is 2.1 million pixels.

they should easily be able to get 1440p 60 fps by reducing the resolution by half to double the fps. i really dont like this because it means the ray tracing is causing a huge bottleneck on the gpu. but then again, if that was the case they shouldnt have been able to get to 4k 30 fps. maybe its 4kcb?

Disparity between cpu/gpu usage? Dont know graphic engines or the software or hardware side of things so well, but cutting the pixels in half doesnt necessarily means the new available cpu/gpu capacity would be enough to jump the FPS by half?

Basically I'm trying to say that it could take more cpu/gpu power, if you will, to run an additional 30 fps than it does to run an additional 2k resolution...if that makes sense

 

[Hendrick's]

Because the console doesn't have games at launch he tried to give excuse saying what he said.

That is the definition of damage control.

It is not my issue you couldn't understand what he said.

My question was why would Tom Warren need to damage control anything? What's in it for him?

 

[FranXico]

Only reason I would speculate this is based on the BC tests done in 2019.

We don't know when were the tests actually done. The leak consisted of old test data. Could well have been 2018.

 

[Rea]

My question was why would Tom Warren need to damage control anything? What's in it for him?

Nobody knows, but he's been shilling Microsoft Xbox for gods knows how long.. he also been called out several times by different people.

 

[thurnishaleygw]

Kojima Productions is currently composing music for an 'undisclosed project'

I absolutely loved his OST for Death Stranding, so glad to see him working on something new.

 

[Nickolaidas]

Man so excited for this.

I love the artstyle and the animal themed metallic armors.

If the bestiary is solid, I can see this occupying my time for a long while.

 

[Hendrick's]

he also been called out several times by different people.

By man-children maybe.

 

[Dolomite]