So, after the Redfall news. Is starfield most definitely only 30fps at this point?

ChorizoPicozo said:
i don't think arguments on both sides should be that cut and dry.

but fantrolls are gonna fantroll.
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Well I agree the arguments should not be cut and dry but that hasn't stopped people from saying that 'since Destiny 2 is 60fps(on consoles now) Redfall should be too'. There is a clear lack of understanding of how game development or technology works.
jroc74 said:
PC or console tho? :pie_thinking:

Seems from now on for Xbox games we're gonna have to specify PC or console.

30 fps will always be on the table, isnt going away. At best hope for performance modes.
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As far as MS is concerned they generally release games on PC and console at the same time. They have never promised that both places will play the games at exactly the same performance.
 
SJRB said:
It's Bethesda, lmao. My garbageman is better at optimising game engines than Bethesda.

These idiots probably think "minimum viable product" and "going gold" are the same thing.
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This attitude is why gaming sucks these days. Back when I was a kid, nobody cared about the inner working of gaming studios. The games simply arrived at Toys R Us and we bought them, enjoyed them.
 
I'd be pleasantly surprised if Starfield has a 60fps mode. All we can do is cross our fingers and hope for the best there. I'm obviously playing that one regardless.

When you look at what Turn 10 is doing with Forza at 60fps, certainly anything is possible. I'm pro 60fps wherever possible, but good games that can only be 30 are fine for me as well on console (these would probably be games that would require a quite expensive PC to nail 60 or better anyway). Bad games are bad games regardless of what they are running at.
 
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Punished Miku said:
I assumed it would be long before Redfall was even talked about.
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Yeah. First real official hint about it was in an IGN interview where Todd said he thinks their games play great at 30fps, he wasn't specifically talking about Starfield at that point but it was obviously a way to prepare people that 30fps will come.
Time-stamped
 
Im more concerned with how much content will be on offer.
Will it be a short main quest or a big beefy one with extra pickles?
Will It have 50 or 500 hours of side stuff?
Will I lose myself exploring huge worlds and planets? Or will everything look cut and pasty?
I dont expect much in the way of technical showcase. Just make me feel I am in another world away from the office grind.
I will be sitting in my rocker recliner with my feet up, controller in hand and a beer next to me.
I am so looking forward to this game.
 
Very likely. Good thing I own a PC so I don't have to deal with peasant "cinematic" framerates in Starfield. I'm more worried about the bugs and how broken it will be at launch on PC. Hoping the modding community can salvage it.
 
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j.k.2021 said:
Starfield is a RPG.Combat won't be the focus.
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That doesn't matter. Combat is still going to be a major focus of the game, and it probably isn't going to be like Fallout in which you can rely on VATS.

As for Starfields performance: We'll have to wait and see and it's too early to say anything definitely at this point. A lot of people are drawing the conclusion that, since Redfield will run at 30 so much Starfield, but that's really a logical fallacy. They aren't the same developer, they're very different games and they use very different tech. Comments made by Bethesda employees suggest that they're fine with 30, but it's a little bit strange to go out of their way to develop current gen versions of Skyrim and Fallout 4 just so that they can run at 60 FPS, and then lock the next project to 30.

We'll see what happens.
 
Hawking Radiation said:
Been on PC gaming for the past few years and play Division 2 on the regular. The other day my game for some weird reason dropped from 135+ FPS down to 30 FPS. Immediately made playing the game uncomfortable and gave me a headache not long after.

I'll never go back to 30 FPS gaming again. Fuck that. I pity you console peasants having to sit through 30 FPS games.
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Man, you have a weak ass brain. 30FPS gave you a headache? Jeez.
 
Rykan said:
it's a little bit strange to go out of their way to develop current gen versions of Skyrim and Fallout 4 just so that they can run at 60 FPS, and then lock the next project to 30.
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It's a common way to resell an old game, look at the remaster era around the mid-gen upgrades. Can't draw any conclusions that they're somehow focusing on higher framerates now from that.
Actually, 30fps on Series consoles and 60fps on Series Pro might be what will happen.
 
I would think it's just an isolated thing with Redfall. Starfield looks about the same level graphically as something like Plague Tale or Horizon which can both run at 60fps+
 
TehGoomba7s said:
30fps looks like absolute trash on OLEDS and a lot more people have them now. 30fps and no field of view is absolutely vomit inducing sitting at a desk with a monitor too.
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Yeah, the 40Fps modes on some PS5 games are the bare minimum.
Otherwise, I really can't play 30Fps games on my OLED.
 
Fredrik said:
It's a common way to resell an old game, look at the remaster era around the mid-gen upgrades. Can't draw any conclusions that they're somehow focusing on higher framerates now from that.
Actually, 30fps on Series consoles and 60fps on Series Pro might be what will happen.
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I highly doubt that the intention behind reselling an old game is to make a profit. The frame rate improvements for both Skyrim and Fallout 4 have been made through patches. It seems unlikely that anyone would wait this long to buy these games just to play them at 60 FPS. Even if they did, Fallout 4 is usually on sale for as little as $6, it's included in the PlayStation 5 collection, and is available on Game Pass. So, the increased sales generated by these patches will likely be minimal.

It's also unlikely that there will be a Series Pro. It's doubtful that Microsoft wants to flood the market with three different SKUs, each with a different hardware configuration.
 
Hoppa said:
I would think it's just an isolated thing with Redfall. Starfield looks about the same level graphically as something like Plague Tale or Horizon which can both run at 60fps+
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Bethesda are doing so much more with the interactivity unless they for some reason scale that back in Starfield. I remember some interview where they said their engine know where every single object in the game is, at all times, the trick was then to not update the position every cycle for distans object, if they did nothing could run their games.
I assume they can lock down object position when they leave a planet though, can't keep track of objects on thousand planets at all times.
 
Rykan said:
The frame rate improvements for both Skyrim and Fallout 4 have been made through patches.
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I only play Bethesda's games on PC but I thought Skyrim on console got 60fps through Special Edition? Or was it a fps boost update?

And a Pro console of some sort will happen. Zero doubt. Imagine if they didn't do it and Sony did. Ouch.
 
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Fredrik said:
I only play Bethesda's games on PC but I thought Skyrim on console got 60fps through Special Edition? Or was it a fps boost update?
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Skyrim received a Special Edition for the PS4 and Xbox one. This version works on PS5 and XBS consoles, and Bethesda released a patch so that it runs at 60 FPS. They're planning to do the same for Fallout 4.
 
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Rykan said:
I highly doubt that the intention behind reselling an old game is to make a profit. The frame rate improvements for both Skyrim and Fallout 4 have been made through patches. It seems unlikely that anyone would wait this long to buy these games just to play them at 60 FPS. Even if they did, Fallout 4 is usually on sale for as little as $6, it's included in the PlayStation 5 collection, and is available on Game Pass. So, the increased sales generated by these patches will likely be minimal.

It's also unlikely that there will be a Series Pro. It's doubtful that Microsoft wants to flood the market with three different SKUs, each with a different hardware configuration.
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MS will make a Pro if Sony does.
 
Feel Like I'm On 42 said:
Can we talk about the absolute ineptitude, bad management, and failure of Microsoft to make good on all the technological features they themselves touted about the Series X?

Redfall being 30 fps. Starfield almost guaranteed to be 30. Why the fuck isn't FSR2 being used in all MS's first party games? Why has Forza Horizon 5 using FSR on SX months after its been brought to the PC version?

How many stupid decisions does MS have to make this gen guys? At the very least how bad does it look that Redfall and probably Starfield will be 30 fps? As if MS's handling of Halo Infinite, the lack of games, the worse performance of games compared to Ps5 in a lot of games recently wasn't bad enough. The development hell, the delays, etc etc the list just goes on.

I'm tired of the consoles being treated like second class citizens by MS and certain 3rd party devs by things like what we're seeing with Redfall targeting only 30 fps or FH5 not getting fsr 2 brought over. There's NO REASON these features CANT be implemented! The only reason they do it is because they think they can get away with taking shortcuts because they think console owners are sheep who won't care! Sadly, there are a ton of console gamers that do still have this mindset.

One more thing- Redfall was shown and advertised for Xbox with trailers that showed the game running at 60! Only for the geniuses at MS and Arkane to say "oops, we know it's coming in 2 weeks but there's no 60 mode at launch". WHEN ARE GAMES JOURNALISTS AND YOUTUBERS GOING TO START BEING HONEST ABOUT THE FACT THAT ALL PREVIEWS ARE DONE ON PC? Ask these devs why they're not also showing it on consoles? Be honest with your subscribers that ALL FOOTAGE WAS PC and maybe devs will start being more honest as well! We're seeing this exact thing happening with Star Wars Survivor and NOBODY ANYWHERE is talking about it. Not on YouTube, not on Gaf or Reddit.. we have NO IDEA how that games going to run on ps5/sx either and it comes out in 12 days.
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Temporarily 30fps Redfall. Yet to be released Starfield. And then you managed to shoehorn locked 60fps Forza Horizon 5 into this epistle for some crazy reason.

That's it? Console owners are 'sheep' because not ever visual setting on PC for Forza Horizon 5 was brought over to console, despite the game running perfectly fine?

Ridiculous
 
Saber said:
I think its only possible through a specific mod. And I don't remember being stable.
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Rykan said:
Skyrim received a Special Edition for the PS4 and Xbox one. This version works on PS5 and XBS consoles, and Bethesda released a patch so that it runs at 60 FPS. They're planning to do the same for Fallout 4.
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Sorry I thought Special Edition was 60fps natively.
Guessing you're talking about a FPS Boost update then? Edit: Or did it get an official next gen patch? Trying to Google it but can't find anything solid, just some talk about a mod and fps boost which means it's not actually Bethesda doing work on that.
 
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rhodesianshepard said:
They are both owned by Microsoft! Bethesda/Arkane games have always been kind of janky, but it's not unreasonable to think maybe Microsoft could help with polishing up their first party exclusive games upon release. Redfall seems to be just as janky as every other Arkane game, so I'm gonna guess Starfield will be just as buggy and poorly optimized as Fallout 4/76 were on release. Microsoft has not shown the ability to enhance these studios after acquisition, which is disappointing
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Starfield hasn't yet come out and people are already expressing their heartfelt disappointment in the final release.

This has got to be a new level unlocked in 'concern' 😂

Never mind that Arkane has released two 60fps games post acquisition. Or that multiple studios purchased by MS have released 60fps titles. Or even that a 60fps mode for Redfall comes out post launch.
 
Fredrik said:
Sorry I thought Special Edition was 60fps natively.
Guessing you're talking about a FPS Boost update then? Edit: Or did it get an official next gen patch? Trying to Google it but can't find anything solid, just some talk about a mod and fps boost which means it's not actually Bethesda doing work on that.
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No worries, It can be rather confusing. This is what happened.

Skyrim Special Edition was released on PS4/XBONE. This version is available on PS5/XSX as well. It was originally locked to 30 FPS. Both Skyrim and Fallout 4 support mods on consoles, and one of the mods unlocks the framerate for both titles. This means that the games can run up to 60, but I believe only PS5 and XSX ran at a consistent 60 FPS. Digital Foundry has a video on this if you'd like to know more.

To make matters more confusing, Fallout 4 was part of Xbox's "FPS BOOST" program, which means that the game runs at 60 FPS on XSX due to enhanced BC. This isn't ideal because it uses the base Xbox one version, and not the enhanced Xbox One X version that runs at a higher resolution.

Bethesda released a patch for Skyrim for both PS5 and XSX that makes both games run at 60 FPS (and I believe 4k) and they are planning to release a somewhat similar FPS patch for Fallout 4 so that it "officially" supports 60 FPS without relying on mods or the enhanced BC of the Series X. This means it will be closer to the One X version while running at 60 FPS framerate.
 
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Feel Like I'm On 42 said:
failure of Microsoft to make good on all the technological features they themselves touted about the Series X?
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Yeah there's been almost zero talk of "and we're using the bla bla bla power of the Series X to bring this amazing experience to life!". Even though the Series X (and S) have fast SSDs (compared to last gen), Sony has decisively won the PR game in that space.

Back on topic - yes.
 
I get the impression that some of you don't really get the difference between CPU and GPU limited games, and why CPU limited games - if they're doing something to justify it - would be the most interesting. They're what interest me, anyway.

avin
 
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I never expected anything else. Starfield is a massive game and Bethesda open world RPGs are not known for their silky smooth performance.
 
supernova8 said:
Yeah there's been almost zero talk of "and we're using the bla bla bla power of the Series X to bring this amazing experience to life!". Even though the Series X (and S) have fast SSDs (compared to last gen), Sony has decisively won the PR game in that space.
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Really? What do you think Quick Resume relies on?

It's probably the most public, most visible thing from the fast SSDs this gen, right behind fast loading times.

supernova8 said:
Sony has decisively won the PR game in that space.
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Hard to make this point when some PS5 exclusives ported over to PC have run comfortably on spinning HDDs.
 
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Knowing how CPU intensive Starfield can get, on account of the many gameplay systems layered on top of each other, and given Bethesda's record, I would really doubt it. The question, however, is whether the title will be polished, with minimal bugs and glitches, and a fluid, consistent framerate...🤔
 
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you can't use Redfall as an indicator for anything, other than that publishers clearly aren't interested in releasing a finished product.

Redfall can and will run at 60fps on Series X and most likely S as well.
what is happening here is that the game will be released unfinished, with not enough polishing time given to get the 60fps mode running at launch.

instead of giving the developers time to properly finish the game, Bethesda opted to release the game in the state that it is, and promise improvements to come later.

Can Starfield run at 60fps on Series X? most definitely...
will Bethesda actually offer an option, and put development time into polishing a 60fps mode?
THAT is the real question... do they care? will they launch in any state the game is in and not delay further?
 
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I would be pretty surprised if they don't have a 60fps mode at release on Series X, given the reaction to Redfall being only 30fps at launch. If I were Bethesda I would put a small team dedicated to figuring it out ASAP if it's not already.

Edit: Given that Starfield seems to lean more heavily into shooting than any of their previous games (Fallout had VATS and Skyrim relies more on melee/stealth/aoe spells) I think of 60fps being more of a necessity in Starfield. It would greatly elevate the feel of the gameplay, if it indeed leans into shooting as much as the gameplay trailer made it seem.
 
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analog_future said:
Starfield has literally nothing to do with Redfall.

That's like asking if, since Returnal renders at 1080p, does that mean that future SIE games are going to render at 1080p.

The answer is no, obviously.



Their trailer from a month ago, which includes in-game footage, was uploaded at 60fps:

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Pretty sure Redfall had 60fps gameplay trailers too
 
Starfield will be 30, with a possible 40fps mode. The game is going to be extremely CPU limited due to their engine. Don't look at the graphics and think it is going to be 60fps because it doesn't look like Forbidden West. Graphical quality is only one factor when it comes to FPS.
 
My approach to this expectation, is to think about it like this:

Has BGS ever released a game in 60 fps?

So, since Morrowind, Oblivion, Skyrim, Fallout 3 and 4, we've never played those in 60 fps on their origin platform. Right?

So then, why is this all of the sudden such a big deal?
And so, do sprawling open-world RPGs such as what BGS makes, where you don't really travel very quickly, and the game is basically slowly wandering around and exploring at your own pace, what is the benefit of 60 fps, other than sacrificing visual fidelity at a high cost?
 
Different teams, engines, and production pipelines lead to different results. However, knowing Bethesda I would go with lower expectations.

So, in short, if you want a guaranteed 60fps+ experience with Starfield at launch, you better have a nice PC.
 
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