As nice as The Matrix Awakens look right now I know for sure we will see games on PS5 / Series X that will look even better

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onQ123

Member
At this point it's really about who can get the best assets into a game & get it on the screen in a playable form. What we seen was still scaled back to be part of a big city so someone using old tricks could focus on a smaller area like a few rooms or a small neighborhood & make everything look even more detailed knowing you will never leave out of that area.

Also games & movies can share assets so the Halo show & new Spiderman movie could share assets with the new games killing 2 birds with one stone.
 
There are many photorealistic aspects to the matrix presentation which make it stand out, but there is a lot more to interactive games and their visuals.

Matrix currently is rough around the edges in many aspects including iq and performance. I would not crown a game as an ultimate achievement it were in this shape.

Things need to be more polished and cohesive as a whole to get the Shmunter seal of approval. More is needed here.
 
I've kind of resigned the other way a bit,

Due to the chip shortages, and advancements made in tech, this might be the shortest gen ever, and both will have new systems shorter than we expect them.
 
Yea i feel that way as well.
The tech demo is pushing everything from scale of gameplay level, number of AI, ray tracing and etc....

Dev could definitely push it further since video games will be in smaller scale compared to the tech demo.
 
True. I agree.

I'm looking forward to whatever Naughty Dog and Rockstar do next. If they release a current-gen only game in 2023-2024, I'm very confident that game will look better than the UE5 2020 Tech Demo and this Matrix Demo.
 
Thx Captain obvious
sure thing cool story bro GIF by Captain Obvious
 
Wont even have to wait that long.
Senuas Saga comes out 2022?

Whatever The Coalition is working on 2023/4?

Naughty Dogs true nextgen title 2023?


Its a good demo and a true showcase of what these consoles are capable of.
But its not endgame levels good.
These consoles are still babies.

Kagey K said:
I've kind of resigned the other way a bit,

Due to the chip shortages, and advancements made in tech, this might be the shortest gen ever, and both will have new systems shorter than we expect them.
Click to expand...
Wait what?
Chip shortages will lead to a shorter generation because they will be able to magically make new chips for their new systems from the ether because chip shortages dont affect ether-made chips?

These console might actually last longer than first expected as they need to actually get them out there.
Their orders with chip makers need to be fulfilled
Both consoles are still actually pretty rare considering the amount of time they have been out.
 
onQ123 said:
At this point it's really about who can get the best assets into a game & get it on the screen in a playable form. What we seen was still scaled back to be part of a big city so someone using old tricks could focus on a smaller area like a few rooms or a small neighborhood & make everything look even more detailed knowing you will never leave out of that area.

Also games & movies can share assets so the Halo show & new Spiderman movie could share assets with the new games killing 2 birds with one stone.
Click to expand...

Apple Event GIF by Mashable


I prefer even more games we've seen so far than that shimmering and artifact fest.
 
I don't think you can have photo realistic, non-uncanny valley characters AND interesting gameplay.

You have to choose up to two.

I.e. maybe you can have a Matrix Awakens style walking simulator with believable actors, but you can't add Spiderman gameplay to the mix..
 
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We got games that looked better than PS4 UE4 demo, and that demo wasn't even interactive... for sure the talent exists to make something that looks even better in the long run but it doesn't mean we will see it often. Only a handful of developers.
 
Until those studio's running proprietary engines show their versions of Nanite, then UE5 is a giant step ahead at the moment. That's not to say the cuting edge studio's like Naughty Dog won't be able to give fantastic experiences tied to more traditional or contemporary development practises, but the two UE5 demo's have shown that this is clearly 'the big step forward' for this generation and if you don't have similar tech, then you need something like it. At least in my opinion. Decoupling the poly budget from the background environmentals is the start of something great and hopefully it will apply to non static meshes at some point in the near future. Nanite can be applied to almost 90% of most scenes apparently.

cgobsession.com

Does Unreal Engines 5 Nanite Make Poly Count Irrelevant - CG Obsession

One of the biggest bottle necks for 3d art in game development is the fact you have to manage poly ... Read more
cgobsession.com cgobsession.com

In terms of constraints, most studio's are still going to be limited by the vessel and the art teams. BD-XL is the maximum size of your game on disk to ship which gives you 100GB. That's not much if you want everything to have a 4k texture and even worse if you want 8k textures in the future. It's a static contraint for all team and platforms. There's nothing stopping these packs being optional of course and downloadable but you'd be more likely to see a medley of different textures in that case (bundles of 2k, some 4k and a very few 8k).

Using Nanite will give you almost endless budget for all the static meshes but for the dynamic stuff it will need to be creative (static mesh overlays for things like armour plates or robots, providing you didn't need deformation), or still heavily authored.

Around the 11min mark they discuss Nanite meshes - so they can respond to physics, but the plates won't deform when hit etc.


Things like foliage etc. are also exempt, so that's still going to rely on traditional development and art as well. I think ultimately it's going to come down to who can blend the two techs together and avoid 'uncanny' valley syndrome compared to those studio's using their own optimised consistent and proven workflows. But I would be surprised if they are not looking at Nanite or already have something in their engines either that can do the same job or they are working on to emulate the same.
 
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In-game settings: turn off the Matrix Filter, set Crowd / Traffic / Parked Cars to 50%.

Try it, makes a BIG improvement. The default settings do not show this demo at its best.
 
RPS37 said:
You think chip shortages means new consoles …sooner?
Click to expand...
I think it's an iffy but interesting idea. I'm pretty sure Sony was expecting to sell a lot more ps5 consoles by this time. So launching a new console sooner for that launch hype seems like something these console makers could do.

edit: I'm guessing 8k will be resolution of the next generation.
 
Of course we'll see games that look and run better. People shouldn't focus on the tech demo defaults but on UE5 and nanite huge potential, which is obvious here.

The UE5 games themselves should look incredible. The best game developers will work on this tech for years. We should get incredibly detailed open worlds in our games.
 
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I just thought about Bend studios, their new IP will be using UE5

But yeah we're going to get some crazy visuals this generation
 
Kagey K said:
I've kind of resigned the other way a bit,

Due to the chip shortages, and advancements made in tech, this might be the shortest gen ever, and both will have new systems shorter than we expect them.
Click to expand...
If there are chip shortages why would it shorten the gen? If anything it will do the opposite where nobody wants to create a new monster chip but just cut costs to shrink it.
 
Hobbygaming said:
I'm even more impressed with how real the car damage is, car crashes look real for once
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There isn't gameplay as such, but there's gleeful amusement value in ramming cars and seeing the crash damage rendered so impressively.

If you actually get out your damaged car and free look around it, in close up the scratches and dings are really next gen.
 
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K2D said:
I don't think you can have photo realistic, non-uncanny valley characters AND interesting gameplay.

You have to choose up to two.

I.e. maybe you can have a Matrix Awakens style walking simulator with believable actors, but you can't add Spiderman gameplay to the mix..
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Button bashing and enemies with low Ai would be the easiest gameplay to add to this. So yes you could add Spiderman.
 
There is definitely a good margin for improvement as this demo is an example if open world, but for different type of game which is not there is more that can be done
 
I'll believe it when I see it.

Nanite tech seems impressive, yes. But using it changes the production pipeline significantly and introduces a new paradigm. I've seen lots of interesting technological improvements going mostly unused due to that. It might also be relegated to cutscenes. I'm sure studios when starting out projects will give it a go, and then decide to proceed development with it, or skip it. This current wave of upcoming software? I'd say they'll skip it in order to prevent further delays.

Also, I think Epic needs to do the killer software to sell it. Perhaps that's where their project with former Team Ico members comes in. Team Ico members were always closer to film development than gaming, Nanite working environment too.

I don't think we'll have a generation as reliant on UE5 as Xbox360/PS3 were on UE3, and even if it is, apart from these extras, UE5 is more similar to UE4 than UE2 is to UE3 and UE3 is to UE4. You can just convert the game up to UE5 and it's not like suddenly you'll be using this new tech (see Fortnite on UE5, when it comes out), this wasn't possible between UE 2/3/4 previously.

UE5 is UE4.5 otherwise.
 
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lostinblue said:
Nanite tech seems impressive, yes. But using it changes the production pipeline significantly and introduces a new paradigm. I've seen lots of interesting technological improvements going mostly unused due to that.
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You are free to only use Nanite for some objects and render everything else normally, None of the characters use Nanite.
 
Lethal01 said:
You are free to only use Nanite for some objects and render everything else normally, None of the characters use Nanite.
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I didn't know that in regards to objects. Impressive. I didn't think it could be an hybrid solution.

That makes it more feasible to implement at the end of development on a case by case scenario, rather than making you go one way since the beginning so it increases the likelihood of it being used a lot.

I don't have any ideia how the "pixel mesh" (1 polygon per pixel) works that way though, assumed it was a full screen thing.
 
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Nanite is the best technology and innovation of this engine, we can finally achieve with this the absolute reality in a scene with objects no more geometrical shaped but perfectly round shaped as you can use billions of micropolygons for shaping object and get infinite 3D geometrical details attached to everything, for example the suit of a soldier whereas before many of these microdetails were represented by a flat texture, now it will be finally geometrical and so realistic thus interactive as well, thanks to this the difference between CGI and real time is closer than ever as you have no more limits.Imagine render this at 4k on PC. I am recently playing Death Stranding on PC and game looks stunning, very cinematic and world details are great and wondering how more perfected could be using metahuman for characters and nanite to render the rocks and landscapes. It would be undistinguishable from a real movie/life
 
xPikYx said:
Nanite is the best technology and innovation of this engine, we can finally achieve with this the absolute reality in a scene with objects no more geometrical shaped but perfectly round shaped as you can use billions of micropolygons for shaping object and get infinite 3D geometrical details attached to everything, for example the suit of a soldier whereas before many of these microdetails were represented by a flat texture, now it will be finally geometrical and so realistic thus interactive as well, thanks to this the difference between CGI and real time is closer than ever as you have no more limits.Imagine render this at 4k on PC. I am recently playing Death Stranding on PC and game looks stunning, very cinematic and world details are great and wondering how more perfected could be using metahuman for characters and nanite to render the rocks and landscapes. It would be undistinguishable from a real movie/life
Click to expand...

Actually it can only be used for static meshes (so far), so it's not usable for character models, animated foliage, etc. But it's great for buildings, rock formations, all that stuff.

But you also still can't just throw billions of polygons at everything, because the file sizes would be ridiculous. This very limited demo with three detailed character models and a pretty "static" city environment is like 30GB.
 
RoadHazard said:
Actually it can only be used for static meshes (so far), so it's not usable for character models, animated foliage, etc. But it's great for buildings, rock formations, all that stuff.

But you also still can't just throw billions of polygons at everything, because the file sizes would be ridiculous. This very limited demo with three detailed character models and a pretty "static" city environment is like 30GB.
Click to expand...
this is the most densely populated and biggest urban cities ever made in a video game. 30 GB is nothing for a world so massive.
 
SlimySnake said:
this is the most densely populated and biggest urban cities ever made in a video game. 30 GB is nothing for a world so massive.
Click to expand...

There's a LOT of repeated assets though. The buildings are made from different blocks in different combinations, as are the NPCs (they're basically generated like when using the sliders in an RPG to create your character), not counting the main three characters of course. The city looks pretty much the same everywhere, it being large and densely populated has nothing to do with how much space it takes up really, that's more a question of memory usage and CPU/GPU utilization.

There's little else here, really. An actual game is gonna need to have MUCH more variety in things that actually take up space.
 
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"As nice as The Matrix Awakens look right now I know for sure we will see games on PS5 / Series X that will look even better"


Certainly
 
I'm excited to see what ID can pull out for their true next gen engine. Sony / MS need to concentrate on getting consoles in punters hands so we can finally be free of shackles of PS4/Xbone.
 
Maybe a top tier developer like a Naughty Dog or a Coalition could pass the Matrix demo visuals in a few years with a lot of effort, but I doubt the average developer will be able to accomplish and surpass what we witnessed in that demo. In other words, I doubt they demo will be the norm. We'll see though.
 
Also the environment has a lot to do how well graphics are received, some environments look better then others.

If UET demo was a blade runner inspired city I think it will look better because of the more creative architecture, neo lights and fog, lighting reacting to fog.
 
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