Colin Moriarty: Concord cost 400M. Was viewed as the future of PS.

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Even arrogant sony from ps3 era was better than this. Japan should transform overseas sony into a glorified localisation subsidiary, just like nintendo does with noa.
 
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I remember the fanboys were pissed a couple of years ago when I was criticizing this new loser management and wanted to get back the ps4 dreamteam. It needed clown world level 10000 to see what was obvious from the get go
 
Kaiserstark said:
One developer said that in 2019, there were 12 of them working on the game. The number had to gradually increase until it reached 160 for them to enter full production for about two years as is the norm.

It's pretty hard to believe that such a game could cost 400 million.
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Sony probably had everybody under their umbrella charging to this project for the past couple years.
 
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PlayerNumber0ne said:
Doesnt HD2 have mtx?
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Yes, they have permanently available (so no FOMO) battle passes, added each month, that are quite reasonably priced. You buy them with in game currency, which can be earned through play, or bought in packs….each day there's also 3 or 4 rotating premium items that can be purchased with the same currency. If you don't buy any of those then you can likely buy the battle pass just with what you earn from play. I enjoyed the game, and the prices felt perfectly fair, so it's a very rare occasion I've bought stuff, nothing felt predatory, but they likely made decent revenue outside of the initial £40 price tag
 
Kaiserstark said:
One developer said that in 2019, there were 12 of them working on the game. The number had to gradually increase until it reached 160 for them to enter full production for about two years as is the norm.

It's pretty hard to believe that such a game could cost 400 million.
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My honest opinion reading between the lines is that there is/was a talent issue and also a period of time where the game was essentially redeveloped, as well as overspend on salaries when the investment was rolling in given the 'calibre' of veterans.

If the timeline is right then it meant the original game would have to have started life as an UE4 game. UE5 wasn't on GA until 2022 so I imagine porting was required.

Add to that the fact ICE are usually Sony centric and most of the talent use custom engines across Sony and you get a lack of support. Now they are insanely talented people across SIE so I'm guessing a few could get up to speed quickly.

They initially raised $18 million investment seeds via ProbabkyMonsters: https://venturebeat.com/business/ex...s-18-8-million-for-two-triple-a-game-studios/

Enough to draw salaries and pay people while a second round of investment was run to the tune of $200million: https://www.gamesindustry.biz/proba...00m-to-make-games-with-a-people-first-culture

Then a final round of investment of a further $50million: https://www.gamesindustry.biz/probably-monsters-raises-usd200m-in-series-a

We know Cauldrons game was cancelled about 18 months ago, and I don't think the final studio even showed what they were doing. I think Concord basically swallowed all three studio's and they couldn't see it failing because they needed it to succeed so badly. Why the fuck Sony bought them as late as they did I have no idea.
 
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Saturn Dragon said:
. Killzone IV
. Resistance Fall of Aliens
. Uncharted V: Drake and Sully witty adventure
. God of War: Osiris
. B2oodborne
. Day2 Gone: Zombie-nado
. Infamous III: Triple power
. Ghost of Tsushima II: Double Dragon
. The Order 1866: Vampire Stalker
. Guardian of the Colossus (Roku-ico)
. The Last Shadow (go-ico)
. Astrobot in Knack World
. Astrobot's Time Machine
. Astrobot is missing

There you go Sony. You better not fuck it up.
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God Of War Egypt, Ghost of Tsushima 2 and Bloodborne 2 is all that is needed from this list; and would sell gangbusters.
 
There is simply no way this game cost 400Mil to make. They must be including the cost of buying Firewalk Studio, their offices, hair dye, etc.

But if they did, I don't blame the people working on the game. If someone's willing to pay you that much to put out something like that, good on you for finding a patsy. However, anybody who signed off on this project or was in charge of it should be a run out of the business.
 
It supposedly does not include the price to buy the studio.

I'd think that as long as we see games that cost $400M, we're going to occasionally see games that lose damn near $400M.

It's the cost of doing business.
 
No one with any sense of objectivity believes this.

Firewak was founded in 2018, just 6 years ago. Assume for a second that the game has been in development the entire time, which we know it wasn't, that's 400 million dollars over 6 years, with a studio smaller than Sucker Punch.

Even if the studio was 200 people, the average cost per developer would be 333K dollars per year... this is simply not true.

This is Colin either trumping up a story or believing someone's trumped up statements because they're mad at the studio. And it certainly sounds like one or the other.

For a game that Sony thought would be their next star wars, they never really advertised it. We got a single teaser a year ago and we didn't get a gameplay trailer until 3 months ago. That's not what you do with a game that you think is going to be the future of your brand.

This game is a failure, but we don't need to lie about the framework of that failure.

I also don't believe several Sony studios had their hand in the development of the game. You can see who worked on it in the games credits. Many of which are customary accreditations.

So it seems that people continue to try and take things that have a grain of truth and sprinkle in lies or hyperbole so that it sticks to the truth.
 
So if a bunch of budget was spent on making the game playable via outsourcing, that pretty much means everyone at firewalk is worthless.
 
Mibu no ookami said:
No one with any sense of objectivity believes this.

Firewak was founded in 2018, just 6 years ago. Assume for a second that the game has been in development the entire time, which we know it wasn't, that's 400 million dollars over 6 years, with a studio smaller than Sucker Punch.

Even if the studio was 200 people, the average cost per developer would be 333K dollars per year... this is simply not true.

This is Colin either trumping up a story or believing someone's trumped up statements because they're mad at the studio. And it certainly sounds like one or the other.

For a game that Sony thought would be their next star wars, they never really advertised it. We got a single teaser a year ago and we didn't get a gameplay trailer until 3 months ago. That's not what you do with a game that you think is going to be the future of your brand.

This game is a failure, but we don't need to lie about the framework of that failure.

I also don't believe several Sony studios had their hand in the development of the game. You can see who worked on it in the games credits. Many of which are customary accreditations.

So it seems that people continue to try and take things that have a grain of truth and sprinkle in lies or hyperbole so that it sticks to the truth.
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i believe this game cost a shit ton of dollar which ever way we cut it.
 
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Wouldn't be surprised if this is why PS5 Pro is $699 without a disc drive rather than $649 with one.

That extra markup we're seeing will probably cover that $400m in a couple years.
 
Audiophile said:
Wouldn't be surprised if this is why PS5 Pro is $699 without a disc drive rather than $649 with one.

That extra markup we're seeing will probably cover that $400m in a couple years.
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Oh by the way that little stand is an extra $30.

That alone is almost the same as Concord's launch price.
 
kruis said:
It's not about the story making sense, but the numbers not adding up. I find the $400 million budget hard too believe too considering the fact that bigger Sony studios working on far more ambitious games had $200 million budgets that were already deemed extravagant because of the required sales numbers just to break even.

Spider-Man 2 cost a crazy $300 million and needed to sell at least 7.2 million copies at $70 to to start making a profit. If Concord's budget really was $400 million, then how many copies of the game at $40 did Sony expect to sell before they'd start making money? 14 million copies? Remember that Concord didn't have a microtransaction system (yet) and that Sony only gets 100% of that $40 for sales on its own online sales platform.
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Did you hear what he said? They thought it was going to be a massive game, and a massive franchise. If you feel that way you're not thinking of 7.2 million copies but 20, 30, and up, and spin off games, TV shows, movies, the whole deal.
 
Clearly some middle manager KNEW it was a disaster and kept it under wraps long enough to make a huge fuckin paycheck.
 
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I figured it tested really well internally. Most gameplay reviews were positive. If you're convinced those characters are all amazing and worthy of spinoff games then you probably think Concord is a great game.
 
cormack12 said:
My honest opinion reading between the lines is that there is/was a talent issue and also a period of time where the game was essentially redeveloped, as well as overspend on salaries when the investment was rolling in given the 'calibre' of veterans.

If the timeline is right then it meant the original game would have to have started life as an UE4 game. UE5 wasn't on GA until 2022 so I imagine porting was required.

Add to that the fact ICE are usually Sony centric and most of the talent use custom engines across Sony and you get a lack of support. Now they are insanely talented people across SIE so I'm guessing a few could get up to speed quickly.

They initially raised $18 million investment seeds via ProbabkyMonsters: https://venturebeat.com/business/ex...s-18-8-million-for-two-triple-a-game-studios/

Enough to draw salaries and pay people while a second round of investment was run to the tune of $200million: https://www.gamesindustry.biz/proba...00m-to-make-games-with-a-people-first-culture

Then a final round of investment of a further $50million: https://www.gamesindustry.biz/probably-monsters-raises-usd200m-in-series-a

We know Cauldrons game was cancelled about 18 months ago, and I don't think the final studio even showed what they were doing. I think Concord basically swallowed all three studio's and they couldn't see it failing because they needed it to succeed so badly. Why the fuck Sony bought them as late as they did I have no idea.
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This is probably part of where the disinformation comes from. ProbablyMonsters raised 250 million dollars, but that doesn't mean that all this money went to Firewalk. There are 250 people on LinkedIn set to currently working at ProbablyMonsters and this is down 2% in the last 6 months. So maybe as high as 255 just 2 months ago. This is larger than the team at Firewalk.

They had at least 3 studios to fund in addition to their HQ.

So someone is probably adding that 250 million as if it all went towards Concord.... which is ignorant at best and a lie at worst.

It's also clear that someone wants to embarrass Herman Hulst here. No one else was named as involved but him... That's entirely purposeful and it's obvious why. People like to hate on Herman Hulst. If he cost Sony 400 million dollars, do you think the margin minded CFO of Sony Group would reward him with a promotion?

It's so funny how people will let things add up when they're looking for a story to match their conclusion, but they leave out other details.

You could argue that Jim Ryan fell on the sword and that's why he left, but again, I don't think you're going to make Herman Co-CEO if this was something he pushed for and this was the cost of it.
 
Ridicululzz said:
Future of PlayStation?? They took a look at that roster of characters and decided,

"Yep! This is what our company needs to be known for!!"

Really? :messenger_tears_of_joy:
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The story as told is clearly meant to be as provocative as possible...

Future of PlayStation that was hardly advertised? It had one teaser, one cinematic trailer, and one gameplay trailer before its beta...

Astro Bot and Lego Horizon got playable demos from the press and major trailer reveals.
 
400 million dollars, IF true, is not only unrealistic, but wholly and egregiously unsustainable for a video game to make back. That's big budget Hollywood film production money, yet allegedly tied to a product that didn't last 3 months. That's not just a failure, it's a critical, fundamental, absolute catastrophe. In no way should the studio behind Concord be the same after this, nor should Sony itself as a publisher.
 
6 years and $200M for an alpha. Another $200M and 2 years with outsourcing to bring it up to standards (lol).

I don't understand how that studio will not be closed

Its the biggest fuckup in gaming

How much more money would be spent to save it? I don't think anyone at Sony will approve further funds on that.
 
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Mibu no ookami said:
So it seems that people continue to try and take things that have a grain of truth and sprinkle in lies or hyperbole so that it sticks to the truth.
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Yeah, it's more about optics and PR. But as I've said many times, this failure also reflects on Bungie, and that shitshow cost $3.6 billion, plus the six other canceled GaaS projects and the disruption inside PS Studios.

So, at the end of the day (and since Sony isn't going to say anything, of course), I welcome the hyperbole and whining.
 
Man, who was arguing in that other thread about the 200million dollar amount?

This is just absolutely wackadoo.

10,000,000 copies at 40$ a pop to break even, and what's the actual cut breakdown to after retail gets their cut of purchased physical? After manufacturing costs?
 
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