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[Son_of_Zardoz]

I'm hoping that by the time I can get one, Sony announces official PC compatibility and at the same time cheering the sales numbers on because I want anybody who's supporting VR to succeed with it.

 

[IntentionalPun]

At week 6 PSVR was hitting peak holiday shopping season.

For PSVR2 it was early April.

Yeah that's a good point.

 

[mckmas8808]

Sold about 50% more than the Bloomberg Playstation hater journo 'leaked', I know others have mentioned the guy, but his failure rate with his inside info needs to be brought up every time!

You mean 100% more right?......

 

[IntentionalPun]

I just realized they are only looking at sales until the end of March?

I'm guessing as it was pointed out, PSVR's 6th week basically being post-black Friday would have had it's sales continuing on strong for the following month.

Still wish they would have showed a comparison, but I get it. Hopefully PSVR2's holiday sales are great.

 

[Romulus]

Retail units are available since pre order in Europe. Media markt and other stores sell is like any other product.

It's not across the board though like psvr1. The US did not get retail units and that's a massive player. I remember seeing months ago the US market share for all video game sales was bigger than UK, Germany, and several other major European countries combined. If I'm not mistaken Canada could have been thrown into that list too. So that's a colossal difference when comparing the two, and i would bet most psvr sales are in the US too.

 

[THE DUCK]

Had PSVR1 released when PSVR2 did you’d have a point. Today’s inflation doesn’t mean yesterday’s price is the same in retrospective.

What? Of course it does. Time value of money matters. $399 is not worth what it was in 2016, it has less value.
To validate your argument you would then be saying the PS1 launched at a value of $299 as of today, when in fact due to the value of money in 1994, it really was about $600 in today's money.
Or lets make it more obvious to you. If you bought a house in 1940 for $100,000, the same house would cost you $2,000,000 today.

 

[mckmas8808]

I just realized they are only looking at sales until the end of March?

I'm guessing as it was pointed out, PSVR's 6th week basically being post-black Friday would have had it's sales continuing on strong for the following month.

Still wish they would have showed a comparison, but I get it. Hopefully PSVR2's holiday sales are great.

What do you mean? They did show a comparison. What other comparison are you looking for?

 

[IntentionalPun]

What do you mean? They did show a comparison. What other comparison are you looking for?

Beyond week 6.

They have the data for several more weeks (around 12?), and they chose not to show it. Likely because understandably, the PSVR numbers start to outpace PSVR2 due to the holiday sales period.

 

[THE DUCK]

600k units with a way more expensive headset, no retail availability for most countries, a lower number of consoles sold and a financial crisis?

Some morons are gonna eat crows today.

Lower consoles, but bigger more exposed VR market, much better product with much better launch lineup/software, should it not have done better? Heck the original was low res, crappy cables everywhere, and nowhere near the experience. No crow to eat, more like the opposite due to sales that appear to only match PSVR1. So much twisting of the facts here for Sony, I mean seriously reaching for whatever was you can twist this into something it is not.
It's still a win, it sold enough to keep it going, the pet project will continue. But this is no raging success to celebrate.
This doesn't mean PSVR2 is bad, or they should stop making games, or stop selling it, I'm hoping for some announcements today.

Put it to you this way, had Sony launched a portable instead of PSVR, do you really think they would have only sold 600k? Pretty easily would have been looking at 2 million on day one.

 

[mckmas8808]

Beyond week 6.

They have the data for several more weeks (around 12?), and they chose not to show it. Likely because understandably, the PSVR numbers start to outpace PSVR2 due to the holiday sales period.

True dat. It wouldn't be a fair comparison anyway. At this point they shouldn't talk about sales until after Black Friday of this year or when they hit 1 million units sold.

Lower consoles, but bigger more exposed VR market, much better product with much better launch lineup/software, should it not have done better? Heck the original was low res, crappy cables everywhere, and nowhere near the experience. No crow to eat, more like the opposite due to sales that appear to only match PSVR1. So much twisting of the facts here for Sony, I mean seriously reaching for whatever was you can twist this into something it is not.
It's still a win, it sold enough to keep it going, the pet project will continue. But this is no raging success to celebrate.
This doesn't mean PSVR2 is bad, or they should stop making games, or stop selling it, I'm hoping for some announcements today.

Put it to you this way, had Sony launched a portable instead of PSVR, do you really think they would have only sold 600k? Pretty easily would have been looking at 2 million on day one.

YES!!!! Why do I say this? The Steam Desk sold about 1.6 million units in all of 2022. Given all the hype and greatness that Steam Deck is.....along with their huge player-base, It's not like it went super crazy in sales. And that's with it being a full PC machine in your hand. Who's to say Sony would have made a PS5 handheld earlier this year. But there's literally NO WAY it would have done 2 million day one.

 

[PanzerCute]

So much twisting of the facts here for Sony, I mean seriously reaching for whatever was you can twist this into something it is not.
It's still a win, it sold enough to keep it going, the pet project will continue. But this is no raging success to celebrate.
This doesn't mean PSVR2 is bad, or they should stop making games, or stop selling it, I'm hoping for some announcements today.

Put it to you this way, had Sony launched a portable instead of PSVR, do you really think they would have only sold 600k? Pretty easily would have been looking at 2 million on day one.

How am I twisting things? Psvr2 was not available at retail during these 6 weeks for all main markets, thats a fact.

Psvr2 is way more expensive than psvr1, thats also a fact.

We face a big economical crisis, that is also a fact.

There were more PS4 sold than PS5s when the PSVR1 released, also a fact.

So please, what am I twisting here? And when did I say that it was a huge success?

The only thing I see twisted here is what I said in my post, sorry.

Have a nice day, though.

 

[Guntherlibby]

The biggest thing going against PSVR2 is the fact that you can't watch porn on it.

 

[THE DUCK]

True dat. It wouldn't be a fair comparison anyway. At this point they shouldn't talk about sales until after Black Friday of this year or when they hit 1 million units sold.



YES!!!! Why do I say this? The Steam Desk sold about 1.6 million units in all of 2022. Given all the hype and greatness that Steam Deck is.....along with their huge player-base, It's not like it went super crazy in sales. And that's with it being a full PC machine in your hand. Who's to say Sony would have made a PS5 handheld earlier this year. But there's literally NO WAY it would have done 2 million day one.

A direct sold PC centric mobile device at a higher price with unfinished software is the benchmark for a fully supported Sony portable? I don't think so. Steam deck wasn't in stores, doesn't have any exclusive software, and it was barely advertised, and it doesn't have the same broad appeal to gamers. Easily 2 million in a day.

 

[Salty Popsicle]

Looking at the unit sales graph provided by Sony, it looks like the PSVR 2 line is plateauing much more quickly than the PSVR1 line and will soon intersect. Definitely not a good sign.

 

[THE DUCK]

How am I twisting things? Psvr2 was not available at retail during these 6 weeks for all main markets, thats a fact.

Psvr2 is way more expensive than psvr1, thats also a fact.

We face a big economical crisis, that is also a fact.

There were more PS4 sold than PS5s when the PSVR1 released, also a fact.

So please, what am I twisting here? And when did I say that it was a huge success?

The only thing I see twisted here is what I said in my post, sorry.

Have a nice day, though.

PSVR2 being more expensive is not a fact. PSRV2 was cheaper if you want motion controllers (gee sort of important for VR gaming) and adjust for inflation. (you are saying we are in economic crisis, right, doesn't inflation matter then?)

All main markets? Please list them all and if it was available at retail or not.

Economic crisis is coming, but by all accounts has barely begun. Unemployment is still at very low levels. People are somehow still buying PS5's.

More PS4 sold part is true. (it's the only thing you have right) But conveniently don't seem to care that the VR market is larger and sales are still flat.

Saying that many will have to "morons will have to eat crow today" clearly indicates you think it was a huge success.

 

[Romulus]

I think inflation is a bad argument when looking at a successor this close. The psvr1 was being sold at $300-ish when it was selling its best in 2016-2018. A $600 psvr2 a few years later is a difficult pill to swallow for typical buyer.

It makes no sense that the typical consumer that paid $300-400 for psvr1 is walking into retail and seeing a $600 tag a few years later and saying, "ah I'm good, $600 is really just $300 in 2018 money, lemme get that." Or whatever the inflation rate is.

I could understand if psvr1 launched in 2005 or so, most people would make the inflation distinction, but when brand new consoles are still being launched at $400, no.

 

[mckmas8808]

A direct sold PC centric mobile device at a higher price with unfinished software is the benchmark for a fully supported Sony portable? I don't think so. Steam deck wasn't in stores, doesn't have any exclusive software, and it was barely advertised, and it doesn't have the same broad appeal to gamers. Easily 2 million in a day.

PSVR2 wasn't in stores either! And it was barely advertised. That's our point. Plus.......


The PS Vita sold 1.2 million units in 2.5 months. How could a PS Steam Deck sell 2 million in a day?

Sony: 1.2 million PlayStation Vita units sold worldwide

The company says total software sales for the video game handheld have reached 2 million units at both retail and on its PlayStation Network.

www.cnet.com

 

[Rodolink]

damn i kinda hoped this to not sell well due to the price, costs almost same than the damn console

 

[PanzerCute]

PSVR2 being more expensive is not a fact. PSRV2 was cheaper if you want motion controllers (gee sort of important for VR gaming) and adjust for inflation. (you are saying we are in economic crisis, right, doesn't inflation matter then?)

All main markets? Please list them all and if it was available at retail or not.

Economic crisis is coming, but by all accounts has barely begun. Unemployment is still at very low levels. People are somehow still buying PS5's.

More PS4 sold part is true. (it's the only thing you have right) But conveniently don't seem to care that the VR market is larger and sales are still flat.

Saying that many will have to "morons will have to eat crow today" clearly indicates you think it was a huge success.

I really dont want to argue with your weak reasoning, and I wont waste my time talking with someone who interpret everything I say.

Cheers man.

 

[THE DUCK]

PSVR2 wasn't in stores either! And it was barely advertised. That's our point. Plus.......


The PS Vita sold 1.2 million units in 2.5 months. How could a PS Steam Deck sell 2 million in a day?

Sony: 1.2 million PlayStation Vita units sold worldwide

The company says total software sales for the video game handheld have reached 2 million units at both retail and on its PlayStation Network.

www.cnet.com

It's a peripheral for a small market that had direct marking to everyone who has a PS5, even right on their PS5, not the same thing at all vs a regular console launch.
PS Vita is hardly the benchmark for everything that is great about handheld gaming, it had tons of things wrong with it's launch. You really think Sony would screw up a handheld launch that badly again?

 

[THE DUCK]

I really dont want to argue with your weak reasoning, and I wont waste my time talking with someone who interpret everything I say.

Cheers man.

Understood, you have no logical argument for what has been said in response, so by all means, run away.

 

[DeepEnigma]

• More expensive, even during a recession/inflation time.
• Released outside the traditional non-Holiday season.
• Only was available up until last week on Sony's Direct online store.
• Only counted to the end of March.

There is no negative to the 8%, at all.

 

[DenchDeckard]

Looking at the unit sales graph provided by Sony, it looks like the PSVR 2 line is plateauing much more quickly than the PSVR1 line and will soon intersect. Definitely not a good sign.

This is what I noticed. A large burst of sales at first which is inline with the explosive demand of ps5 but the line is platueing and if continued, psvr 1 will overtake it.

 

[Ogbert]

Hottest of takes.

And?

It’s a niche product that won’t sell especially well, but it’s good to see one of the main platforms try and develop it.

 

[DeepEnigma]

And?

It’s a niche product that won’t sell especially well, but it’s good to see one of the main platforms try and develop it.

I was being a smartass because it's a captain obvious statement, is all.

 

[Ogbert]

I was being a smartass because it's a captain obvious statement, is all.

Hottest of takes then.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Looking at the unit sales graph provided by Sony, it looks like the PSVR 2 line is plateauing much more quickly than the PSVR1 line and will soon intersect. Definitely not a good sign.

This is what I noticed. A large burst of sales at first which is inline with the explosive demand of ps5 but the line is platueing and if continued, psvr 1 will overtake it.

That is due to the line being pre-retail chain (and Holiday) release timeframe.

In that timeframe, this context matters,

• More expensive, even during a recession/inflation time.
• Released outside the traditional non-Holiday season.
• Only was available up until last week on Sony's Direct online store.
• Only counted to the end of March.

There is no negative to the 8%, at all.

 

[bitbydeath]

What? Of course it does. Time value of money matters. $399 is not worth what it was in 2016, it has less value.
To validate your argument you would then be saying the PS1 launched at a value of $299 as of today, when in fact due to the value of money in 1994, it really was about $600 in today's money.
Or lets make it more obvious to you. If you bought a house in 1940 for $100,000, the same house would cost you $2,000,000 today.

That time of value doesn’t exist back when Psvr1 released vs Psvr2, you got it backwards.

Let’s take a housing example, back in the 70’s houses cost $20-50k and could be payed off within a year back then, along came inflation and we’re now paying 800k and it now takes 30 years to pay off a house instead of just 1.

You can say Psvr2 cost the same as psvr1 due to today’s inflation, but psvr1 most certainly did not cost the same as psvr2 before inflation, (back when it launched).

 

[mckmas8808]

It's a peripheral for a small market that had direct marking to everyone who has a PS5, even right on their PS5, not the same thing at all vs a regular console launch.
PS Vita is hardly the benchmark for everything that is great about handheld gaming, it had tons of things wrong with it's launch. You really think Sony would screw up a handheld launch that badly again?

 

[THE DUCK]

That time of value doesn’t exist back when Psvr1 released vs Psvr2, you got it backwards.

Let’s take a housing example, back in the 70’s houses cost $20-50k and could be payed off within a year back then, along came inflation and we’re now paying 800k and it now takes 30 years to pay off a house instead of just 1.

You can say Psvr2 cost the same as psvr1 due to today’s inflation, but psvr1 most certainly did not cost the same as psvr2 before inflation, (back when it launched).

I think you are confused. If you had a 50K house in the 70's, you were paid far less. Ergo, you could not pay off your house in a year. The money had more value.

Don't believe me....... lets look at PSVR1 - $399

Calculate the Value of $399 in 2016. How much is it worth today?

www.dollartimes.com

$399 in 2016 → 2025 | Inflation Calculator

The 3.16% inflation rate means $399 in 2016 is equivalent to $528.11 today. This inflation calculator uses the official US consumer price index published by the Department of Labor.

www.officialdata.org

data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=399.00&year1=201601&year2=202302

Equivalent cost today is $500, and that's without the motion controllers, which you really need to properly play VR, so add another $50-75. So like I said, basically the same price as PSVR2. This is fact, not conjecture.

 

[Deerock71]

8% more in the same timeframe?

 

[bitbydeath]

I think you are confused. If you had a 50K house in the 70's, you were paid far less. Ergo, you could not pay off your house in a year. The money had more value.

Don't believe me....... lets look at PSVR1 - $399

Calculate the Value of $399 in 2016. How much is it worth today?

www.dollartimes.com

$399 in 2016 → 2025 | Inflation Calculator

The 3.16% inflation rate means $399 in 2016 is equivalent to $528.11 today. This inflation calculator uses the official US consumer price index published by the Department of Labor.

www.officialdata.org

data.bls.gov/cgi-bin/cpicalc.pl?cost1=399.00&year1=201601&year2=202302

Equivalent cost today is $500, and that's without the motion controllers, which you really need to properly play VR, so add another $50-75. So like I said, basically the same price as PSVR2. This is fact, not conjecture.

You were paid less but not far less, and I don’t know how old you are but houses could be paid off in a year back then. The money you earn doesn’t increase due to inflation, only what you buy.

 

[Sleepwalker]

A direct sold PC centric mobile device at a higher price with unfinished software is the benchmark for a fully supported Sony portable? I don't think so. Steam deck wasn't in stores, doesn't have any exclusive software, and it was barely advertised, and it doesn't have the same broad appeal to gamers. Easily 2 million in a day.

The benchmark for a fully supported Sony handheld is the PS Vita which did 1.4m in its launch window and 4m around the year mark. After that they stopped reporting numbers.

No chance it does 2 million in a day, specially after burning all the vita buyers.

 

[Romulus]

The handheld argument is also bad when comparing sales. You wouldn't be required to own a ps5 to purchase a ps vita 2.

 

[Noxxera]

I legit fucking hate Sony/Playstation regarding VR. That's right, their VR support in youtube is fucking garbage on PS4/VR1. If I'm lucky I can watch a VR video in 1080p for 1 min, rest of the times it freezes or lags as soon I start it. This is a new issue, it wasn't there 2 years or whatever ago when I bought the VR headset for the first time. They should fucking remove Youtube VR on PS4 if it doesn't work.

 

[Max_Po]

PSVR2 is

extremely comfortable and easier to use than PSVR

I am playing Horizon with my daughter.

 

[SportsFan581]

The lines looking like they are going to converge in a couple weeks I'm sure aren't exciting Sony or it's investors too much.

That's what I was thinking. The trend doesn't look long-term favorable at all. Though getting the units in stores could help things.

 

[SaintALia]

Seems a bit low no? I figured PSVR1 expanded the market for VR. Maybe we need an 'all platform VR device', with a publisher consisting supporting the platform with software.

Or maybe just variety of software being the issue and the same VR people are buying with slow expansion?

 

[Noxxera]

Seems a bit low no? I figured PSVR1 expanded the market for VR. Maybe we need an 'all platform VR device', with a publisher consisting supporting the platform with software.

Or maybe just variety of software being the issue and the same VR people are buying with slow expansion?

Dunno I dont see it as low or high, VR haven't quite taken off yet on consoles at least, but yeah PlayStation is the way to go if you wanna do VR. Biggest hurdle for x amount of units sold is the pricing, I can guarantee it's too high.

 

[THE DUCK]

You were paid less but not far less, and I don’t know how old you are but houses could be paid off in a year back then. The money you earn doesn’t increase due to inflation, only what you buy.

Not true, typically wages follow in line with inflation (there is a delay and there are some exceptions, but it's there, and it's factual), otherwise over time the workforce would be paid far less for the same work. I'm not making this up, check on wages vs inflation.

 

[THE DUCK]

So here's the thing, why a new PS portable would be different than the VITA, below is a list of things that differ vs the Vita launch:

- It will be dual purpose - hooks to a TV easily and is also a home console
- It will have third party support
- Similar architecture to home consoles, much easier to develop for and will have hundreds more quality games than vita
- It will actually be supported and have multiple Sony AAA games from day one, including day and date 1st party titles from PS5
- Doesn't require an expensive memory cards
- Much better form fact, bigger screen, far nicer to actually use
- Full backwards compatibility with prior generation (very likely could run PS4 games)
- Demand is higher for handheld gaming in general (Switch has proven this)
- Sony is even more entrenched as the long term market leader

You can't honestly say a PS portable that launches with Ratchet and Clank a Rift in Time, GT7, GOW Rognarok, Horizon Forbidden west, Demon souls, etc would sell as much as the crappy hand cramping, under supported, and overpriced memory card Vita?
It's a completely different ball game.

 

[THE DUCK]

The benchmark for a fully supported Sony handheld is the PS Vita which did 1.4m in its launch window and 4m around the year mark. After that they stopped reporting numbers.

No chance it does 2 million in a day, specially after burning all the vita buyers.

See my post to mckmas8808 just before this one. 2 Million is conservative. Vita had tons wrong with it that would not be repeated.

 

[bitbydeath]

Not true, typically wages follow in line with inflation (there is a delay and there are some exceptions, but it's there, and it's factual), otherwise over time the workforce would be paid far less for the same work. I'm not making this up, check on wages vs inflation.

It’d be great if it worked that way but it doesn’t. People can go 10+ years without a pay rise while inflation marches on.

We have a ton of history to draw on that goes against your view.

And further damning, back in the 70’s when it only took a years salary to fully out-right own a house, that was also just one person’s salary, people made enough money that only one person was required to work.

 

[THE DUCK]

It’d be great if it worked that way but it doesn’t. People can go 10+ years without a pay rise while inflation marches on.

We have a ton of history to draw on that goes against your view.

And further damning, back in the 70’s when it only took a years salary to fully out-right own a house, that was also just one person’s salary, people made enough money that only one person was required to work.

Your wrong, track income vs inflation and they are almost always within 2 to 5% of each other. There may be the odd industry or area or bad economic period with no raises, but on the average, it always goes up with inflation.
Even just look at the past 3 years, you will note the blue graph for wages goes up with inflation.

Wage growth vs inflation U.S. 2024 | Statista

The rate of inflation overtook the growth of wages in April 2021. High rates of inflation means that consumers are seeing a decrease in purchasing power

www.statista.com

Note what is said here:
"And during the high-inflation years of the 1970s and early 1980s, average wages commonly jumped 7%, 8% or even 9% year-over-year."

For most U.S. workers, real wages have barely budged in decades

Despite some ups and downs over the past several decades, today's real average wage in the U.S. has about the same purchasing power it did 40 years ago. And most of what wage gains there have been have flowed to the highest-paid tier of workers.

www.pewresearch.org

None of this matches with the idea that wage growth is stagnant during times inflation, in fact it accelerates to keep up.

Also, so in this one person's house, where they made an average income in the USA of $8,730 in 1970, and only one person was working since people made enough, you think people were just paying off their $50,000 house?

 

[bitbydeath]

Your wrong, track income vs inflation and they are almost always within 2 to 5% of each other. There may be the odd industry or area or bad economic period with no raises, but on the average, it always goes up with inflation.
Even just look at the past 3 years, you will note the blue graph for wages goes up with inflation.

Wage growth vs inflation U.S. 2024 | Statista

The rate of inflation overtook the growth of wages in April 2021. High rates of inflation means that consumers are seeing a decrease in purchasing power

www.statista.com

Note what is said here:
"And during the high-inflation years of the 1970s and early 1980s, average wages commonly jumped 7%, 8% or even 9% year-over-year."

For most U.S. workers, real wages have barely budged in decades

Despite some ups and downs over the past several decades, today's real average wage in the U.S. has about the same purchasing power it did 40 years ago. And most of what wage gains there have been have flowed to the highest-paid tier of workers.

www.pewresearch.org

None of this matches with the idea that wage growth is stagnant during times inflation, in fact it accelerates to keep up.

Also, so in this one person's house, where they made an average income in the USA of $8,730 in 1970, and only one person was working since people made enough, you think people were just paying off their $50,000 house?

US was under 20K.

Here's how much the median home value in the U.S. has changed between 1940 and 2000:

• 1940: $2,938
• 1950: $7,354
• 1960: $11,900
• 1970: $17,000
• 1980: $47,200
• 1990: $79,100
• 2000: $119,600

Here’s how much housing prices have skyrocketed over the last 50 years

In 1940, the median home price in the U.S. was less than $3,000.

www.cnbc.com

 

[THE DUCK]

US was under 20K.

Here’s how much housing prices have skyrocketed over the last 50 years

In 1940, the median home price in the U.S. was less than $3,000.

www.cnbc.com

Follow along, average income, not house price. Still haven't explained to me how this $8,730 single income house manages to pay off it's $17,000 house in a year.

Your average housing pricing link does nothing to change that fact that wages have increased with inflation, which you claimed doesn't occur.

 

[SRTtoZ]

I was gonna say that's not really GREAT but considering they did this without even launching in stores is kinda HUGE. Now that it's hitting retail shelves it's going to sell even more. We'll see in the next 6-12 months how it really shakes out but Sony should be really happy with how its going. Just keep the games coming and the hardware will sell itself. This holiday season SHOULD be huge.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

Let's not stoop down to using Vgchartz lads.

I think people are rounding the line chart because looking at the PDF the line chart looks like it's below the 600,000 line. PS VR2 (Sony writes it this way officially) data regardless isn't very helpful here because Sony stops the chart at week 6, so we don't have any idea what the trajectory is.

Basically it boils down to how you answer this question, do you think Sony can sell another 1.41m PS VR2 by July? That's what they would need to sell by that time in order to still be ahead of the original aligned.

 

[ABnormal]

Let's not stoop down to using Vgchartz lads.

I think people are rounding the line chart because looking at the PDF the line chart looks like it's below the 600,000 line. PS VR2 (Sony writes it this way officially) data regardless isn't very helpful here because Sony stops the chart at week 6, so we don't have any idea what the trajectory is.

Basically it boils down to how you answer this question, do you think Sony can sell another 1.41m PS VR2 by July? That's what they would need to sell by that time in order to still be ahead of the original aligned.

What? Didn't the first one take one year to sell the first million?

 

[Draxon Gamer]

What? Didn't the first one take one year to sell the first million?

The first one from launch until feb 20th 2017 sold 915,000. Through Nov 2017 ending Dec 3rd Sony announced 2m were sold.