Microsoft / Activision Deal Approval Watch |OT| (MS/ABK close)

Do you believe the deal will be approved?


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tmlDan

Member
How? Ms is in third place among the three console platforms. Do you think Sony would survive without cod? How much marketshare do you think Sony would lose do to this acquisition? Curious if you had a number in mind?
I don't think people like you understand how this all trickles down to how Sony and Playstation got to where they are and why MS failed.

Answer this question, why is Sony in first place? is it the number of studios they own?

I'll answer, no, its not that. It generates more revenue because of a few things:

1. They produce quality games that sell despite having less studios (now) than MS. That results in a larger consumer base and a need to play those games that then conditions them to buy their games still because they don't have something like GP.
2. As a result of having quality first party games they get bonuses, like:
a. Cheaper third party deals and marketing rights because studios and publishers know that people will buy their games on PS and not resort to GP. This means that the third party studios trust and know they have a quality product that will sell, GP is great for indies or experimental projects that may or may not sell. Example: HW Legacy, they knew it would sell well and were confident in their product hence why PS got marketing rights which further increases their revenue and sales + opportunity to work together again
b. Influence on third party exclusive rights for the same reasons mentioned above. Sony assists a ton of studios with their xdev and support studios to help other developers
3. Sony is great at touching on multiple audiences in multiple markets, make good marketing and third party deals, and are better at project management, market analysis, potential, and are smarter when spending money.

These are all things MS can compete against now, they just have to provide better quality exclusives and build a proper network and market share will slowly shift. It will be difficult and I'm not sure they have the leaders in place to do so but it's definitely possible.
 
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Baki

Member
If Sony managed to get deathloop and Ghostwire as timed exclusive (and marketing) deals then that's evidence that Microsoft would have had a fair shot at getting Hi Fi Rush as part of a gamepass + timed exclusive deal. Bethesda proved they were both open to and willing to doing business deals of that nature. Hence their games have appeared on all sorts of subscription services over the years.

To support my point above there were a number of Bethesda games that hit gamepass long before the acquisition.

They were clearly not a difficult publisher to sit down and do business with so I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion.
Doesn't prove shit. Both games had little commercial value and MS knew at the time that they were going to make a big acquisition, so it was to their benefit to show regulators that they would honour pre-existing agreements. MS will do what's best for the business, the concessions they're willing to give is based purely on what regulators will force them to do, to get this deal over the line. The problem with the 10 year contract is that MS can decide to break the contract after the deal is closed and then pay the fines out of court settlement to Sony for breaking the agreement. That's why the CMA wants a structural remedy because the contract would require the CMA to constantly monitor and then enforce.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Wait I thought that in the UK the decision can't be subject to a trial...so what are they talking about? What losing legal argument?
Does Pachter even know what he's talking about or is he doing damage control for their previous confidence in the deal?
It can't, he doesn't know what he's talking about. He is beholden to hedge funds that have a vested interest in their stock investments on the success of this deal. He is as partisan as it gets when it comes to this fiasco.

Wedbush Securities huh? I wonder why they would take this stance.

EwKJeHo.png


Oh, of course.
Yep. Which is why I laugh when legacy media fake news brings him on and prances him around like a non-partisan opinion on this matter without disclosing that his firm has a vested interest in this deal succeeding.
 
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Alesimage

Banned
One great thing from all of this is I know Xbox had the full backing of papa Microsoft now. I Remember when "MS warchest" used to be a joke. I don't think it's funny for some people now. Gonna be an interesting gen for sure.
 
Says this biggest shill and console warrior, lol. It's hilarious that you write so much yet regurgitate the same bs. CoD off Gamepass? Pretty sure you meant off Playstation. If that wasn't the case, why did Phil came out and say 3 years only then? It was ALWAYS been their goal to take it off from day 1 when they were in talks for the acquisition. Bethesda games that were in development HAS been removed from Playstation. If it's been about money, then why is Starfield, Elder Scrolls not going to be on Playstation? Why isn't Hi-Fi Rush? This deal is as good as dead.

Cause they don't normally offer 10 year contracts in gaming? Pretty simple. Starfield and Elder Scrolls is a decision that doesn't need to be all about money buddy. That's about positioning. Are Starfield and Elder Scroll 6 major multiplayer, annual franchises? I don't think so.

You're comparing Hi-Fi Rush to Call of Duty Warzone and yearly COD games? Now you've officially jumped the shark.

And on that deal as good as dead, far from it by the looks of it things. That may be your desire, but a full reading of what the CMA said doesn't appear as if that wish of yours will be granted. This deal is getting approved, and I will say that confidently till I see otherwise. The CMA doesn't have to entertain remedies. They could have just killed it and said no remedies will do.

Instead what did they do? After saying that the deal raises competition concerns where they would go so far as to suggest divestiture, they then very visibly opened the door wide open to allowing behavioral remedies from Microsoft. They simply were not at that part in the process yet. Go back and look at their schedule that has been up for a while. First they give provisional findings, and THEN they consider remedies, if necessary. They made clear that they will entertain behavioral remedies in this case whereas they otherwise would not. If you think that's bad news for the deal, when one of their requirements appears to be allowing ABK games on Geforce now type services, I don't know what to tell you.

I've been saying for a while that this deal will go through. Today changes nothing. In fact, it raises my level of confidence. See you at the finish line boys.
 

Heisenberg007

Gold Journalism
I wonder how they would remedy this. If the solution is to then allow CoD on PS+ for game streaming purposes and others, then it kind of devalues the deal overall for Microsoft.
It does devalue it a lot. But remember that the Cloud gaming part isn't just about Sony.

The CMA also mentioned GeForce, Amazon Luna, Shadow (?), Google Stadia (now dead), and Ubisoft. They also mentioned that Stadia died, partially because of this.

So theoretically, it wouldn't just be PS+. COD would be available on all these (maybe except Ubisoft) as well as any other future entrants to the market, e.g., Apple or Meta etc.

That's what Microsoft will have to agree to, put in writing, and abide for the rest of the time until COD exists.
 
So CMA has opened the door, very slightly to the strictest of all possible behavioral remedies. And if Microsoft doesn't come up with something good, they will want full divestiture of either COD business or Blizzard business to allow the deal to go through.

In other words, commit to all games multi-plat for 20 years, or even permanently if they won't budge for 20 years. Allow all competitors license access to ABK games on their game pass and cloud competitors, including Sony, Nvidia etc.

Offer Sony new COD games day one on ps+ for up to a year then afterwards they need to pay to extend.

But if the current situation stands, looks like I owe thicc_girls_are_teh_best thicc_girls_are_teh_best a game possibly. Will watch. They straight adopted all Sony talking points. FTC seems to have successfully influenced it. But there is still hope, but Microsoft's remedy offers will have to be ironclad to avoid divesting.

I tried to warn 'ya buddy 😂

Jokes aside, in the case MS want to push against divestiture and the 10-year offer was not enough, I don't see a 20-year offer being enough, similar to what another poster said. Keeping COD multiplat in perpetuity might, but that has a lot of caveats. For example, how are competitors able to negotiate for marketing deals in absolute good faith when they have to go through a direct competitor for those deals?

On the one hand, I can see how that situation actually levels the playing field, because in a scenario where MS has to keep COD multiplat in perpetuity, that goes for keeping all access possibilities fair & equal for themselves & competitors. So while Sony wouldn't be able to negotiate for marketing deals, Microsoft cannot do marketing deals with the IP, either. So whatever platform gets more sales is down to the strength of that platform's advertising and brand power. Or maybe better to say, it's not that both MS & Sony would be locked out of marketing deals, it's more like neither could have exclusive marketing deals with the IP. They could both advertise COD for their respective platforms with creative license so long as no actual lies are present (i.e "only available on PlayStation/Xbox!" when factually it's on both platforms).

Of course what complicates this is Game Pass; say in a case MS are forced to keep COD multiplat in perpetuity, and therefore all releases get same native releases on all platforms, same updates, same quality & feature support, same marketing arrangements, same services arrangements etc...does that allow each platform holder to decide if they want to include the game in their subscription service or not? Because I can easily see MS saying "screw it" and putting a new COD in Game Pass, whereas Sony refuses for PS+, but the macro factors at play would be that MS doesn't really rely much whatsoever on COD revenue or even Xbox revenue, whereas COD is a decent chunk for PlayStation's revenue and PlayStation is an absolute core pillar of Sony's whole business. So of course Sony aren't going to give away something like COD for "free" in PS+, whereas for MS they can do that for it in Game Pass and not break a sweat, because even if it leaves tons of money on the table, it's ultimately pennies compared to the money MS makes from their actual corporate pillars.

And I think that's the kind of thing regulators are taking into consideration, which is probably a reason they are more opposition on the deal than Microsoft thought they'd be.

You guys saying the deal is dead need to take your time and read again.

Not everyone's saying the deal is dead. However, one of Microsoft's reasons for the deal was absolutely to have control over COD. If they're going to potentially be forced to divest COD, chances are they lose a massive motivation to see the deal through, and decide to walk away. Which would betray that a core reason they were interested in the deal was in fact for control over COD and, most likely, using it as leverage against competitors to push heavy-handed terms at detriment of competitors, for stuff like Game Pass on competitor platforms.

MS potentially being forced to divest Blizzard could result in the same thing, though maybe to a lesser scale. Although Overwatch, Starcraft, WoW, Diablo etc. are very valuable IP in their own right.

As much as i hate bobby he was right in his recent interview with cbnc, regulators have no idea, MS would be incredibly dumb making cod an exclusive and even if they did how many people would jump consoles? I cant see it being significant especially since a majority of people that have playstations have had nothing but playstation, ps3 one of the worst consoles to ever come out still sold well due to loyalty

The point is that MS have been trying to argue that Sony would be totally fine without COD as a means of getting approval for the acquisition, which both somewhat contradicts claims by them that the deal isn't about COD/COD not being that important, and that they have no plans to remove the IP from competitor platforms like PlayStation.

Simply by positing those scenarios of a PS being well without COD (which could very well be true, financially speaking) shows that there's at least some intent for them in the future to remove it from the platform, or to make it materially worst of an offering on competitor platforms through one or several means, something they would not do if they actually felt COD was not of substantial value in the acquisition of ABK.
 
It does devalue it a lot. But remember that the Cloud gaming part isn't just about Sony.

The CMA also mentioned GeForce, Amazon Luna, Shadow (?), Google Stadia (now dead), and Ubisoft. They also mentioned that Stadia died, partially because of this.

So theoretically, it wouldn't just be PS+. COD would be available on all these (maybe except Ubisoft) as well as any other future entrants to the market, e.g., Apple or Meta etc.

That's what Microsoft will have to agree to, put in writing, and abide for the rest of the time until COD exists.
I don't think that is a bad deal per se, as long as the kickers are 1) dont fuck other people over with stupid pricing which how would that even be determined, and 2) CoD needs to be day and date with Game Pass and available on other platforms but NOT on other platforms sub services, would have to be a standalone purchase. I think that would have to be enough to convince he CMA and others while also still making the deal "worth it" to MS. ABK is first and foremost about Game Pass.
 
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DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Would it be ok for you if Ms continue to acquire studios piecemeal wise instead of entire publishers. Like the way Sony has done for years.
Like MS has been doing as well in the same timeframe? Nobody bitched when they purchased studios they worked closely with. It becomes an issue when you start buying up all the largest and oldest third party publishers to play takeaway of storied 3rd party IPs.
 
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reksveks

Member
Read the document and Chris Dring's tweets. It's all in there.
  • In the UK, Xbox has a 40% console market share, while PlayStation has a 60% console market share.
  • According to the survey by the CMA, 24% of PlayStation owners will switch to Xbox if Call of Duty were made an Xbox exclusive.
  • So the new console market share will become 64% for Xbox and 36% for PlayStation.
And that's just from one game.

That's as anti-competitive as it can get. That's why the CMA made this decision, which makes total sense.
Just want to fix the maths (the point stands, as that is the biggest swing that we have seen from regulators investigation and stood out to me), it should be 24% of the 60% (14.4%) so the difference will be 45.6% for Sony and 54.4% for xbox.
 
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poppabk

Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
It's ironic that cloud gaming, that pretty much no gamer really gives a shit about, is the major stumbling block. Especially as MS is pretty much the only one who is keeping even the idea of cloud gaming on life support currently.
 

demigod

Member
Cause they don't normally offer 10 year contracts in gaming? Pretty simple. Starfield and Elder Scrolls is a decision that doesn't need to be all about money buddy. That's about positioning. Are Starfield and Elder Scroll 6 major multiplayer, annual franchises? I don't think so.

You're comparing Hi-Fi Rush to Call of Duty Warzone and yearly COD games? Now you've officially jumped the shark.

And on that deal as good as dead, far from it by the looks of it things. That may be your desire, but a full reading of what the CMA said doesn't appear as if that wish of yours will be granted. This deal is getting approved, and I will say that confidently till I see otherwise. The CMA doesn't have to entertain remedies. They could have just killed it and said no remedies will do.

Instead what did they do? After saying that the deal raises competition concerns where they would go so far as to suggest divestiture, they then very visibly opened the door wide open to allowing behavioral remedies from Microsoft. They simply were not at that part in the process yet. Go back and look at their schedule that has been up for a while. First they give provisional findings, and THEN they consider remedies, if necessary. They made clear that they will entertain behavioral remedies in this case whereas they otherwise would not. If you think that's bad news for the deal, when one of their requirements appears to be allowing ABK games on Geforce now type services, I don't know what to tell you.

I've been saying for a while that this deal will go through. Today changes nothing. In fact, it raises my level of confidence. See you at the finish line boys.
Typical wall of texts full of excuses coming from you. I never compared Starfield / hi-fi rush to CoD. Loss of revenue is loss of revenue. No Bethesda game in the works is releasing on Playstation that we know of. Look where Redfall is. Do you honestly think ms hasn’t been in talks with the CMA about concessions?

You should’ve left and come back when the deal was over. You just make yourself look bad with every post.
 

GHG

Gold Member
It's ironic that cloud gaming, that pretty much no gamer really gives a shit about, is the major stumbling block. Especially as MS is pretty much the only one who is keeping even the idea of cloud gaming on life support currently.

According to what exactly?
 
It's ironic that cloud gaming, that pretty much no gamer really gives a shit about, is the major stumbling block. Especially as MS is pretty much the only one who is keeping even the idea of cloud gaming on life support currently.
I know my take on cloud gaming isn't a popular one here, but there is going to be a time when its the platform of choice for most gamers. The moment the infrastructure and tech behind cloud gaming is ready for mass adoption and the pricing/service model is right, it's going to redefine how people consume videogames.
 

Punished Miku

Human Rights Subscription Service
It's ironic that cloud gaming, that pretty much no gamer really gives a shit about, is the major stumbling block. Especially as MS is pretty much the only one who is keeping even the idea of cloud gaming on life support currently.
And ironic that MS can't even afford to get Call of Duty on GP currently, but CMA is worried about guaranteeing CoD can be on PS+ and rival services. Sony doesn't even put their own games on PS+ day one. Seems like a crazy overreach and totally kneecaps MS's plan to do something innovative, while also guaranteeing CoD for PS consoles. Weak sauce.
 
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Thirty7ven

Banned
It's ironic that cloud gaming, that pretty much no gamer really gives a shit about, is the major stumbling block. Especially as MS is pretty much the only one who is keeping even the idea of cloud gaming on life support currently.

Xbox community been telling us it’s the future of gaming for a couple of years now. Hell we have Xbox gamers at neogaf saying they play Xcloud all the time.
 

Punished Miku

Human Rights Subscription Service
Xbox community been telling us it’s the future of gaming for a couple of years now. Hell we have Xbox gamers at neogaf saying they play Xcloud all the time.
Everyone says it's a nice optional thing that's basically free. In the future, it's not hard to imagine a time when it could be dominant. Similar to Netflix and all other streaming services. We're obviously not there yet. The demands on internet speed are higher.
 

Alx

Member
The regulators aren’t there to “even out” the competition.

They are there to represent consumer interests. The consumers have, with their wallets, chosen the marketplace as it is today.

MS is trying to force consumers onto their platforms through acquisition. Regulators don’t like that.

MS is welcome to win market share through innovation, compelling products or even aggressive pricing. They are not though, allowed to change the market place through acquisitions when they aren’t doing as well as they hoped in it.
I'm not disagreeing with that, I'd understand if the regulators claimed the acquisition was "unfair". But their argument is that the consequence for the consumer would be less competition and less innovation, which is not what happens when competitors are closing in.
And honestly I don't think regulators are supposed to "like" the way companies increase their value. Their role is to make sure they don't reach monopolistic status that would hurt the consumer (otherwise they could block all company acquisition). And like I said, evening the competition is the opposite of that.
 
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tmlDan

Member
Pachter says it’ll close? This deals dead then.
I wonder if Wedbush uses Pachter as an opposites guy, they get a report from him and then they do exactly the opposite and are hugely successful.

That's my only reasoning as to why he even has a job lol

Unless he's retired now 🤷‍♂️
 
Xbox community been telling us it’s the future of gaming for a couple of years now. Hell we have Xbox gamers at neogaf saying they play Xcloud all the time.
I use it to try games before downloading, pretty handy tbh. And no matter what you think about cloud gaming, its eventually going to be a major force in the industry.
 

Banjo64

cumsessed
Read the document and Chris Dring's tweets. It's all in there.
  • In the UK, Xbox has a 40% console market share, while PlayStation has a 60% console market share.
  • According to the survey by the CMA, 24% of PlayStation owners will switch to Xbox if Call of Duty were made an Xbox exclusive.
  • So the new console market share will become 64% for Xbox and 36% for PlayStation.
And that's just from one game.

That's as anti-competitive as it can get. That's why the CMA made this decision, which makes total sense.
Not to mention we’ve yet to see mega hits from Bethesda in TES and Fallout. The market share could potentially become more lopsided than even those figures.
 

Baki

Member
I wonder if MS will be open to spinning off COD into an entity jointly owned by them, Sony and Google/Amazon?
 

Punished Miku

Human Rights Subscription Service
I wonder if MS will be open to spinning off COD into an entity jointly owned by them, Sony and Google/Amazon?
If the deal is blocked it's a huge L for MS. But ... if they are allowed to buy King/Blizzard at a reduced price, it's still kinda a win. Who knows.
 

POKEYCLYDE

Member
Just want to fix the maths (the point stands, as that is the biggest swing that we have seen from regulators investigation and stood out to me), it should be 24% of the 60% (14.4%) so the difference will be 45.6% for Sony and 54.4% for xbox.
The survey polled 40k Call of Duty gamers on Playstation. That 24% is of Call of Duty players, not the all encompassing Playstation players. If 20% of Playstation players play Call of Duty, and roughly 25% of those players abandon Playstation for Xbox, only 5% of total Playstation players are migrating to Xbox. Still leaving Sony in the lead.
 

demigod

Member
Everyone says it's a nice optional thing that's basically free. In the future, it's not hard to imagine a time when it could be dominant. Similar to Netflix and all other streaming services. We're obviously not there yet. The demands on internet speed are higher.
Not the same. How many folks do you see in real life whip out a controller to play on their phone?
 

Punished Miku

Human Rights Subscription Service
Not the same. How many folks do you see in real life whip out a controller to play on their phone?
I said it's an optional thing that may take off in the future. Many of the games have touch screen controls. Anyone using a controller is probably doing it at home, not on the road. Or TVs, browsers, roku sticks, etc.
 

GHG

Gold Member
Why would ABK shareholders agree to sell king?

Might be forced to. Usually when things like this happen the deal goes through as per the original financial terms and then any divestments happen separate to that.

At this point it's largely out of ATVI shareholders hands since they voted in favour of the acquisition. Regardless of how it goes through (if it does) then they will get their due. The rest is for Microsoft to manage in accordance with regulator requests.
 
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sainraja

Member
Yeah it has turned pretty boring.

It went from fun to read the melt downs to just writing something for the sake of writing something.
The best meltdown has been yours, but you seem to be mellowing down in your recent posts. So there is that.

Everyone says it's a nice optional thing that's basically free. In the future, it's not hard to imagine a time when it could be dominant. Similar to Netflix and all other streaming services. We're obviously not there yet. The demands on internet speed are higher.
Do you really want that to be the future? I can see content owners pushing for cloud streaming because they keep control of how their content is accessed and distributed—the ease of access is definitely a factor they have been counting on, but the tech needed to get gaming there isn't here yet, not for a global rollout anyway, and they have already succeeded in taking control over how people get their movies and music. It is the best type of DRM these companies could have asked for and some of you are already in line for it lol.
 
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Punished Miku

Human Rights Subscription Service
The best meltdown has been yours, but you seem to be mellowing down in your recent posts. So there is that.


Do you really want that to be the future? I can see content owners pushing for cloud streaming because they keep control of how their content is accessed and distributed—the ease of access is definitely a factor they have been counting on, but the tech needed to get gaming there isn't here yet, not for a global rollout anyway, and they have already succeeded in taking control over how people get their movies and music. It is the best type of DRM these companies could have asked for and some of you are already in line for it lol.
I like it as an optional thing. But it's just being stubborn to not mentally conceive that it's entirely possible this could be the future. That's the case with my personal habits with music, TV, movies.
 

M16

Member
Cause they don't normally offer 10 year contracts in gaming? Pretty simple. Starfield and Elder Scrolls is a decision that doesn't need to be all about money buddy. That's about positioning. Are Starfield and Elder Scroll 6 major multiplayer, annual franchises? I don't think so.

You're comparing Hi-Fi Rush to Call of Duty Warzone and yearly COD games? Now you've officially jumped the shark.

And on that deal as good as dead, far from it by the looks of it things. That may be your desire, but a full reading of what the CMA said doesn't appear as if that wish of yours will be granted. This deal is getting approved, and I will say that confidently till I see otherwise. The CMA doesn't have to entertain remedies. They could have just killed it and said no remedies will do.

Instead what did they do? After saying that the deal raises competition concerns where they would go so far as to suggest divestiture, they then very visibly opened the door wide open to allowing behavioral remedies from Microsoft. They simply were not at that part in the process yet. Go back and look at their schedule that has been up for a while. First they give provisional findings, and THEN they consider remedies, if necessary. They made clear that they will entertain behavioral remedies in this case whereas they otherwise would not. If you think that's bad news for the deal, when one of their requirements appears to be allowing ABK games on Geforce now type services, I don't know what to tell you.

I've been saying for a while that this deal will go through. Today changes nothing. In fact, it raises my level of confidence. See you at the finish line boys.

like you said, if they wanted to outright block this deal, they would have. this is just a performance from politicians to try to act like they are tough against big tech( cringe buzzword)
the report is based on microsoft having full exclusivity, a licensing deal was never factored,and did not shape their opinion. everyone knows they werent gonna green light this. leaving the part in about behavioral remedies is their out. the licensing deal microsoft is offering goes above and beyond all concerns in the report. the CMA knows this. they will use it to make themselves look good.
 
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FritzJ92

Member
I don't think people like you understand how this all trickles down to how Sony and Playstation got to where they are and why MS failed.

Answer this question, why is Sony in first place? is it the number of studios they own?

I'll answer, no, its not that. It generates more revenue because of a few things:

1. They produce quality games that sell despite having less studios (now) than MS. That results in a larger consumer base and a need to play those games that then conditions them to buy their games still because they don't have something like GP.
2. As a result of having quality first party games they get bonuses, like:
a. Cheaper third party deals and marketing rights because studios and publishers know that people will buy their games on PS and not resort to GP. This means that the third party studios trust and know they have a quality product that will sell, GP is great for indies or experimental projects that may or may not sell. Example: HW Legacy, they knew it would sell well and were confident in their product hence why PS got marketing rights which further increases their revenue and sales + opportunity to work together again
b. Influence on third party exclusive rights for the same reasons mentioned above. Sony assists a ton of studios with their xdev and support studios to help other developers
3. Sony is great at touching on multiple audiences in multiple markets, make good marketing and third party deals, and are better at project management, market analysis, potential, and are smarter when spending money.

These are all things MS can compete against now, they just have to provide better quality exclusives and build a proper network and market share will slowly shift. It will be difficult and I'm not sure they have the leaders in place to do so but it's definitely possible.
There is no way someone is going to say Sony is smarter at spending money when they are also the company that released the crappy designed PS3, PS Move, PS Vita failed. Sony is no smarter than MS at "spending money" they just got a strong headstart in a market that is built on nostalgia and running franchises. Its really that simple.
 
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