Colin Moriarty: Concord cost 400M. Was viewed as the future of PS.

"The Future of PlayStation"

Money is just money and can be recouped. The above view is the most damaging portion there. How can these executives have such a dim pulse of things? Who is assessing these types of games lol?
 
Besides the development time, you could tell by the quality of the cinematics, cartoon shorts and amount of marketing (I had daily Concord adverts on YT and Twitch) this was a serious project. This is also why I'm not buying 'but nobody knew about the game'.

Some of the costs that were thrown around like $100 M seemed a bit low to me. I thought it'd at least be $250 M, but honestly didn't expect $400 M.
 
Punished Miku said:
Can't even come up with a good insult. The reality is already beyond parody.
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After laughing at the failure for a few weeks there's only so much left to say.

If anything I think paves the way for a more positive future for PlayStation. A mega loss like this leads to big strategic changes.
 
9mWXKFo.jpeg
 
Haint said:
I would err towards he misheard or is misinterpreting what he was told. $400 million all inclusive, which would include buying the studio, is very plausible if not very likely. $400 million on raw development, NOT including buying the studio, is very hard to believe. I don't want to say impossible cause they did spend $150 million on 4 hour DLC that reused every asset within (Miles Morales).
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He made it very clear that the $400m does not include the acquisition cost. It does however, include costs associated with the game prior to Sony's acquisition, mostly from outside investors. So Sony is on the hook for roughly $200m of the $400m.
 
We need a movie or a miniseries on this game and its failure. I'm sure they can get Zach Galifianakis to be the Professor, and Jason Schwartzman to be Hulst.
 
Haint said:
I would err towards he misheard or is misinterpreting what he was told. $400 million all inclusive, which would include buying the studio, is very plausible if not very likely. $400 million on raw development, NOT including buying the studio, is very hard to believe. I don't want to say impossible cause they did spend $150 million on 4 hour DLC that reused every asset within (Miles Morales).
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He was a journalist for IGN for many years who has done this before. He said he was rock solid on this info and discussed it with his source "extensively." You may think he is a retard who can't comprehend English but he said what he said. FWIW I think he's been reliable over the years.
 
Ugh now news sources are running with it, can we verify sources and get actual evidence instead of clickbait BS, i trust Del more than i trust Colin
 
Herbspiceguy said:
Besides the development time, you could tell by the quality of the cinematics, cartoon shorts and amount of marketing (I had daily Concord adverts on YT and Twitch) this was a serious project. This is also why I'm not buying 'but nobody knew about the game'.

Some of the costs that were thrown around like $100 M seemed a bit low to me. I thought it'd at least be $250 M, but honestly didn't expect $400 M.
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I think it's because all that marketing was condensed into a couple months.

There was that snazzy CGI trailer a year ago. Then the next promo was May State of Play 3 months from release. Then maybe a month or two from release you got more info, beta, some cinematic clips I think, Concord gamepad etc....) all jammed in tight.

If someone was a casual gamer not keeping up in July or August, you probably didnt notice any of it.

I think they had enough markeing material. But the timing was off. They should had been drip feeding gamers info the past 12 months since the CGI video.
 
EviLore said:
Everyone quoting salaries x years of development should reconsider their estimates.

Let's say you have a software development team with median salary of $150k/year. In the US at a white collar establishment, the company is paying substantial additional costs out of pocket. Health care/dental/vision insurance is mostly covered by the employer. 401k matching contributions. Contributions for continuing education. Office space and other overhead.

A typical rule of thumb in places like California is to double the employee's salary to estimate the actual cost of the employee to the company. That $150k is more like $300k.
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There are other costs: renting office space, furniture, power/water bills, computer equipment, servers, cleaning, catering ...
 
Interesting if it ends up true.
"Viewed as the future of PS" is more damning than the cost. This game didn't underperform, it straight up failed to find an audience at all
 
tmlDan said:
Ugh now news sources are running with it, can we verify sources and get actual evidence instead of clickbait BS, i trust Del more than i trust Colin
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why didn't those sites do the reporting on it? Oh because they need to suck up to Sony to stay in business.
 
EviLore said:
Everyone quoting salaries x years of development should reconsider their estimates.

Let's say you have a software development team with median salary of $150k/year. In the US at a white collar establishment, the company is paying substantial additional costs out of pocket. Health care/dental/vision insurance is mostly covered by the employer. 401k matching contributions. Contributions for continuing education. Office space and other overhead.

A typical rule of thumb in places like California is to double the employee's salary to estimate the actual cost of the employee to the company. That $150k is more like $300k.
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Yes, but thats always been the case though. We have numbers from Sony's Los Angeles based studios back in the late 2000s and early 2010s. We have numbers from Amsterdam based studios as early as 2017 for way bigger than studios than this new 150 person studio.

Lets say the costs have doubled since thanks to inflation and covid. Ok so $100 million makes sense. Say they have quadrupled. Thats $200 million. But $400 million?

If it costs $400 million to make one pvp game with 150 devs over the course of say 7 years then that would mean Rockstar with their 3,000 devs all making one game for the last 7 years would cost $8 billion. GTA6 is likely $1-2 billion but no one not even rockstar can justify spending $8 billion on one game.
 
SlimySnake said:
Yes, but thats always been the case though. We have numbers from Sony's Los Angeles based studios back in the late 2000s and early 2010s. We have numbers from Amsterdam based studios as early as 2017 for way bigger than studios than this new 150 person studio.

Lets say the costs have doubled since thanks to inflation and covid. Ok so $100 million makes sense. Say they have quadrupled. Thats $200 million. But $400 million?

If it costs $400 million to make one pvp game with 150 devs over the course of say 7 years then that would mean Rockstar with their 3,000 devs all making one game for the last 7 years would cost $8 billion. GTA6 is likely $1-2 billion but no one not even rockstar can justify spending $8 billion on one game.
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It's not 150 people, holy shit, why do people keep saying this

www.mobygames.com

Concord credits (PlayStation 5, 2024) - MobyGames

The official game credits for Concord released on PlayStation 5 in 2024. The credits include 1,982 people.
www.mobygames.com www.mobygames.com
 
I have not read any posts in detail. I just want to say. Holy Shit. I will do my part to fix this by buying a PS5 Pro next week and also maybe a LE too.
 
If you find the 400 million number hard to swallow with the "only 150 employees" narrative, the credits list 1,972 professional credits.
Voice actors, localization, quality assurance and quite a few outsourcing studios listed like Little Red Zombies, WETA Workshop, Pipework Studios, Lakshya Studios, Red Hot CG, Glass Egg. There a ton of them and even Nixxes is listed. People are credited for working on a PVE mode.

Goodbye Kansas Studios AB are curiously not listed, the Swedish studio that created the cinematic CG for the game. They make CG for EVERYTHING. By the looks of it, they might have scrubbed their homepage of Concord references. Linkdin & Facebook posts are still there. This is quite the rabbit hole, found artstation posts where artists show assets used in the trailer and they are not featured in the credits. But they are listed as a partner studio in Helldivers 2's credits.

www.mobygames.com

Concord credits (PlayStation 5, 2024) - MobyGames

The official game credits for Concord released on PlayStation 5 in 2024. The credits include 1,982 people.
www.mobygames.com www.mobygames.com
 
diffusionx said:
He was a journalist for IGN for many years who has done this before. He said he was rock solid on this info and discussed it with his source "extensively." You may think he is a retard who can't comprehend English but he said what he said. FWIW I think he's been reliable over the years.
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A total all inclusive spend of somewhere between $700 million and $1 Billion+ for this shit is unfathomable and would genuinely represent criminal levels of incompetence. As in actionable lawsuits from shareholders that would actually move forward and not get dismissed outright.
 
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Holy shit even gaf underestimated this disaster. Where did the money even go? Concord didn't even look like an expensive bad game.
 
proandrad said:
Holy shit even gaf underestimated this disaster. Where did the money even go? Concord didn't even look like an expensive bad game.
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in the video he says a big part of it was due to last minute outsourcing to multiple studios to rush the game to the finish line as it was barely even a functional game when Sony bought the studio
 
Tears of the Kingdom costed around 100 Million including marketing, to put this on perspective…. But i take every info that comes from Colin like is a rumor.. He likes drama A LOT.
 
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tmlDan said:
i cant answer that, but instead of using Colin for clickbait they should do better, definitely
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I've listened to a few of Colin's podcasts in the past, and he isn't the sort of character to make shit up or spew hyperbole statements to farm attention. I can only speak for myself but I trust what he says here. If anything he's source might be lying but he vouched for them. At the end of the day, it is a rumour and not a statement of fact.
 
Holammer said:
If you find the 400 million number hard to swallow with the "only 150 employees" narrative, the credits list 1,972 professional credits.
Voice actors, localization, quality assurance and quite a few outsourcing studios listed like Little Red Zombies, WETA Workshop, Pipework Studios, Lakshya Studios, Red Hot CG, Glass Egg. There a ton of them and even Nixxes is listed. People are credited for working on a PVE mode.

Goodbye Kansas Studios AB are curiously not listed, the Swedish studio that created the cinematic CG for the game. They make CG for EVERYTHING. By the looks of it, they might have scrubbed their homepage of Concord references. Linkdin & Facebook posts are still there. This is quite the rabbit hole, found artstation posts where artists show assets used in the trailer and they are not featured in the credits. But they are listed as a partner studio in Helldivers 2's credits.

www.mobygames.com

Concord credits (PlayStation 5, 2024) - MobyGames

The official game credits for Concord released on PlayStation 5 in 2024. The credits include 1,982 people.
www.mobygames.com www.mobygames.com
Click to expand...
Cyberpunk 2077 has 3,185 professional credits and over the 11 years of developing the game and expansion and marketing both they spent $440 million.
 
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SlimySnake said:
Yes, but thats always been the case though. We have numbers from Sony's Los Angeles based studios back in the late 2000s and early 2010s. We have numbers from Amsterdam based studios as early as 2017 for way bigger than studios than this new 150 person studio.

Lets say the costs have doubled since thanks to inflation and covid. Ok so $100 million makes sense. Say they have quadrupled. Thats $200 million. But $400 million?

If it costs $400 million to make one pvp game with 150 devs over the course of say 7 years then that would mean Rockstar with their 3,000 devs all making one game for the last 7 years would cost $8 billion. GTA6 is likely $1-2 billion but no one not even rockstar can justify spending $8 billion on one game.
Click to expand...

Yes, but this game clearly did not have a "normal" dev cycle. The reporting was that the game was in a terrible state and Sony had to outsource the work to outside studios just to get it to a playable state, all at the same still paying all the employees at Firewalk. Also, this is a brand new studio. So it's very plausible that they were just burning through cash as "startup" costs while doing next to nothing when it comes to actual game development.
 
DonkeyPunchJr said:
I just watched the video and holy fuck, this is so much worse than we thought if true.

- already cost $200m by the time it reached alpha stage and was in atrocious state at that time

- required another $200m to get it to MVP (minimum viable product) state

- the $400M figure doesn't even include the cost of buying the studio

- the most expensive first/second party game Sony has ever made

- this was Herman Hulst's baby and nobody was allowed to criticize it

- only made $1m revenue before they had to refund it and give it all back

- biggest loss Sony has ever suffered on a project
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If Hermen is by chance lurking on/reading GAF:

that-hilarious-jack-nicholson.gif
 
zapper said:
normally one feels bad if someone's work is mocked/criticized, but IF you're so stupid to say these things...

I think there's nothing to save here sadly.


a question: did Sony pay for all these millions? They were acquired long after development had begun
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So I guess how much $ Sony is responsible for is unclear... but if there is any truth to this figure, it sounds like the cost of making Concord was $400 million. I am wondering if that is too much money for a game like it was? Did Overwatch cost less?
 
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near said:
I've listened to a few of Colin's podcasts in the past, and he isn't the sort of character to make shit up or spew hyperbole statements to farm attention. I can only speak for myself but I trust what he says here. If anything he's source might be lying but he vouched for them. At the end of the day, it is a rumour and not a statement of fact.
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oh im not blaming Colin on this, I guess he didn't have to share that cost, but his source was definitely not clear on the financials they just seem to be throwing out numbers but now reporters are using that as headlines without looking into it themselves
 
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